Hey Guys Let's Try And Not Ruin Halo 4, Like We Did With Reach

Games Other Halo
1

Remember how the community complained like a bunch of whiny brats when Reach came out, successfully turning Reach into a splintered game experience with multiple different settings and modes that all catered to each individual need? (TU, NO Bloom, Vanilla , Anniversary, …etc.) Let’s not do this and keep the game consistent throughout all of the playlists. There is nothing more annoying than having to keep track of all the different settings and modes that people wanted.

I guess I shouldn’t blame the community though, because people will always complain. It actually was Bungie’s fault for listening to the limited community, succeeding in splitting up and ruining the Halo community (Reach is the least successful Halo game to date).

I guess I’m just asking 343 to simply not listen to their fans, and do what they think is right, because they know what’s best. Kudos on no beta because that would only serve to invite community influence. We just need to realize that WE DON’T MAKE GAMES, WE DONT KNOW WHAT WORKS< WE ARE limited, 343 WILL TAKE CARE OF US, TRUST THEM.

PEACE.

2

What? The community fixed Reach and encouraged 343 to bring out 3 brand new settings which were vastly superior to Vanilla Reach in every single way.

If Halo 4 turns out to be terrible just like Reach was, we will do the same.

3

> What? The community fixed Reach and encouraged 343 to bring out 3 brand new settings which were vastly superior to Vanilla Reach in every single way.
>
> If Halo 4 turns out to be terrible just like Reach was, we will do the same.

I’m going to agree with this.

4

Sure, if by “fixing” you mean “runing” the community by splintering it into various sects, each warring and arguing that their “settings” are superior. All this shows is great weakness in the developer if they succumb to the internet bickerings of forumgoers. People don’t realize that although a large majority of forum posts may be negative of the game, people on the forums are a very tiny percentage of the entire population. Biggest mistake of Halo 3 and Reach were the BETAs because they give an early incentive to the community that they actually have a say in the development. This is a dangerous thing, all of the sudden we think we run this show where we are actually just mere lemmings.

5

> > What? The community fixed Reach and encouraged 343 to bring out 3 brand new settings which were vastly superior to Vanilla Reach in every single way.
> >
> > If Halo 4 turns out to be terrible just like Reach was, we will do the same.
>
> I’m going to agree with this.

Even if you thought the changes were beneficial, they don’t work because that’s not the way the game was originally designed, there are and always will be problems. Don’t you know about the health pack glitch ?

6

> > > What? The community fixed Reach and encouraged 343 to bring out 3 brand new settings which were vastly superior to Vanilla Reach in every single way.
> > >
> > > If Halo 4 turns out to be terrible just like Reach was, we will do the same.
> >
> > I’m going to agree with this.
>
>
> Even if you thought the changes were beneficial, they don’t work because that’s not the way the game was originally designed, there are and always will be problems. Don’t you know about the health pack glitch ?

They took out bleed… So thats invalid

7

Yeah, I prefer Halo: Reach before all the ‘specialised’ playlists, too. I hope 343i will listen, but make more considerate changes, if at all.

8

> > > > What? The community fixed Reach and encouraged 343 to bring out 3 brand new settings which were vastly superior to Vanilla Reach in every single way.
> > > >
> > > > If Halo 4 turns out to be terrible just like Reach was, we will do the same.
> > >
> > > I’m going to agree with this.
> >
> >
> > Even if you thought the changes were beneficial, they don’t work because that’s not the way the game was originally designed, there are and always will be problems. Don’t you know about the health pack glitch ?
>
> They took out bleed… So thats invalid

Congratulations, you succeed in proving my point even further. Yes you are right, they took out “bleedthrough.” Oh noes! now MLG is angry because they want bleedthrough in their gametype. OK so we’ll leave it in MLG. More separation and splintering of the community, more mental notes need to be taken as to which playlists have what settings? Can’t we just get some damn consistency? GEEZ.

