Halo 4 needs to compensate...

for both casual and competitive.

One of the things that makes Halo great is the community. The Halo Community has been broken up into two groups, the casual players, and the competitive players and 343i has recognized this and they are making a game for both parts of the community.

Halo 4 can’t be a game that is made for only one side of the community. 343i knows that and if they were to create a game just for the casual players then i’m pretty sure the competitive community would leave and vice versa. 343i is creating a game that will compensate for both casual and competitive.

So wait till Nov. 6th, and see what the people are talking about from E3 and RTX. At E3, some MLG players played the game and they said it was really good and it played like H2, and H3. So just be patient, you’ll enjoy the game when it comes out

I honestly don’t see how this is happening. I cannot, off the top of my head, name ANY additions 343 has added to Halo 4 specifically for the Competitive community. I can name COUNTLESS additions for the casuals.

I think that they have completely forgotten about one side of the community and its a shame, because for a lot of people (especially in the Competitive community) this was the last chance Halo.

> I honestly don’t see how this is happening. I cannot, off the top of my head, name ANY additions 343 has added to Halo 4 specifically for the Competitive community. I can name COUNTLESS additions for the casuals.
>
> I think that they have completely forgotten about one side of the community and its a shame, because for a lot of people (especially in the Competitive community) this was the last chance Halo.

Additions for the competitive community? No, but I do see a helluvalotta tuning of the game to add skill. Aim assist is lower than in Halo 2, while killtimes are in the neighborhood of Halo 2’s, even being slightly faster. Strafe speed, movement and jump height have been upped, and grenades are not the “solve all problems” mini-nukes from Halo Reach. There, just a few things I thought I’d mention.

Edit: Dual-wielding is gone too.

> I honestly don’t see how this is happening. I cannot, off the top of my head, name ANY additions 343 has added to Halo 4 specifically for the Competitive community. I can name COUNTLESS additions for the casuals.
>
> I think that they have completely forgotten about one side of the community and its a shame, because for a lot of people (especially in the Competitive community) this was the last chance Halo.

To many people, Halo 3 was considered a competitive game and they’ve integrated that in Halo 4. Player movement has been upgraded as well as numerous updates on how the game plays.

343 said that there will be a classic playlist for the competitive to play in that playlist.

The sandbox (while no sandbox is perfect) has been made to balance the game as much as possible

and like IDKwhatName2Say said, they’ve tuned the game so it can add skill.

> 343 said that there will be a classic playlist for the competitive to play in that playlist.

Oh good. Competitive players can get shoehorned into one dark corner of matchmaking again.

Telling people to wait until release before judging is a terrible argument.

> > 343 said that there will be a classic playlist for the competitive to play in that playlist.
>
> Oh good. Competitive players can get shoehorned into one dark corner of matchmaking again.
>
> Telling people to wait until release before judging is a terrible argument.

How?

Its impossible to fully judge a game based on unfinished builds and a couple of trailers.

> > > 343 said that there will be a classic playlist for the competitive to play in that playlist.
> >
> > Oh good. Competitive players can get shoehorned into one dark corner of matchmaking again.
> >
> > Telling people to wait until release before judging is a terrible argument.
>
> How?
>
> Its impossible to fully judge a game based on unfinished builds and a couple of trailers.

It’s also impossible to praise the game and say it’ll be the best Halo ever right now, but people do that all the time on this forum, amiright?

I can already tell the game will be about exploiting the awful mechanics.

> > > 343 said that there will be a classic playlist for the competitive to play in that playlist.
> >
> > Oh good. Competitive players can get shoehorned into one dark corner of matchmaking again.
> >
> > Telling people to wait until release before judging is a terrible argument.
>
> How?
>
> Its impossible to fully judge a game based on unfinished builds and a couple of trailers.

Agreed. It sounds like they’re making it more casual now, but you can’t be sure of what will change before the game is actually released.

What about the people who are not casual, but do not care to be competitive, like us who like the story and love to read all the novels and such. I don’t consider myself casual or competitive. What do you think?

> > > > 343 said that there will be a classic playlist for the competitive to play in that playlist.
> > >
> > > Oh good. Competitive players can get shoehorned into one dark corner of matchmaking again.
> > >
> > > Telling people to wait until release before judging is a terrible argument.
> >
> > How?
> >
> > Its impossible to fully judge a game based on unfinished builds and a couple of trailers.
>
> It’s also impossible to praise the game and say it’ll be the best Halo ever right now, but people do that all the time on this forum, amiright?
>
> I can already tell the game will be about exploiting the awful mechanics.

