H4s biggest problem? Teams vs Teams, LW vs LW

Mods: I have a thread similar to this, lock it if you need to. Apparently it was very unclear, and some how for a reason only god knows people are denying mics help with teamwork.

My premise:

Teams of 4 in mlg, ts, obj, etc usually have mics and communicate more.
Teams of 8 in btb usually have mics and communcate more.
Randoms(people searching by themselves) generally dont have mics and dont communicate
Communication with mics is an important part of teamwork.
This extra communication is a LARGE advantage.

If for some god knows reason you disagree with these, go spend an hour in BTB, MLG, or team objective then come back and youll agree.

Now on to the problem

For halo reach, the biggest turn off was the lack of a challenge. A large part of this was loose search restrictions, but i feel even a bigger problem was that teams dont match teams, and randoms dont match randoms. This lead to very lopsided matches.

I dont know about you guys, but i sure as hell dont like to lose 15-50. But i also dont like to win 50-15. Its just not a challenge, i dont improve, and i feel as if i accomplished nothing.

All im asking is for teams to match teams and randoms to match randoms. I just want fairer fights, for both sides. This is currently my biggest issue with halo 4, and hopefully they carry through with it and dont worry about some kid whining because he has to wait 2 extra seconds to find a match.

and if someone unplugs their mic or accidentally gets unplugged or needs to be recharged?

We’re all aware of the problem. I for one think it was one of the biggest problems in Reach. I got over most of the stuff in Reach after awhile, but the unbalanced matchmaking really aggravated me. Seriously teams vs teams and random vs random. That’s how it should be.

> and if someone unplugs their mic or accidentally gets unplugged or needs to be recharged?

did you even read the post

> Mods: I have a thread similar to this, lock it if you need to. Apparently it was very unclear, and some how for a reason only god knows people are denying mics help with teamwork.
>
> My premise:
>
> Teams of 4 in mlg, ts, obj, etc usually have mics and communicate more.
> Teams of 8 in btb usually have mics and communcate more.
> Randoms(people searching by themselves) generally dont have mics and dont communicate
> Communication with mics is an important part of teamwork.
> This extra communication is a LARGE advantage.
>
> If for some god knows reason you disagree with these, go spend an hour in BTB, MLG, or team objective then come back and youll agree.
>
>
>
>
> Now on to the problem
>
> For halo reach, the biggest turn off was the lack of a challenge. A large part of this was loose search restrictions, but i feel even a bigger problem was that teams dont match teams, and randoms dont match randoms. This lead to very lopsided matches.
>
> I dont know about you guys, but i sure as hell dont like to lose 15-50. But i also dont like to win 50-15. Its just not a challenge, i dont improve, and i feel as if i accomplished nothing.
>
> All im asking is for teams to match teams and randoms to match randoms. I just want fairer fights, for both sides. This is currently my biggest issue with halo 4, and hopefully they carry through with it and dont worry about some kid whining because he has to wait 2 extra seconds to find a match.

I never said mics did not help with teamwork. You claimed that players with mics were better, which is not a fact but only an opinion. LOL

Although I don’t agree with some of this post, it is much clearer and concise. I agree that search restrictions should be tweaked to match teams with teams. However, mics don’t mean that players are better or more organized, which is what you conveyed in the original topic.

Otherwise I commend you for not giving an ultimatum and making a clearer post.

I agree OP. H3 did a near perfect job of this, I dont understand why it wasnt included in Reach. Even a To3 with one random vs a To4 would be fine. This new trueskill needs to be explained soon.

> I agree OP. H3 did a near perfect job of this, I dont understand why it wasnt included in Reach. Even a To3 with one random vs a To4 would be fine. This new trueskill needs to be explained soon.

Maybe bungie knew no one would like reach so they prepared for a low population

> > I agree OP. H3 did a near perfect job of this, I dont understand why it wasnt included in Reach. Even a To3 with one random vs a To4 would be fine. This new trueskill needs to be explained soon.
>
> Maybe bungie knew no one would like reach so they prepared for a low population

Bahhaaahaha yes.

> > I agree OP. H3 did a near perfect job of this, I dont understand why it wasnt included in Reach. Even a To3 with one random vs a To4 would be fine. This new trueskill needs to be explained soon.
>
> Maybe bungie knew no one would like reach so they prepared for a low population

why would Bungie expect their game to fail… so they “prepared for low population” instead of fixing the game?

If they anticipated its low population they would obviously try to fix it. better product=more $$$

> > I agree OP. H3 did a near perfect job of this, I dont understand why it wasnt included in Reach. Even a To3 with one random vs a To4 would be fine. This new trueskill needs to be explained soon.
>
> Maybe bungie knew no one would like reach so they prepared for a low population

It sure seems that way. Hooray for fixing things that arent broken!

