Flight feedback part 2

Games Halo Infinite
1

So we got all of the feedback from 343 about the results of the 2nd flight.

Overall I’m pleased but 2 parts just really grinded my gears

They announced they will be adding a progression (shiny badge that sweaty players try to max out) system to the social game mode. Yeah not really happy about this one but I guess it’s not the worst thing once the sweats get up a decent level I won’t have to play with them anymore lol

The second thing is that they will not be adding back in player collisions and they said some bull crap that it isn’t fun not being able to move. I am really not happy about this. The reason we need player collision is not only for having fun with your friends and doing buddy jumps but also so we have those limitations where if you don’t place yourself right, or to close next to your friend it will mess them up and you both will get punished for it! I hate how sterile they are trying to make this where basically everyone is just a ghost not even playing real multiplayer. Blocking doors or forcing someone to move is part of learning the tactics of a FPS game and its what made Halo a real tactical shooter instead of a run and gun cheese fest.

Well that’s my rant. Did any of you guys have any rants from 343s post?

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2

I want to know what changes they are adding in at launch due to player feedback from July? So far, all I can gather is that the Needler will sound a little better. Everything else is being considered or planned for later. Seems like a rather long process from feedback to patch/update. Also, it appears that they are publishing supposed “positeves” and “feedback” that they want to implement themselves, not honestly representing the true sentiment of the player base in a lot of cases.

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Player collision in my opinion will definitely be reversed post launch.

Easily one of the most exploitable/busted ideas for competitive play I’ve ever seen. Makes finishing kills much more difficult and overall will slow down gameplay.

Aside from that everything else looks pretty positive. Plasma pistol getting buffed, Commando getting nerfed.

they’re all fixing that ghost push flag exploit, but what concerns me is the flag/grapple exploit (as was shown by Mint Blitz) where you can just abuse grapple to get free caps essentially.

Jeff will come to BTB post launch.

343i overall also aren’t just making huge and wide shifts on design principles, such as the PC red reticule thing. It would’ve been more alarming if 343i just starting throwing out their basic design principles on the fly.

Drop Wall will stay the same which I feel is a bad call, I feel that all they needed to was decrease uses on pickup but make it more durable (less is more)

Overall pretty good stuff assuming 343i follow up on these things post launch.

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These would be my main gripes.

  • Just about everything changed will be post launch.

  • I’m not sure adding more aim assist to weapons will make the ‘bad aiming’ feel better.

  • Majority of the weapons will still not have a red reticle on PC.

  • They left the sniper bloom the same while unscoped.

  • They nerfed the commando more. I’d rather not have bloom.

  • Player collision will be off entirely.

  • They aren’t changing when the heavy vehicles will come into the game.

  • No mention if the fusion coils will respawn.

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I think the Plasma Pistol feedback was weird. I understand they’re trying to make weapons fit a certain role, but them adding electro weapons and then mmm stripping the PP of an EMP just also feels wrong. I feel they missed on this.

I feel they’re dead wrong with player collision.

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okay lets hear them!

okay? Surely them taking feedback from launch into consideration would also be useful right?

They talk about this, things like lack of optimization contribute to this and makes aiming feel “off” irregardless of aim assist and such.

They mentioned this as well. They did this solely to address cheaters… You seriously would’ve rather them just ignored a potential exploit and just immediately go back on their design philosophy so easily?

I can keep this going forever but honestly just read it folks, 343i give reasons for their decisions, whether you agree with them or not.

One of the main complaints for BTB players was just how easy it is to counter vehicles in Infinite (Dynamo Grenade, Shock Rifle, Grappleshot, etc.) so I could see why they felt PP EMP was a bit much. Regardless it was trash vs other players so this will be a nice touch I feel.

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I’m pretty disappointed they didn’t take the radar range feedback seriously for social playlists but at least it’s being increased in BTB

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I think that are too many people that want player collision on, and it should be, hopefully they change it asap, it was seriously annoying with ctf where someone in ghost pushing team mate across map :persevere:

I’m glad 343 took time to write that feedback, it’s always nice to know that problems are being addressed, and we are being listened to. I wasn’t expecting everything to be 100% with the covid thing, and they have done such a remarkable job considering.

I can live with a few bugs here and there while they get fixed, and I’m sure new one’s may pop up when our community get’s there hands on final release.

It’s impossible to please everyone, so I hope on some things there are compromises

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Oh… I just MEGA ranted over on Reddit. I’m legitimately annoyed after reading that blog, and I’m really not even excited anymore. A lot of what is said doesn’t make any sense, not to mention a lot of it ended with “we’ll monitor it”, leading me to believe the game should’ve just been delayed a second time.

