Halo 3 will always be #1 (the importance of first impressions)

[TheKiltdHeathen]

@Moditor_026

Truth was senile out of nowhere appeared to know halo was a weapon and had no real plan in place.

Caught this late, but this has been given some answer, at least, in “Halo: Divine Wind”:

Truth knew that the Halo Array was a weapon, and would wipe out all sentient life in the galaxy. He played up the Religious aspect of that for his necessary pawns, but once there was no more threat to his plan from within he didn’t really care anymore. He did believe that he would become a “god”, and planned to attain this by wiping out all life in the Galaxy, and then remaking the Galaxy in the image of the San’Shyuum with his loyal followers who had been kept safe from the “coming fire” in Shield Worlds and on the Ark. Flotillas of San’Shyuum escaped from High Charity during the chaos and distraction of the Great Schism.

Credit to 343 Industries for going back to patch up that glaring contradiction in character, and give reason to the apparent madness.

[Moditor_026]

The majority of your argument i 100% support.

But 5%

Come on dude thats hyperbolic.
Given what we know I reckon we have seen all this thing has to offer outside 30% of weapon and equipment.

The only surprises are the story beats and thats why the story beats are gonna make or break it for me.

As for the argument of comparing launches. I’m sick of seeing it.

Halo3 was unable to deliver on what the team wanted for 2 with at that time NEW hardware.
It launched exclusively on 360.
Infinite is far more ambitious than any game in the franchise and delivers on many features that
Bungie failed to get working.
The engine is easily the most ambitious update from a prior game.
Halo 3 was not that big an update on 2.
I love 3 but the nostalgia goggles are foggy as hell guys take em off!
Nothing about 3s dna carried over to reach.
Basic level, combat design was reworked.
Art style changed.
The new leads wanted a grittier take.
Gone as the space opera.
Enemy encounter design was far more like 1 is anything. Not because of the time period.
Bungie wasn’t interest in lore beyond lip service, 3 is a prime example of that.
It was due to them not liking the brutes or knowing how the evolve them.
So Elites returned for the vast majority of the game.
Brute showed up in what?
2 levels memorably.

If you want to make the if bungie had more time argument.
No, historically bungie success comes from last minute crunches cut most of what was planned mismanagement.
And they had time with destiny a games whose scope is closer to infinite that launched bear bones and had little of the initial Vision in tact.
343i launched halo4 in less time, it had solid gameplay a comperable sandbox of ai and items a polished if linear campaign, a full mp suite with customisation and progression, progression was technically the most robust the series had seen and an online coop raids campaign that beat destiny out the door.
People like to ignore this for some reason.

The minutiae of development has expanded by considerable levels since halo 3. Fidelity means much more work for artists despite the improved tool sets we have at our disposal. More detail = more work simple math.
The engine level updates to infinite are impressive the new things implemented are not negligible.
The game is being launched on 2 Generations of console and PC a first for the series and tonnes of more work than one system.
The updates to fidelity is not just reliant on horse power like 3s a game that wasnt technically top of visuals on release.
Yes it looks great, art style and lighting are excellent layered textures gave a nice depth but modern warfare and motor storm were more impressive no question.
And because the discourse has abandoned the topic entire it seems lets course correct.

FIRST IMPRESSIONS
Demo was hated, rereveal was applauded.
Flight was the most well recieved halo beta and arguably the most like beta of the years big titles.
The game will have the lowest barrier to entry ever and have the largest player base at launch due to this. The market has grown considerably since 2007 and just because people won’t be queueing up ad midnight doesn’t mean we won’t be seeing the biggest day one player base the series has seen.
Campaign is missing my personal favourite way to play the series day one.
The data indicates most players won’t play coop on Campaign anyway, least not first time.
The game will get it and seasoned players can coop with the newbies then and show them the cool stuff and spread the interest.
Forge will launch later also, most players don’t forge.
Not to a serious degree.
Once it launches people will know the sandbox intimately and have preformed ideas that will quickly create whole sub genres of playes and invariably reignite interest in lapsed and new players alike.
The largest social media reach to date. The open sandbox will see the most clips shared online every bugs, glitches, amazing moments will be shared more than even and the variety inherent to campaigns design and mps f2p model will support this more than any prior release.

