Fixing the Game: Capture the Flag

As a long time Halo fan, the changes to capture the flag are really quite appalling and a downgrade as far as I’m concerned. Halo 4 has the worst capture the flag mode that I have ever seen an first person shooter( I’ve played a lot of first person shooters)in my entire life. The changes have taken away what made Halo 1/2/3/Reach Capture the Flag an interesting, exciting mode from a player and spectator point of view.

In the current CTF offering in Halo 4, you can no longer drop the flag, and pick it up. This is a huge issue, firstly because you can no longer defend yourself with whatever other weapons you may have. Currently you have the "Flagnum, which solves the problem of the carrier defending himself, fixing a problem that Halo never really had to begin with. It was more interesting to not have a weapon while carrying the flag because you would have to make the decision of dropping the flag and getting the first shot on your attacker; at the risk of dropping the flag unnecessarily and revealing your position to the enemy team via the defend flag waypoint( another issue I’ll address later). In addition this removes the tactic of “flag juggling”, while some might argue that it is annoying to hear the announcer repeat the same lines over and over again; it gave the gameplay depth. Largely due to the decision making involved; if a player decides to juggle the flag, he will be rewarded with a faster capture at the risk of the entire enemy team knowing his position. While if said player were to not juggle the flag, the enemy team would have a harder time knowing his actual position, at the cost of moving slower. All of the following issues could be fixed by allowing flag pickup and dropping with no cooldown, and disabling auto-pickup.

Unfortunatley flag dropping isn’t the only issue, the mode is also plagued by auto-pickup. This is a frustrating mechanic in every objective gamemode. It seizes control away from a player which should be a factor in a first person shooter, which revolves entirely around controlling your movement, and weapon. Once again a very simple fix; remove it. There’s literally no point in this mechanic; once again 343 fails miserably at trying to fix issues with a gametype that the gametype never actually had. People will play the objective if there is an incentive to win, not by forcing them to pickup the objective and taking it to the capture point so they can get rid of it. This incentive could be created simply by lowering the EXP bonus of capturing a flag in exchange for a 500-1000 win bonus.This would also solve the problem of betraying for the flag, or letting your teammates die because you wanted to cap it. By making these changes you are giving control back to players, and creating an objective gamemode that they WANT TO WIN.

Furthermore, the mechanics of a resetting a flag has been changed for the worse. Instead of standing in a close proximity of the flag for a set amount of time, you know have to defend a flag for a full 30 seconds without an enemy player touching it. The problem this creates is that if the enemy team gets any amount of momentum(1/2 across the map), the flag is captured even if their entire team dies twice. That simply isn’t fair to the defending team. A reasonable solution would be to make the flag reset activated by a player standing close to the flag for 5-15 seconds, and then reset automatically after 30. This change is more interesting because it now will now give teams the option to punish a team where all the players in addition to returning their own flag. But wait there’s more…

In the current brew, there is no way to punish a team that loses every player, because players respawn way too fast. You currently have the option to cut the respawn time by 5 seconds by hitting the X button. This make CTF boring; if the enemy team over extends currently they can get back into the game lightning fast and defend easily. If the fast respawn was removed, teams would be punished for losing large amounts of players all at once, and the enemy team in response can push forward and secure map control virtually uncontested to give themselves a small lead. The solution to the issue is to remove the fast respawn button in CTF, and have a straight up, no nonsense 10 second respawn timer.

Don’t worry there’s just a little more.

Another issue is the way that waypoints currently work. In the current mode, waypoints are shown for the flags at all times. Even when the flag is held by an enemy player, it still reveals them fully with the waypoint. This is just bad design, it should require communication to spot a carrier who isn’t juggling(see above.), not a giant kill marker over said person’s head.

In conclusion to this giant wall of text. A lot of the pointless changes that were made, take away the spirit of the gametype for me.They should be reverted in addition to some other changes that will make CTF a more fun, and competitive game mode for casual and competitive players alike.

TL;DR

  • Halo 4 CTF Bad
  • Halo 3 CTF Good
  • 10-20 XP bonus per flag capped per player
  • 500-1000XP Bonus to the winning team per player
  • Flagnum needs to be removed.
  • Auto pickup needs to be removed
  • Juggling needs to be made possible.
  • Respawn timer needs to be 10 seconds. No nonsense.
  • Flag return needs to be changed.
  • Flag dropping needs to be enabled.
  • Strong incentives for winning, over capping flags.

Well since this is the first time I’ve liked Capture the Flag in any halo game (and I’ve been playing since CE) I would have to say i disagree

I enjoy this ctf much better than any of the previous halos. The simple fact that flag juggling is gone alone makes me smile.