I guess I’ll copy it and post it here, but if you don’t feel like reading it I completely understand and I don’t expect anyone to waste their time reading it. But here’s my rant if anyone does care to read it:

[side-note: any time I say “You” I’m referring to 343, because I’m responding directly to them]

  • Triple Keybinds were nice, but there were a lack of binds in other areas; no binds for Weapon 1 and Weapon 2 (for a PC game, not having separate binds for weapons is a little weird, and it makes it feel like the game wasn’t designed with PC in mind at all), as well as a lack of Zoom settings; no “Zoom out” and “Zoom in” like in MCC.

  • So if we can’t have friends in TM, then what’s the point of TM? Especially considering you can also have Bots in Custom Games.

  • There wasn’t enough feedback to justify changing the Radar in Arena? Did we play the same game? Did we read the same feedback threads? Nah fam, this NEEDS to be changed. You acknowledged why people want it changed, then literally in the same sentence you go and say there wasn’t enough feedback to change it. I’m dumbfounded…

  • Behemoth was pretty good, but the lightning was very spotty and needs adjusting. A player on the outskirts wouldn’t be able to see a player in doorways, corridors, tunnels, hallways, etc, because the inside lighting is super dark and it makes it near impossible to spot people when you’re outside.

  • 2 things about Fragmentation: (1) vehicle spawn rate ABSOLUTELY needs to be changed. You talk about the end of matches feeling like bigger moments, but vehicles would spawn in with only 10 seconds remaining. Quite literally some vehicles just weren’t usable because they spawned literally right when the match ended. (2) You talk about Fragmentation being an amazing map with plenty of spaces for vehicle and Spartan combat, but the map felt so small that vehicles felt like they had no place because they had no room to breathe.

  • 2 things about PC: (1) While there were a plethora of settings and options, there was also a lack of settings and options; no binds for Weapon 1 and Weapon 2; no “Zoom out” and “Zoom in” binds like in MCC; no crosshair size option; no audio option to make your Personal AI quite. (2) I don’t mean to sound rude, but I improved my performance by doing weird little tricks recommended by the community. So I wouldn’t quite say the improved performance was all from your efforts.

  • About (the lack of) Red Reticle: I’m not going to sit here and claim that y’all should make a better anti-cheat, but you don’t just go and remove something crucial just because it could be beneficial to cheaters. If you could permanently eliminate cheating, maybe I’d get behind it, but fighting cheaters will be a never-ending war.

  • A few things about Weapons: (1) AR feels extremely powerful while the BR feels incredibly weak. (2) Ya know, it’s really funny how it’s claimed that the Sidekick isn’t a Primary weapon, yet you absolutely CAN use it as a Primary weapon. (3) Bloom is something that’s not very fun. You can’t do anything about it because it has nothing to do with you. You miss shots and maybe some of it are from you actually missing shots, but the rest are from bloom taking over. (4) Maybe statistically Infinite’s Sniper Rifle hip-fire tuning is in-line with other Halo’s, but it just doesn’t feel like it is. The only 343-created Halo game that exists on PC is Halo 4, so I won’t be able to use Halo 5 as a comparison, but no-scoping with the Sniper Rifle in Halo 4 feels much easier and even way more satisfying than in Infinite, which is concerning because Halo 4 is older than Infinite.

  • The purpose of the the Drop Wall is to shield you, yet it deploys so slow that you can’t rely on it in any situations like you could the Bubble Shield in past games.

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That’s not how player levels work at all…
The level you get from earning XP is purely just a number

Matchmaking prioritises MMR (Matchmaking rank) & CSR (Competitive Skill Rank) for Social & Ranked respectively.
Your KDA, win percentage etc play a role as contributing factors to who you’re matched against, not the number next to your level.

The only visible rank that applies is your Ranked rank, Bronze, Gold, Onyx etc. That’ll only happen in Ranked matches, which again - you’ll be matched with people of a similar rank anyway.

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I’m very interested in how the aim assist changes will play out. I hated playing with a controller in the flights, but I don’t have regular access to a good PC right now. I’m not too worried in the long run, because I’m convinced 343 understands just how important this is and will adjust things as needed over time. You really can’t afford to screw this sort of thing up in a Halo title. Especially if you want it to last 10 years.

