Halo 4 Multiplayer Utility weapon spawn

For too long now (H2 - Reach) we’ve been spawning primarily with a short range, full automatic weapon which is incapable of defending yourself at long range.

This needs to stop with Halo 4. Every non-niche gametype needs to spawn you with a medium to long range utility weapon, like the BR. Spawning with an AR is only acceptable when you spawn with a utility weapon too.

A couple of (incorrect) points made by people about spawning with a utility weapon are the following:

‘There is less weapon variety in [utility weapon] starts’ - Wrong. There are no weapons that I would pick up in AR starts that I wouldn’t pick up in BR/DMR starts. The same can be said for any mediocre or better player. Anyone who does pick up anything else likely doesn’t care too much about utility weapon spawns anyway.

‘There is less map movement in [utility weapon] starts’ - Wrong. When you spawn with a utility weapon, you are free to move around the map and defend yourself and the game will actually progress because you can put shots on people and they can put shots on you rather than having to run across the whole map to try and AR melee you.

Anyone remember ARs on Guardian? That’s what happens when there are no utility weapon spawns; you spend 45 seconds waiting at top gold for a BR to spawn because you can’t do much else without one because you’ve spawned with a useless gun that’s more efficient as a beating implement than it is as a gun.

‘There is no reason to pick up anything else when you have a utility weapon’ - Wrong. There are a wide variety of more powerful weapons to take, such as sniper, shotgun, rockets, grenade launcher, etc. etc. which will all be more effective than the utility weapon in their niche ranges. Any other full auto weapon in the past has likely just been a re-skinned AR and there’s no point in picking it up in any circumstance anyway.

‘[utility weapon] starts aren’t favoured by bad players’ - Wrong. Good players will generally be more proficient with precision weapons, bad players will probably not. If the matchmaking system matches lesser skilled players with other players of similar skill, they’re all likely to use the short range non-utility weapon so there’s no imbalance issue. If a good player who can use the utility weapon gets matched with a bad player who can’t, then that’s not a problem with the gameplay or with the weapon starts, it’s a problem that the two got matched together.

‘Utility weapon starts take away any form of strategy’ - Wrong again. Utility weapon starts allow a player to do anything they want from the spawn to counter what the enemy is doing. Spawning with a short range, full auto weapon limits the player to the weapon’s effectiveness, which denies them the opportunity to do things off spawn.

Remember playing ARs CTF on The Pit in Halo 3? Because I do, and I remember an enemy pulling the flag and you watch them run down longhall but you can’t do anything about it other than mash LT because you spawned with a gun that fires popcorn and can’t combat the other people who are on your side, let alone the guy carrying the flag.

TL;DR With utility weapon starts, skilled and unskilled players will have fun if the match is even. Without them, good players won’t have fun because waiting for a weapon to spawn so that you can actually do something isn’t fun at all.

The utility weapon is supposed to be effective at all ranges but doesn’t dominate any one range. It’s supposed to be the weapon you can fall back on, not a weapon you can rely on. That’s why I find the AR to be the utility weapon of Halo. It doesn’t dominate any one area but is competent to work at all ranges. This is helped much better in Reach with the bloom system, that actually works with the AR.

Of course you’re supposed to look for other weapons. You’re supposed to find weapons that either work towards your strengths or can be used more effectively with the map layout. If you prefer close range combat you can pick up the Plasma Pistol or Repeater. Duel-wield weapons to make up for the lack of longe range with power (but sacrifices grenades). If you prefer long range combat you would pick up the BR.

Because of the limited amount of weapons you can hold a good solution would be to have the utility weapon equipped with another weapon you are comfortable with and can be used at its intended range or you can learn how the gun works even more and use it beyond its range. If you’re attacked outside that weapons range, say at medium range with the shotgun, you would switch to the utility weapon for a better chance to fight them off or to keep them at bay while you move towards a better location. If a player is confident enough they can discard the utility weapon if they’ve found a combination that can suit their playstyle or can be useful for their location on the map. But even then they will still need to be cautious if the opposing player knows what weapons they have and can effectively counter them, even with this utility weapon.