Simply put. Infinites first impressions will be magnitudes above prior launches in scale and reach. And the game quite simply is fun to play and more accessible than ever and even the idiots that make content about how the lack of coop, br and forge at launch dooms the game will be advertising that fun.

[TheKiltdHeathen]

@Moditor_026

But 5%

Come on dude thats hyperbolic.
Given what we know I reckon we have seen all this thing has to offer outside 30% of weapon and equipment.

I think we’ve been given ample hints to a lot of it, but I don’t think we’ve seen much of the game at all. Content news has been really tight-lipped, and especially in terms of the sandbox I think there’s a lot more surprises to come. I also am estimating around 5% (not dedicated to the number, really) of the game as a whole, campaign included. So weapons, vehicles, armors and armor lore, storyline, locations, characters, etc.

[Moditor_026]

I think we’ve seen alot more than you realise.
I won’t go into leaks but we’ve seen a wholenpile of stuff and have gotten hints to be moderate in our hopes for launch.

1 biome.

Most enemies.
Loads of unlocks shown in various ways to various

degrees.

Most weapons.

Most equipment.

Most enemy types.

5% is a very small number that seems hyperbolic.
But you can dream to your hearts content dude more power to ya.
That said it is strating from the topic a bit.

So your opinion is the first impressions will be positive due to the surprises it will bring?

[TheKiltdHeathen]

@Moditor_026

So your opinion is the first impressions will be positive due to the surprises it will bring?

Oh, undoubtedly. It’s sad that there won’t be a huge Midnight Release of Infinite - I blame culture for that, those have been on the decline since 2010 due to store rules and a general societal shift - but I think Infinite’s going to be huge. I just hope I’m able to install the thing on the 8th or 9th, and that the servers handle the rush well

[Thee_Bluejay]

Bless your soul.

I do think Infinite will impress with its MP offering though… Expect to see more playlists/gametypes then we’ve seen with 4/5 at launch. So arguably Infinite will have the most ‘complete’ MP in quite some time.

[ch33zy_burrito]

@TheKiltdHeathen

I estimated. And because I don’t consider Multiplayer to be the entirety of the game. And I’d wager that you’re not suppose to discuss leaks, whatever they might be.

You ask for hard facts when it comes to statistical balancing on halo 3’s sandbox but bs a number like 5 percent for amount of content we’ve seen in infinite? Come on dude.

@TheKiltdHeathen

Not quirks , flat-out terrible lines and aged graphics. “To war” is not a “quirky” line or a snappy one-liner, it’s a flat-out terrible piece of dialogue incomparable to anything else. John-117 telling Cortana “Figured I’d try shooting my way out. Mix things up a little,” ? That was cheesy and funny. Appropriate for the tone of the series. Cortana replying “Just keep your head down; there’s two of us in here, remember?” Cheesy and heartwarming. A solid call back to the first game.

Talking about Luck like it’s a superpower? Not so much.

I feel like we’re going in circles here. Cortana “observing” a “cave” that is clearly NOT a natural structure is a horrid disservice to the fans, just how dumb did bungie think the player is? Or master chief telling the HIGHEST ranking member of the UNSC that he’s going to give back the covenants bomb after being directly question by him? I bring these up because they are direct examples of idiotic moments in halo, and they exist in ALL of them. It is part of their flare. How about when Palmer idiotically blurted out “I thought you’d be taller.” No explanation necessary.

@TheKiltdHeathen

So that’s a “no” on verifiable statistics on balance.

What do you suppose I do? I can refer you to general kidds channel where he tackles all of the weapons and their statistics in halo 3 if you like, but hard statistics shows you only that. It cannot show you the flux of balance in game. And i gave you perfect examples of how weapons coexist in the halo sandbox, which you have seemingly ignored.

