In your halo remake development add in forge a feature where you can add grunt bots and etc… please. LOOKING FORWARD IN YOUR DEVELOPMENT
We can’t place bots in forge because it would be so complicated to code and to save the map…
But it is still possible to place new objects (no-turret warthog, transport falcon…)
Caps lolck.
I’m hoping we get some decent objects on all the maps. Like no structure objects or anything, but I remember on Citadel, Standoff, and all those we got an okay number of objects to alter the map with.
> We can’t place bots in forge because it would be so complicated to code
I’m so tired of this “argument”…
Nothing is impossible to code!
Nothing is too complicated to code!
It’s their JOB to code!
If you can create THE UNIVERSE (read: a game) with code, you can code ANYTHING!
What you could say, though, is that they won’t do it because it’s out of the scope of the project or it requires more work than they’re willing to invest on a released game (Reach) - especially because a whole new trilogy has been announced.
It surely can happen in a future game, and we all hope it does! 
> > We can’t place bots in forge because it would be so complicated to code
>
> I’m so tired of this “argument”…
> Nothing is impossible to code!
> Nothing is too complicated to code!
> It’s their JOB to code!
>
> If you can create THE UNIVERSE (read: a game) with code, you can code ANYTHING!
>
>
> What you could say, though, is that they won’t do it because it’s out of the scope of the project or it requires more work than they’re willing to invest on a released game (Reach) - especially because a whole new trilogy has been announced.
> It surely can happen in a future game, and we all hope it does!
You’re right. It’s too difficult to code bots for Forge, but because the AI would need to respond to the environment around them. What do you think will happen when you make a Wall, Double floor and the A.I. is coded to avoid walls? What about using a platform (a piece they’d be able to walk on) as walls in a hallway?
These kind of constraints are why it’d be difficult to code an AI bot that can play properly with Forge creations, because they’re coded to react to the environment around them. Campaign is “on rails”, meaning the environment wont change. In Forge, it’s not the case.
> > > We can’t place bots in forge because it would be so complicated to code
> >
> > I’m so tired of this “argument”…
> > Nothing is impossible to code!
> > Nothing is too complicated to code!
> > It’s their JOB to code!
> >
> > If you can create THE UNIVERSE (read: a game) with code, you can code ANYTHING!
> >
> >
> > What you could say, though, is that they won’t do it because it’s out of the scope of the project or it requires more work than they’re willing to invest on a released game (Reach) - especially because a whole new trilogy has been announced.
> > It surely can happen in a future game, and we all hope it does!
>
> You’re right. It’s too difficult to code bots for Forge, but because the AI would need to respond to the environment around them. What do you think will happen when you make a Wall, Double floor and the A.I. is coded to avoid walls? What about using a platform (a piece they’d be able to walk on) as walls in a hallway?
>
> These kind of constraints are why it’d be difficult to code an AI bot that can play properly with Forge creations, because they’re coded to react to the environment around them. Campaign is “on rails”, meaning the environment wont change. In Forge, it’s not the case.
One possible solution would to make a forge option for either 1. floor 2. wall and so-on to make that not be an issue.
BT, its quite obvious that somebody doesn’t understand coding.
You cannot simply code for the angle of an object; you would have to specify an incredibly number of things to be taken into consideration; pitch, yaw, bend, whether the angle is walkable by a human, whether the AI could sense/see through the wall, etc. And the biggest reason you should realize that AI couldn’t be coded in? Because, in terms of Reach, this is little more than a map-pack download. Its not a whole new engine, and the current Reach engine simply cannot handle Dynamic AI in a custom-game setting.
Besides, it would be a pain in the butt if you had fifty grunts throwing grenades on an already framerate-clogged map… can you say lagfest!?
> BT, its quite obvious that somebody doesn’t understand coding.
>
> You cannot simply code for the angle of an object; you would have to specify an incredibly number of things to be taken into consideration; pitch, yaw, bend, whether the angle is walkable by a human, whether the AI could sense/see through the wall, etc. And the biggest reason you should realize that AI couldn’t be coded in? Because, in terms of Reach, this is little more than a map-pack download. Its not a whole new engine, and the current Reach engine simply cannot handle Dynamic AI in a custom-game setting.