9

> Remember how the community complained like a bunch of whiny brats when Reach came out, successfully turning Reach into a splintered game experience with multiple different settings and modes that all catered to each individual need? (TU, NO Bloom, Vanilla , Anniversary, …etc.) Let’s not do this and keep the game consistent throughout all of the playlists. There is nothing more annoying than having to keep track of all the different settings and modes that people wanted.
>
> I guess I shouldn’t blame the community though, because people will always complain. It actually was Bungie’s fault for listening to the limited community, succeeding in splitting up and ruining the Halo community (Reach is the least successful Halo game to date).
>
> I guess I’m just asking 343 to simply not listen to their fans, and do what they think is right, because they know what’s best. Kudos on no beta because that would only serve to invite community influence. We just need to realize that WE DON’T MAKE GAMES, WE DONT KNOW WHAT WORKS< WE ARE limited, 343 WILL TAKE CARE OF US, TRUST THEM.
>
> PEACE.

no…just no.

vanilla reach was crap. bloom was crap. guess what? bungie screwed up the game. we got parts of it fixed by us dissenting.

same thing with halo 2. it sucked pre-patch, then became awesome.

and to say that we don’t know what works…i can tell you what makes a competitive game…a lot of people can. i trusted bungie, and they crapped all over my face with a disappointing game. not again.

i am actually comfortable with what we have heard now, but that is not to say that if something is screwed up when it ships we should all keep quiet. devs aren’t perfect. we are the consumer, and in order to keep our business they need to placate the user base.

10

You can never control what others will say or do to you or others. I agree that many complainers without constructive thoughts are the beating posts for further dissension, but as someone who has seen this for Halo 2, Halo 3, and now Reach, your hoping a fools dream if the overall community will be able to set aside the differences for each other.

11

> Sure, if by “fixing” you mean “runing” the community by splintering it into various sects, each warring and arguing that their “settings” are superior. All this shows is great weakness in the developer if they succumb to the internet bickerings of forumgoers. People don’t realize that although a large majority of forum posts may be negative of the game, people on the forums are a very tiny percentage of the entire population. Biggest mistake of Halo 3 and Reach were the BETAs because they give an early incentive to the community that they actually have a say in the development. This is a dangerous thing, all of the sudden we think we run this show where we are actually just mere lemmings.

the community was already ruined.

user retention dropped dramatically with vanilla reach, not to mention the game sales werent as good as 3.

now at least some of the people that quit are coming back and finding decent game options.

i cant believe that you support basically keeping the worst idea in the history of halo (bloom). it should have been taken out across the board, but i’ll take what i can get.

12

> You can never control what others will say or do to you or others. I agree that many complainers without constructive thoughts are the beating posts for further dissension, but as someone who has seen this for Halo 2, Halo 3, and now Reach, your hoping a fools dream if the overall community will be able to set aside the differences for each other.

i dont agree with dissention for the sake of dissention.

i like to see well thought-out critiques grounded in facts…not ZOMG THIS GAME IS TERRIBLE BLAH

our feedback does make a difference and can fix things that are wrong. it is the whole point of a beta, and the whole point of feedback.

13

> What? The community fixed Reach and encouraged 343 to bring out 3 brand new settings which were vastly superior to Vanilla Reach in every single way.
>
> If Halo 4 turns out to be terrible just like Reach was, we will do the same.

I am going to interject and say that while i am all for TU, ZB and anything that makes the game better, the fact that we had so many problems to begin with the shooting mechanics says volumes of the game’s quality. Plus

Don’t mistake this as not being appreciative. Games are much more enjoyable now (minus the lack of trueskill) but i think that the shooting mechanics shouldn’t be this split up. It’s providing variety yes but only for the sake of salvaging what’s left of the sinking ship. The game simply needed more testing and Bungie failed to implement these ideas properly. You don’t need to be a game designer to know this and how many obvious problems were ignored.