The problem comes when a utility weapon becomes too effective at all ranges and many players rely on it to win fights rather then themselves. They’re not concerned about what weapon selections they should look out for, they’re only concerned with using power weapons and then relying on that utility weapon when they run out. They’re not concerned about the weapon selection because no combination of weapons can be effective against an overpowered utility weapon that can only be beaten by itself, or a power weapon at its intended range.

1st the AR is not useless

2nd many game types you do spawn with a dmr or br

3rd if he running down that hallway on the pit u do have a magnum and there no bloom on the ar in halo 3 so you could easily get the kill

> That’s why I find the AR to be the utility weapon of Halo.

Go and get 4 competent players and ask them to play ARs on Guardian and see how that plays out.

The AR is NOT a utility weapon. If you wanted to take the AR and give it a 1.5x scope and make the reticule smaller, by all means, be my guest. But in any of the previous iterations of Halo, the AR has not been a utility weapon because it has never been more than a blunt poking stick at any range further than 6 feet.

Halo needs more scoped aiming reliant weapons and less hold-trigger-melee weapons, like the AR.

> 3rd if he running down that hallway on the pit u do have a magnum and there no bloom on the ar in halo 3 so you could easily get the kill

Clearly you haven’t accounted for the facts that

a) the aim assist on the Halo 3 magnum was very short range so actually hitting him would be difficult without any scoped capabilites.

b) the Halo 3 AR definitely did have bloom, but the reticule didn’t show it.

c) the other team who aren’t running the flag will be on your side in places like your S2 and your 2nd BR and if you spawn with an AR then against them you are royally -Yoinked!-.

Give the AR a damage buff and a scope and that would be a true utility weapon. The rifles in Halo are simply too powerful they way they are now. The rest of the sandbox needs a 150% buff to compete.

The AR a utility weapon ? Seriously ? It fails as a utility weapon in every way possible. For starters it is a close ranged niche weapon. Secondly …well I guess there is no further explanation needed.

No, I disagree with this. Do not force unto the players a single weapon starting system universal in all non-niche gametypes. That’s boring. All that needs to be done is a mild buffing to the Halo 3 pistol (add 2x zoom and reduced spread) and Ar starts are well within toleration with the side effect of broader customer satisfaction and variety.

> No, I disagree with this. Do not force unto the players a single weapon starting system universal in all non-niche gametypes. That’s boring. All that needs to be done is a mild buffing to the Halo 3 pistol (add 2x zoom and reduced spread) and Ar starts are well within toleration with the side effect of broader customer satisfaction and variety.

But reach already tried this. It is much better than H3 AR starts but still not as good as DMR starts. If the pistol did not have random spread( if it was more reliable ) then maybe.

> > No, I disagree with this. Do not force unto the players a single weapon starting system universal in all non-niche gametypes. That’s boring. All that needs to be done is a mild buffing to the Halo 3 pistol (add 2x zoom and reduced spread) and Ar starts are well within toleration with the side effect of broader customer satisfaction and variety.
>
> But reach already tried this. It is much better than H3 AR starts but still not as good as DMR starts. If the pistol did not have random spread( if it was more reliable ) then maybe.

Which I just outlined, did I not? At any rate, the Reach comparison is comparing a weapon with a 3x scope to one with a 2x. Range on the DMR is much longer than the BR negating any balanced created by the pistol.

The only Problem I seen is that From a Halo: CE 60-round AR, we got nerfed to a 60-round (recoil loaded) SMG in H2, then a pathetic 32-round AR in H3, THEN the same, pathetic and slight weaker AR in Reach. (It took 18 rounds in H:R, while H3 took 16, despite H:R’s AR being hitscan.).

And then the Pistol became terrible as the games go by. It’s either a 3 shot Pistol, a pathetic dual-wield Pistol that can’t kill for -Yoink- unless it’s in an actual dual-wield combo, OR a super-fast ROF Pistol that has Bloom.

