Halo Needs to Evolve

[Celestis]

@ShinoKeiyakusha

@Celestis

The last couple of Halo games all were slower than the original Trilogy. Halo CE to this day is still the fastest games of the franchise.

I agree with most of what you’ve said, but this I disagree with.
Halo 3 was very slow compared to 4, 5 and Infinite.

Not according to my measurements.

I have measured the time spent running around the maps just looking for other players in Halo 3, Reach and 4.
In Halo 3, it took me around 5-10 seconds to get from engagement to engagement (be it winning a fight or losing and respawning… or in the case of Reach and 4, the enemy just running away) whereas in Halo Reach and 4 it took me between 15-20 seconds. This is more than twice as long and is caused by the bloated maps that are a consequence of sprint and other AMM being added to the games.

I haven’t tested H5G myself, but according to other people’s measurements, H5G is substantially slower than Halo 3 at least on a pro level, with matches taking longer to finish with less kills being made in the process: https://www.reddit.com/r/halo/comments/656gyr/halo_5_appears_to_be_substantially_slowerpaced/

I haven’t made objective measurements for Infinite either, but it currently seems to be faster than the last couple of games because sprint speed is only 9% higher than BMS, so the maps don’t have to be as bloated as its predecessors.

[lmperialOne]

I do know equal starts and it is because both teams spawn and use the wepaons and equipment. Not one team is favored over the other.

@commando544

But none of it is equal, you have no prediction on what some other player will pick and thus what their capabilities will be

And Halo CE, 2 and 3 have equal starts spawn with the same weapons but you can’t predict the outcome because you don’t know how good the other person is with the br and what their capabilities will be.

Equal starts don’t apply in invasion (although can still be argued) and Halo 4 with the custom loadouts.

[lmperialOne]

But both sides spawn with the same loadouts to choose from how is it not equal? Again its not the games fault that people are only picking sprint and then getting slayed by the guy flying with a jetpack and not picking it to counter him.

[commando544]

@lmperialOne

I do know equal starts and it is because both teams spawn and use the wepaons and equipment. Not one team is favored over the other.

Not being able to know what weapon and abilities a player will have is just bad game design for an arena shooter and breaks Halo’s arena combat.

@lmperialOne

And Halo CE, 2 and 3 have equal starts spawn with the same weapons but you can’t predict the outcome because you don’t know how good the other person is with the br and what their capabilities will be.

That’s how all video games work so try a different arguing point, of course players are different but their weapons and abilities are predictable ( the exact definition of an arena shooter )

[commando544]

And then I pick jetpack and he dies to someone else and picks drop shield and camps, so I lose no matter what due to RNG.

[ShinoKeiyakusha]

@commando544

The time it takes to get into combat after spawn is much faster than in H5, maps are scaled to the speed H3 plays in so it takes a much shorter amount of time to get into the action.

@Celestis

This is more than twice as long and is caused by the bloated maps that are a consequence of sprint and other AMM being added to the games.

It takes seconds to get into battles on Aquarius, Streets, Bazaar and Live Fire.
Launch Site and Highpower are about the same as High Ground from what I remember.
Recharge is about the same as the Pit.
Fragmentation is about the same as Sand Trap.
Behemoth is about the same as Valhalla.

The time it takes to get into battles isn’t much different, and you both seem to be forgetting that Halo 3 had large maps despite how slow movement was.

Edit: Sorry, I misread.
I thought you were both talking about Infinite, not Halo 5.

[Celestis]

@ShinoKeiyakusha

The time it takes to get into battles isn’t much different, and you both seem to be forgetting that Halo 3 had large maps despite how slow movement was.

All the large Halo 3 maps also had vehicles on them. The purely infantry maps in Halo 3 were substantially smaller than maps in its sequels. Tsassi (a moderator on these forums here) measured the areas: https://i.imgur.com/JEXoVcN.png

EDIT: Infinite wasn’t tested yet. It would be interesting to have verifyable data to compare.

[yeskezspanem]

@lmperialOne

But both sides spawn with the same loadouts to choose from how is it not equal?