We have ZB, Anniversary, vanilla TS, and TU. For Halo 4 we CANNOT afford to do this and confuse the hell out of the average player. The shooting mechanics (for Halo 4 hitscan and recoil) have have to be nothing less than great right out of the gate. Not only is this a great idea that provides much needed simplicity, players will be able to adjust easier to each playlist because it’s the same mechanics, just a different flavor (i.e snipes, swat, BTB, TS, FFA)

I hope no one asks for a ZR playlist (Zero Recoil) as Recoil is a controllable factor, unlike bloom and Halo 3 bullet spread. Of course Recoil adjustments on guns after launch is totally viable if some guns become less used/more used for perhaps having too much or not enough.

14

> > Remember how the community complained like a bunch of whiny brats when Reach came out, successfully turning Reach into a splintered game experience with multiple different settings and modes that all catered to each individual need? (TU, NO Bloom, Vanilla , Anniversary, …etc.) Let’s not do this and keep the game consistent throughout all of the playlists. There is nothing more annoying than having to keep track of all the different settings and modes that people wanted.
> >
> > I guess I shouldn’t blame the community though, because people will always complain. It actually was Bungie’s fault for listening to the limited community, succeeding in splitting up and ruining the Halo community (Reach is the least successful Halo game to date).
> >
> > I guess I’m just asking 343 to simply not listen to their fans, and do what they think is right, because they know what’s best. Kudos on no beta because that would only serve to invite community influence. We just need to realize that WE DON’T MAKE GAMES, WE DONT KNOW WHAT WORKS< WE ARE limited, 343 WILL TAKE CARE OF US, TRUST THEM.
> >
> > PEACE.
>
> no…just no.
>
> vanilla reach was crap. bloom was crap. guess what? bungie screwed up the game. we got parts of it fixed by us dissenting.
>
> same thing with halo 2. it sucked pre-patch, then became awesome.
>
> and to say that we don’t know what works…i can tell you what makes a competitive game…a lot of people can. i trusted bungie, and they crapped all over my face with a disappointing game. not again.
>
> i am actually comfortable with what we have heard now, but that is not to say that if something is screwed up when it ships we should all keep quiet. devs aren’t perfect. we are the consumer, and in order to keep our business they need to placate the user base.

This. With Reach Bungie splintered their own game by alienating their existing loyal fanbase that loved Halo for what it already was, then invited a bunch of new players that didn’t give a -Yoink- and or understand why some of the old stuff was better. Change is fine, but change for the sake of change is silly. You improve on the core formula, not take a -Yoink- all over it for no reason.

It’s quite hilarious that you think MLG settings are partially responsible for splintering the game when they’re more similar to what Halo has been consistently been about for about 9 years. No, no my friend, you’ve got it backwards. Those -Yoink- backwards Reach settings are what splintered the community.

But I will agree with you on one thing, we need good default settings across the board, MLG is one thing, but when we have pre-TU, post TU settings then MLG, etc.

They should’ve forced TU settings on everyone, half the kids didn’t even notice bloom was missing in the TU Beta playlist when it came out (not even joking). Fact of matter is, only the kids who cared noticed, if Bungie wasn’t so damn stubborn they would have fixed their damn game and admitted their mistakes this time around. But perhaps they didn’t care since Halo was no longer their child to worry about. Given that fact I don’t imagine it’s easy for 343 to force settings over everyone like that since it wasn’t their creation to begin with.

I don’t think we’ll have this problem with Halo 4. Base movement appears to be quite quick, jump height is good, there is no bloom to my knowledge thus far and the only variable factors will be AA’s or no AA’s, and drop spawns or static spawns. Those can’t be decided until launch.

15

Bloom in halo reach was terrible, it was random and inconsistent, that is why people didn’t like the game. 343 added no bloom and kept bloom in separate playlists which brought people who didn’t play the game, myself included, back to continue playing.

That being said, Reach was created by Bungie, Halo 4 by 343. It looks like 343 is making Halo into a ‘Call of Halo’ game for multiplayer from what the game informer stated but I personally hope they have separate playlists that have the classic Halo 1 or 2 feel to them. That doesn’t make the community divided if they add something like that, it just caters to what different people want; Casual or competitive.

