Playing at a single time. Same with Halo 2. This was around the time when the first Gears of War came out and Call of Duty Modern Warfare 4 was the HOT new game.
So uhhhhhhh why did the Winning halo formula change in Halo Reach and halo 4? Why is 343 still sticking with this new failed formual for Halo 5? People say halo had to modernize to compete with call of Duty well then how come Halo 3 was #1 or #2 on the XBL charts for its entire lifespan? It makes no sense to repeatedly try these failed ideas over and over again when the old formula worked just fine.
Street Fighter 2 is the most popular fighting game of all time (snes version alone sold in 6.3 million copies). Now that franchise is just shadow of former self. What happened? With your logic Capcom should stay with SF2’s “winning formula” of just 8 characters, lack of any further gameplay mechanics (super combos, dashing, blocking mid-air, parrying etc.) and Street Fighter would be played by same millions of players till the end of time…
So what happened? Growing up fanbase happened. Other games happened. Not only to Halo, but any gaming franchise since Pong (why don’t millions of players play that game nowadays? It’s the most fair, competitive, random-less game ever!).
> how come Halo 3 was #1 or #2 on the XBL charts for its entire lifespan?
I highly doubt that Halo 3 topped the charts throughout its entire lifespan.
CoD4, CoDWAW, and MW2 all came out during Halo 3’s lifespan, and all of them had tons of players.
Halo 5 is quite a bit different from Halo 4 and Halo Reach. It’s no Halo 2 but it’s definitely not Halo 4. The only things really returning from those games are Thruster and Sprint.
> So what happened? Growing up fanbase happened. Other games happened.
CoD is still popular, Halo isn’t.
Natural attrition hardly explains the rapid decline in interest.
Back in 2008, I switched between Halo 3, CoD4, and TF2 all the time. I never really abandoned those games until around 2011.
> 2533274819302824;3:
> > how come Halo 3 was #1 or #2 on the XBL charts for its entire lifespan?
>
>
> I highly doubt that Halo 3 topped the charts throughout its entire lifespan.
> CoD4, CoDWAW, and MW2 all came out during Halo 3’s lifespan, and all of them had tons of players.
>
> Halo 5 is quite a bit different from Halo 4 and Halo Reach. It’s no Halo 2 but it’s definitely not Halo 4. The only things really returning from those games are Thruster and Sprint.
>
>
>
> > So what happened? Growing up fanbase happened. Other games happened.
>
>
> CoD is still popular, Halo isn’t.
> Natural attrition hardly explains the rapid decline in interest.
>
> Back in 2008, I switched between Halo 3, CoD4, and TF2 all the time. I never really abandoned those games until around 2011.
Halo 3 was in the top 3 (Pretty sure it was 1st or 2nd but I’ll just say top 3) for the entire time until Reach came out. Halo 2 was at the top for its run. It just makes absolutely no sense for 343 to continue this way when the old forumal is prioven to work and the new formula is proven not to work.
And as for the other guy who tried to compare the old arcade gaem Street fighter to halo well that just doesn’t make sense. And I’m pretty sure Street fighter then and now is still pratically the same exact game just new graphics and charchters so your analogy doesn’t work at all.
I think Street Fighter is a great example, it hasn’t changed much since it was launched which is might be why it’s no longer the huge hit it was. But then you can argue that COD hasn’t changed much and those games are consistently in the top 3 of sales and online population for console games. I think it’s a combination of many reasons for why Halo online is not as popular now as it was back in Halo 3’s day; I don’t think you can point to just one and say “this is the cause”. Halo certainly isn’t struggling in sales but past success isn’t a guarantee of future success either.
It’s almost as if Halo is caught in the middle of 2 generations; the older generation who played Halo 2/3 and the younger generation who prefer things more fast paced and have far more choice (I’m generalizing there I know) and it’s trying to satisfy both and on their own there isn’t enough to put Halo back on top…just a thought
the classic halos (1,2 and 3) did so well and still do well because they “level the playing filed”. Equal starts are what grew the big attraction to the game, whereby no player had a significant advantage over the other. The game was based on pure skill and play style of the individual, not by what loadout you selected. Halo is what set the precedent for all first person shooters to come, and I think 343 was trying to still remain competitive against the other shooters that were coming out at the time, I agree that they should stick to what worked, as the old saying goes. . . " if it aint broke, don’t fix it".
