Halo Xbox One: How to Handle Weapons and AAs

Games Halo 5: Guardians
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Disclaimer: these are my opinions
Loadouts should not be as extensive/over-complicated as they are in Halo 4. Make it where your primary weapon choices are: AR, BR, or DMR (no reason, canonically or otherwise, why S-IVs are issued Covenant/Promethean weapons). Same goes for sidearms and grenades, so I think Magnum and Frags should be default and unchangeable (this gets rid of the problems with N00B combos, PP/Plasma grenades, and Boltshot at spawn). Resupply is now, or rather once again, a default characteristic (no reason to over-complicate the elegant “golden triangle” dynamic of firearm-grenade-melee that has been around since CE). That said, no support upgrades/tactical packages or AAs at spawn. Rather than having Sprint as an innate ability of all players, increase base player speed and allow the choice between Sprint and Evade as such (choose between increased mobility or maneuverability).

I feel that the Covenant arsenal should once again include the Needle Rifle (balanced to be the counterpart to the DMR, as the Storm Rilfe is to the AR and the Carbine is to the BR). Brute weapons and grenades should also return, with the Brute Shot (replacing Concussion Rifle), Mauler (replacing Boltshot), Spiker Rifle (heftier Spiker with Retro Lancer-like design), and Spike/Incendiary grenades. Brute vehicles, mainly the Brute Chopper, should also return.

The Promethean arsenal should receive a damage boost, making them more effective versions of their UNSC/Covenant counterparts. The Boltshot, however, should stay out of multiplayer.

Armor Abilities and weapons, not just a few power weapons, should be placed on the map. This puts more emphasis on map control and should remain a recognized staple of Halo.

Ordinance should only be able to drop Armor Abilities. That said, a few AAs that I think should return (or be made) are: Bubble Shield, Regen Field, Hologram, Active Camo (but with changes to promote movement rather than camping), Gravity Lift (substitute for Jetpack in multiplayer), and the EMP Mine (releases EMP to drop shields and stop vehicles, but doesn’t kill). The thing that made Equipment work seems to be that they affected the map, rather than affecting how the players worked. i think 343i needs to keep that in mind when designing/balancing AAs in the future.

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> Disclaimer: these are my opinions

Couldn’t have this gone in one of the other threads about reverting H5 to H3?

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> > Disclaimer: these are my opinions
>
> Couldn’t have this gone in one of the other threads about reverting H5 to H3?

It’s not intended in any way to revert Halo back to a carbon copy of Halo 3. I, and many others, feel that Halo 4’s implementations of some things like loadouts and personal ordinance were overly gratuitous and that it in turn reduced the emphasis of map control. However, that isn’t to say that they are necessarily bad concepts, only that many people feel that they brought with them many problems. Case in point, I direct your attention to the abilities to: spawn with N00B combos, miniature shotguns as sidearms, Plasma Pistol/grenades that render most vehicles rather useless, and the population of “camo campers” that abuse the armor ability.

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> > Disclaimer: these are my opinions
>
> Couldn’t have this gone in one of the other threads about reverting H5 to H3?

Couldn’t your reply have gone in the ‘unoriginal’ thread?

The OP has posted their ideas, and no where have they said that Halo 5 should be a Halo 3 disc in a Halo 5 case.
So take your nonsense elsewhere.

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> I direct your attention to the abilities to: spawn with N00B combos, miniature shotguns as sidearms, Plasma Pistol/grenades that render most vehicles rather useless, and the population of “camo campers” that abuse the armor ability.

The Noob Combo was never even born in H4. The tracking on the PP OC is so bad that Noob Combos are effectively impossible. The only problem that the PP brings with being a loadout weapon is that it, along with stickies, kills vehicle play in BTB. The Boltshot wasn’t a miniature shotgun pre-patch and is even less of one now. AC is a problem but that’s a problem born out of using AC as an AA.

The problem isn’t Loadouts. It’s that specific weapons/abilities were allowed to be equipable in Loadouts.

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> > I direct your attention to the abilities to: spawn with N00B combos, miniature shotguns as sidearms, Plasma Pistol/grenades that render most vehicles rather useless, and the population of “camo campers” that abuse the armor ability.
>
> The Noob Combo was never even born in H4. The tracking on the PP OC is so bad that Noob Combos are effectively impossible. The only problem that the PP brings with being a loadout weapon is that it, along with stickies, kills vehicle play in BTB. The Boltshot wasn’t a miniature shotgun pre-patch and is even less of one now. AC is a problem but that’s a problem born out of using AC as an AA.
>
> The problem isn’t Loadouts. It’s that specific weapons/abilities were allowed to be equipable in Loadouts.

