Halo 5 kills BR dominance.

Games Halo 5: Guardians
1

After playing early access beta I already know what “purists” will complain about. Halo 5 has the best AR/Pistol combo of any Halo. I’m talking about literally beating BRs with Pistol and AR at mid range. Imagine if Bungie didnt nerf Pistol but still added BR. Thats how Halo 5 gunfights feel, sort of.

Depending on who you talk too thats a good or bad thing. Good if you remember how good AR/Pistol was in CE. Bad if you think AR is a “noob” weapon and BR takes the most skill ever, lol. Technically H5’s AR is more like H4 but i kept switching to Pistol off spawwn like CE. AR is more of a mid range weapon this time arounnd.

First of all Smart Scope DOES increase accuracy for AR. But to that I say…so what? Descope balances this and I hope 343 doesnt change it. Pistol shoots extremely fast and can give ranged weapons a challenge. This means we have a halo game with TWO effective weapons off spawn OUT THE BOX. Something we havent seen since CE.

If you combine H5’s AR/Pistol AND the extremely low aim assist then you have a Halo game where the BR wont dominate and true aim skill will shine. Since we all know Halo is notorious for aim assist.

I’m already convinced Halo 5 will have solid and balanced MP from what I played. A few tweaks maybe but no real issues. I just cant wait for the flood of “nerf this and nerf that” because BR doesnt dominate.

Going back to MCC after H5 is…interesting. MCC has a good amount of aim assist while H5’s is low. SMG H2 starts are horrible in terms of fighting BRs, not balanced at all. I could go on with H3 AR starts. But my point is you quickly see that 3 out 4 Halo MP experiences revolve around BR.

I just hope people make VALID complaints/arguments for what they feel needs to be improved without a WARPED idea of Halo. That idea being BR should beat anything and Team BRs on every map. Even in the short beta I’ve seen more variety in weapon kills in any Halo.

My plea to 343: DONT NERF AR AND PISTOL.

2

I’d nerf the AR VERY slightly. Otherwise it’s good. Gets pretty boring when the BR is effectively a power weapon.

3

> 2535425310804235;2:
> I’d nerf the AR VERY slightly. Otherwise it’s good. Gets pretty boring when the BR is effectively a power weapon.

Maybe the Smart Scope accuarcy buf should be taken out or nerfed even though I dont have a problem with it because of descope.

4

@above: BR is not a power weapon and if it is then DMR is an overpowered power weapon.

Anyways it’s trash that anything gains accuracy when scoped in. I am happy to have more viable spawn weapons but I don’t want more weapons that do the same thing.

BR or DMR need to go. Just keep one. Pistol and DMR are too similar enough as is so get rid of DMR I say.
Remove accuracy boost when scoped keeping AR effective at close and close-mid.

5

BR dominance is gone. My reaction.

The accuracy for the AR in smart scope is mostly fine as I’ve noticed the gun tends to kick around a bit with sustained fire. Maybe increase the kick more a bit so burst fire is rewarded more.
All I know is that I’m happy it’s finally performing like an Assault Rifle, close and mid ranged killer with no fancy bells and whistles. Combined with the Magnum it should be a very decent spawn combo that will leave you feeling like you aren’t at all helpless, and that in my opinion is a great thing.

6

Finally

7

> 2533274805485781;1:
> After playing early access beta I already know what “purists” will complain about. Halo 5 has the best AR/Pistol combo of any Halo. I’m talking about literally beating BRs with Pistol and AR at mid range. Imagine if Bungie didnt nerf Pistol but still added BR. Thats how Halo 5 gunfights feel, sort of.
>
> Depending on who you talk too thats a good or bad thing. Good if you remember how good AR/Pistol was in CE. Bad if you think AR is a “noob” weapon and BR takes the most skill ever, lol. Technically H5’s AR is more like H4 but i kept switching to Pistol off spawwn like CE. AR is more of a mid range weapon this time arounnd.
>
> First of all Smart Scope DOES increase accuracy for AR. But to that I say…so what? Descope balances this and I hope 343 doesnt change it. Pistol shoots extremely fast and can give ranged weapons a challenge. This means we have a halo game with TWO effective weapons off spawn OUT THE BOX. Something we havent seen since CE.
>
> If you combine H5’s AR/Pistol AND the extremely low aim assist then you have a Halo game where the BR wont dominate and true aim skill will shine. Since we all know Halo is notorious for aim assist.
>
> I’m already convinced Halo 5 will have solid and balanced MP from what I played. A few tweaks maybe but no real issues. I just cant wait for the flood of “nerf this and nerf that” because BR doesnt dominate.
>
> Going back to MCC after H5 is…interesting. MCC has a good amount of aim assist while H5’s is low. SMG H2 starts are horrible in terms of fighting BRs, not balanced at all. I could go on with H3 AR starts. But my point is you quickly see that 3 out 4 Halo MP experiences revolve around BR.
>
> I just hope people make VALID complaints/arguments for what they feel needs to be improved without a WARPED idea of Halo. That idea being BR should beat anything and Team BRs on every map. Even in the short beta I’ve seen more variety in weapon kills in any Halo.
>
> My plea to 343: DONT NERF AR AND PISTOL.