I am all for new graphics and the like, but they should leave the mechanics of the game the same.
#field . . not “filed”… sorry
> 2533274906745123;5:
> I think Street Fighter is a great example, it hasn’t changed much since it was launched which is might be why it’s no longer the huge hit it was. But then you can argue that COD hasn’t changed much and those games are consistently in the top 3 of sales and online population for console games. I think it’s a combination of many reasons for why Halo online is not as popular now as it was back in Halo 3’s day; I don’t think you can point to just one and say “this is the cause”. Halo certainly isn’t struggling in sales but past success isn’t a guarantee of future success either.
>
> It’s almost as if Halo is caught in the middle of 2 generations; the older generation who played Halo 2/3 and the younger generation who prefer things more fast paced and have far more choice (I’m generalizing there I know) and it’s trying to satisfy both and on their own there isn’t enough to put Halo back on top…just a thought
I would be careful with this shortcut since it’s highly questionable. I would personaly not qualify Reach and H4 as more fast paced than HCE and H2. I see what you mean but I’m not sure this is the right way to put it.
> 2533274819302824;3:
> CoD is still popular, Halo isn’t.
> Natural attrition hardly explains the rapid decline in interest.
>
> Back in 2008, I switched between Halo 3, CoD4, and TF2 all the time. I never really abandoned those games until around 2011.
There was no “rapid decline in interest” in Halo. It’s actually very steady decline since Modern Warfare 2 showed up and people understood that CoD 4 wasn’t just 1-hit, but beginning of new era. After that Halo’s online population was steady decreasing year-by-year, to the point where there was around 50 000 Halo players splitted across 3 games. Have you noticed how hype-following is Halo’s fanbase? How this forum suddenly became another bungie.net when there was “MCC month” on IGN? Same thing happened to Halo 4: suddenly population of Halo 3 and Reach increased, and when Halo 4 was released, people were playing all 3 games until BO2 showed up. Few months later population fall down to pre-Halo 4 levels and kept falling down.
Right now CoD is still popular, but this franchise is actually 7 years old (only thing CoD 4 shared with it’s predecessors is the name). Halo was 7 yo in 2008 - peak of Halo 3 of it’s popularity, or, if you consider it solely as online game, it was 7 yo in 2011 - year after Reach, when downfall was pretty much visible. Same kind of downfall is visible in CoD: few days ago I tried playing Ghosts on PS4. Out of almost 3 million sold copies, there was just around 3000 players online! Right now vast majority of CoD players plays Advaced Warfare, which is “strange” (not really - people are just tired with same old CoD, just like they were tired with same old Halo few years back) considering how different this game is to it’s predecessors. I mean seriously. If someone says that exoskeletons (with boost jumps, dodge, dash, slide or slam) is just minor feature, that person knows nothing about how CoD works and feels (same kind of person who says that Halo 4 is “CoD in space” actually).
> 2533274940426117;8:
> > 2533274906745123;5:
> > I think Street Fighter is a great example, it hasn’t changed much since it was launched which is might be why it’s no longer the huge hit it was. But then you can argue that COD hasn’t changed much and those games are consistently in the top 3 of sales and online population for console games. I think it’s a combination of many reasons for why Halo online is not as popular now as it was back in Halo 3’s day; I don’t think you can point to just one and say “this is the cause”. Halo certainly isn’t struggling in sales but past success isn’t a guarantee of future success either.
> >
> > It’s almost as if Halo is caught in the middle of 2 generations; the older generation who played Halo 2/3 and the younger generation who prefer things more fast paced and have far more choice (I’m generalizing there I know) and it’s trying to satisfy both and on their own there isn’t enough to put Halo back on top…just a thought
>
>
> I would be careful with this shortcut since it’s highly questionable. I would personaly not qualify Reach and H4 as more fast paced than HCE and H2. I see what you mean but I’m not sure this is the right way to put it.