Not once did I say that the N00B combo was born in Halo 4. I only mentioned that the problems with loadouts stemmed (at least partially) on the fact that this tactic was made easier to gain with the inclusion of loadouts. I also addressed the fact that plasma pistols and plasma grenades at spawn made vehicles less effective. Also, if the Boltshot wasn’t/isn’t a “miniature shotgun”, please enlighten me on what you would classify its charged firing mode as.

Active Camo has potential as a balanced AA. It just hasn’t achieved that in either Reach or H4. I would refer you to the topic “Reverse the effects of Camo.”, but I know that you’ve already posted on it and that the suggestions have likely fallen on deaf ears in regard to you, as you make an argument on both that page and this one that shows evidence against you reading more of the OP than the first few lines.

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This is basically the essence of what the community wants. +1

I completely agree, but I think the boltshot should receive a buff and return in the form of a power weapon.

Also, something that I dearly want to see gone are ordnance indicators. Remember when predicting spawns was a skill?

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> This is basically the essence of what the community wants. +1
>
> I completely agree, but I think the boltshot should receive a buff and return in the form of a power weapon.
>
> Also, something that I dearly want to see gone are ordnance indicators. Remember when predicting spawns was a skill?

I wouldn’t mind the inclusion of the Boltshot as long as it stayed out of loadouts. However, it serves virtually the same purpose as the Mauler and, truth be told, I’d choose the Mauler over the Boltshot any day.

As for ordinance indicators, I agree that they do nothing more than serve as “training wheels” to those who don’t know the map, which is something that people don’t need to have their hand held over. At this point, it seems almost like an insult to both the player and the S-IV Program as a whole. You are a super-soldier and in a training simulation meant to keep you prepared for actual combat. Putting waypoints over weapons seems counter-productive to preparing them for that. I’d hate to see the feature return, as it seems redundant and would make the S-IVs more dependent on their tech (same problem as arming them with AAs and their choice of exotic weapons at spawn). Dependency on anything other than your wits and personal (or team-oriented) abilities is a dangerous thing and not something you would expect to see from Spartans.

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> > Also, something that I dearly want to see gone are ordnance indicators. Remember when predicting spawns was a skill?
>
> As for ordinance indicators, I agree that they do nothing more than serve as “training wheels” to those who don’t know the map, which is something that people don’t need to have their hand held over. At this point, it seems almost like an insult to both the player and the S-IV Program as a whole. You are a super-soldier and in a training simulation meant to keep you prepared for actual combat. Putting waypoints over weapons seems counter-productive to preparing them for that. I’d hate to see the feature return, as it seems redundant and would make the S-IVs more dependent on their tech (same problem as arming them with AAs and their choice of exotic weapons at spawn). Dependency on anything other than your wits and personal (or team-oriented) abilities is a dangerous thing and not something you would expect to see from Spartans.

My goodness, someone give this man a cookie.
Since when has Halo had to have been so gimmicky? I completely agree. Honestly, I’d be fine with subtle weapon indicators if the weapon was right in front of me and in direct line of sight, but having an across-the-map indicator is ridiculous and unnecessary, not to mention that, once again, it reduces the skill gap (something which is always beneficial to gameplay).

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> > > Also, something that I dearly want to see gone are ordnance indicators. Remember when predicting spawns was a skill?
> >
> > As for ordinance indicators, I agree that they do nothing more than serve as “training wheels” to those who don’t know the map, which is something that people don’t need to have their hand held over. At this point, it seems almost like an insult to both the player and the S-IV Program as a whole. You are a super-soldier and in a training simulation meant to keep you prepared for actual combat. Putting waypoints over weapons seems counter-productive to preparing them for that. I’d hate to see the feature return, as it seems redundant and would make the S-IVs more dependent on their tech (same problem as arming them with AAs and their choice of exotic weapons at spawn). Dependency on anything other than your wits and personal (or team-oriented) abilities is a dangerous thing and not something you would expect to see from Spartans.
>
> My goodness, someone give this man a cookie.
> Since when has Halo had to have been so gimmicky? I completely agree. Honestly, I’d be fine with subtle weapon indicators if the weapon was right in front of me and in direct line of sight, but having an across-the-map indicator is ridiculous and unnecessary, not to mention that, once again, it reduces the skill gap (something which is always beneficial to gameplay).

Haha, thank you. Also, your idea for how to lessen the mechanic of weapon indicators is interesting. Less of an affront to the players vision, allows for easier recognition of power weapons right in front of you (that would also aid newer players and those of us who would see any new weapons for the first time), and can have a place in canon (since 343i seems to want to make that a priority). Canonically, the MJOLNIR armor recognizes what weapon you are holding and adjusts the HUD to accommodate the new weapon. Its not a stretch to think that the armor could also register what the weapon you’re looking directly at is.