16

> > Sure, if by “fixing” you mean “runing” the community by splintering it into various sects, each warring and arguing that their “settings” are superior. All this shows is great weakness in the developer if they succumb to the internet bickerings of forumgoers. People don’t realize that although a large majority of forum posts may be negative of the game, people on the forums are a very tiny percentage of the entire population. Biggest mistake of Halo 3 and Reach were the BETAs because they give an early incentive to the community that they actually have a say in the development. This is a dangerous thing, all of the sudden we think we run this show where we are actually just mere lemmings.
>
> the community was already ruined.
>
> user retention dropped dramatically with vanilla reach, not to mention the game sales werent as good as 3.
>
> now at least some of the people that quit are coming back and finding decent game options.
>
>
> i cant believe that you support basically keeping the worst idea in the history of halo (bloom). it should have been taken out across the board, but i’ll take what i can get.

This discussion has nothing to do with me supporting or not supporting bloom. It’s about me supporting the time-tested method of “we know what’s right for our fans and if you don’t like it leave” method that Bungie approached these matters with. People cried and cried about bullet spread in Halo 3. Did Bungie change anything? NO. Because they knew what they were doing; and last I checked Halo 3 was pretty damn successful.

17

I’m in half agreement with the OP.

I agree in the sense that if we do get a Title Update…Apply it to the whole damn game. Make the gameplay consistent except for niche playlists like Classic or MLG.

18

> > <mark>Remember how the community complained like a bunch of whiny brats when Reach came out</mark> Duuuuuh THE GAME out of the box wasa BIG FAIL
> > <mark>successfully turning Reach into a splintered game experience with multiple different settings and modes that all catered to each individual need? (TU, NO Bloom, Vanilla , Anniversary, …etc.)</mark> Ture but if Reach was not sooo bad it would not have needed so many UPDATES for THE FANS to want to play it.
> > Let’s not do this and keep the game consistent throughout all of the playlists. There is nothing more annoying than having to keep track of all the different settings and modes that people wanted.
> >
> > I guess I shouldn’t blame the community though, because people will always complain. <mark>It actually was Bungie’s fault</mark> for listening to the limited community, succeeding in splitting up and ruining the Halo community <mark>(Reach is the least successful Halo game to date)</mark>.
> >
> > I guess I’m just asking 343 to simply not listen to their fans, and do what they think is right, because they know what’s best. Kudos on no beta because that would only serve to invite community influence. We just need to realize that WE DON’T MAKE GAMES, WE DONT KNOW WHAT WORKS< WE ARE limited, 343 WILL TAKE CARE OF US, TRUST THEM.
> >
> > PEACE.
>
> …
> no…just no.
>
> <mark>vanilla reach was crap. bloom was crap. guess what? bungie screwed up the game.</mark> we got parts of it fixed by us dissenting.
> So true just look at what MLG had to fix just to make it work
>
> <mark>same thing with halo 2. it sucked pre-patch, then became awesome.</mark>
> Same for the most part with HALO 3 - it was much better after TU2 if i recall
>
> <mark>and to say that we don’t know what works…i can tell you what makes a competitive game…a lot of people can.</mark>
> Again look at what THE PEOPLE HAD to change for the 1 Ranked playlist they gave us
> <mark>i trusted bungie, and they crapped all over my face with a disappointing game.</mark> not again.
> Reach was a huge fail in my book – but that’s just ME
>
> i am actually comfortable with what we have heard now, but that is not to say that if something is screwed up when it ships we should all keep quiet. devs aren’t perfect. we are the consumer, and in order to keep our business they need to placate the user base.

-,-

19

Vanilla TS has 10 times as many players playing it at any given time as Super Slayer, ZB Slayer, MLG and Anniversary TS do combined.

20

> Vanilla TS has 10 times as many players playing it at any given time as Super Slayer, ZB Slayer, MLG and Anniversary TS do combined.

That’s because the original Reach settings forced out all of the competitive players and left us with a batch of kids.

The skilled players just haven’t come back.