Yeah, it wasn’t my best wording
Halo 2 and Halo 3 didn’t exactly have much competition on the consoles.
Once CoD rolled out, Halo hasn’t been the Titan it once was.
You also ask why 343 are sticking with the same formula for Halo 5 as they did with 4. How are they? Halo 5 is an Arena Shooter and Reach and 4 were not. How is that the same formula?
Answer: It isn’t. Therefore, Your point doesn’t hold much ground.
The thing that drives me mad about this type of thinking is the idea that the return of classic Halo formula will automatically fix everything and Halo will regain millions of players when the reality is it’s only going to appease at most half of the current fan base and stagnate while killing the future of Halo’s campaigns and multiplayer. Halo is affected like all other things that are popular and an example would be comparing Halo to a rock band from the 80’s, in it’s time it was the top of the charts but now it’s performances aren’t filling stadiums, it’s filling smaller venues but still productive, entertaining and successful. The problem is that CoD is like country or rap and just won’t die out soon enough or ever and this is solely do to the fact that that game franchise is one giant hype machine and marketing brainwash monster.
All of my halo friends and two of my brothers didn’t leave halo because halo reach and h4 had problems and was unbalanced. how do i know this?.. they play call of duty now, every time a new halo comes out they(friends,family) are more interested in the next cod.
I started playing at halo CE and enjoyed all the halo games.I played all the halo campaigns, custom games and played online multiplayer on Halo CE(pc), halo 3, reach and 4, and i enjoyed making forge maps and playing online custom games with people.
I didn’t like everything that reach and 4 added, but I don’t believe it was the main thing that killed the population. i stopped playing the MCC until its working better and will be waiting for the H4 playlist, and on my 360 i still jump between halo 3, reach and four. Halo 5 is looking fun and im going to make my brothers try the beta.
One more thing actually:
> 2535430955527510;4:
> And as for the other guy who tried to compare the old arcade gaem Street fighter to halo well that just doesn’t make sense. And I’m pretty sure Street fighter then and now is still pratically the same exact game just new graphics and charchters so your analogy doesn’t work at all.
Street Fighter 2 has 2d graphics. Playing 2d fighting games is literally about reacting to animation of 2d sprites - each single frame means something else (that’s why with SSF2T HD remix none frame was added to character’s animation - because that will mean totally new game!). SF4 has 3d graphics with smooth animation - it plays much more like SF EX (most hated game in entire series), than SF2 or SFA or SF3.
Also SF4 has dashing mechanics (it’s kind of sprint in fighting games) and ultra combos (which rewards taking beating, as it’s most loser-friendly mechanic in any fighting game). Really, saying that SF4 is practically the same exact game just with new graphics and characters, is same as saying that Halo 4 is exact game as Halo CE with just new graphics and weapons. Halo, no matter if it’s CE, 2, 3, Reach or 4 is fps with regenerating shields, 2 weapons at once, grenades, melee and vehicles. If you think that addition of some small features (sprint, loadouts, AAs etc.) had major impact on franchise’s popularity, then it’s sign you lost any sense of distance and just should play more (other than Halo) games.
Okay, alright, can we finally take a good hard look at this argument. Realistically, how many multiplayer console games maintain a high userbase over multiple years? I’ll answer that for you, basically none. You really can’t compare CoD since it comes out every year - so they put enough new features in for people to enjoy the game, then get on to the next one, they only need to maintain their player base for one year. Halo is released once every three so there’s little to no chance that it will keep even a sizable proportion of its player base as they slowly drift of to other fps and such.
Right now players are spoil for choice on games and more are always coming out, that was not the case when Halo 3 was released and the fps market was slightly less flooded then - no game will hold a playerbase like that again, especailly not on the current-gen consoles. Realistically the only games that have held their player base are on the PC for obvious reasons.
