Hey 343 here's an idea for an update

[KCD0DGER]

@X11_XOMAN

Yeah removing the classic pump action was a mistake I also call it the flood killer or flood mower because that’s essentially what it was and it was fantastic not anymore all because of 343 I can tell a lot of people on here would hate me if I made weapons for the game because I would actually make weapons that are effective

So you are scared, got it.

@GAMRKNIGHT352

I’ve said this before, but in all other Halo games before this, the shotgun acted as a counter to the sword. If you timed the shot correctly, you could kill the swordbearer in the lunging animation. The bulldog cannot do this, you have to have already engaged the swordbearer for it to be viable against the energy sword, so why use it at all? I appreciate the design, and it could still coexist with the classic shotty, just not as a replacement

A shotgun is. A better sword. Because it can counter the sword. However. The sword is still really good. So what happens. Is you have. Two swords. On the map. By virtue of these filling the same role. What happens. Is that two players. Get instant kill weapons. What happens. When two players. Out of four. On a team. Get two instant. Kill. Weapons.

How dense does the playerbase have to be to not get why this is a problem.

EDIT: Look. The classic shotgun can return. But It will return as a close range power weapon that spawns in the same place the sword and gravity hammer does, because it fills the same role.

You will see a bulldog and a classic shotgun on the map. You will NOT see a sword and classic shotgun on the map.

They are not counters. They are the same weapon type. ONE. Is objectively. Superior. (It is the shotgun.)

AND IF 2/4 on a team HAVE THEM then you have a serious snowballing imbalance. It sucks.

[Darwi]

@KCD0DGER

AND IF 2/4 on a team HAVE THEM then you have a serious snowballing imbalance. It sucks.

That has been my major concern all along.

The other thing I never liked about the OG shotgun is that it was seriously camped. Like plant a flag, this is where I’m going to stay for the rest of the game. Legitimate strategy.

At least the sword, with it’s speed boost and lunge, encouraged you to get moving.

[KCD0DGER]

100%. That is how it works, every time. The sword is more rewarding and risky. For balance, it is better.

[X11_XOMAN]

Well apparently if I’m scared then you must be a donkey I want 343 Industries to bring back weapons to the campaign that don’t suck balls

[KCD0DGER]

have you even played the campaign lmao

the Bulldog slaps hard, especially the special variant

[X11_XOMAN]

Still not as good as the original and no I won’t be happy until the original returns so stop trying to convince me otherwise in fact stop posting here because your passing me off

[The_MetaChief]

What do you do when a player that you can’t just call a dumb noob disagrees with you? God you’re such an angry little person.

But, at least as far as Reach and 4/5 goes. Yes, that shotgun is just a better sword. I never want that shotgun to be in Infinite. It was too easy to use and spawned too frequently.

If the classic (OG trilogy) shotgun is to return it needs to be the exact opposite of a bulldog. Which is the Halo 3 shotgun. Consistent but with almost no range to speak of, its not a better sword. Not even close.

Case closed.

Add the shotgun back in 343.

[KCD0DGER]

@X11_XOMAN

in fact stop posting here because your passing me off

why do you think I care if I’m making you mad

@The_MetaChief

What do you do when a player that you can’t just call a dumb noob disagrees with you? God you’re such an angry little person.

You’d be surprised, I’m not too mad, just standoffish.

@The_MetaChief

But, at least as far as Reach and 4/5 goes. Yes, that shotgun is just a better sword. I never want that shotgun to be in Infinite. It was too easy to use and spawned too frequently.

Mhm.

@The_MetaChief

If the classic (OG trilogy) shotgun is to return it needs to be the exact opposite of a bulldog. Which is the Halo 3 shotgun. Consistent but with almost no range to speak of, its not a better sword. Not even close.

Mm… No, that was a better sword too. Couldn’t lunge, but if it beats the sword at its job, it by definition does the job better.

(post deleted by author)

lol

[X11_XOMAN]

You just want all weapons to suck and you can piss off i am glad you don’t make game because all of your weapons would suck we have real world shotguns that can hold more than the Bulldog and that property could bo more damage than the Bulldog

[LITTLEFATMONKEY]

I’m blown away that this hasn’t happened yet. Like, do they really expect to just release one more of the old weapons each year? It’ll still be months before we get the DMR.

[KCD0DGER]

Yeah, I know. I shoot IRL. lmao.

[psi5000]

I would say bring back the variants of the PP, particularly Void’s Tear.

