I know what I am about to say will seem like heresy to a lot of people given how almost everyone I have met prefers the H3 variation of the MARK VI armor but… I don’t. I like the Halo 4 variation better, It feels more like military hardware as opposed to the earlier variations that feel very…artificial. The newer variation looks very well designed and it feels as if should the armor be created in reality, It would be closer to the 343 variation rather than Bungie’s. I prefer the Halo 4 and 5 design of the MJOLNIR armor and I would prefer that Halo Infinite stuck with it. If not then at the very least they can add some sort of customization menu so that people can select their preferred variation of the MJOLNIR armor. The 343 variation of the MJOLNIR armor looks really good, well, better than the earlier iterations and I don’t like the fact that they have reverted to the older artstyle to appease people who simply can’t let go of the old art and nostalgia.
What do you people think?
I think you’re wrong in saying people who prefer the old art style only do so out of nostalgia. I prefer the old art style because I think it looks better, not because I have my nostalgia goggles on.
Well, It is the case for the majority. Most of the arguments I have been in revolve around the “this is how the mjolnir has always looked and it reminds me of my childhood”. It is annoying to be honest. I will never understand how the less detailed older artstyle is preferred to the richly detailed newer one.
I dislike the Gen-2 Mjolnir because it isn’t actually armored in a lot of places where the originals were, so in-universe, it’s a significant downgrade in technology and doesn’t make sense that any Spartan would choose it over the original. (Except maybe S-IV’s which probably aren’t able to handle the Gen-1.) I’m really happy that 343 has finally done away with this nonsense in campaign.
For multiplayer, hovever? Sure, make it an armor permutation if people want…
We talked about it in a different thread and, just like you, I’m really disappointed to see this armor disappearing without any good reason.
It’s really sad to see such a good design won’t be used in-game anymore or for toys, statues, etc…
Well, Infinite seems to have it’s own style rather than any previously seen style, though closer to the Halo 2/Halo 3 variation than H4/H5g variations were to those ones.
So it’s not technically reverting exactly but seems to be more about going for truer model in regard of source material, If you look closely, the shoulder pads for example differ from original models, so there are details that show bit of a mixing going on.
And I really would disagree with the statement of H4 variation looking like military hardware in any shape or form, Joint movement looks to be more free but otherwise it looks like oversized pieces of metal stapled to a skintight suit, & don’t get me started about the horrid weight distribution.
Basically it has similar problems like those H4/H5g “Elites”.
And simplistic is not always inferior, overdetailing exists though that comes down to preferences.
And I see that there could be irony applied to here regarding the people who “cant let go of the old art & nostalgia” as of now, H4 & H5g variants are rather old as a part of entertainment industry, though I hold the nostalgia argument in little to no value anyway as it’s really rare that people in general wouldn’t have any other points to their preferences than having seen something before another thing.
And that majority claim is based on personal experience, but surely such points exist too, in my experience I have seen them accompanying more solid arguments in most cases but thats just personal experience versus another, both without solid large scale data to back it up.
As someone who has seen franchises rise & fall it will be interesting to see how H4 generation reacts to potential new generation of Halo fans who view this as new & H4 generation will be the “old ones” looking to bring back a decade old artstyle. Its interestingly cyclical.
“There is much talk, and I have listened, through rock and metal and time. Now I shall talk, and you shall listen.”
> 2535442765997359;3:
> Well, It is the case for the majority. Most of the arguments I have been in revolve around the “this is how the mjolnir has always looked and it reminds me of my childhood”. It is annoying to be honest. I will never understand how the less detailed older artstyle is preferred to the richly detailed newer one.
Because having as much detail as you can isn’t always the best option. It’s exactly why 343’s art style overall is frown upon. It’s over-detailed in many places.
In the case of MJOLNIR, 343’s style of armor (GEN II) is inferior. It doesn’t protect you nearly as much as Bungie’s (GEN I), and sacrifices that for more gimmicks. Furthermore, most of 343’s MJOLNIR armors are meh or ugly. What even is Foehammer? Seeker? Breaker? Legionnaire?
Few of their armors actually look good.
There’s more to it than “nostalgia” and that’s such a weak argument to use against people who prefer the older stuff. Some of us actually have reasons you know🤷♀️.
I prefer the original as it actually has armor to it, the newer stuff loses to much, I’m also in agreement with the guy that said there’s to much detail, having so much of that doesn’t mean it’s better, sometimes less is more.
And then I’ll just straight up say I believe the older stuff looks better, much better while the newer stuff is just like a power ranger to me lol.
I’ve been with the series since the begining and I agree with you OP. Mind you, the Mark V will always be my favorite and go-to armor for multiplayer in any Halo game, but I’d put the Mark VI GEN2/MOD/ very, very close.
To me, the OG Mark VI always looked, for a lack of a better word, plastic-y and oddly outdated in comparison to the sleek Mark V. Part of that was doubtlessly Bungie wanting to make a more detailed character model to show off their increased tech chops. The Mark VI GEN2 achieves that more complex and detailed look while retaining a measure of the sleekness of the Mark V that I loved so much. Still, beauty is in the eye of the beholder, so I won’t bismerch people for liking the old design.