The “downfall” of Halo has very little to do with the changes in gameplay that have happened since 3. Up to 2009 Halo really had no major competition for multiplayer on console. In 2007 Modern Warfare came out and that was the was the beginning of the end for the he near monopoly that Halo maintained. 3 was able to maintain a steady population during 2008 and the first parts of 2009 due to World at War being the main competitor to Halo. Once Modern Warfare 2 came out the market shift towards CoD was complete. The loss of population that Halo has faced is due to a far different market not gameplay changes.
> 2533274906745123;5:
> I think Street Fighter is a great example, it hasn’t changed much since it was launched which is might be why it’s no longer the huge hit it was. But then you can argue that COD hasn’t changed much and those games are consistently in the top 3 of sales and online population for console games. I think it’s a combination of many reasons for why Halo online is not as popular now as it was back in Halo 3’s day; I don’t think you can point to just one and say “this is the cause”. Halo certainly isn’t struggling in sales but past success isn’t a guarantee of future success either.
>
> It’s almost as if Halo is caught in the middle of 2 generations; the older generation who played Halo 2/3 and the younger generation who prefer things more fast paced and have far more choice (I’m generalizing there I know) and it’s trying to satisfy both and on their own there isn’t enough to put Halo back on top…just a thought
I agree. Back then sci-fi was the real deal. Star wars, star trek, Aliens, Predators, Transformers and the list goes on. Nowadays, the modern “realistic” warfare is whats cool, which is what CoD is offering
First off 343i DIDN’T make Reach. Bungie did, 343i only took over controlling the maintaining and updating it after Bungie left Microsoft. And they’re not sticking to the same formula as Halo 4. For one loadouts are gone, ordnance is gone and AA are gone. They added a few abilities that everyone has and everyone starts with the SAME weapons. So I fail to see how 343i is sticking to what they did with H4. Maybe I’m missing something though. I loved H4 personally and despised Reach and I know there’s people who feel the opposite. To each their own really. I like the direction 343i is going with H5 and I can’t wait to get it day one and play the Beta come the 29th.
Every game has it’s issues and downfalls. No dev can make everyone happy. No matter how good a game is their will always be people who are unhappy with the end results and will find anything and everything to nit pick at. That’s one reason I’m glad I’m an optimist. Instead of constantly seeing the downside of a game look at the bright side. Instead of trying to find all the things you think they did wrong look at all the things you like. If you don’t like a game so much than why do you find the need to come onto a forum site and bash it and even continue to play it? Obviously there are some things you like which is why you keep playing it and have faith in the dev that they will change something and find a new way to immerse you in their game. Hold off on your judgement until the game is actually out and we get our hands on the Beta. And even then you can’t say how the end game will be because of a beta. It’s for testing and tweaking things for the final product. I think a lot of people forget that.
/rant
> 2533274819302824;3:
> > how come Halo 3 was #1 or #2 on the XBL charts for its entire lifespan?
>
>
> I highly doubt that Halo 3 topped the charts throughout its entire lifespan.
> CoD4, CoDWAW, and MW2 all came out during Halo 3’s lifespan, and all of them had tons of players.
Halo 3 was the most played game on Xbox live in '07 '08 and '09. And was trading places with MW2 throughout the early part of '10. Feel free to check Major Nelsons blog archive.
> 2533274819302824;3:
> > how come Halo 3 was #1 or #2 on the XBL charts for its entire lifespan?
>
> I highly doubt that Halo 3 topped the charts throughout its entire lifespan.
> CoD4, CoDWAW, and MW2 all came out during Halo 3’s lifespan, and all of them had tons of players.
>
> Halo 5 is quite a bit different from Halo 4 and Halo Reach. It’s no Halo 2 but it’s definitely not Halo 4. The only things really returning from those games are Thruster and Sprint.
>
>
>
>
> > So what happened? Growing up fanbase happened. Other games happened.
>
> CoD is still popular, Halo isn’t.
> Natural attrition hardly explains the rapid decline in interest.
>
> Back in 2008, I switched between Halo 3, CoD4, and TF2 all the time. I never really abandoned those games until around 2011.
It was the number one for 2007 2008 and 2009 it beat out all the gamesame you mentioned. Thanks for playing 