[X11_XOMAN]

So explain to me why you hate the pump action shotgun so much

[BlueDevistator]

I think she has made her position pretty clear, not only in just this thread.

Anyways, anyone else find it strange that we would still be using pump action in 500 years?

[X11_XOMAN]

I’m not saying I hate the design of the bulldog but the bulldog could be made as powerful as the pump shotgun to me it was essentially the human energy sword and it wouldn’t matter if one team got both the Sword and Shotgun that would essentially be the same thing as one team getting 2 Swords or 2 Gravity Hammers or a Sword and Gravity Hammer I know because this has happened and then the team I’m on gets slaughtered

[FeudalPhoenix10]

if thats the case then why is a super advanced alien race still using swords and sheilds like it’s medieval times?

[KCD0DGER]

I think the M90 is cool. But I think it is, as a balance implement, much worse than the utilitarian bulldog. As a POWER weapon, the M90 is great! It’s fine! But it cannot, for good balance, exist ALONGSIDE a sword or hammer.

I want it back! But not instead of The Bulldog, which is my favorite in the series yet. This thing has REALLY good reach but that range is reined in by the fact it cannot One Shot Kill. It is equal to something like a BR, AR or otherwise, in utility. Honestly I think Bulldog slayer would be a REALLY fun mode to try.

@X11_XOMAN

I know because this has happened and then the team I’m on gets slaughtered

Then you know how much it sucks.

Game balancing isn’t about making JUST good effective weapons. It is about making good, effective, balanced weapons that have answers to them - which you’re right, the sword does not - or didn’t. Now you can trade with it.

But a BETTER sword was never the right answer, and that’s what the M90 was.

Bring back the M90 as a power weapon that spawns where the other 1SK CQC weapons do. That’s okay. That’s fine. That’s really cool. Hel, dude, we’re getting a double barreled shotgun with a GRAVITY hammer… Bayonet? Hammernet? idk. On it, sometime. It’s in development. It’s wack. Brute double barrel is very cool as an idea.

@FeudalPhoenix10

if thats the case then why is a super advanced alien race still using swords and sheilds like it’s medieval times?

Religion! That’s the actual diegetic answer, haha. That’s why the UNSC isn’t using anything like that at all.

@BlueDevistator

Anyways, anyone else find it strange that we would still be using pump action in 500 years?

Nah not really. Pump actions have less points of failure. In today’s theater of war, they’re basically just breaching tools. Most militaries don’t employ shotguns in actual warfare.

Halo’s just weird and is expected to have cool shotguns. But if you needed a specific combat shotgun, a pump action, foregrip laden, drum fed Bulldog, is a really good answer.

Gotta’ say, it makes me wish Infinite had a gunsmith. I’d LOVE a card-mag no-grip short stock bulldog. A real fast-whip-out gun. Might have higher bloom but it’d be a nice little lightweight boomstick.

[BlueDevistator]

@FeudalPhoenix10

if thats the case then why is a super advanced alien race still using swords and sheilds like it’s medieval times?

I’m assuming you are referring to the jackal shields and not the overall energy shields. I think they make reasonable sense. We still use shields today. If we could make them super light weight and clip to your hip when not in use then we would probably see way more use.

The sword makes sense only when used with active camouflage, or the heavy overshield (good ol’ OG gold elites). We do still use swords today as well, in (almost?) every US military branch, but they are purely ceremonial.

@KCD0DGER

Pump actions have less points of failure

I get that, but even today a semi-auto shotgun is only slightly more cost and a bit less reliable, and they’ve only been around for like 100 years. Add another 500 to that and I think the advancements will make it the clear choice for the same reason we don’t see much use with bolt action rifles and revolvers. (You won’t catch me using a semi auto shotgun much though. Whenever I do sporting clays I have to use pump action. I guess it is too deeply ingrained now)

[KCD0DGER]

Who knows! Suppose it’s fun.

But you know, the Bulldog is a pump-action too, and people forget that! I can see why, but it IS a pump!

[X11_XOMAN]

I say if that’s the case then let’s have two different types of pump shotguns one will be the classic CE shotgun that one will be strictly for campaign though the other one would be a rebalanced version so that it’s better than the bulldog but not quite as powerful as the CE shotgun this one could kill within maybe let’s say two hits but only if both shots are on point in other words dead accurate I mean I wouldn’t see a problem with having different ones they did in Halo 5 my favorite one was the blaze of glory mainly because of the way it looked oh just not curiosity would you want to see firefight return some people I’ve asked say no and some say yes it was a game mode I enjoyed though