After playing the Infinite Tech Preview, I have a point I’d like to address, in hopes 343 come around if they don’t have plans too already.
the gameplay was awesome, I’m extremely excited for its actual release! I’m a huge fan of the direction they’re taking. I’m not a huge fan of battle passes in games but I think it could work in infinite if a few things are addressed.
my main issue is after you complete the daily/weekly challenges you have no reason to continue playing progression wise (for at least 24 hours until the daily challenges reset)
I’d like to see some form of ranking system like reach. So then when you can no longer unlock armour etc from the battle pass, all your grinding in online multiplayer is still worth while working towards a 1-50 rank, I for one loved being able to earn a high amount of kills and medals in a match and have them go towards commendations and help boost my actual rank. At the moment I feel like I’ll feel ripped off when I’ve maxed out the battle pass and have to start from scratch again when the next season comes out with no other ranking system in place to show how much effort I’ve been putting in to the game.
would love to hear everyone’s thoughts and hope 343 can oblige with some input also, cheers!!
I really don’t understand this need for the 1-50 ranking system, is it your just in love with a number attached to your rank? Heck how about 1-100 then?
If you clicked “rank help” in the tech demo it actually stated what the ranks are going to be… Alah the same is Halo 5 which I’m perfectly fine with Bronze, Silver, Gold, Diamond, Oynx and top echelon of players going Champion.
And actually if you read some of the posts in here from other areas of this forum you’d learn that the H3 rank system is quite inferior to that of which H5 became, and that’s not a subjective statement either, numbers and data back it up. Unfortunately the man who lead the charge in that department no longer works for the company so maybe you’ll get your 1-50 system after all, who knows.
I used to be a huge advocate for going back to that system however the Halo 5 ranking system is borderline perfect. It requires you to meet a threshold to be the best.
Infinite will have a Spartan Rank - which is the same as the XP based 1-50 in Reach. We don’t know if it’s 1-50 (Reach), 1-152 (Halo 5), or something else. We just saw that everyone had a ‘1’ on their name plate.
Ideally it would have exponential type levels out to 100 or so… and then repeat that last level over and over. First to 1000 wins!
As for skill ranks… I do prefer Bronze-Onyx over 1-50. Although it doesn’t really matter… they both have the same TrueSkill2 based MMR internally.
> 2533274801996916;2:
> I really don’t understand this need for the 1-50 ranking system, is it your just in love with a number attached to your rank? Heck how about 1-100 then?
> If you clicked “rank help” in the tech demo it actually stated what the ranks are going to be… Alah the same is Halo 5 which I’m perfectly fine with Bronze, Silver, Gold, Diamond, Oynx and top echelon of players going Champion.
>
> And actually if you read some of the posts in here from other areas of this forum you’d learn that the H3 rank system is quite inferior to that of which H5 became, and that’s not a subjective statement either, numbers and data back it up. Unfortunately the man who lead the charge in that department no longer works for the company so maybe you’ll get your 1-50 system after all, who knows.
I am happy with the idea of a Halo 5 type ranking system, based on your skill level. but it would be good to see something that rewards the player for how long they’ve played game, not just how skilled you are, im all for both, I have friends who would play halo day in day out but who arent that skilled, it would be nice to have a ranking system like reaches added as well to show the dedication of players.
The 1 - 50 ranks still exists in H5. They just have a different title. The original Halo 3 actually had a 1 - 75 but the final 25 ranks were hidden. This was confirmed by ex 343 employee Josh Menke.
Infinite should have a system split between MCC and H5. There will be a progression system similar to MCC and the competitive ranks like H5. Then on the side we will have our battle pass system. It should be quite user friendly and give everyone a sense of achievement at the end of each match. I know I personally like to see myself moving forward toward something.
> 2535445608274502;6:
> The 1 - 50 ranks still exists in H5. They just have a different title. The original Halo 3 actually had a 1 - 75 but the final 25 ranks were hidden. This was confirmed by ex 343 employee Josh Menke.
>
> Infinite should have a system split between MCC and H5. There will be a progression system similar to MCC and the competitive ranks like H5. Then on the side we will have our battle pass system. It should be quite user friendly and give everyone a sense of achievement at the end of each match. I know I personally like to see myself moving forward toward something.
Couldn’t agree more. Have something for everyone, so everyone gets some sense of achievement that keeps bringing them back!
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> > 2533274801996916;2:
> > I really don’t understand this need for the 1-50 ranking system, is it your just in love with a number attached to your rank? Heck how about 1-100 then?
> > If you clicked “rank help” in the tech demo it actually stated what the ranks are going to be… Alah the same is Halo 5 which I’m perfectly fine with Bronze, Silver, Gold, Diamond, Oynx and top echelon of players going Champion.
> >
> > And actually if you read some of the posts in here from other areas of this forum you’d learn that the H3 rank system is quite inferior to that of which H5 became, and that’s not a subjective statement either, numbers and data back it up. Unfortunately the man who lead the charge in that department no longer works for the company so maybe you’ll get your 1-50 system after all, who knows.