> > > I agree OP. H3 did a near perfect job of this, I dont understand why it wasnt included in Reach. Even a To3 with one random vs a To4 would be fine. This new trueskill needs to be explained soon.
> >
> > Maybe bungie knew no one would like reach so they prepared for a low population
>
> why would Bungie expect their game to fail… so they “prepared for low population” instead of fixing the game?
>
> If they anticipated its low population they would obviously try to fix it. better product=more $$$

it was a joke

> > Mods: I have a thread similar to this, lock it if you need to. Apparently it was very unclear, and some how for a reason only god knows people are denying mics help with teamwork.
> >
> > My premise:
> >
> > Teams of 4 in mlg, ts, obj, etc usually have mics and communicate more.
> > Teams of 8 in btb usually have mics and communcate more.
> > Randoms(people searching by themselves) generally dont have mics and dont communicate
> > Communication with mics is an important part of teamwork.
> > This extra communication is a LARGE advantage.
> >
> > If for some god knows reason you disagree with these, go spend an hour in BTB, MLG, or team objective then come back and youll agree.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Now on to the problem
> >
> > For halo reach, the biggest turn off was the lack of a challenge. A large part of this was loose search restrictions, but i feel even a bigger problem was that teams dont match teams, and randoms dont match randoms. This lead to very lopsided matches.
> >
> > I dont know about you guys, but i sure as hell dont like to lose 15-50. But i also dont like to win 50-15. Its just not a challenge, i dont improve, and i feel as if i accomplished nothing.
> >
> > All im asking is for teams to match teams and randoms to match randoms. I just want fairer fights, for both sides. This is currently my biggest issue with halo 4, and hopefully they carry through with it and dont worry about some kid whining because he has to wait 2 extra seconds to find a match.
>
> I never said mics did not help with teamwork. You claimed that players with mics were better, which is not a fact but only an opinion. LOL
>
> Although I don’t agree with some of this post, it is much clearer and concise. I agree that search restrictions should be tweaked to match teams with teams. However, mics don’t mean that players are better or more organized, which is what you conveyed in the original topic.
>
> Otherwise I commend you for not giving an ultimatum and making a clearer post.

1: Well i guess this was just a misunderstanging.

2: yes it would help.

3: it doesnt make them better persay, but it definately gives them a tool to use to their advantage that some players dont have.

Look at it like an AA. Say a team had jetpacks, and the other team didnt. Does this make them better? No. Do they have an advantage? Yes.

4: the ultimatum is still there for me, just didnt put it in.

> > > Mods: I have a thread similar to this, lock it if you need to. Apparently it was very unclear, and some how for a reason only god knows people are denying mics help with teamwork.
> > >
> > > My premise:
> > >
> > > Teams of 4 in mlg, ts, obj, etc usually have mics and communicate more.
> > > Teams of 8 in btb usually have mics and communcate more.
> > > Randoms(people searching by themselves) generally dont have mics and dont communicate
> > > Communication with mics is an important part of teamwork.
> > > This extra communication is a LARGE advantage.
> > >
> > > If for some god knows reason you disagree with these, go spend an hour in BTB, MLG, or team objective then come back and youll agree.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Now on to the problem
> > >
> > > For halo reach, the biggest turn off was the lack of a challenge. A large part of this was loose search restrictions, but i feel even a bigger problem was that teams dont match teams, and randoms dont match randoms. This lead to very lopsided matches.
> > >
> > > I dont know about you guys, but i sure as hell dont like to lose 15-50. But i also dont like to win 50-15. Its just not a challenge, i dont improve, and i feel as if i accomplished nothing.
> > >
> > > All im asking is for teams to match teams and randoms to match randoms. I just want fairer fights, for both sides. This is currently my biggest issue with halo 4, and hopefully they carry through with it and dont worry about some kid whining because he has to wait 2 extra seconds to find a match.
> >
> > I never said mics did not help with teamwork. You claimed that players with mics were better, which is not a fact but only an opinion. LOL
> >
> > Although I don’t agree with some of this post, it is much clearer and concise. I agree that search restrictions should be tweaked to match teams with teams. However, mics don’t mean that players are better or more organized, which is what you conveyed in the original topic.
> >
> > Otherwise I commend you for not giving an ultimatum and making a clearer post.
>
> 1: Well i guess this was just a misunderstanging.
>
> 2: yes it would help.
>
> 3: it doesnt make them better persay, but it definately gives them a tool to use to their advantage that some players dont have.
>
> Look at it like an AA. Say a team had jetpacks, and the other team didnt. Does this make them better? No. Do they have an advantage? Yes.
>
> 4: the ultimatum is still there for me, just didnt put it in.