lol the h5 pistol is nowhere near as awesome as the CE pistol

8

The AR should be dominant in close quarters, that’s the type of weapon it is, at mid to long range the BR needs to be dominant as it is does require more skill to use. But if a skilled player with a BR goes up against a weak player with an AR, the BR should always win.

9

> 2533274805485781;1:
> After playing early access beta I already know what “purists” will complain about. Halo 5 has the best AR/Pistol combo of any Halo. I’m talking about literally beating BRs with Pistol and AR at mid range. Imagine if Bungie didnt nerf Pistol but still added BR. Thats how Halo 5 gunfights feel, sort of.
>
> Depending on who you talk too thats a good or bad thing. Good if you remember how good AR/Pistol was in CE. Bad if you think AR is a “noob” weapon and BR takes the most skill ever, lol. Technically H5’s AR is more like H4 but i kept switching to Pistol off spawwn like CE. AR is more of a mid range weapon this time arounnd.
>
> First of all Smart Scope DOES increase accuracy for AR. But to that I say…so what? Descope balances this and I hope 343 doesnt change it. Pistol shoots extremely fast and can give ranged weapons a challenge. This means we have a halo game with TWO effective weapons off spawn OUT THE BOX. Something we havent seen since CE.
>
> If you combine H5’s AR/Pistol AND the extremely low aim assist then you have a Halo game where the BR wont dominate and true aim skill will shine. Since we all know Halo is notorious for aim assist.
>
> I’m already convinced Halo 5 will have solid and balanced MP from what I played. A few tweaks maybe but no real issues. I just cant wait for the flood of “nerf this and nerf that” because BR doesnt dominate.
>
> Going back to MCC after H5 is…interesting. MCC has a good amount of aim assist while H5’s is low. SMG H2 starts are horrible in terms of fighting BRs, not balanced at all. I could go on with H3 AR starts. But my point is you quickly see that 3 out 4 Halo MP experiences revolve around BR.
>
> I just hope people make VALID complaints/arguments for what they feel needs to be improved without a WARPED idea of Halo. That idea being BR should beat anything and Team BRs on every map. Even in the short beta I’ve seen more variety in weapon kills in any Halo.
>
> My plea to 343: DONT NERF AR AND PISTOL.

i’d say i’m a halo “purist” though not all “purists” are from halo 2 or 3. if you taken the time to look at real competitive players opinions they want a narrower sandbox where every weapon is effective, hence why mlg removed weapons because they were so underpowered and useless that they had no purpose.

the key problem i have with the AR is less aim assist, if a weapon is effective it needs to be difficult.

to be honest i don’t think halo has ever had a good automatic, it wasn’t even that great in CE. a good automatic should have a tight spread, zoom, mid/short range, low aim assist, projectile and a quick kill time, halo’s never had that.

10

> 2533274898131165;8:
> The AR should be dominant in close quarters, that’s the type of weapon it is, at mid to long range the BR needs to be dominant as it is does require more skill to use. But if a skilled player with a BR goes up against a weak player with an AR, the BR should always win.

Dominant close-range weapons are what the shotgun and sword are. The AR needs more versatility out of its close-range capacity, but like what people said, it should require skilful, trained bursting if the AR ever needs to be used mid-range in a hurry

11

I would like to second the “finally!” comment. I cant wait to get hands on. The new sandbox as a whole looks slick and I’ve seen vids with good players dominating with just about everything. Halo is BACK!

That doesn’t mean I am against tweaks. Ill reserve my real judgement until I actually get to play.
I just hope nothing goes the way of the focus rifle in reach (Power weapon in beta, next to useless in the final game).

12

GOOD.

13

The AR doesn’t need a scope to dominate the BR at close range. In fact, the only reason you would slap a scope on any weapon would be because you intend it to be good at mid range, which the AR shouldn’t even be doing. If they wanted the AR to at least reach mid ranges, they should have left it scopeless and tightened its spread instead. But the AR should never be a viable option for mid range combat, especially against a weapon like the BR which was meant to be used for mid range.

The whole “AR is useless, BR dominates” argument stems from people who try going up against the BR with an AR at mid range and failing because the AR specializes specifically in close range. But instead of using the AR at it’s most efficient range, they cry “BR is OP! I can’t win with my AR!” and when these people are catered to, we end up with a bullet hose that covers both close and mid ranges, which is essentially Halo 4’s SAW, minus the extra rounds, the scope, and the fact that it’s a spawning weapon. This may very well be one of the easiest AR’s to use in Halo’s history, and that isn’t a good thing.