>
> I am happy with the idea of a Halo 5 type ranking system, based on your skill level. but it would be good to see something that rewards the player for how long they’ve played game, not just how skilled you are, im all for both, I have friends who would play halo day in day out but who arent that skilled, it would be nice to have a ranking system like reaches added as well to show the dedication of players.
The whole battle pass system isn’t the only thing you can work towards OP. ranks and such are coming back for e.g. the 152 grind in halo 5 or reach etc.
My thing about Halo 5’s ranking system was the fact that it reset every season. Perfectly fine with Bronze-Champion but as long as it doesn’t reset. Would prefer 1-50 though, as it’s to pay respect to the trilogy beforehand.
> 2535415525919240;10:
> My thing about Halo 5’s ranking system was the fact that it reset every season. Perfectly fine with Bronze-Champion but as long as it doesn’t reset. Would prefer 1-50 though, as it’s to pay respect to the trilogy beforehand.
343 really hasn’t done a great job of selling the reset.
Yes, it’s a crutch to encourage people to come back regularly… but I think it also serves an important reset for TrueSkill2. During the re-ranking period they can increase the sigma value that controls how much your rank varies. This makes your rank volatile (like when you first start) but allows them to quickly re-assess and rerank you. It’s essentially the exact opposite of the rank blocking in Halo 3 (where your sigma value got very small and stuck there).
Your MMR doesn’t get reset… it just gets a bit more volatile (which also explains the swing you sometimes get in opponent quality).
Maybe the MMR could be kept visible - just to the player… and then made public when you are re-ranked and the MMR has stabilised. Or they could soften the changes to the CSR (your displayed rank) even if the MMR is swinging a bit.
Or they could just have a system where your sigma value is increased more regularly but not as drastically - ie. not back to first game levels.
As for the 1-50… the biggest problem is going to be selling it to those who remember Halo 3. The hidden internal levels really skewed the 1-50 to the right. I’m not sure those who remembered getting a 50 would be happy when they now struggle towards 40.
I liked the old ranking system but it was removed for a reason if I remember correctly. It promotes cheating and deleveling both. That’s why they went away from it. All of their systems have an actual ranking system n to hopefully place us with other like players. It’s just not shown because of the negative side effects.
I get the point of having some thing to play for, but if a game is truly fun you play it for pure enjoyment. Lol I miss halo 2 and 3 so much.
As long as we get xp/credits for playing matches and getting kills as well as the challenges I’m happy. The beta felt dumb once you ran out of challenges because you literally couldn’t earn any xp and progress… I was lucky and just bought all the levels of the battle pass with the credits we received from the get go but for players who used any of those credits to get anything else from the store they seriously struggled to get to level 20.
Unless its only designed this way for players vs bots and you get xp for playing/getting kills in a pvp match but I did not get to test this since 343 decided to only do pvp for 2 hours while I was at work… but if it is the case for pvp matches as well then its kinda pointless for me to try and get as many kills as possible and win since I’ll only earn xp if I go back smack a spartan or play 5 games etc…
As for overall levels I feel we should be keeping the battle pass level separate to our overall spartan rank, to me it just feels cheap having my rank tied to something that someone can drop money on and instantly have a higher level than one I’ve grinded for, not to mention the fact the battle pass level resets at the end of a season.
I really just hope we will have some form of rank that sticks with us over the whole course of our infinite career that doesn’t reset so we can have a sense of progression like with reach and 3, fair enough have your diamond, gold whatever ranks for people who want to have to level that up competitively every month or whenever they reset but also allow for players who don’t want to have to grind every reset to have some form of lifetime rank.
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> > 2535445608274502;6:
> > The 1 - 50 ranks still exists in H5. They just have a different title. The original Halo 3 actually had a 1 - 75 but the final 25 ranks were hidden. This was confirmed by ex 343 employee Josh Menke.
> >
> > Infinite should have a system split between MCC and H5. There will be a progression system similar to MCC and the competitive ranks like H5. Then on the side we will have our battle pass system. It should be quite user friendly and give everyone a sense of achievement at the end of each match. I know I personally like to see myself moving forward toward something.
>
> Couldn’t agree more. Have something for everyone, so everyone gets some sense of achievement that keeps bringing them back!
Exactly! I absolutely love grinding for max in everything Halo, I just love to show off my stats. I’m a bit nerdy like that
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> As for overall levels I feel we should be keeping the battle pass level separate to our overall spartan rank, to me it just feels cheap having my rank tied to something that someone can drop money on and instantly have a higher level than one I’ve grinded for, not to mention the fact the battle pass level resets at the end of a season.
It would appear so. Our nameplates had the number ‘1’ on them. Assuming this is an XP based Spartan Rank like in Halo 5.