>
> Besides, it would be a pain in the butt if you had fifty grunts throwing grenades on an already framerate-clogged map… can you say lagfest!?
>its quite obvious that somebody doesn’t understand coding.
You don’t necessarily need to specify all those characteristics to every object.
You can, of course, because you can do whatever the heck you want when coding, but it’s definitely not necessary.
It all depends on what type of programmer you are, really.
> > BT, its quite obvious that somebody doesn’t understand coding.
> >
> > You cannot simply code for the angle of an object; you would have to specify an incredibly number of things to be taken into consideration; pitch, yaw, bend, whether the angle is walkable by a human, whether the AI could sense/see through the wall, etc. And the biggest reason you should realize that AI couldn’t be coded in? Because, in terms of Reach, this is little more than a map-pack download. Its not a whole new engine, and the current Reach engine simply cannot handle Dynamic AI in a custom-game setting.
> >
> > Besides, it would be a pain in the butt if you had fifty grunts throwing grenades on an already framerate-clogged map… can you say lagfest!?
>
> >its quite obvious that somebody doesn’t understand coding.
>
> You don’t necessarily need to specify all those characteristics to every object.
> You can, of course, because you can do whatever the heck you want when coding, but it’s definitely not necessary.
>
> It all depends on what type of programmer you are, really.
They haven’t done it that way for Reach as far as I know, I seem to recall a public thread with one of the programmers detailing the reasons why new armor couldn’t be added as DLC. In that thread, somebody asked about AI and the guy said that it could not be, because they have it set up so that there are paths and traits that the AI tend to based on what you are holding, where you are, where you are looking, where everyone else is, etc. And because of the paths, they could not add firefight forge (which they apparently debated…)
So, as I said before, the current Reach engine simply cannot handle Dynamic AI in a custom game setting. Its possible in a new came, but not Reach.
NOBODY is good enough to code something that huge into a reasonably sized update.
I would LOVE this, but I think “bots” Are going a little to far. I want some dead marines and some Covanant.
> We can’t place bots in forge because it would be so complicated to code and to save the map…
> But it is still possible to place new objects (no-turret warthog, transport falcon…)
firefight is exactly what this guy is suggesting, so its not at all too ‘complicated’
the reason is, the net code slows down dramatically when you add in non player characters.
i’m sure you’ve noticed the lag in over xbox live co-op campaign/firefight. thats because theres so much going on, and it has to send all that data to all players.
competitive multiplayers can’t be as laggy as firefight/campaign, and so there are no NPCs in normal multiplayer.
AI on a Forge map is possible if we’re given the ability to edit the AI’s navigation mesh. But for that to happen, they’d need to bundle a 3D editor with Forge.
(For those who don’t know: a navigation mesh basically defines the spaces where an AI can move, using an invisible 3D object.)
Of course, those who are saying it’s too complicated are right. Guys, look at what Forge is now. And now look at all the things you’re suggesting. Does that really seem like a realistic set of requests, given the technology that 343 would be building on?
EDIT: Also see what the above poster said. AI require the use of a synchronous netcode, which is inherently slower and less responsive than the asynchronous netcode used in standard Multiplayer.
Okay, so let me get this straight. You say bots are impossible because the enviroment would be changing constantly? Well, if this is an actuall issue, then why doesn’t bungie just design two types of forge? One would be enviroment only, adding walls and floors and so on. Then, have another type of forge that was bot only, where you could add your bots in a map that the enviroment is already created? Plus coding for bots isn’t that hard. I know a 15 year old game that lets you add bots. And yes, I know you don’t save maps in said game, but you can still change the enviroment in the game. It might be small changes, but they’re still changes. I don’t know a lot about coding, but I’m pretty sure Bungie/343 games can handle it.
> > > > We can’t place bots in forge because it would be so complicated to code
> > >
> > > I’m so tired of this “argument”…
> > > Nothing is impossible to code!
> > > Nothing is too complicated to code!
> > > It’s their JOB to code!
