I’ve been a Halo fan ever since the original was released, clocking in hundreds of hours over the years in the multiplayer. I realize that when you hand over development to a new studio that things are obviously going to change, unfortunately said changes aren’t always for the better.
I remember watching one of Bungie’s vidocs when they were making Reach. They stated that the changes they made to the gameplay in multiplayer were put into place to make the one versus one battles a little more intimate and last longer(things like no bleed through and the bloom system.) The changes 343 has made to the game totally change the core fundamentals of the game.
Things that have changed and what the end result is:
85% bloom
- Noobs that can’t time their shots can SPAM the DMR and kill you more easily
- The needle rifle is now basically a machine gun where you can just hold down the trigger and SPAM shots from any range(you don’t have to time your shots at all, you will still get the kill.)
- SPAMMING the pistol will get an easy kill almost every time
With bleed through being brought back you can shoot somebody with the assault rifle for about 1 second, beat them down and kill them.
It seems to me that Bungie wanted to evolve the Halo series into something where the more skilled players are the ones who will come out on top. IE - people who can actually time their shots and don’t want to try and pummel everyone.
343 obviously wants to dumb down the gameplay so any casual player can just jump right into the multiplayer and get kills. Pehaps Microsoft wants to go after the casual Call of Duty audience now that the Halo community is dwindling? The reason I played Halo in the first place was because the Call of Duty series caters to casual players and is a run and gun one shot kill-fest.
Thanks for taking most of the skill out of Halo Reach 343. I can honestly say that I’m not very excited about Halo 4 now.
Sincerely,
A long time Halo fan
This post has been edited by a moderator. Please do not flame or attack other members.
No offense, but if 343 and MS catering to casuals is your only argument then let’s say it’s true.
Let’s pretend for a moment that this is exactly what they are doing. Look at it this way.
There are more casual gamers than competitive gamers.
So I guess you are looking forward to Halo 4 Kinect then?
I am slightly so wondering about halo 4 as well. I just don’t want it to play anything like cod…reach is pretty close to it…IMO
TU is the best thing to happen to Reach thus far. MW3 has been out a month and has already had 6 updates, it took us a year and a half to get one.
How could you possibly enjoy no-bleed through?! Do you not get frusrated when you shoot someone 3 times, and he does nothing but sprint at you and beat you down and wins the battle?!
85% bloom/ZB takes SKILL. DMR is way too slow paced for Halo. IMO.
Bloom slowed down Halo game play enormously, which is why none of the truly competitive players/Pros like it. Casual gamers enjoy it because they don’t die as quickly. =)
There’s plenty of playlists with original Reach settings you can still enjoy. and 4-5 with the TU settings for us competitive players.
> TU is the best thing to happen to Reach thus far. MW3 has been out a month and has already had 6 updates, it took us a year and a half to get one.
>
> How could you possibly enjoy no-bleed through?! Do you not get frusrated when you shoot someone 3 times, and he does nothing but sprint at you and beat you down and wins the battle?!
>
> 85% bloom/ZB takes SKILL. DMR is way too slow paced for Halo. IMO.
>
> Bloom slowed down Halo game play enormously, which is why none of the truly competitive players/Pros like it. Casual gamers enjoy it because they don’t die as quickly. =)
>
> There’s plenty of playlists with original Reach settings you can still enjoy. and 4-5 with the TU settings for us competitive players.
Yeah, You are right it takes more skill to put the reticule on somebody’s head and press the trigger as fast as you can. What was I thinking?
I stand corrected.
All 343 had to do was make the pummel less powerful.
to both of the guys above me.
The implementation of bloom was not thought out, much like spread.
First, I would like it to be said I thoroughly enjoyed halo 3 and PreTU reach; however, both games have serious mechanic flaws.
In halo 3, spread was the mechanic on the BR (the precision and utility weapon of halo 3), basically the BR was a triple shot weapon that forced you to lead your shots or not all the bullets would hit your target. In theory, this mechanic added a layer of skill to the precision class in halo 3, but what actually happened was that in the slightest lag, the bullets would not register and good players would be robbed because of a faulty or unfair connection.
In preTU reach, bloom was the mechanic of the DMR (the precision and main utility weapon of halo reach), bloom caused your reticle to expand and randomly fire as you stopped pacing your shots. In theory, this added another window of “precision”, not only did you have to hit your targets on the screen, but you had to hit the trigger at the right time. What actually happened was that although the shots would go randomly, sometimes they could hit their target anyway, giving lesser skilled, or careless players an unfair advantage.
bloom and spread both suck but at least TU bloom makes the game easier to pace the last one, instead of waiting a full second for your fully expanded reticle to decrease while you get spammed.
SPAM is way more evident with DMR. It’s hardly even arguable that the BR takes more skill than the DMR, not simply because of AIM, but because the game was faster pace. Strafing took place. Left/Right movement took place much quicker. It’s much harder to 4 shot someone with the BR than it is to 5 shot someone with the DMR. I like both games, obviously I like H2/H3 settings much, much more as does the majority of the community. But why not allow us to both be happy with some TU playlists, some not?