Yeah? List some, I’m kind of curious.

  1. Movement and jump height have been increased.
  2. Less aim assist than Reach
  3. Sprint feels much more natural and you slow down when hit
  4. AAs are better balanced
  5. The BR is back
  6. So far based on the people that have played, Halo 4 seems to have one of the best balanced sandboxes in a while.

All this in an early build that can still be improved based on further feed back I’m sure 343i is getting. So I laugh when people say they aren’t doing anything for competitives.

> > > > > 343 said that there will be a classic playlist for the competitive to play in that playlist.
> > > >
> > > > Oh good. Competitive players can get shoehorned into one dark corner of matchmaking again.
> > > >
> > > > Telling people to wait until release before judging is a terrible argument.
> > >
> > > How?
> > >
> > > Its impossible to fully judge a game based on unfinished builds and a couple of trailers.
> >
> > It’s also impossible to praise the game and say it’ll be the best Halo ever right now, but people do that all the time on this forum, amiright?
> >
> > I can already tell the game will be about exploiting the awful mechanics.
>
> Yeah? List some, I’m kind of curious.

Armor abilities, increased kill times, built in sprint and goodness knows what else. Reach made it quite clear that littering the game with skill-gap-lowering additions is going to make the gameplay frustrating. 343 has given me no reason to think that it’ll be different this time.

I’m sorry that the fantasy where everyone is squealing in delight over the game isn’t a reality.

> 1. Movement and jump height have been increased.
> 2. Less aim assist than Reach
> 3. Sprint feels much more natural and you slow down when hit
> 4. AAs are better balanced
> 5. The BR is back
> 6. So far based on the people that have played, Halo 4 seems to have one of the best balanced sandboxes in a while.
>
> All this in an early build that can still be improved based on further feed back I’m sure 343i is getting. So I laugh when people say they aren’t doing anything for competitives.

No no, this game is just looking more casual by the minute. Sarcasm

They also seem to be trying to implement both a skill ranking system and progression. The only real complaints I have left are PV, and the no news on Jetpack. Other than that, this looks like what Reach could’ve been, and then some.

> > > > > > 343 said that there will be a classic playlist for the competitive to play in that playlist.
> > > > >
> > > > > Oh good. Competitive players can get shoehorned into one dark corner of matchmaking again.
> > > > >
> > > > > Telling people to wait until release before judging is a terrible argument.
> > > >
> > > > How?
> > > >
> > > > Its impossible to fully judge a game based on unfinished builds and a couple of trailers.
> > >
> > > It’s also impossible to praise the game and say it’ll be the best Halo ever right now, but people do that all the time on this forum, amiright?
> > >
> > > I can already tell the game will be about exploiting the awful mechanics.
> >
> > Yeah? List some, I’m kind of curious.
>
> Armor abilities, increased kill times, built in sprint and goodness knows what else. Reach made it quite clear that littering the game with skill-gap-lowering additions is going to make the gameplay frustrating. 343 has given me no reason to think that it’ll be different this time.
>
> I’m sorry that the fantasy where everyone is squealing in delight over the game isn’t a reality.

But thats not your final judgement. You are judgeing Reach’s implmentation of those things, and assuming it won’t be different. But you are right, you can not judge the game fully positive either.

There is a difference between “This game looks like it’ll be awesome” and “This game is awesome”. Most say this game looks like it’ll be awesome. A lot of haters say this game will suck, and act as if it is fact.

Besides, just because Reach didn’t implment some features right doesn’t mean 343i can’t learn from it and do it right.
They already made Hardlight Shield the way Armor Lock should have been.

> > > > > > 343 said that there will be a classic playlist for the competitive to play in that playlist.
> > > > >
> > > > > Oh good. Competitive players can get shoehorned into one dark corner of matchmaking again.
> > > > >
> > > > > Telling people to wait until release before judging is a terrible argument.
> > > >
> > > > How?
> > > >
> > > > Its impossible to fully judge a game based on unfinished builds and a couple of trailers.
> > >
> > > It’s also impossible to praise the game and say it’ll be the best Halo ever right now, but people do that all the time on this forum, amiright?
> > >
> > > I can already tell the game will be about exploiting the awful mechanics.
> >
> > Yeah? List some, I’m kind of curious.
>
> <mark>Armor abilities</mark>, <mark>increased kill times</mark>, <mark>built in sprint and goodness knows what else</mark>. Reach made it quite clear that littering the game with skill-gap-lowering additions is going to make the gameplay frustrating. <mark>343 has given me no reason to think that it’ll be different this time.</mark>
>
>
> I’m sorry that the fantasy where everyone is squealing in delight over the game isn’t a reality.