@TheKiltdHeathen

Nostalgia’s a hell of a filter, I guess. The lighting is one of the worst things about the game, and is directly responsible for the absolute clash between armor pieces that look like brushed aluminium and flesh that looks like matte plastic.

You cannot be serious. The lighting, the water physics, the attention to detail on armor, vehicles, and the environment, so on and so forth. Think back to the first mission of halo 3 where chief is revived from his fall. That is the most obvious example I can think of that clearly shows halo 3’s excellence. The game looks great, even today. What you are talking about is the texture, which can wane here and there, as it does IN ALL video games.

@TheKiltdHeathen

Firstly, Reach absolutely pushed forward with the art style and story. Only a fool would blatantly deny this observable fact. Secondly, as Halo Reach “pushed forward” from Halo 3 , it did not follow suite with Halo 3 . Halo 3 changed very little from Halo 2 , really only adding equipment to the mix. The mechanical changes from those two games was very minimal and stagnant, the artwork was a more polished continuation of the same, and the storyline really only served as a Halo 2: Part 2 . Especially when you know the behind-the-scenes development of the two. If Halo Reach had followed suite with Halo 3 , it would have been further stagnation and more of the same.

Why the strawman? I keep saying that we’re talking about core features being carried on into the next title and even new ones being added in, absolutely nothing about the story or art style or even gameplay. Just simply the overarching game structure. Did reach bring back theater, forge, custom games, and fileshare? Yes. It also brought forward new features like invasion and firefight.

@TheKiltdHeathen

If you’re going with the slanted metric of all at once, perhaps. This conglomeration of trends doesn’t make for an exception in trend-chasing. Nonetheless, games with those features include: Call of Duty, Wolfenstein, Tomb Raider, Counterstrike, Read Dead Redemption, Max Payne, The Darkness, Borderlands, Rainbow Six, Battlefield. …

/None of those games have all the features mentioned. Moving on.

@TheKiltdHeathen

And the lines blur… “Halo is Call of Duty” was ever a criticism for Sprint and loadouts in matchmaking. But now it’s the art style… cool. Never mind that nothing about Halo 4’s art style is even remotely indicative of Call of Duty’s art style. This is just plainly ridiculous. And you know, what’s truly funny is that I remember this being a big dig thrown at Halo Reach . A Bungie title.

Another strawman. Just because I use “call of duty” and “chasing trends” in the same paragraph does not mean halo is copying call of duty’s art style . Nevertheless, 343 tried making halo into something its not and it was at the behest of the majority (since that’s the type of metric 343 fans use). Halo didn’t just play like something else, it now looked and sounded like something else. A generic sci fi shooter which we have been seeing for years. And don’t think I have sympathy for Bungie either, they’re the ones that started this mess by trying to change halo with reach.

@TheKiltdHeathen

Elites being larger than Spartan models and having a different movement speed absolutely presented problems for players. Larger targets are more easy to be seen, and uneven movement speeds leads to an uneven engagement rate. But nail on the head for Elites being excluded because it’s not a necessity; it’s not really a high-demand feature when the entirety of the Community is considered.

Again, only in halo 3. In halo 2, 2A, and reach elites worked fine. Them being excluded is only another step backwards. Now another key feature that set halo apart from its competitors is missing. Want to make a machinima with elites? Sorry. Want to make clan based on elites? Out of luck. Want to play as elites because its a cool -Yoink!- feature? Too bad lol. That’s 3 whole communities within the larger halo community instantly left out, regardless of whether or not they’re in the minority.

@TheKiltdHeathen

Why do people leave out Halo 2 Anniversary? Because it’s not really a separate game. It’s an Anniversary remaster of Halo 2. Dual wielding has been in two games. And again, it’s just not a popular feature. Slanting it as “too difficult for 343i” shows clear bias, especially if you’re going to also try and consider Halo 2 Anniversary as a wholly separate game, which would also place it as a 343i title. Clearly not “too difficult” for them, if that’s the case.

