wouldnt it be awesome if Halo Wars 2 had a forge mode / mod support… further more how awesome would it be if it led to the creation of a halo-inspired DOTA clone??
Sorry to burst your bubble.
From Rooster Teeth’s Jack and Gus E3 interview with Kevin Grace [Narrative Design Director] on Halo Wars 2."… We don’t have anything in the plans for user-generated game modes or custom Forge maps…"
Also, a Dota-style game would be completely out of place in the Halo universe. We have enough MOBAs - or as I like to call them, RTS for simpletons.
> 2533274927592272;3:
> Also, a Dota-style game would be completely out of place in the Halo universe. We have enough MOBAs - or as I like to call them, RTS for simpletons.
How would a DotA game be completely out of place? Especially if it’s a user-made game?
It doesn’t even have to be canon- or set in the Halo universe, only use known and new characters from the Halo universe, Heroes of the Storm, while I dislike the whacky skins, is a game that does it.
Furthermore, how can we have “enough” MOBAs? It’s a genre, don’t we have enough FPS, RPGs, Driving etc, games then?
Why “RTS for simpeltons”? Do you dislike MOBAs and try to downplay them?
> 2533274809541057;2:
> Sorry to burst your bubble.
>
> From Rooster Teeth’s Jack and Gus E3 interview with Kevin Grace [Narrative Design Director] on Halo Wars 2."… We don’t have anything in the plans for user-generated game modes or custom Forge maps…"
EDIT: quoted wrong person haha, also, hello fellow viking.
> 2533274927592272;3:
> Also, a Dota-style game would be completely out of place in the Halo universe. We have enough MOBAs - or as I like to call them, RTS for simpletons.
the same thing was said when the original halo wars was announced lol
> 2533274795123910;4:
> > 2533274927592272;3:
> > Also, a Dota-style game would be completely out of place in the Halo universe. We have enough MOBAs - or as I like to call them, RTS for simpletons.
>
>
> How would a DotA game be completely out of place? Especially if it’s a user-made game?
>
> It doesn’t even have to be canon- or set in the Halo universe, only use known and new characters from the Halo universe, Heroes of the Storm, while I dislike the whacky skins, is a game that does it.
>
> Furthermore, how can we have “enough” MOBAs? It’s a genre, don’t we have enough FPS, RPGs, Driving etc, games then?
> Why “RTS for simpeltons”? Do you dislike MOBAs and try to downplay them?
exactly. especially since I suggested it be user created lol I wasnt expecting it to be cannon. Halo has a ton of characters to fill a roster and the console “MOBA” (I hate that term, I prefer Action RTS as it was originally called) is basically just smite at the moment so it could be fun
> 2741700308869377;5:
> > 2533274809541057;2:
> > Sorry to burst your bubble.
> >
> > From Rooster Teeth’s Jack and Gus E3 interview with Kevin Grace [Narrative Design Director] on Halo Wars 2."… We don’t have anything in the plans for user-generated game modes or custom Forge maps…"
>
>
> EDIT: quoted wrong person haha, also, hello fellow viking.
Hello, Son of Odin.
> 2741700308869377;7:
> > 2533274795123910;4:
> > > 2533274927592272;3:
> > > How would a DotA game be completely out of place? Especially if it’s a user-made game?
> > >
> > > It doesn’t even have to be canon- or set in the Halo universe, only use known and new characters from the Halo universe, Heroes of the Storm, while I dislike the whacky skins, is a game that does it.
> > >
> > > Furthermore, how can we have “enough” MOBAs? It’s a genre, don’t we have enough FPS, RPGs, Driving etc, games then?
> >
> >
> > Why “RTS for simpeltons”? Do you dislike MOBAs and try to downplay them?
>
>
> exactly. especially since I suggested it be user created lol I wasnt expecting it to be cannon. Halo has a ton of characters to fill a roster and the console “MOBA” (I hate that term, I prefer Action RTS as it was originally called) is basically just smite at the moment so it could be fun
Perhaps I was a little too salty the first time around. Let me elaborate.
I feel as if a MOBA-style game wouldn’t be at home in the Halo universe - not in the Halo canon, but utilising elements from the universe like you suggested - for two main reasons. The first is the focus on realism within the Halo universe - see, MOBAs often present you with situations in which, let’s say an armoured Knight (we’ll call him Garen) and a skimpily dressed acrobat who throws knives (we’ll just call her Katarina for the sake of ease, wink wink) are depicted as equal in combat when they’d really not be if the universe had any sense of realism - thrown knives bounce off plate, sword doesn’t bounce off thin leather/-Yoink!- skin so Kat runs away.