  1. They have counters. PV is still being tweaked.
  2. What the hell do you want slow kill times or fast, is it a happy medium, because you are being vague.
  3. Countless of feedback from people suggest that this game plays nothing like Reach. Yet your bitter hatred towards Reach still blinds your decisions of Halo 4.
  4. Look at number 3, again the same goes for sprint. People have compared it to Reach and feel it’s much more balanced in Halo 4 and natural.
  5. 343 has not given you reason to think it plays like Reach, because you have the evidence of pros and your community telling you “It is not REACH.” Yet you choose to ignore the feedback from everything, that is just your ignorance.

> > > > > > 343 said that there will be a classic playlist for the competitive to play in that playlist.
> > > > >
> > > > > Oh good. Competitive players can get shoehorned into one dark corner of matchmaking again.
> > > > >
> > > > > Telling people to wait until release before judging is a terrible argument.
> > > >
> > > > How?
> > > >
> > > > Its impossible to fully judge a game based on unfinished builds and a couple of trailers.
> > >
> > > It’s also impossible to praise the game and say it’ll be the best Halo ever right now, but people do that all the time on this forum, amiright?
> > >
> > > I can already tell the game will be about exploiting the awful mechanics.
> >
> > Yeah? List some, I’m kind of curious.
>
> Armor abilities, increased kill times, built in sprint and goodness knows what else. Reach made it quite clear that littering the game with skill-gap-lowering additions is going to make the gameplay frustrating. 343 has given me no reason to think that it’ll be different this time.
>
> I’m sorry that the fantasy where everyone is squealing in delight over the game isn’t a reality.

Your view on Armor Abilities being flawed mechanics from the get-go is caused by your narrow-minded nature and false impression Reach gave due to its poor implementation.

The kill times aren’t increased from what I’ve seen, not to mention kill-times are being tweaked.

Built-in Sprint is fine; it’s natural for FPSs to progress with other FPSs and collaboratively share/expand upon ideas. Not to mention the mechanic in and of itself is fine.

> > > > > > > 343 said that there will be a classic playlist for the competitive to play in that playlist.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Oh good. Competitive players can get shoehorned into one dark corner of matchmaking again.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Telling people to wait until release before judging is a terrible argument.
> > > > >
> > > > > How?
> > > > >
> > > > > Its impossible to fully judge a game based on unfinished builds and a couple of trailers.
> > > >
> > > > It’s also impossible to praise the game and say it’ll be the best Halo ever right now, but people do that all the time on this forum, amiright?
> > > >
> > > > I can already tell the game will be about exploiting the awful mechanics.
> > >
> > > Yeah? List some, I’m kind of curious.
> >
> > <mark>Armor abilities</mark>, <mark>increased kill times</mark>, <mark>built in sprint and goodness knows what else</mark>. Reach made it quite clear that littering the game with skill-gap-lowering additions is going to make the gameplay frustrating. <mark>343 has given me no reason to think that it’ll be different this time.</mark>
> >
> >
> > I’m sorry that the fantasy where everyone is squealing in delight over the game isn’t a reality.
>
> 1. They have counters. PV is still being tweaked.
> 2. What the hell do you want slow kill times or fast, is it a happy medium, because you are being vague.
> 3. Countless of feedback from people suggest that this game plays nothing like Reach. Yet your bitter hatred towards it still blinds you.
> 4. Look at number 3, again the same goes for sprint. People have compared it to Reach and feel it’s much more balanced in Halo 4 and natural.
> 5. 343 has not given you reason to think it plays like Reach, because you have the evidence of pros and your community telling you “It is not REACH.” Yet you choose to ignore the feedback from everything, that is just your ignorance.

  1. Why make counters when you can remove it altogether? If people complain about it, then get rid of it instead of making something else to complain about. The fact that 343 improved armor lock by turning it into the hardlight shield doesn’t mean anything because they failed to recognize that the ability to become protected at the tap of a button is a BAD idea that should NOT exist in Halo.