14

I find the whole dominant weapon argument flawed.

Medium / Long Range weapons are usually the most dominant, whether we’re talking games or real life, simply due to the versatility of this range.

If you trade out the BR for the AR, you haven’t solved the “problem” of medium range dominance.
You’ve simply changed the utility from the BR to the AR, exchanged one “overpowered” weapon for another.
The only thing you’ve actually changed is making the utility gun of the game an easier to use one.

FYI Descope inherently favors weapons that fire faster, for what should be obvious reasons. The AR is always going to have the advantage when it comes to descoping so long as bullets are actually connecting, so I don’t see how “descoping balances it”.

Regardless, all of the above is besides the point. Smart Scope is unnecessary because having two separate spread patterns is unnecessary. Why can’t we just have a uniformly tight spread in and out of scope? This would make automatics somewhat harder to use. All having wider hipfire does is make them easier to use in CQC.

15

Is the beggin of the automatic weapons era.

16

So what your saying, and let me make sure I understand you. I can’t just abuse the fastest kill time weapon in the game, I’ve gotta approach each situation with a modicum of intelligence using the strengths of the weapon and not just the fact that it was a 4 shot kill with (virtually) no penalty at any range in every other halo game.

17

> 2533274836395701;7:
> lol the h5 pistol is nowhere near as awesome as the CE pistol

*broken and overpowered

Fixed that for you. The Magnum in Halo CE is so overwhelmingly powerful that it dominates pretty much everything everywhere. It makes the rest of the weapon’s sandbox practically useless. Yes, you can use the Assault Rifle to “quick camo” but that’s an exploit, so that’s not something to bring up as a counter argument anyway.

18

yep, happy this happened, i always loved halo ce more than the rest and halo 5 is like halo ce :slight_smile:

19

Man this makes me so happy. No more one trick pony Halo.

20

> 2533274819302824;14:
> FYI Descope inherently favors weapons that fire faster, for what should be obvious reasons. The AR is always going to have the advantage when it comes to descoping so long as bullets are actually connecting, so I don’t see how “descoping balances it”.
>
> Regardless, all of the above is besides the point. Smart Scope is unnecessary because having two separate spread patterns is unnecessary. Why can’t we just have a uniformly tight spread in and out of scope? This would make automatics somewhat harder to use. All having wider hipfire does is make them easier to use in CQC.

De-scope does not favour the firing faster weapon, it favours the more accurate and then more precise one. I can reliably no-scope BR or DMR an AR user at about 20m… But I am annouyed they can hold down fullauto and engage me without putting in much effort for my troubles. If an AR user had to pulse their weapon to be effective against me at that range, no problem… But currently the unscoped H5AR seems to feel too forgiving itself.

I do not consider the H4AR, or any of H4’s loadout fullautos, to be useless or powerful enough to be called “Spray and Pray,” the H5AR (not SMG) feels like you can name it such. As long as you hold the trigger down in red reticle and if your enemy makes a mistake, you easily mow them down for a quick reload. No need to maintain some sort of control to be rewarded for your troubles.

It’s not that the H5AR is too powerful, per say, it’s that it is too easy for its power.

I favour more kick and or/spread when scoped to promote burst firing to keep its current scoped ranged lethality. If it was fired in bursts and its spread pattern looked like it does now, I’d love it because it would feel different than the H5SMG, not just re-skinned, offset weapon.
I certainly favour an increase in bloom effect when unscoped. It’s not that I mind its position in the sandbox, I mind its no-scope ease for it. It “just” needs a reduction in bullet magnetism if sustained, for my thinking.

Of course something else of note: I prefer to fun and gun the AR off spawn but will still toss it aside for my first pickup. The Pistol’s headshot capability plus its just-outside-of-melee-range-lethality + Sprint make it a more attractive weapon. There is a range where the AR will dominate the Pistol but it’s a short-ranged band that lays outside of CQB and inside BR domination. If engaging head-on, the Pistol maintains its lethality unscoped before 7m and past 15m better than the AR. Though the AR requires little effort to engage the Pistol user who must on their game to ensure they down said AR user before the luck of the draw puts enough bullets on them and pulsing doesn’t seem to help the AR’s users odds much better.

Although there are tweaks to be made, there is a fun and working balance as is. The BR and DMR are far from useless… The DMR may be too useful unscoped while outside everything else’s range… But map design and gamemode may keep that in check. Similarly the AR may be too easy to use in its intended niche but it has a niche. The spawning AR and Pistol don’t make you feel useless.
The BR is no longer dominate… And that’s a good thing.