Is everyone starting with the same exact load out? The answer is that simple.

[lmperialOne]

@commando544

But none of it is equal, you have no prediction on what some other player will pick and thus what their capabilities will be

You said it wasn’t predictable

@commando544

That’s how all video games work so try a different arguing point, of course players are different but their weapons and abilities are predictable ( the exact definition of an arena shooter )

But now they’re predictable
Stop contradicting yourself you halo 3 fanatic.

And if that’s how all video games work then that applies to halo reach too bc like you just said they’re weapons and abilities are predictable because both sides have DMRs and ARs in the loadouts, just as Halo 3 With BRs and ARs at spawn.

With the armor abilities in Reach you don’t know what the guy has until he uses it SAME with Halo 3 you don’t know what equipment the guy has until he uses it(Radar Jammer, Power Drain, Regen, Bubble shield). The only difference is that in Halo 3 both had to find the equipment to use it while in Reach both teams have preset loadouts with the same armor abilities for both. How is Reach less equal than Halo 3?

While in Halo 3 someone with equipment you can’t tell it just gets morphed into their body while in Reach behind the persons back on the lower spine is where the armor ability is located with different colors indicating which one they have. So you can predict what they have more in Reach than Halo 3.

[lmperialOne]

Do both teams have the same loadouts to choose from? the answer is that simple.

[lmperialOne]

And if the guy picks bubble shield don’t push him when he sits and heals in it you’re obviously going to lose. Don’t bot walk into his bubble and walk on the nade he throws inside as they jump out. Its literally the same as someone camping in a bubble shield in Halo 3 and you bot walking in it as they throw a nade in and jump out there is no difference.

Oh wait doesn’t both teams have the choice to pick bubbleshield too, oh yes thats right its not favored to one. Just because one perosn is utilizing what the game offers and you’re not doesn’t make it unequal starts.

And its not RNG when both teams can pick the same sfuff, do you know what RNG means? Have you played fiesta because that gamemode is RNG the true definition of RNG for Halo.

[yeskezspanem]

Equal starts = equal starts.

1 jetpack =/ 1 sprint
1 active cammo =/ 1 jetpack
1 armor lock =/ 1 active cammo
1 bubble shield =/ 1 armor lock
1 sprint =/ 1 bubble shield

It’s a far better system than the custom loadouts in 4 but Reach did not have equal starts.

[commando544]

@lmperialOne

You said it wasn’t predictable

Yes, it isn’t

@lmperialOne

But now they’re predictable
Stop contradicting yourself you halo 3 fanatic.

Yes I can predict when he is going to pick jetpack before he does it. ( sarcasm )

[commando544]

You simply don’t understand how equal starts works, you aren’t winning any arguments since you don’t understand the concept.

[lmperialOne]

You’re wrong on that let me correct it for you,

1 jetpack =/ 1 hologram, sprint, camo, evade, bubble shield and armor lock.

1 sprint =/ 1 evade, hologram, camo, jetpack, armor lock, bubbleshield

1 camo =/ 1 bubble shield, sprint, jetpack, hologram, evade, armorlock

1 hologram =/ 1 camo, sprint, jetpack, evade, armor lock, bubble shield

1 evade =/ 1 armorlock, sprint, camo, jetpack, bubble shield, hologram

1 bubbleshield =/1 jetpack, sprint, camo, evade, armor lock, hologram

1 armor lock =/ 1 sprint, camo, jetpack, evade, hologram, bubbleshield

They all cancel each other out equally. Although it goes down to people’s preferences but as I just showed you and say again they all cancel each other out equally and as I’ve been constantly having to repeat myself both sides can choose and spawn with the same stuff. (Other than invasion but can be argued)

[lmperialOne]

I do and you clearly don’t understand rng and you already contradicted yourself

[commando544]

Yes, Reach is RNG and H3 isn’t

[commando544]

That’s not how game design works you dolt, this isn’t some class based shooter with unique traits and specializations.

[lmperialOne]

They’re both not rng

[lmperialOne]

Then why don’t you say that to your boyfriend who thinks its like that too.