I also find it fairly weird that some of y’all are trying to bring lore into the equation. You are aware that the way the armor looks has no measurable impact on the level of protection it provides, right? This is isn’t medieval plate armor we are talking about here. Heck, the majority of the protection that post-Mark IV suits provide come from the energy shields.
Just say you dislike the way the thing looks and leave it at that.
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> I also find it fairly weird that some of y’all are trying to bring lore into the equation. You are aware that the way the armor looks has no measurable impact on the level of protection it provides, right? This is isn’t medieval plate armor we are talking about here. Heck, the majority of the protection that post-Mark IV suits provide come from the energy shields.
Many GEN II armors lack pieces that GEN I covered before. Most of GEN II armor lacks crotch armor, for example. All that area is protected by a suit, nothing more. It’s not about how it looks: it’s the fact that it actually has less protection.
And for most of the time, MJOLNIR never had shields. That was only introduced with Mark V, by 2551. Energy Shields only became a standard of the armor, but shouldn’t be relied on. Spartan IIs, without them, were already brutally effective. With these shields, their performance only increases, as they can expose themselves for a bit more and kill more enemies before falling back.
SilentRebel: yeah there’s less plate protection, but that’s precisely because the shields and updated tech suit (yeah the undersuit provides some protection, it’s not just basic fabric) pick up the slack. Otherwise, we may as well just dump the Mjolnir line altogether and just give every spartan a HRUNTING/YGGDRASIL exo-suit. Which would be awesome and I’m all for it ,but that’s beside the point. Again, why do we need to argue lore to define which Mjolnir design people prefer?
> 2535442765997359;3:
> Well, It is the case for the majority. Most of the arguments I have been in revolve around the “this is how the mjolnir has always looked and it reminds me of my childhood”. It is annoying to be honest. I will never understand how the less detailed older artstyle is preferred to the richly detailed newer one.
People say that because they don’t know how to actually articulate how they feel. The truth is, if people liked H4/H5 look they would like it. The problem isn’t that there is a lack of detail. The Infinite look is very detailed, but just has a different design approach that is closer to what Bungie was doing.
Saying that the older games “lacked detail” because they had a different art style shows a lack of understanding in how games utilize art design. It’s important for things to stand out and “belong” to a series. H4/H5 did a lot of cool things when it comes to art. I, personally, really like the new, organic, look to a lot of the Covenant stuff and Sanghilios is breathtaking. But overloading detail into things makes them visually confusing and muddy. The Prometheans demonstrate that perfectly. I’d even argue that Reach strayed into that a little bit too much, but not nearly as much as 4 and 5 did.
Why do we need all the tiny, floaty, bits on the Prometheans? Why do all of the UNSC weapons look like they were pulled out of CoD or Titanfall? It’s important for Halo to have a look of its own, not just a generic “sci-fi” look that looks in indistinguishable from any other “sci-fi” series. Bungie did that all the way back in 2001 with CE. When people say they want the games to look like they used to they don’t actually mean that they want the games to look like they were made in 2001. They want the game to have an art style that makes the games stand out as original, as well as be consistent with what has come before. So far 343i has failed with that, but Infinite seems to be a huge step in the right direction.
Personally, I didn’t mind the Halo 4/5 armor style THAT much with the Master Chief along with Blue Team and Fireteam Osiris, but the rest of the armor (available in multiplayer customization) did look rather meh. Yeah its true that many art styles of the armors in 4/5 tanked due to the major differences from Reach but there were some decent standouts, like the Recruit armor along a few others like FOTUS, Venator, Prefect, and even Achilles. Also the other plus to the 4/5 armors was that they showed how the Spartan IV’s get suited up for battle thanks to the cinematic cutscenes from Spartan OP’s. It seemed to help answer the lingering question, “How do Spartans suit up with bulky powered assault armor?” And Halo 4 did in fact answer the question, mainly for the Spartan IV’s…
Even though in Halo 4’s ending, the chief, a Spartan II who is much taller than the Spartan IV’s had his armor removed slightly differently due to his size being too large for the machinery made for Spartan IV’s.343 has already apparently stuck with the style they gave to chief already in the trailer, Mk VII, but I would like to see the good armors from 4 and 5 come back, as a cosmetic option without flat-out overwriting the defaults. And since 343 is promising Reach level customization, I can see it happening…
> 2535442765997359;1:
> I know what I am about to say will seem like heresy to a lot of people given how almost everyone I have met prefers the H3 variation of the MARK VI armor but… I don’t. I like the Halo 4 variation better, It feels more like military hardware as opposed to the earlier variations that feel very…artificial. The newer variation looks very well designed and it feels as if should the armor be created in reality, It would be closer to the 343 variation rather than Bungie’s. I prefer the Halo 4 and 5 design of the MJOLNIR armor and I would prefer that Halo Infinite stuck with it. If not then at the very least they can add some sort of customization menu so that people can select their preferred variation of the MJOLNIR armor. The 343 variation of the MJOLNIR armor looks really good, well, better than the earlier iterations and I don’t like the fact that they have reverted to the older artstyle to appease people who simply can’t let go of the old art and nostalgia.