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I must say, the ideas proposed in “Reverse the effects of Camo” really have potential. As an Armor Ability, making Active Camo more effective while moving would directly promote movement over stationary camping. Also, making it where your shields have less density (and therefore making you easier to kill) while cloaked can balance its reusability as an AA. Still, I think we can all agree that even as an AA, the AC should be strictly placed on the map, rather than equipped at spawn.

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Nice ideas OP.
:slight_smile:

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> Nice ideas OP.
> :slight_smile:

Thank you. What do you think about the concept of choosing Sprint or Evade as an innate ability (choosing between increased mobility and increased maneuverability)? I think making it a choice between loadouts (simplified loadouts) would allow people to choose whether or not they can get to their objective quicker or have a better chance at actual gunfights (to a limited extent).

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> > Nice ideas OP.
> > :slight_smile:
>
> Thank you. What do you think about the concept of choosing Sprint or Evade as an innate ability (choosing between increased mobility and increased maneuverability)? I think making it a choice between loadouts (simplified loadouts) would allow people to choose whether or not they can get to their objective quicker or have a better chance at actual gunfights (to a limited extent).

Ugh. Sprint.
Personally, I feel it would be best for gameplay if sprint were removed entirely of the game, but accounting for the whole “changing times” and “no steps backwards” arguments, if it came down to having to choose between permanent sprint or permanent evade, I would definitely choose a nerfed version of evade. Perhaps it could function in the way that you could only roll once once for a short distance?

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> > > Nice ideas OP.
> > > :slight_smile:
> >
> > Thank you. What do you think about the concept of choosing Sprint or Evade as an innate ability (choosing between increased mobility and increased maneuverability)? I think making it a choice between loadouts (simplified loadouts) would allow people to choose whether or not they can get to their objective quicker or have a better chance at actual gunfights (to a limited extent).
>
> Ugh. Sprint.
> Personally, I feel it would be best for gameplay if sprint were removed entirely of the game, but accounting for the whole “changing times” and “no steps backwards” arguments, if it came down to having to choose between permanent sprint or permanent evade, I would definitely choose a nerfed version of evade. Perhaps it could function in the way that you could only roll once once for a short distance?

That’s what I was thinking (in regard to nerfing Evade), although I would keep sprint as an option if only to allow people to traverse larger maps more quickly.

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> I only mentioned that the problems with loadouts stemmed (at least partially) on the fact that this tactic [Noob Combo] was made easier to gain with the inclusion of loadouts.

And?

So it’s easier to gain. The Noob Combo isn’t even effectively possible. The tracking on the PP OC for non vehicles is garbage.

> Also, if the Boltshot wasn’t/isn’t a “miniature shotgun”, please enlighten me on what you would classify its charged firing mode as.

Basis the entire description for a weapon off it’s secondary fire mode is silly.

That and I can count how many times I see Boltshots being used in MP post patch.

> Active Camo has potential as a balanced AA. It just hasn’t achieved that in either Reach or H4. I would refer you to the topic “Reverse the effects of Camo.”, but I know that you’ve already posted on it and that the suggestions have likely fallen on deaf ears in regard to you, as you make an argument on both that page and this one that shows evidence against you reading more of the OP than the first few lines.

:confused:

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> > I only mentioned that the problems with loadouts stemmed (at least partially) on the fact that this tactic [Noob Combo] was made easier to gain with the inclusion of loadouts.
>
> And?
>
> So it’s easier to gain. <mark>The Noob Combo isn’t even effectively possible. The tracking on the PP OC for non vehicles is garbage.</mark>
>
>
>
> > Also, if the Boltshot wasn’t/isn’t a “miniature shotgun”, please enlighten me on what you would classify its charged firing mode as.
>
> <mark>Basis the entire description for a weapon off it’s secondary fire mode is silly.</mark>
>
> That and I can count how many times I see Boltshots being used in MP post patch.
>
>
>
> > Active Camo has potential as a balanced AA. It just hasn’t achieved that in either Reach or H4. I would refer you to the topic “Reverse the effects of Camo.”, but I know that you’ve already posted on it and that the suggestions have likely fallen on deaf ears in regard to you, as you make an argument on both that page and this one that shows evidence against you reading more of the OP than the first few lines.
>
> The PP/BR combo has worked well for me whenever I feel like getting even with a player who does the same to me repeatedly. Perhaps you’re simply trying to do it from too far a distance or something…
>
> The Boltshot can be classified by its “secondary firing mode” because it is in fact used in said firing mode on a much greater scale than its “primary” firing mode. The PP also has this identity crisis as a portable shield-disperser.
>
> The facts remain that the PP/Plasma grenade options in loadouts have led to a decline in the quality of vehicle play, and although the Boltshot is used less since the TU, it still functions the same and shouldn’t be a sidearm at spawn. f you have any actual reasons why you believe these things should return, please give your reasons here and let’s see if they show any merit. Simply assaulting the ideas of others, rather than stating your own, is in no way constructive.