> 2533274836627202;13:
> I really just hope we will have some form of rank that sticks with us over the whole course of our infinite career that doesn’t reset so we can have a sense of progression like with reach and 3, fair enough have your diamond, gold whatever ranks for people who want to have to level that up competitively every month or whenever they reset but also allow for players who don’t want to have to grind every reset to have some form of lifetime rank.
Remember that Reach was XP based and not skill… so it doesn’t count.
Halo 3 was just wrong. Hidden levels and rank locking. It sucked.
As for Halo 5. The divisions (bronze to onyx) have nothing to do with the reset - it’s just a way to describe your internal rank (MMR). It could be a number, a colour, or a division. It’s all the same under the hood. The resets just give the system a chance to re-calibrate.
And the resets don’t really force you to grind. Your MMR is not reset. You are just required to play 10 grading games to check your ranking.
There is a bit of a grind for Onyx players… but that is just because TrueSkill (and any Elo based system) needs games between the top players to sort out the pecking order. The system can predict very quickly that you are Onyx - but it needs lots of games between those players to find your exact ranking. I guess this is only important if you want to display an acutal MMR (the number with your Onyx rank) or to allocate things like Champion status.
Besides - you do have a ‘lifetime’ rank. When you check your overall stats it shows your ‘highest’ rank.
I personally feel your skill rank resetting every season is pretty pointless (like Halo 5). No ones wants a skill rank that they worked so hard to get to be irrelevant at the end of the season. I like to be able to play the top players when I feel like it. Then also play casual games such as social but have some sort of exp gain from it like in Halo 3 that worked to a rank combined with your skill rank. Even the social felt rewarding and fun on the way they implemented the ranking system. There’s a reason Halo 3 stayed so popular for so many years and it’s because Bungie had the multiplayer and it’s ranking system perfect. It made the grind fun and worth it. No one here can tell me they don’t miss the double exp events every weekend to try and get the big 2 exp. Fun times. Hopefully they look at what’s worked over the years and stop trying to fit into this seasonal ranking like ‘every’ other shooter like Apex for example. 343 need to realise the things what made the franchise great. Whether that was through Bungie or not. They still need to acknowledge that Halo 4 and Halo 5 were levels below Halo 3 for a lot of the reasons I mentioned above and then some.
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> I personally feel your skill rank resetting every season is pretty pointless (like Halo 5). No ones wants a skill rank that they worked so hard to get to be irrelevant at the end of the season. I like to be able to play the top players when I feel like it.
343 hasn’t sold this well. Your rank doesn’t actually ‘reset’. Your MMR (internal rank) stays the same and is used to match make your grading games.
I suspect they increase how much your rank can change per result (the opposite of how rank lock broke Halo 3). This makes your rank a bit more volatile and allows the system to quickly (and accurately) re-rank you. This is why they hide your CSR (external rank) and why the quality of your opponents can swing a bit during grading.
Plus it helps reign back the really high Onyx players who would theoretically keep drifting up if they win more than they lose.
So not pointless. Just not well explained / implemented.
> 2533274854492804;17:
> There’s a reason Halo 3 stayed so popular for so many years and it’s because Bungie had the multiplayer and it’s ranking system perfect.
There are plenty of reasons Halo 3 was so popular… but it wasn’t the ranking system.
First up there were 25 or so hidden ranks… so that a ‘50’ could be anywhere from ‘50’ to ‘75’.
Secondly there was rank locking. The sigma value that governed how much your rank could change dropped too low and you ended up having to win an obscene number of consecutive games to rank up (or lose to rank down).
And thirdly, because of rank locking, we had rank boosting. Good players could start new accounts and quickly get them up to level ‘50’ as they rank locked. They could then sell these accounts for people to play on knowing that they were rank locked to a level they hadn’t earned.
> 2533274854492804;17:
> They still need to acknowledge that Halo 4 and Halo 5 were levels below Halo 3 for a lot of the reasons I mentioned above and then some.
H4 and H5 both had faults… but H3 was far from perfect; poor FOV, broken dual-wielding (probably a tautology), and a -Yoink- ranking system for a start!
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> OP is getting their wish.
>
> Infinite will have a Spartan Rank - which is the same as the XP based 1-50 in Reach. We don’t know if it’s 1-50 (Reach), 1-152 (Halo 5), or something else. We just saw that everyone had a ‘1’ on their name plate.
>
> Ideally it would have exponential type levels out to 100 or so… and then repeat that last level over and over. First to 1000 wins!
>
> As for skill ranks… I do prefer Bronze-Onyx over 1-50. Although it doesn’t really matter… they both have the same TrueSkill2 based MMR internally.
The 1 on the nameplate was the emblem. You could change this from the waypoint mobile app beta and has nothing to do with Level…
I don’t like the challenges for being the only way to level up the battlepass. It’ll take away enjoyment from playing with friends to grinding specific challenges and playing modes you might not want to just to level up.