> I am slightly so wondering about halo 4 as well. I just don’t want it to play anything like cod…reach is pretty close to it…IMO
Halo: Reach isn’t ANYTHING like Call of Duty.
OP if 100% bloom and no-bleed through ADDED skill to the game, why is it that the competitive community and even the CEO of the premier competitive gaming franchise (MLG) agrees that Reach and many of it’s mechanics are some of the worst in the series? Why is it that MLG is using bleed through and Zero Bloom? If your response is something like “MLG is for bad kids who can’t adapt to new games and just want the basics of the game”, then you are clearly too uninformed to even have a decent debate with on this topic, so I will just leave it at that, but i surely hope that is not the case.
> SPAM is way more evident with DMR. It’s hardly even arguable that the BR takes more skill than the DMR, not simply because of AIM, but because the game was faster pace. Strafing took place. Left/Right movement took place much quicker. It’s much harder to 4 shot someone with the BR than it is to 5 shot someone with the DMR. I like both games, obviously I like H2/H3 settings much, much more as does the majority of the community. But why not allow us to both be happy with some TU playlists, some not?
curbs,
you are aware that halo 3 and halo 2 have ENTIRELY different mechanics right.
The machine looks the same but one is electronic and one is diesel.
Spread and hitscan my friend. Halo 3 takes a RIDICULOUS amount of skill to play, and I would argue that on system link, halo 3 is the most competitive shooter out today.
But because of its poor netcode (compared to reach), its skill gap making mechanics turn into a proverbial warewolf under the right online circumstances transforming it into a game that I only get on when I get tired of reach.
TLDNR;
halo 3 is awesome offline
online is the only reason halo is so great, and halo 3 can be really bad under the wrong conditions.
Default bloom doesn’t work for Reach. Why? because all the good players in Reach spam the DMR.
I can guarantee you all the 1% onyx and MLG players spam their DMR shoots.
> Default bloom doesn’t work for Reach. Why? because all the good players in Reach spam the DMR.
>
> I can guarantee you all the 1% onyx and MLG players spam their DMR shoots.
Im 20% onyx season 8.
My motto - aim for the chest, hope for the best
85% takes a lot more talent, hit registration in ZB comes down to host connection sometimes. Either are fine to me, I just dont practice ZB.
Very aware. I never ran into too many issues with hit scans. And I have two 5star accounts with multiple 50’s. It’s not hard to lead a shot. Yes, host was a huge advantage, but it always is. Still is with DMR battles.
I actually prefer 85% to ZB on REACH IMO.
> Very aware. I never ran into too many issues with hit scans. And I have two 5star accounts with multiple 50’s. It’s not hard to lead a shot. Yes, host was a huge advantage, but it always is. Still is with DMR battles.
not like it was in h3.
In reach it lets you spam, in halo 3 Ive had doubles matches where kids ate BR bullets for breakfast and a full clip dropped shields after I was dead on the ground.
Both PreTU reach and H3 have bad mechanics, Halo 3’s make me punch holes in walls, halo reach’s make me get on fallout for a week.
I’ve been a casual and competitive gamer since Halo 1.
I couldn’t disagree with you more. I think that Halo Reach is now much more fun to play. I find myself actually excited to get home and play, where as before I never much turned on my xbox.
I think that Halo should be played with 0%-25% bloom to make it game that the masses and the competitive gamers will enjoy.
The only thing holding back Reach is the lack of good maps. Honestly I was very disappointed with the maps released with Reach. Only 2-3 were and good and forge maps are too CPU laggy to enjoy with friends.
I think that the DLC has helped but honestly it was too little too late. The lack of good maps and addition of Bloom severely hurt the Halo population.
For awhile I thought that Halo Reach’s network code was bad but that is not the case, I simply realized that there are just fewer gamers playing Halo than in the past so by default you are going to play more gamers who live further distances away which result in bad/laggy connections.
> I’ve been a casual and competitive gamer since Halo 1.
>
> I couldn’t disagree with you more. I think that Halo Reach is now much more fun to play. I find myself actually excited to get home and play, where as before I never much turned on my xbox.
>
> I think that Halo should be played with 0%-25% bloom to make it game that the masses and the competitive gamers will enjoy.
>
> The only thing holding back Reach is the lack of good maps. Honestly I was very disappointed with the maps released with Reach. Only 2-3 were and good and forge maps are too CPU laggy to enjoy with friends.
>
> I think that the DLC has helped but honestly it was too little too late. The lack of good maps and addition of Bloom severely hurt the Halo population.
>
> For awhile I thought that Halo Reach’s network code was bad but that is not the case, I simply realized that there are just fewer gamers playing Halo than in the past so by default you are going to play more gamers who live further distances away which result in bad/laggy connections.
agree except ZB has odd registration.
ZB might be ok with a ROF and reticle revision.
Good shipping/FW 4v4 and FFA maps:
arena zealot
powerhouse
swordbase
Asylum
boardwalk
treasury
select
synapse
good dlc 4v4 and FFA:
anchor 9
tempest (great for 4v4, not really FFA)
Penance
beaver creeck
high noon
condemned
solitary
and thats not even counting the BTB stuff