This is straight up denial. You yourself have stated that you know halo 2 anniversary is not simply a reskin of halo 2. A new updated campaign with a completely revamped multiplayer experience is not a new game? Give me a break. Halo 2 anniversary is the perfect counter argument to anyone that says dual wielding and elites are unfeasible. Plus, dual wielding is not the same as elites, it most definitely is a popular feature. Any player (new or old) knows that dual wielding is better than just having one of the same weapon and the only game where it is an issue is halo 2.

@TheKiltdHeathen

And again, that is what Free-To-Play necessitates. And yet, we’ve received nothing but vapid speculation that we’ll have to “pay for colors”, and we saw a decent selection of basic color schemes made available by default, so this is really an insubstantial non-constructive criticism.

And who the hell asked for a free to play halo game? (Not halo fans lmao) Why not just do what has worked multiple times and release a standalone halo project? We already know the answer to this, no need to elaborate further.

@TheKiltdHeathen

I think you’re missing - intentionally or not - the matter of a Free-to-Play model. Money has to come from somewhere, and if people who view Multiplayer as the entirety of the game do nothing but download that free gamemode, well… that’s poor business. Again, if you don’t want to spend money on it, don’t.

I am most definitely missing it. And i’m doing it on purpose. A free to play halo will never sit right with me. Forcing a game to have an “open world” and restricting things like armors/colors simply to make money ruins games. Companies focus on making money in all avenues instead of simply making a good game that will sell itself AND endure for years. Every. Single. Halo. From CE-Reach did this. They all had substantial populations up until the release of the next game. It’s only when you try to change the formula (4-5) that the games die out quickly. And that is all encompassing. From microtransactions to art style to marketing to gameplay and all other facets of the game. This formula only works for them to make money, not to make a great and longlasting game.

[ch33zy_burrito]

I can’t even say it’s their ego. Bungie had an ego. 343 is more timid, like a sad puppy lol. If I had to guess, someone in the higher ups is dictating what is actually going on with halo, either someone at 343 or at microsoft, possibly even both. All I know is that they don’t think a traditional halo would work in todays market and that’s tragic. Buuuut…

What is more worrying to me is the state of the fanbase. 343 is removing said features because most of the long time halo fans are gone. They’ve been replaced by the reach and 343 generation of halo fans that is either ok or used to these features not existing in the games to begin with. Its antiquity to them and totally justifiable when they are left out. Forge, elites, dual wield, co op campaign are all expendable to 343 because of this. It’s just not the same franchise anymore.

I too, am hyped for infinite. I’m hoping this will be the best campaign we get in years. And the gameplay (despite me loving classic gameplay more than anything) looks solid, balanced, and more importantly, fun. The art style is great too. But when you look at all these great things we just mentioned, every single one has a drawback. Awesome campaign? Can’t play it with friends. Awesome multiplayer? Monetized to shit. Best art style since halo 3? Ruined by awful, uninspired cosmetics like fractured armors/armor effects. We just can’t win with 343.

And it’s not just 343 either! Bungie sold their souls away to activision and payed the ultimate price. Destiny will never be what they wanted it to be. Battlefield 6 is the worst battlefield experience to date. Another example of trying to fix what isn’t broken. Assassins creed isn’t even about assassins anymore. Cyberpunks launch was a nightmare, do people still play that game?

So many once great developers and their series’ are now such garbage that I wonder if it’s actually me that is starting to go crazy.

[Grimmulv369]

Halo CE were the best regarding mystery and awe. Had several dreams regarding being on Alpha Halo, even dreamt up a weapon in hand, eerily similar to the red stalker rifle for Halo Infinite. Having it in hand standing by the crashed pelican with sniper rifle in the dirt trail bheind it with my warthog and some marines to the right of me… When games makes you DREAM about them, then you hit the nail on the head something good!
Gameplaywise it was its own beast with deadly physics and such. The multiplayer were kinda limiting but addicting IMHO. I did not attend LAN parties but couch cooped alot with cousins of mine.

