I think Halo 4 would be a much better game with projectiles rather than hitscan. Projectiles will make the game have a steeper learning curve and will lead to a better experience. The aim assist and bullet magnetism should also be lowered to how it was in Halo 3.
Let me explain. Hitscan makes the game easy to play so anyone can be good at the game. All you have to do is aim and shoot and you will get the kill. Projectiles will require more skill because you will have to lead shots.
If I got out BR’d on Halo 3 that player actually deserved that kill. If I got out BR’d on Halo 4 it would feel like they got a cheap shot because not much skill is required.
If Halo 4 had projectiles I would probably play it. Look at Halo 3. It still has plenty of people playing it. The reason people are playing Halo 3 is because it takes more skill than Halo Reach and Halo 4 because of projectiles.
ew Projectile bullets. The one reason i don’t still play halo 3 is the projectile bullets. I can’t stand it.
I would much rather they just lower the aim assist and bullet magnetism.
> f Halo 4 had projectiles I would probably play it. Look at Halo 3. It still has plenty of people playing it. The reason people are playing Halo 3 is because it takes more skill than Halo Reach and Halo 4 because of projectiles.
Or they just have more fun playing that game and dislike the Infinity crap that goes on in Halo 4? I mean most people play the social playlists so I doubt any of them play for projectile bullets.
> ew Projectile bullets. The one reason i don’t still play halo 3 is the projectile bullets. I can’t stand it.
>
> I would much rather they just lower the aim assist and bullet magnetism.
>
>
>
> > f Halo 4 had projectiles I would probably play it. Look at Halo 3. It still has plenty of people playing it. The reason people are playing Halo 3 is because it takes more skill than Halo Reach and Halo 4 because of projectiles.
>
> Or they just have more fun playing that game and dislike the Infinity crap that goes on in Halo 4? I mean most people play the social playlists so I doubt any of them play for projectile bullets.
Why do you hate projectiles? Please explain.
I see nothing wrong with them. They are actually better than hitscan because it takes more skill.
I really don’t care for either of those aspects if a gamer can’t adapt to a new style that’s their fault and just because a game is easier to reach out to new gamers. if you had a full skill base game it would retain far less players.I would still play Halo 3 if my friends did and sometimes we do not because it takes more skill not very many players now play for skill.
And people don’t play Halo 3 because projectiles hell I’m sure half of them don’t even know know what that is its probably because of games with gold for people who never bought Halo 3.
> Why do you hate projectiles? Please explain.
>
> I see nothing wrong with them. They are actually better than hitscan because it takes more skill.
Well I find it frustrating more than anything, not getting a kill because of the incredibly slow projectile speed. I honestly don’t see why leading your shots is that much better than actually hitting the player directly. Couple that with Halo 3’s terrible hit detection and lag.
It would be interesting to see it in Halo 5 where the hit detection will be incredibly solid but I still see Hitscan being far superior. As said before Halo Reach and 4 wasn’t incredibly easy because of Hitscan but the increase in Aim Asist and Bullet magnetism. Tone these down and the skill curve will be much higher.
I find the netcode arguments to be over exaggerated. While yes, projectiles can be faulty, I never really had an issue with shots registering in Halo 3. Of course, Halo PC was terrible about it, but that’s a much older game, and Halo 3 will be in the same position when Halo 5 comes out.
Projectiles were good. They added an extra layer of skill to the game while at the same time preventing long range combat from dominating the map. I felt Halo 3’s projectile speed was just right, while Halo CE’s was a bit fast.
I really, really don’t like hitscan. Maybe I’d enjoy it more if the aim assist was toned down, but I still think I’d like projectiles better.
As for the range argument, the only ways to eliminate hitscan at long range are to either add a ton of spread, add bloom, or simply make the bullets disappear past a certain distance. I’m not a huge fan of any of those options.
> Projectiles will make the game have a steeper learning curve and will lead to a better experience.
For Halo these two ideas are entirely disconnected. We have this franchise now BECAUSE of its extreme accessibility compared to other shooters and we won’t win back any sizable chunk of the market by making Halo worse according to one of its most important qualities.
> I find the netcode arguments to be over exaggerated. While yes, projectiles can be faulty, I never really had an issue with shots registering in Halo 3.
I will say too that this is a moot point to make. Sure you don’t remember having issues with shot registration but consider what effect one occasional shot missing because of network issues would have had on your game. Do you really trust that you would have been able to even recognize what that happened (in the heat of battle with half-a-dozen other things fighting for your attention), let alone recalled that infrequent moment over the span of half a decade? No, you shouldn’t, not for something as fine a point as this and yet it would have had an impact on the quality of your gameplay.