> What do you people think?
I myself prefer the Original Trilogy era armors and would love to see designs similar to that return in Infinite. That being said I think the option between Gen 2 and Gen 3 would be great in the customization, for example being able to wear the Warrior helmet alongside the new Gen 3 torso. While I don’t personally like a lot of the designs for the Gen 2 suits, I don’t think 343 should alienate a group of their fanbase because of the classic crowd.
Also where did this “We want classic, cause nostalgia” come from? The people who like the classic artstyle that I’ve spoken to never use this as a point.
I like the GEN 2 aesthetic in regards to the Spartan VI’s more mass produced deployment, and I prefer the more mobile-look of the GEN 2 design, where the Techsuit comprises the majority of the armor with the addition of the metal armor matrices that attach to the suit. It think it’s very fitting of the design concept of faster, lighter and stronger for the GEN 2 platform. At times compromising armor integrity and coverage, relying more on the the suit’s improved shield recharge rate and strength. I believe S-VI’s were more prone to aggressive tactics and constant movement to achieve thier goals, unlike thier predecessors. This was very evident in the armour’s design implementation.
Just has the more futuristic sci-fi feel that I like in the Halo games.
Now this isnt to discredit the new GEN 3 platform. Assuming its building upon both previous iterations of Mjolnir, definitely offering greater levels of protection. Limiting range of motion to a degree, to keep operators from over extending thier joints and limbs. Reducing snag areas for reduced visible signature, and maintaining uniform design, focusing more on function, rather than form to achieve the same results.
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> yeah the undersuit provides some protection, it’s not just basic fabric
The keyword here being “some”. It’s still less than before, thus makes no sense for an actual upgrade. Why would you not want a Spartan to have the maximum amount of protection possible?
And no, shields are not an excuse. Shields fail, quite regularly (especially when literally the most common weapon used by the enemy army is able to produce an EMP that kills shields), and the actual armor needs to be able to withstand the bulk of the impacts. Plus, shields regenerate, but every damage to the armor accumulates.
> 2533274870884222;11:
> Again, why do we need to argue lore to define which Mjolnir design people prefer?
Because some people might actually like their visuals to make sense?
Otherwise, where are the demands for swimsuit skins? It’s probably more visually appealing than any Mjolnir could ever be.
I feel that they should keep all stages of armor from the past that go in an armor category just like Halo:Reach with the add-ons. So you have Mk 6 gen 1(Halo 3), gen 2(Halo 5 Story), and gen 3 in one section. No armor left behind or forgotten (except for the fishbowl helmets). Such as Mk 5 gen 1(CE 2001), Mk 5 gen 1(CE 2011), Mk 5 gen 2(delta), Mk 5 gen 3. Mk 4 gen 1(Halo Wars 2), Mk 4 gen 2(Halo 5), Mk 4 gen 3. etc etc
All of these designs were sick, why leave any behind?
I enjoyed the look of the H4/5 version of Chief’s armor. It was more clear that the MJOLNIR was made of armor plates that sit on an undersuit. It had a modular look that made sense to me, and I could understand how it was put on or removed.
I worry, from the look of the Infinite armor, that 343 is leaning too heavily on nostalgia with the game. I remember the look of the Infinite helmet in 2018 and there, I could see a blend of old and new styles that gave me a sense of honoring the old while still being new. With the final design, though, all I see is the Halo 3 design in higher resolution. Comparing the E3 2018 and 2019 helmets, I can’t help but think that the final design abandons pretty much everything from the H4/5 design, which to me feels very pandery. I hope I’m wrong, I would feel bad if 343 abandoned their art style entirely due to negative feedback. Not everyone had an issue with it.
> 2533274817408735;18:
> I enjoyed the look of the H4/5 version of Chief’s armor. It was more clear that the MJOLNIR was made of armor plates that sit on an undersuit. It had a modular look that made sense to me, and I could understand how it was put on or removed.
>
> I worry, from the look of the Infinite armor, that 343 is leaning too heavily on nostalgia with the game. I remember the look of the Infinite helmet in 2018 and there, I could see a blend of old and new styles that gave me a sense of honoring the old while still being new. With the final design, though, all I see is the Halo 3 design in higher resolution. Comparing the E3 2018 and 2019 helmets, I can’t help but think that the final design abandons pretty much everything from the H4/5 design, which to me feels very pandery. I hope I’m wrong, I would feel bad if 343 abandoned their art style entirely due to negative feedback. Not everyone had an issue with it.
Even if it looked different, you cannot deny that Chief’s armor looked pretty darn cool in Halo 5
> 2535438636443468;17:
> All of these designs were sick, why leave any behind?
I couldn’t agree more.