Halo 2 aaaall the way story arch wise.
Halo 3 story arch was kinda butchered compared to Halo 2.
Gameplaywise when it comes to character animations like LOVELY Flood infection procedures, a.i Halo 3 takes the cake.

Regarding the baffling story element decicions to Halo 3

1: The most vocal toxicteers laid alot of pressure on that ARBITER IS BADZ! So Bungie lessened the important role he had

2: This might ruffle some feathers buuuut. Thanks to mr Marty himself… well thats why Sgt. Avery Johnson went out with a bang. I think Staten refused the idea. But I think Marty said it would make a bigger, emotional impact if he died. Got right in that sirs…
BUT could argue if that should have been avoided and bypass major character deaths with something just as impactful.

I like Halo Reach… buuut thanks to the STUBBORNESS and yes, disrespect at least some at the top with Bungie had with expanding the universe and let fans and fanwriters help them with deepen the Halo lore, universe and such, well. I wish Bungie adapted Eric Nylunds book to game as close as possible.
For Halos sakle! The encouraged and helped him of all things.
Same for Halo Wars that was CLOSE to never be.
The lack of support for Halo Wars back in the day makes me boil a little
Bungie was like overprotective parents, didnt really let Halo grow with the help of fans and such, widen their vision, inspire them as much as Bungie inspired the fans to write such marvels of some novels. Talk about covering your child in kevlar so no nasty fans will ruin their Halo canon/ lore bible.

I do think Halo Reach besides that have one of the best astethics, art, graphics, even to this day.

Halo 4 had a VERY promising story arch. Master Chief is his OWN character we only loan to play and imagine we are him when we manage his role in hte games. He should NOT be a robotic one hit liner machine but also not a total emotional Hamlet character either. Seems Halo 4, Halo 5 to some degree and Halo Infinite at the very least gives him the personality of both worlds. A dutyful, cold headed soldier with some funnyquirky lines and comment while also be a soft, human and understanding person on the insoide.

The gameplay of Halo 4 and 5 wre adequate. Not fond of fighting Prometheans but their concept is neat, their aesthetics.
Halo 4 and 5 were kinda opposite of each other. But not totally black and white.
Halo 4: Great, promising story arch beginning. Love the version of Cortana and her dynamic relationship with John. The Didact had potential buuut. Well books explain all after his death… H4 had also too codifyed Multiplayer, loadouts etc, no microtransaction were a plus though.

Halo 5 had worse story arch presentation. I dont hate fireteam Osiris, but their introduction should have been expanded, maybe a few missions with them BEFORE killing of Jul, which also were a travesty. WE should have done that in-game. Big points for trying to introduce Blue team though even if their introduction form book to game could have been done much more respectful of their characters. Also big pints for having us travel to Sanghelios and meet the Arbiter again.

The multiplayer was great, though too much movement options and ravenous microtransactions. And dont get me started on all those wacky armors, even though they are in-lore explained with that different armor manufacturers MIIIIGHT have something to do with going so wildly over board with certain designs, even if their intent might have been otherwise.
I love how 343 and fans now try to expand, clarify lore, canon aspects of the franchise along with book writers. Some kinks here and there but better than Bungie IMHO.
THATS top notch! Make sense of every singel lore and canon detail but at the same time let there be mystry and real danger too.

The problem is that when TOO much lore/ canon details regarding characters and such are left for the books, odd mini games, toys. Instead of smoothly introducing them in related games ( before/ after ) and from there delegate their prescence too books and other media, entertainement.

Now, this is my take on it all. Could write more but… well, wall of text and all that.

[TheKiltdHeathen]

@ch33zy_burrito

You ask for hard facts when it comes to statistical balancing on halo 3’s sandbox but bs a number like 5 percent for amount of content we’ve seen in infinite? Come on dude.

Well, here’s the funny thing about that. I have been upfront and clear that I’m estimating and guessing at how much content we’ve seen. I don’t know, so I’m not going to make a factual claim. You, on the other hand, made a factual claim that Halo 3 has “some of the most balanced sandbox in the series”.