Stick to the arguments. In this case they’re much more reliable than your remembrances.
> I will say too that this is a moot point to make. Sure you don’t remember having issues with shot registration but consider what effect one occasional shot missing because of network issues would have had on your game.
Yes, and this isn’t exclusive to projectile weapons. Being in a laggy match will throw me off, whether or not my gun is projectile or hitscan. I have played source games where I will see blood but no damage is dealt. Network issues are universal.
I can paraphrase a post you made in another thread “We don’t know the extent of how well Halo 5’s netcode is designed”. We don’t even know if projectiles not registering will even be an issue, much less a significant one.
Missing a bullet 1/1000 games for the sake of added skill gap is worth it in my opinion. As for the “money is on the line” argument, tournaments usually LAN so this is irrelevant.
Halo PC is a good example of a game that NEEDS hitscan weaponry. The netcode is so bad that if you are ran over by a friendly vehicle, you lag forwards, rubber banding back and forth constantly, until you finally settle in one spot.
Halo 3 wasn’t anywhere near this bad, and one could argue many of those “shots that didn’t register” are simply “bullets that missed due to the spread of the BR”. Technology is constantly moving forward. I will agree that since we don’t know, we should leave this aspect out of the argument. Just threw it in for the sake of it.
I’m in favor of projectile as well as it requires greater skill at longer ranges, and it’s what they used in H3. HOWEVER it has a major flaw, internet lag. As in H3, if lag is present it becomes ridiculously difficult to hit a moving target at any range so some form of Hit-scan is needed, and H4 brought about a very good blend of the 2. H2 was ALL about hit-scan, and was stupid easy to hit people, I was so glad to see it removed with H3.
I have a question about hitscan before I put in my two cents.
With a hitscan weapon, what information is sent from the client to the host? Is it the position of the reticle at the time the weapon is fired, or is it the position of the target within the reticle when the weapon is fired?
The reason I ask is because of an example brought up to me by a friend the other day. Say that a player is moving straight and then ducks behind cover, but because of lag, I still see him moving straight. I fire my weapon while the reticle is directly over him. Does the shot register as a hit, even though in reality, he was behind cover when I shot?
Considering the population size of Halo 4, I have to disagree. When you take into account lag from said population size projectile becomes far too inaccurate.
Shooters with projectile-based physics require more skill (in general) than shooters with hitscan-based mechanics. There are so many elements the player needs to account for that a higher amount of skill is required to make the most effective use out of the weapon sandbox. For example: The Rocket Launcher. The projectile has travel time, which requires the shooter to take into account where their target is vs. where they will be when the rocket hits. They also need to take into consideration their surroundings because something random could occur like a vehicle or another player passing by and getting hit by the rocket. The issue with projectile physics in a competitive shooter is that there are factors that affect it like lag and hit detection and so on that could be detrimental to the projectile mechanics. Server based lobbies would be more beneficial than peer-to-peer hosts. Halo as it has been up to now would not work with projectiles. With Halo 5 and (apparently) all Xbox One games getting dedicated servers, projectile physics would work more with Halo 5 than any other title in the series.
I agree that they require more skill; however with flawed hit detection and laggy matches, it would only serve to detract from the general gaming experience. If 343 was able to solve those issues I would agree 100% that projectiles were the way to go.
What if Halo 4 had a “Good Connection” preference? Would it then work? Or let’s even go as far as assuming Halo 4 had dedicated servers. Would projectiles work then? I think since if dedicated servers were in Halo 4 and if projectiles would work just fine.
> > Why do you hate projectiles? Please explain.
> >
> > I see nothing wrong with them. They are actually better than hitscan because it takes more skill.
>
> Well I find it frustrating more than anything, not getting a kill because of the incredibly slow projectile speed. I honestly don’t see why leading your shots is that much better than actually hitting the player directly. Couple that with Halo 3’s terrible hit detection and lag.
>
> It would be interesting to see it in Halo 5 where the hit detection will be incredibly solid but I still see Hitscan being far superior. As said before Halo Reach and 4 wasn’t incredibly easy because of Hitscan but the increase in Aim Asist and Bullet magnetism. Tone these down and the skill curve will be much higher.
Because leading your shots take more skill. If you take any gun and point and shoot you are going to hit them. However when you lead shots it will require you to think.