Halo, on the other hand, whilst it doesn’t have realistic gameplay, does follow a strong sense of realism. You won’t see a UNSC Marine overcome a Spartan because she “popped her ult at the right time”, and you sure as hell won’t see a grunt kite a -Yoinking!- elite with an energy sword. In order to properly implement characters like that into Halo, you’d need to ignore this sense of realism, which is something that doesn’t sit right with me and absolutely will not sit will with large amounts of fans.
And this notion that MOBAs are “action-RTS” is absolutely ridiculous, but does show exactly why I have a general distaste for them - despite occasionally playing League because my friends do. Basically, they’re RTS games that take most of the management out off them and have you focus on a single unit. Instead of making the player focus on a whole battlefield, they reduce the scale (taking away most of the appeal of RTS games) and allow players to focus on the eternal micro of a single unit. They’re less fun and more just a construct engineered for competitive players to demonstrate their skill.
Then there’s the fact that the Halo universe is one that is defined by scale. That’s why the FPS gameplay is considered unique, because it is much larger scale than most FPS - at least it was at the time of Halo 1-3. You had many more enemies on-screen at once, and had a much bigger battlefield to fight on. That’s why it made such a good translation to an RTS - and why, I believe, seeing depictions of Halo in the form of a MOBA would be massively underwhelming.
There’s a little more of an elaboration.
> 2533274927592272;9:
> I feel as if a MOBA-style game wouldn’t be at home in the Halo universe - not in the Halo canon, but utilising elements from the universe like you suggested - for two main reasons. The first is the focus on realism within the Halo universe - see, MOBAs often present you with situations in which, let’s say an armoured Knight (we’ll call him Garen) and a skimpily dressed acrobat who throws knives (we’ll just call her Katarina for the sake of ease, wink wink) are depicted as equal in combat when they’d really not be if the universe had any sense of realism - thrown knives bounce off plate, sword doesn’t bounce off thin leather/-Yoink!- skin so Kat runs away.
But Characters in MOBAs are not put on equal footing in combat. Different charactets have different roles. Kat will run away from Garen in the MOBA as well because her skill set is bettet suited for other tactics than Garen’s direct approach combat.
Sven in DotA totally flattens many charactets on the same level as him in direct combat, but in turn can get flattened by other charactrrs. Then some characters exist for the sole purpose of being supportive. Wisp comes to mind, while you surely can carry with it, it’s a lot more difficult than say with Rikki or Sniper.
Abathur in HotS can’t survive at all in the battlefield and is more or less forced to be glued to home base. He has to rely on other heroes and his mines to make a difference.
So, Kat has to rely on other tactics, and team mates, in order to take on Garen. Not to mention, knights in armor usually have openings in joints. It’s not impossible to imagine that her knife throwing skills are good enough to hit those openings in order to actually hurt Garen. Kat however being armorless means she has far more manouverability meaning she can dodge his hits better. However not represented in game as not taking damage. That is if they’re even meant to be at the same combat level.
I’m certain you’re familiar with Dungeons and Dragons? Characters have the attribute AC, which is Armor Class. However, a character with no armor can still have a high AC because the number only represents how difficult you are to inflict damage upon. Either you’re a tank and everything bounce off or you’re light and nimble to the point where you’re difficult to hit. AC 18 can mean many things.
> 2533274927592272;9:
> Halo, on the other hand, whilst it doesn’t have realistic gameplay, does follow a strong sense of realism. You won’t see a UNSC Marine overcome a Spartan because she “popped her ult at the right time”, and you sure as hell won’t see a grunt kite a -Yoinking!- elite with an energy sword. In order to properly implement characters like that into Halo, you’d need to ignore this sense of realism, which is something that doesn’t sit right with me and absolutely will not sit will with large amounts of fans.
Going back to the first point. Different characters have different roles. Who said that a grunt would kite a sword wielding elite? There are quite a few characters in many mobas who are not able to properly kite due to lower movement speeds or no escape abilities.
That is of they even go as far as to implement low strength looking characters as playable characters. Unless of course they come up with some very niche way of implementing them.
HotS:
Cho’ Gall: Two headed ogre, two players and one body.
Abathur: Global skill set only hero. “Infects” ally heros and can shoot from the infected hero as well as shield it. Can lay mines and clone ally heros or evolve creeps into a super creep which is also controllable if Abathur choose to infect it.
Murky: Low strength hero, easy to kill, fast respawn. Have not familiarized myself with it.