One claim demands evidence, the other does not.

@ch33zy_burrito

Cortana “observing” a “cave” that is clearly NOT a natural structure is a horrid disservice to the fans, just how dumb did bungie think the player is? Or master chief telling the HIGHEST ranking member of the UNSC that he’s going to give back the covenants bomb after being directly question by him?

Cortana musing out loud about the Installation’s architecture is a dialogue narrative following the exploration and discovery of just what Halo is. Is it obvious that the cave isn’t natural? Yes, but it also points out that it’s not a natural cave system and will likely lead somewhere. See, you’re keen to quote the first half, but not the rest which is more important. “This cave is not a natural formation. Someone built it, so it must lead somewhere.”

As for John’s line on Cairo Station, it’s cheesy but applicable. What’s the reason he’s leaving the station? To give the Covenant back their bomb. And he does.

Ah, the infamous and Chief Brostan-hated line. “I thought you’d be taller.” This speaks to just how massive John-117’s legend became in the UNSC. Told everywhere and known by everyone, he became a veritable Giant among Spartans. Setting an expectation that he stood 15 feet tall (chill, it’s metaphorical) and crushed Covenant with his pinky finger. But he’s only 7’3"? Thought he’d be taller.

None of these, absolutely NONE of them even remotely compare to a situation in which a base is about to be massively hit by Covenant, squadron leaders are standing by for a Rally Point and the only answer they get is… “to war”. No -BLAM!- Miranda. That is, objectively, a terrible line.

@ch33zy_burrito

You cannot be serious.

I am serious, yes. And no, what I’m talking about is the lighting, which ruins a lot of models by making them look like plastic.

@ch33zy_burrito

Why the strawman?

Y’know, that claim is really ridiculous when I’m quoting you talking about the art style. “Halo 3 set the bar for what all subsequent halo titles should look like and reach followed suit.” Your words exactly. Regardless I touched on many ways in which Halo Reach did not follow in Halo 3’s style, from artwork to gameplay. So… yeah. Gaslighting doesn’t really work on a forum where everything is there to see.

This is going to be excessively tedious, unproductive, and thoroughly unenjoyable. You have a good 'un.

[l_Bergs_l]

I’m an old halo player too and the list is basically CE=3>2>Reach>>4>>>5. I’m glad parts of infinite are more like 3, but it needs to supersede 3 in all aspects as it has 14 years on it.

[AgentMaryland93]

I highly doubt 343 knocked out Forge and co-op because of ‘graphics’ as a competitor for attention. In fact, from listening to their posts and when they talk to us in reviews about the state of the game currently, it all seems to boil down more to balance issues they need to iron out.

Personally, I’d rather have a well ironed Forge and co-op than a buggy or unbalanced mess because everyone wanted to have their cake and eat it too on day 1.

Also, Forge didn’t come into play until Halo 3, so by that logic Bungie made a mistake for 2 games before finally getting it right? Co-op was also couch only until Xbox Live was realized, so I guess outside of couch play, Microsoft just wasn’t fast enough lol.

Personally, while I love to have fun in Forge from time to time and I do have friends waiting to play Infinite with me, we’ll survive for a few months. The game’s not going anywhere and will even be better by the time the parts get added.

[Thee_Bluejay]

@AgentMaryland93

I highly doubt 343 knocked out Forge and co-op because of ‘graphics’ as a competitor for attention. In fact, from listening to their posts and when they talk to us in reviews about the state of the game currently, it all seems to boil down more to balance issues they need to iron out.

You are just saying they are more incompetent than I was, if you seriously believe it took them an entire year just for balance changes/bugfixing then that’s even worse.

@AgentMaryland93

Also, Forge didn’t come into play until Halo 3, so by that logic Bungie made a mistake for 2 games before finally getting it right?

That is a horrible argument, even if you used this logic it doesn’t change the fact that 343i were incapable of releasing a finished product after 6 years.