I do not understand. I think the best starting weapons will be the Halo 3 BR WITHOUT bullet spread (Since H2’s BR ROF is a little too fast.) and the Halo: CE AR. Fixed. Any fool that dare AR you at mid ranges will be dealt with by the BR. Likewise, any fool that dare BR at close range will be punished by the AR.

The thing I do not like about Reach’s DMR is that it had a 3x zoom and bloom. (Aside from ZB slayer). But however I do find playing Elite Slayer with the NR/PR combo is fun.

The utility weapon should spawn in my hands :wink:

OP is speaking the truth, nuff said.

the AR works well in its intended range (close/punching range) but otherwise it is useless
The BR works perfectly for starts IMO. You can shoot things fairly far away, but its not as easy as say the DMR. DMR’s are almost too good at range, but still a better start than the AR.

> The utility weapon is supposed to be effective at all ranges
>
> That’s why I find the AR to be the utility weapon of Halo. It is competent to work at all ranges.

What the hell are you talking about? The AR is completely and utterly worthless at mid and long range.

You may as well be unarmed if you’re facing anyone who is more than 10 feet away from you and has a mid/long range weapon and a functioning brain.

This is another reason why COD has overtaken halo. In COD you can always spawn with a gun. In halo, half the time you spawn with a club.

> Give the AR a damage buff and a scope and that would be a true utility weapon. The rifles in Halo are simply too powerful they way they are now. The rest of the sandbox needs a 150% buff to compete.

Only if the reticules and aim assist on the auto weapons becomes much smaller.

If you just buff them and add a scope my god H4 would be a derp fest. Kids would just run in straight lines at each other spraying away. There would be no skill gap or learning curve.

> Any fool that dare AR you at mid ranges will be dealt with by the BR. Likewise, any fool that dare BR at close range will be punished by the AR.

That’s rock paper scissors. SNOOOOORRRRRRRRREEEEEE

All actions will be decided by which weapon you have out instead of player action. That’s not where we want to go.

I don’t like what’s happened to the AR. Most Halo players (such as OP, and myself) see it as a joke. But the AR is MC’s go-to weapon. The same can be said for most marines. It’s cool, it’s sleek, it’s a sci-fi machine gun! I love the AR!

But that’s just from a story wise standpoint. In mulitplayer, I hate the AR. Like you said, it sucks at anything beyond punching range and there’s really no reason to keep one around if you could have a DMR (or BR) instead. So what I propose is this- Make the AR the utility weapon, but actually make it a utility weapon. Beef it up. Give it some range, some good damage. Make it a weapon MC might actually want to use instead of tossing at soon as the cutscene is over (because that’s what I did). Don’t give it a scope, though, because then it will be too similar to the BR. All the pr0z use no-scope anyway right? Also, make the reticule smaller or give it a kick like on the Retro from Gears 3 to compensate.

I agree Bazza. Although, I think most gametype should be BR/AR starts, like Halo 3. In Halo 3, the BR was your go to weapon, however, there were occasionally situations were an AR would be useful (very close quarters situations), and a smart player would notice those situations and take advantage of them.

This would only work though if we had a Halo 3 style AR. The AR in Reach is borderline useless. You’ll almost never get a kill with an AR against someone who is competent with the DMR in Reach. As it is right now, the AR is the weapon you use when you’ve run out of DMR ammo, and there are no other weapons around. I trade it away for the first weapon I come across.

Point is, I think BR/AR starts can work if done right. AR starts is absolutely terrible though.

> That’s boring.

I would rather have good gameplay and be able to defend myself from spawn than care about the ‘boringness’ or spawning with a BR/AR rather than BR/AR or AR/Pistol.

Bad players will just switch to the AR anyway so it doesn’t make much difference.

I think the AR needs to become closer to the Lancer from Gears 3; worked as a good-allrounder weapon, and the BR/DMR more like the Hammerburst: precision over power/capacity. I think the pistol needs to become like the ODST Pistol: powerful when used right, but you’d trade it out for something better.