DotA:
Meepo: Hero with many copies acting as their own units, though restricted from the original. Free to move around the map though. One die, all die.
Halo has quite a few Spartans and Elites to choose from on terms of Characters, dead and alive. Then there’s hunters and brutes as well. So a Hero roster of stronger characters would not be difficult to put together. If using low strength characters or groups would be out of the question.
> 2533274927592272;9:
> [And this notion that MOBAs are “action-RTS” is absolutely ridiculous, but does show exactly why I have a general distaste for them - despite occasionally playing League because my friends do. Basically, they’re RTS games that take most of the management out off them and have you focus on a single unit. Instead of making the player focus on a whole battlefield, they reduce the scale (taking away most of the appeal of RTS games) and allow players to focus on the eternal micro of a single unit. They’re less fun and more just a construct engineered for competitive players to demonstrate their skill.
>
> Then there’s the fact that the Halo universe is one that is defined by scale. That’s why the FPS gameplay is considered unique, because it is much larger scale than most FPS - at least it was at the time of Halo 1-3. You had many more enemies on-screen at once, and had a much bigger battlefield to fight on. That’s why it made such a good translation to an RTS - and why, I believe, seeing depictions of Halo in the form of a MOBA would be massively underwhelming.
Myes, the issue is that you see them as a simplification of a main-genre rather than looking at it as its own thing. I’d say the ARTS is more aimed at MOBAs like DotA and LoL where the camera is free, can be locked, and you click where you want to go and attack and such, games which share similarities with RTS games. However the similarities to Top-Down hack’n’slash games are also there. You control a hero with abilities, like in Diablo 2 for instance. Locked camera, control where you go etc. You manage resources, acquire upgrades and so forth, yet it’s an RPG.
In Guardians of Middle Earth it was more of a top down shooter. In Smite it’s a third person shooter. Paragon is also a Third Person Shooter. Yet they’re defined as MOBAs. Just because it came out of the RTS genre, doesn’t mean we need to define it as such, or that microing one unit, or several, means it’s an RTS. Because in many games, you do micro one unit, yet they’re defined as something else than an RTS.
Just because Massive scale Mobas haven’t been made, doesn’t mean they aren’t possible. Either through player participation or creep masses. DotA 2 can be played with 20 players instead of 10.
> 2533274927592272;9:
> > 2741700308869377;7:
> > > 2533274795123910;4:
> > > > 2533274927592272;3:
> > > > How would a DotA game be completely out of place? Especially if it’s a user-made game?
> > > >
> > > > It doesn’t even have to be canon- or set in the Halo universe, only use known and new characters from the Halo universe, Heroes of the Storm, while I dislike the whacky skins, is a game that does it.
> > > >
> > > > Furthermore, how can we have “enough” MOBAs? It’s a genre, don’t we have enough FPS, RPGs, Driving etc, games then?
> > >
> > >
> > > Why “RTS for simpeltons”? Do you dislike MOBAs and try to downplay them?
> >
> >
> > exactly. especially since I suggested it be user created lol I wasnt expecting it to be cannon. Halo has a ton of characters to fill a roster and the console “MOBA” (I hate that term, I prefer Action RTS as it was originally called) is basically just smite at the moment so it could be fun
>
>
> Perhaps I was a little too salty the first time around. Let me elaborate.
>
> I feel as if a MOBA-style game wouldn’t be at home in the Halo universe - not in the Halo canon, but utilising elements from the universe like you suggested - for two main reasons. The first is the focus on realism within the Halo universe - see, MOBAs often present you with situations in which, let’s say an armoured Knight (we’ll call him Garen) and a skimpily dressed acrobat who throws knives (we’ll just call her Katarina for the sake of ease, wink wink) are depicted as equal in combat when they’d really not be if the universe had any sense of realism - thrown knives bounce off plate, sword doesn’t bounce off thin leather/-Yoink!- skin so Kat runs away.
>
> Halo, on the other hand, whilst it doesn’t have realistic gameplay, does follow a strong sense of realism. You won’t see a UNSC Marine overcome a Spartan because she “popped her ult at the right time”, and you sure as hell won’t see a grunt kite a -Yoinking!- elite with an energy sword. In order to properly implement characters like that into Halo, you’d need to ignore this sense of realism, which is something that doesn’t sit right with me and absolutely will not sit will with large amounts of fans.
>
> And this notion that MOBAs are “action-RTS” is absolutely ridiculous, but does show exactly why I have a general distaste for them - despite occasionally playing League because my friends do. Basically, they’re RTS games that take most of the management out off them and have you focus on a single unit. Instead of making the player focus on a whole battlefield, they reduce the scale (taking away most of the appeal of RTS games) and allow players to focus on the eternal micro of a single unit. They’re less fun and more just a construct engineered for competitive players to demonstrate their skill.