@AgentMaryland93

Personally, while I love to have fun in Forge from time to time and I do have friends waiting to play Infinite with me, we’ll survive for a few months. The game’s not going anywhere and will even be better by the time the parts get added.

I’m probably even more hyped than you are, I will also be ok with the wait, WE are not the ones that will drop it and move on to other titles. Infinite will be swarming with new players the first month, what will their impression be? Even if you think the MP is enough the fact remains that Forge/Co-op would’ve made retaining more fans much easier.

Edit: the whole point of the thread is that 343i have yet to release a full fledged product, and that Halo 3 will always remain #1 in terms of content and scope.

[AgentMaryland93]

@Thee_Bluejay

You are just saying they are more incompetent than I was, if you seriously believe it took them an entire year just for balance changes/bugfixing then that’s even worse.

I’m not saying anything, I’m just saying that the lack of co-op and Forge at launch is not just because of bad graphics. The state of the game graphics wise is only part of the reason it got delayed and right about the time it was shown to us, Joe Staten came onboard to work on Infinite. As it stands, the game was going to be shipped that Holiday season and there was no mention of a lack of those two parts until Joe joined.

@Thee_Bluejay

That is a horrible argument, even if you used this logic it doesn’t change the fact that 343i were incapable of releasing a finished product after 6 years.

6 Years? Yeah, sure we haven’t had a Halo game outside of Halo Wars 2 for 6 years, but they sure as heck weren’t working on Infinite for 6 years lol. More like 3.

@Thee_Bluejay

I’m probably even more hyped than you are, I will also be ok with the wait, WE are not the ones that will drop it and move on to other titles. Infinite will be swarming with new players the first month, what will their impression be? Even if you think the MP is enough the fact remains that Forge/Co-op would’ve made retaining more fans much easier.

Edit: the whole point of the thread is that 343i have yet to release a full fledged product, and that Halo 3 will always remain #1 in terms of content and scope.

I dunno, I can’t speak for them, but I mean, if they’ve never played Halo before and are just joining now, what makes you think they’re gonna bellyache about a lack of co-op as if they’d had a Halo experience before? I’m sure they’ll be bummed they can’t play with friends from the get go, but some might even come from games where they normally only play solo. Though it is very likely that a co-op at launch would make it easier to retain attention.

However, I don’t understand why you’re blaming 343 for the lack of co-op, if I were a betting gal, I’d put my money on the fact that Staten’s arrival to the company to help out might have had something to do with co-op being delayed. Forge though, might just be they realized it wasn’t ready or wanted to put a little more polish on it. Because as I said before, there was no mention I could find of co-op being delayed until after Staten joined. Bit coincidental, but it could just be that, coincidence. I can only theorize.

Yeah, 343 has made some pretty bad calls, Halo 4 left a bad taste because of the MP being too CoD like, Halo 5 had a rough story that a lot of people didn’t care for, so Infinite has to make a good impression or else the fans are going to be more than just a little disappointed. BUT, co-op isn’t necessary for the game to function and neither is Forge.

Are both a lot of fun? Without a doubt.

Will the game run without them for a few months? Absolutely.

Is it a bummer neither is ready yet? Sure, if those are the only modes you play in.

Edit: moving forward, 343 has to play their cards right, they’ve made a lot of mistakes and yeah, some of them burned some people the wrong way. Bungie has made many mistakes before I’d imagine, heck, they make a LOT of mistakes now on their current game. But I won’t discredit the amazing job they did with previous Halo’s.

[Thee_Bluejay]

@AgentMaryland93

6 Years? Yeah, sure we haven’t had a Halo game outside of Halo Wars 2 for 6 years, but they sure as heck weren’t working on Infinite for 6 years lol. More like 3.

wtf were they doing? Snorting coke?

(343i are professionals, they’ve been working on it for 6 years, this would be like me saying Halo 5 had 6 months of development, just laughable)

@AgentMaryland93

I dunno, I can’t speak for them, but I mean, if they’ve never played Halo before and are just joining now, what makes you think they’re gonna bellyache about a lack of co-op as if they’d had a Halo experience before?