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> The PP/BR combo has worked well for me whenever I feel like getting even with a player who does the same to me repeatedly.

Maybe you’re fighting bad players?

> The Boltshot can be classified by its “secondary firing mode” because it is in fact used in said firing mode on a much greater scale than its “primary” firing mode. The PP also has this identity crisis as a portable shield-disperser.

I debate your “fact” as opinion based on subjective experience.

> although the Boltshot is used less since the TU, it still functions the same and shouldn’t be a sidearm at spawn.

And if it’s a PW, it’s the crappiest one of the bunch and would be a waste of a ordnance or weapon spawn.

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> > The PP/BR combo has worked well for me whenever I feel like getting even with a player who does the same to me repeatedly.
>
> Maybe you’re fighting bad players?
>
>
>
> > The Boltshot can be classified by its “secondary firing mode” because it is in fact used in said firing mode on a much greater scale than its “primary” firing mode. The PP also has this identity crisis as a portable shield-disperser.
>
> I debate your “fact” as opinion based on subjective experience.
>
>
>
> > although the Boltshot is used less since the TU, it still functions the same and shouldn’t be a sidearm at spawn.
>
> And if it’s a PW, it’s the crappiest one of the bunch and would be a waste of a ordnance or weapon spawn.

  1. Subjectively, maybe I just happen to be a good one, or at least decent.

  2. Can you really argue that players use the single shots, where it takes 10 shots (a whole magazine) to kill, assuming the last is a headshot more than they use the overcharge feature (which can be a one-shot kill)?

  3. If made into a PW, it would be balanced as such. Also, had you read my original post, you would have realized that I feel that the Boltshot can be taken out of multiplayer in exchange for the Mauler (again, as a power weapon placed on the map).

Once more, rather than simply attacking others for posting their opinions, it would be more constructive to relay your own views on such matters and give your reasoning. The fact that I have been able to back up my opinions, whereas you have simply tried to contort them, speaks volumes in regard to who is winning this ‘argument’, if you would even call a conversation between someone voicing his thoughts and another who adamantly reviles them and regurgitates the others words in some attempt to prove his point (which you have not made, as of yet) an argument.

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New/Revised ideas

Loadouts

  • Primary weapon choices: AR, BR, DMR, and Silenced SMG.
  • Secondary weapon choices: M6H (H4 Magnum) and the M6C/SOCOM (ODST Automag).
  • Allow option between Sprint or Evade.
  • Remove tactical packages/support upgrades.
  • Remove Armor Abilities at spawn.
    The inclusion of the Silenced SMG would give the addition of an automatic weapon with a functional zoom at spawn. It would be differentiated from the AR by having a faster rate of fire, more recoil, different round capacity/reload time, and having a smart-link scope. There really shouldn’t be any effect on gameplay for the “silenced/suppressed” aspect of it.

The return of the Automag would allow a longer-ranged sidearm with less damage-per-shot and a faster firing rate. However, it would have recoil to counter this rate of fire and wouldn’t have any “silenced” or stealthy impact on gameplay, since you would obviously still be visible on motion tracker.

“GEN-2 Armor Equipment” Ideas

  • Jetpack- Active Camo- Promethean Vision- Bubble Shield- EMP Mine- Hologram- Jackal Shield- “Lancer” Thruster Pack
    Think of Armor Abilities with a limited charge. They can only be used for so long before they are depleted and detach from the Spartan’s armor. This prevents excessive AC, Jetpack, and PV abuse. Place these game-changing pieces of equipment on the map for players to fight over to establish/maintain map control over spawning locations of these. These pieces of equipment should be noticeable on their wearer, like the Jetpack is. Imagine a helmet attachment for PV, seeing AC and others more prominently on the back, and seeing the Jackal Shield device on the wrist. The Ac module could even make the armor’s lighted segments glow a prevalent green (inspired from Splinter Cell) when not activated.

Some can only be used once, but have a lasting effect on the map (essentially these are Equipment from H3). These include the Bubble Shield (which I’d personally like to see as it appeared in the H3 teaser, in a more “grenade-like” form) that the player throws down in front of him to deploy the familiar dome, the EMP Mine (combination of Trip Mine and Power Drain) which is deployed on the ground and releases an EMP when an enemy player/vehicle walks on or near it, and possibly the return of the Regen Field.

Assassinations
To add a new gameplay mechanic to assassinations, what if performing the action allowed you to take the victim’s “Armor Equipment” (something you wouldn’t be able to do otherwise). This would only work if you didn’t have one yourself, but if you had the same one, perhaps you could take their “charge/ammo” to add to your own?

Also, what if you could sprint/evade at your enemy after popping his/her shields and perform a frontward assassination? It would have the same effect as the standard action, and could only be done moments after sprinting/evading and only if their shields are fully depleted.