>
> Then there’s the fact that the Halo universe is one that is defined by scale. That’s why the FPS gameplay is considered unique, because it is much larger scale than most FPS - at least it was at the time of Halo 1-3. You had many more enemies on-screen at once, and had a much bigger battlefield to fight on. That’s why it made such a good translation to an RTS - and why, I believe, seeing depictions of Halo in the form of a MOBA would be massively underwhelming.
>
> There’s a little more of an elaboration.
I think 100% of what you said here is subjective. I think that halo fans would like the idea of a halo-inspired moba game… especially since again my idea was for a fan made mod not a AAA developed game.
I feel comparing Garen vs Kat to Spartan vs Marine is not a valid comparrisoin. in a game like this a marine would most liking be a creep and not a playable character. Also as stated above kat and garen dont just run at eachother and pop ults they have rolls and playstyles just like in the FPS halo. A dude with a sniper is going to stay back and a dude with a energy sword is gonna push forward etc.
and example of some characters would mostly be (and ill use league of legends examples as it seems you have some familiarity with it, although I think as mobas are concerned league is terrible which is why I said DOTA clone):
Arbiter - melee fighter, like garen
Chief - Close - mid range, fighter/support hybrid, like J4
lek-golo - support tank, low damage high health - alistar
Jul’MDama - support caster, buffs team - sona
Linda-058 - range DPS, snuper - caitlyn
thats a rough example of a balance team if i was creating the mod. if arbiter is fighting MDama 1v1 in halo fiction or in this game hes gonna win, if hes in melee range fighting chief he might also win, but what if MDama is buffing him? (MDama is not a good fighter at all in the halo lore, but he did inspire a covanat uprising so… )
Linda probably couldnt 1v1 chief but if chief was being tanked by a lek-golo and she had free shots with a sniper then yeah she could probably take him out. the reason for them fighting is clearly not canon but the “realism” you are looking for is still there.
Not gonna lie it would be really cool.
> 2533274927592272;3:
> Also, a Dota-style game would be completely out of place in the Halo universe. We have enough MOBAs - or as I like to call them, RTS for simpletons.
How? We already have Warzone and that took some very heavy inspiration from MOBAs. Not saying we should get a Halo MOBA but at the same time it’s not all that far fetched. But it should be more like Smite than Dota, it’ll appeal to console fans more that way since Smite is on consoles. We already have a ton of characters that we can use as characters.
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Halo ware 2 (forge non crée) ?
I really do happen they add somthing like this or at least a lot of mods such as the game devs supported modding for Halo Wars 2 so there would be tons of stuff such as a infinite pop cap, mantis from Halo 4 & 5, a huge space mod inspired by Halo Reach’s models, and have a unlimited spartan count like the spartan from Halo Wars 1 not Halo Wars 2 & maybe some units from other games like anything for example: some COD units maybe some mega units or a few more uber units or maybe a dinosaur lol 
I really hope they support modding for the Xbox 1 Halo Wars 2 version?
Eww. MOBAs. It’s not like I have anything really against it (I haven’t really played enough MOBAs to make a proper decision) but I really don’t enjoy MOBAs. So I’m against this idea. (That didn’t make any sense :/)
> 2533274882881665;16:
> Eww. MOBAs. It’s not like I have anything really against it (I haven’t really played enough MOBAs to make a proper decision) but I really don’t enjoy MOBAs. So I’m against this idea. (That didn’t make any sense :/)
I agree I don’t like MOBAs ( I’ve played a few) mostly because you only control 1 unit but if I could sacrifice my hero to control the spawning AI’s I’d play more but that’s never happening so 10/10 on what you said. IMO
> 2533274974795861;15:
> I really do happen they add somthing like this or at least a lot of mods such as the game devs supported modding for Halo Wars 2 so there would be tons of stuff such as a infinite pop cap, mantis from Halo 4 & 5, a huge space mod inspired by Halo Reach’s models, and have a unlimited spartan count like the spartan from Halo Wars 1 not Halo Wars 2 & maybe some units from other games like anything for example: some COD units maybe some mega units or a few more uber units or maybe a dinosaur lol
>
> I really hope they support modding for the Xbox 1 Halo Wars 2 version?
Srry If I used wrong grammar it’s because I’m using a phone so If i type a 1 letter in a word wrong it thinks I’m typing another word than what I intended to say.