  1. Yes I suppose it was.

  2. Glad that we agree. LOL

  3. I agree with this, since it is a good tool for those who can fully utilize.

I am assuming that the jetpack guys have the advantage. Look at the same analogy from a different perspective. Jetpack guys are flying around exposing themselves and making them a target that sticks out. The guys without jetpacks know that you must not expose yourself to the flying targets, but must take them down.

This is just another way of logical thinking. The one’s without jetpacks do not have this item, but when using common sense they can pick it apart and utilize that weakness. Since they do not have jetpacks, they must have another AA. So one could say they have an advantage if their AA is utilized correctly. Agreed?

  1. Trust me it is ok to have a personal ultimatum. I will say though that if the problem is in the final game, there is a great chance of it not being fixed. And I will assume that 343i will not care, since they already have your money. I have a few problems myself and have my own unannounced ultimatum for the game. I just see it as fruitless. I really hope that the join session is balanced or is turned off for BTB.

I wish you luck in your fight!

glad we got that sorted out and thanks for yalls votes

OP, your flirting with notions of skill and mics. Your post is just suggesting that tone though and we are on the internet, so a modification and re-wording/clarification as to what exactly your saying will do a world of good.

With that said, those with mics and skillful, in my experience, has almost always lead to two categories of people depending on conditions (tired for example): skillful minded players or want to have a conversation players.

In my limited online experience, I’ve found skillful minded players more often then not throughout my eleven years with Halo and that includes most of Reach matchmaking.

I do agree that separate teams need and should be paired together, such allows people to find a possible median when it comes to matchmaking, but here’s my issue:

I can’t say for sure whether this is true, but I’ve contemplated how Halo: Combat Evolved PC, Halo 2 console, and Halo 3 had the capabilities of finding similar skilled players, depending on the circumstances and what changed that brought broad end spectrum players in Reach. While this boils down to implementation that I have not looked at on the coding level, if Halo 4 quotes are any indication of previous search related criteria, then all Halo games to date calculate odds based on statistical numbers like kills, deaths, ratios, gametypes played and what percentages, etc…

So how did that change Reach so much? Boosting is a possible reason. With skewed results, the system may have determined most players followed a 5-10 degree level difference because of having a 4.0 k/d spread due to playing infection all day. Or maybe its a 2.50 k/d in the MLG playlist. The truth of the matter is Truskill is present as the matchmaking setup, which means it follows the same rules, guidelines, and principles of strict and non-strict matchmaking scenarios.

Most of the playlists I’ve had the pleasure of playing, follow non-strict protocols like this. Which means pulling players who, for lack of a better phrase, almost ten different levels on a 1-50 scale, together. IF that is the case, then Arena should be the playlist where all strict material is utilized. After playing in Arena for multiple seasons, I can tell you it followed strict protocols. Almost every match I played in there was, or near, my overall k/d of 1.44. Almost all of my matches included players who were handy with power weapons, and with the DMR. Almost all of my matches featured players who were gold or Onyx status and when I was ranked? Top 5% Gold was the highest I got when I, consecutively, ran into Onyx users.

How this relates to this thread is fairly simple: mic settings, whether plugged in or not, could be a factor above. But without being in a specific playlist, may not be brought into account. Personally, that is fine by me, as long as it eventually gets fixed and appropriate that teams of players will find the ideal matchmaking setup, connection-wise, with similarly skilled players. The issue here is Reach introduced the fastest search times in the history of the Halo franchise. Bungie’s last farewell statistics showed that Reach easily destroyed the amount of matches found and played in just, what? Nine or ten months after being launched? And if it hadn’t overrun the stat, that it was going to? People are going to expect that standard from now on.

Either way, we’ll see what 343 does.

>

I remember seeing that statistic, it was wierd.

Reach had like 10% more games played only 10months in, but the time played was less than half of halo 3s.

Reachs games must go by fast, or they did counting different on one of the things.

> > > I agree OP. H3 did a near perfect job of this, I dont understand why it wasnt included in Reach. Even a To3 with one random vs a To4 would be fine. This new trueskill needs to be explained soon.
> >
> > Maybe bungie knew no one would like reach so they prepared for a low population
>
> It sure seems that way. Hooray for fixing things that arent broken!

Yea lol, seems they compromised the quality of 1/2 the games to shorten the length by 10 seconds.

Yes, this is so annoying in Reach. Even this very day I got frustrated over it, first time in a while since I played Reach. Remembered why I put it away after 3 matches.

> Yes, this is so annoying in Reach. Even this very day I got frustrated over it, first time in a while since I played Reach. Remembered why I put it away after 3 matches.

Itll be like this for me if halo 4 doesnt fix it

thanks for yalls votes