> > >
> > > If you can create THE UNIVERSE (read: a game) with code, you can code ANYTHING!
> > >
> > >
> > > What you could say, though, is that they won’t do it because it’s out of the scope of the project or it requires more work than they’re willing to invest on a released game (Reach) - especially because a whole new trilogy has been announced.
> > > It surely can happen in a future game, and we all hope it does!
> >
> > You’re right. It’s too difficult to code bots for Forge, but because the AI would need to respond to the environment around them. What do you think will happen when you make a Wall, Double floor and the A.I. is coded to avoid walls? What about using a platform (a piece they’d be able to walk on) as walls in a hallway?
> >
> > These kind of constraints are why it’d be difficult to code an AI bot that can play properly with Forge creations, because they’re coded to react to the environment around them. Campaign is “on rails”, meaning the environment wont change. In Forge, it’s not the case.
>
> One possible solution would to make a forge option for either 1. floor 2. wall and so-on to make that not be an issue.
He was putting it into simple terms for people to easily understand…
AI coding isn’t as simple as, “Hey Mr. Elite, avoid that wall!”. There are too many variables to consider to put into options in forge.
Bots are not impossible to code.
Let me explain to you, in idiot terms, how halo Custom Edition AI worked.
You place down a squad (or whatever you want to call them.) it is one point in space.
In that, you specify the amount of the specified AI you want to spawn, and create spawn points for them (they are one point in space.) Set them to guard, And they would stay in an area (in Reach it could be specified by creating a cylinder area) and attack hostile characters within a specified range.
Ai could be placed in custom edition, why cant it be placed in reach with an improved but the same engine 8 years later (YES it is eight years later)
wow some of u wont accept it.
If u want -Yoinking!- bots in ur trash forge maps, then get XDK and the reach dev tools. Then u can put i so many AI u want.
But u cant? oooh 
Accept it.
Its impossible with the Halo Engine structure.
And its a useless gimmick. Dont waste usefull dev time in pointless things. Halo 4 needs to be awesome and not trash like Reach.
You will NOT see this for HCEA!
I have a solid understanding of game engines, networking, AI, graphics etc. Bots and Forge are entirely possible, given the engine was built to handle it from the initial stages.
The real trouble is Bungie/343i have not built their Reach game engine/sandbox with those feature sets as primary goals.
If campaign and multiplayer were built using those rulesets the Forge part would actually become easy/intermediate by design.
The issue is not the idea of bots/forge itself. The real issue is the engine development and feature choices the Reach engine is stuck with.
Personally I could summarise an entire engine philosphy to handle the AI, campaign, multiplayer etc but the Halo 4 engine has already been in development for so long as well that at this point Forge/Bots are either in there or not.
I’m hoping the new Halo 4 engine has been built with such ground breaking features. It would truly be next gen and I’d like to see such user management of maps, AI etc on a new xbox console throughout the new trilogy.
I think that a much better object in forge would be a despawn timer…imagine if one pathway uddenly dissapears. !t could change eveything about how we make maps. Plus, i’d hate to see poorly made maps with even worse AI bots roaming around… now THERE’S a scary thought…though moa hunting would be fun…
I wasen’t saying it was going to happen! im saying that its possible, because IT IS.
I design games with 3 different engines. I havent ever released anything, except for the HALO CUSTOM EDITION ENGINE, WHICH YOU CAN ADD AI to.
I agree with Cobb, its too much to ask for that plus forge is almost too hard for some people now. With the ability to set certain game types with the spawns and all. All want to see with this is more variety in maps like halo 3 was, not just forge world, I want to see more falcon cuz there awesome vehicles, and for VIP game type to come back. I really liked playing custom games with VIP. Thinking of what everyone’s saying though, why not for maps where you can’t really forge anything but scenery make those default maps have the ability to put campign like coded enemies where you want them. Face them the right way and they behave like they then do to you on campaign, shoot on sight, this could make maps like powerhouse more used then just in multiplayer. I thought of this back in halo 3 on high ground thinking the covadant attacking high ground and you needed to defend it. Just a idea throwing it out there.