  2. A 5SK BR is not a happy medium. It’s nerfing the gun so that lesser skilled players don’t get shredded as quickly and offers them more time to sprint away. When you couple weak guns with multiple alternatives for speedy player movement, it’s going to result in unfinished kills and chasing. The need for teamwork goes up because the invidviual isn’t empowered to do anything by themselves.

  3. I can’t respond to this truthfully without getting banned, so I won’t say anything other than the fact that I don’t think people are prepared to badmouth 343 and their work in front of them.

  4. ^

  5. They’ve given me plenty of reasons to think that it’ll play like Reach. They brought back AAs. They didn’t decrease kill times. They brought back loadouts. It’s quite clear to me that considering their support for Reach and lack of support for Halo 3, Reach is their benchmark for making Halo 4.

> 1. Why make counters when you can remove it altogether? If people complain about it, then get rid of it instead of making something else to complain about. The fact that 343 improved armor lock by turning it into the hardlight shield doesn’t mean anything because they failed to recognize that the ability to become protected at the tap of a button is a BAD idea that should NOT exist in Halo.
>
> 2. A 5SK BR is not a happy medium. It’s nerfing the gun so that lesser skilled players don’t get shredded as quickly and offers them more time to sprint away. When you couple weak guns with multiple alternatives for speedy player movement, it’s going to result in unfinished kills and chasing. The need for teamwork goes up because the invidviual isn’t empowered to do anything by themselves.
>
> 3. I can’t respond to this truthfully without getting banned, so I won’t say anything other than the fact that I don’t think people are prepared to badmouth 343 and their work in front of them.
>
> 4. ^
>
> 5. They’ve given me plenty of reasons to think that it’ll play like Reach. They brought back AAs. They didn’t decrease kill times. They brought back loadouts. It’s quite clear to me that considering their support for Reach and lack of support for Halo 3, Reach is their benchmark for making Halo 4.

  1. Let’s remove a feature because it makes the game too intrinsic? That’s horrible logic. Plus, a lot of people like the idea of armor abilities.

  2. LOL. You’re whining because ONE WEAPON (which is still being tuned) is a little slower than the rest!? xD Yes, that makes the entire game’s kill times so much slower.

  3. This statement is so horrifically stupid that I can’t respond to it without being mean. Sorry. I’m just being honest. I’m not trying to flame.

It will compensate - the BR is for casual players and the DMR is for experienced players.

> > > > > > > 343 said that there will be a classic playlist for the competitive to play in that playlist.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Oh good. Competitive players can get shoehorned into one dark corner of matchmaking again.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Telling people to wait until release before judging is a terrible argument.
> > > > >
> > > > > How?
> > > > >
> > > > > Its impossible to fully judge a game based on unfinished builds and a couple of trailers.
> > > >
> > > > It’s also impossible to praise the game and say it’ll be the best Halo ever right now, but people do that all the time on this forum, amiright?
> > > >
> > > > I can already tell the game will be about exploiting the awful mechanics.
> > >
> > > Yeah? List some, I’m kind of curious.
> >
> > Armor abilities, increased kill times, built in sprint and goodness knows what else. Reach made it quite clear that littering the game with skill-gap-lowering additions is going to make the gameplay frustrating. 343 has given me no reason to think that it’ll be different this time.
> >
> > I’m sorry that the fantasy where everyone is squealing in delight over the game isn’t a reality.
>
> Your view on Armor Abilities being flawed mechanics from the get-go is caused by your narrow-minded nature and false impression Reach gave due to its poor implementation.
>
> The kill times aren’t increased from what I’ve seen, not to mention kill-times are being tweaked.
>
> Built-in Sprint is fine; it’s natural for FPSs to progress with other FPSs and collaboratively share/expand upon ideas. Not to mention the mechanic in and of itself is fine.

My view on AAs is based on their functions. Letting players break maps with jetpack, become invisible, become invincible and escape death at the touch of a button lowers the skill gap. They’re crutches for people who aren’t as good. Even so, skilled players abuse them and make gameplay frustrating for their opponents.

343 has yet to address the BR being a 5SK. I’d have to be really dumb to believe that kill times are being tweaked.

Halo was fine before sprint. The fact that it needs to start doing what other FPSs are doing in order to keep up is sad and it shows a lack of creativity from the developer. In addition, being able to escape from death/making a bad map positioning choice or being able to sprint up to people just for a double melee in a SHOOTER results in clunky gameplay.