I can’t agree with the Ghost not needing a damage nerf. It’s supposed to be a scouting vehicle for fast hit and run attacks against 1 or 2 light targets, and was never intended to be a hard hitting or tanky vehicle. It definitely needs less durability, but keeping its damage output high makes it too effective against infantry and makes it encroach on Warthog territory. It should take 1 or 2 more shots to kill, or they could reduce rate of fire, or decrease projectile speed.

Still not a fan of many of the sound effects, like the Plasma Grenade for example. The explosion sound is very generic instead of the almost staticky, electrical splash sound that made it stand out, and the detonation timer sound lacks that short sine sweep that was very satisfying to hear. I don’t want to sound ungrateful, but I actually think many of the sounds should just be scrapped and redone from the ground up.

Weapons should be extremely easy to tell apart just from how they sound, but they should also have a very distinct sound that’s memorable and just a joy to listen to on its own. Every weapon’s sound should have a joyful/pleasant little gimmick to it. Any sort of grating sound effects need to be used very sparingly to not become obnoxious. For example, the Plasma Pistol’s primary fire sound effect in the first flight was hard on the ears. Whereas in the second flight, it’s easier on the ears and close to right for a “Halo” sound effect.

Time to kill wasn’t addressed, and that has me a bit worried. Perhaps 343 will slowly adjust the sandbox over time to be a touch slower overall? And when I say “slower” don’t think I’m talking about several seconds of a difference. I’m talking in the fractions of a second to 1 second differences in non-theoretical (Average, real-world) kill times. Most people would hardly notice this as more than a minor “inconvenience” at best. I still hold firm to the idea that Halo Infinite should be faster than Halo 3, but a touch slower than where it is now, as far as real gameplay TTK goes. I just don’t think it gives you enough time to react, and takes the chill factor right out of the game.

Still no mention of particle effects being changed to better match the rest of the art style (Especially the plasma weapons), but I’m not surprised at this point because that’s a fairly major change that would require a lot of time to address. If changes were even put into motion today, it would take months and months to get things into a presentable state. In other words: If it ever happens, it will happen a fairly long time after release.

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They talk about how the sidekick shouldn’t be used like a primary weapon. How about not allowing the AR to cleanly mow people down from across the map. It is far to accurate from long range

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Yeah, Fragmentation’s vehicle spawns were broken. I was one of the lucky few who actually had the opportunity to hop into a Scorpion. Imagine my joy when I saw the animation of my spartan climbing into a tank. Now imagine my sadness as the match ended as soon as that animation finished. If that’s how late the more powerful vehicles will be spawning in, I’ll be sticking to MCC for games like Big Team Battle.

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I am not happy about the removal of Plasma Pistol EMP and player collision.

And I’m extremely disappointed that we’ll have to wait for months for a proper Halo HUD.

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I think the update is mostly good, but I’ll argue that the lack of player collision leads to more frustration than having it, and it makes the game feel ‘cheap’ if that makes any sense. Like the physics and gameplay don’t have all its features complete.

Really hoping it’s something they reconsider for launch.

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Everybody on the planet was talking about the AR being too strong yer there was nothing about it in their blog? Wat?

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Because no one is talking about that. The AR isn’t to strong and fills its roll well it is a primary weapon and meant to be a go to mid range weapon.

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Has 343 given a reason why they changed the default crosshair color from light blue to white. The white crosshair gets lost in the environment at times depending on the lighting. I understand the red reticule change but why change the default light blue color?

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your problem with aiming is this. aim assist only activates when the reticle touches an enemy but as soon as your reticle stops touching the player, aim assist deactivates and then aiming is much harder.

This is bad design in my opinion as some weapons need more aim assist than others. Weapons like the sniper and BR need little aim assist as they dont require constant accuracy to kill someone as they fire in bursts which is why aiming with those felt decent enough in the flights.

Automatic (fast firing) weapons require a bigger reticle stickeness radius as they require constant acccuracy. this is why people had a real issue with the commando hitting moving targets because the stickiness is so small.

Its even a little issue with the AR, evident with the terrible aim in that IGN first gameplay video when he was wildly messing up his aim. Even a casual shouldnt be aiming that bad. Its a problem with the aim assist stickiness that feels worse at close range with fast moving targets

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Player collision is overrated. Seriously, everyone loves bumping into each other?

I find myself constantly cursing about people bumping into me, blocking my retreat, clogging choke points, shooting at the back of my head instead of pushing, in every game that has collision. Most people have terrible movement, at least in the games I play.

Overwatch and Apex handle no collision pretty well. I don’t feel like I’m missing out with it not being in a game.

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