They won’t. They won’t know what they’re missing in that case. Many will end up leaving though regardless.

@AgentMaryland93

However, I don’t understand why you’re blaming 343 for the lack of co-op, if I were a betting gal, I’d put my money on the fact that Staten’s arrival to the company to help out might have had something to do with co-op being delayed

No Staten was sent in to finish production. He is known as a ‘closer’ of sorts. Blaming Staten tells me you don’t know what you are talking about… I’ll just move on before I hurt your feelings lol.

Its ok to be excited for Infinite, everybody is, but its releasing unfinished and instead of 343i trying to blow newcomers minds they often do the minimum and that is unfortunate for Halo fans. We’ll just have to hope and pray that Infinite doesn’t just end up being forgotten like 4/5 were.

[AgentMaryland93]

@Thee_Bluejay

wtf were they doing? Snorting coke?

(343i are professionals, they’ve been working on it for 6 years, this would be like me saying Halo 5 had 6 months of development, just laughable)

Well for one, a part of the team was working on Halo Wars 2, also, they were working on their engine, so, yeah, definitely not 6 years of development.

@Thee_Bluejay

They won’t. They won’t know what they’re missing in that case. Many will end up leaving though regardless.

Co-op being a few months late to the party and Forge half a year isn’t gonna change that. They might come back when they drop, but you can’t force people to cling to something that can’t hold their attention (which means that if they like it, they like it, if they don’t, they don’t.). If co-op and Forge is the make or break deal for people, then you’re talking about people like Dr. Disrespect who only plays one thing and that’s it. Everything else doesn’t exist. And that’s fine if they’re only interested in one thing or another, but I mean, they will eventually be added. They’re not being removed indefinitely.

@Thee_Bluejay

No Staten was sent in to finish production. He is known as a ‘closer’ of sorts. Blaming Staten tells me you don’t know what you are talking about… I’ll just move on before I hurt your feelings lol.

Its ok to be excited for Infinite, everybody is, but its releasing unfinished and instead of 343i trying to blow newcomers minds they often do the minimum and that is unfortunate for Halo fans. We’ll just have to hope and pray that Infinite doesn’t just end up being forgotten like 4/5 were.

I never claimed to know what I was talking about? I don’t know squat about game development and what goes down behind the scenes, but I’m not the only one lol. I only speculate based on what I hear and what I keep hearing is that part of the down time without a main line Halo title was spent on working on the engine that they technically wanted to work on before Halo 5 was released.

Regardless of how Infinite ends up being, it’s going to hold attention one way or another. It’s a Halo title and while there is a possibility it may not hit the way older fans like, newer fans will likely find something they like about it. Really, the only ones who seem to think it’s gonna fail are Playstation haters and people still upset about a small delay on two features.

[Holly_Johnson]

Graphics arent important if you like the game.
But most casuals just play for a short time until they hop into the next game.
And they (mostly kids) expect great visuals cause they had it in every game they grown up with.

Us oldies played games with colored pixels.
So for us every tiny improvement on the visuals is already more than we ever needed to have fun in games.

me personally, i would play Infinite with H3 graphics if the gameplay is good.
And i will dump the game without thinking twice, when the gameplay sucks.
#grapple shot #mapdesign #CoD

[DARTH_CEDIOUS]

@Holly_Johnson

And i will dump the game without thinking twice, when the gameplay sucks.

Many people seriously underestimate this. The game needs to be fun from day one, if you have a family, a job and other hobbies, you won’t wait months for a game to maybe be enjoyable at some point. It doesn’t need to be perfect but the groundwork has to be there.
Reach,4 and 5 suffered from this.

Also: nice profile picture! Always nice to see other people from my “neighborhood”

[Holly_Johnson]

i added you on xbox neighbour

[JaracRassen]

Halo 3’s story worse than Halo 5? Lol, no.