See I thought I’d hate the new CTF do in large part to not being able to drop the flag, but I actually like it. The only complaint I have is that the 30 sec. return is a bit long.

Halo 4 CTF is wayyyyyy better than Reach CTF. Feels more like CE/2/3 CTF to me.

> I enjoy this ctf much better than any of the previous halos. The simple fact that flag juggling is gone alone makes me smile.

Why? Nobody is forcing you to juggle the flag. You do it so you can cap it faster at the risk of being revealed. Do you hate having strategic options when playing a game?

because “juggling” a flag makes no sense. it was a flaw in the game mechanics that somehow turned into a “strategic option”. if you want the option to drop the flag to defend yourself or toss it up to a teammate, so be it. but juggling should be never be brought back.

You have only finished 4 CTF matches. How can you say it is bad?

New CTF is the worst change in Halo 4. Not being able to drop the flag is the single stupidest change I have ever seen a developer do to a game. If we could drop the flag, I am sure the gametype would be fine, but right now it is atrocious. CTF went from the best objective gametype to the worst.

  1. I’m a LONG time Halo player from the competitive CE days. My opinion is that CTF is brilliants in Halo 4.

  2. Instead of opinion, not sure if you’ve noticed that outside of the major playlists (Slayer, Big Team, and SWAT) CTF is the most played playlist. :wink:

I’m glad people cant drop the flag anymore, because now, when you pick up that flag, you have to commit to that role, and people stop being little -Yoink- about stuff like “NO I WANNA CAPTURE THE FLAG,” or camping with it to get free kills.

Halo 4 CTF is far more enjoyable than any past halo game’s. With a party, CTF is one of my favourite game types.

I find it way more enjoyable than reach’s CTF, but there are only 2 main things I would change:

  1. No autopick up
  2. Let us drop the flag

The whole incentive to win really isn’t a CTF problem, just a matchmaking problem itself.

Not only is CTF bad, it’s bad and easy. I went from losing almost all my games in Halo Reach whenever I played CTF to capturing at least 3 flags every game. Why’s that? Because the Flagnum is over powered (I was literally able to kill a Ghost just by spamming it with the Flagnum).

And argh how I hate how there’s that gigantic waypoint above my head whenever I hold the flag. Unless my team is half competent I’ll always be the target of the entire other team and I have to keep moving otherwise I’ll just get cornered and killed.

-Waypoint while holding flag needs to be removed.
-Manually picking up and dropping flag (juggling) need to be re-added with no cool down.
-30 second timer replaced by the timer system in Halo Reach which punishes bad players for dying on the flag run.
-Flagnum disabled: You either carry a flag with no weapons, or have weapons and no flag. No overpowered magnum with infinite ammo. This is disgusting and muddies up the Halo gameplay.

> I find it way more enjoyable than reach’s CTF, but there are only 2 main things I would change:
> 1. No autopick up
> 2. Let us drop the flag
>
> The whole incentive to win really isn’t a CTF problem, just a matchmaking problem itself.

Indeed, and incentive to win is not an isolated issue; however the suggestion I made about the 500-1000 EXP bonus would definitely create an incentive.

> I’m glad people cant drop the flag anymore, because now, when you pick up that flag, you have to commit to that role, and people stop being little Yoink! about stuff like “NO I WANNA CAPTURE THE FLAG,” or camping with it to get free kills.

That has never been an issue TBH from what I’ve seen This is with thousands of games experience.

The current bonus is 50 Per capture for the player who capped it. A 10-20 EXP bonus per player each time a flag is capped on a team would definitely help mitigate the issue you’re referring to.

The auto pickup was my biggest grip about this gametype. In fact not one person I have played with and talked to agreed that it should be there.
Although I really don’t think juggling should be a viable option either.
I would suggest a mechanic for when the flag is dropped by an individual that they can’t pick it up again for 2-3 seconds.

I enjoy the new CTF also. It’s funny how most people on this post have the same thoughts.

I love capture the flag and ive been play first person shooter since Quake and Doom ive been on Killing spree’s with the flag in hand you must be really bad with the pitol being able to put the flag down was never nessasery if you was accurate.

I don’t know why this thread is even back up here, but since it is I might as well give my 2 pence (Yeah I said 2 pence).

CTF is awful, literally awful.

The waypoint over the carriers head pretty much ruins the game-type. The DMR will destroy you on an open map, just look at settler. Settler is perhaps the worst map for CTF, if not the worst map in the game.

Automatic pick-up is also terrible, sometimes I need to clear a base before I attempt a flag-run. I don’t want to have to tip-toe around a flag just to make sure that I don’t pick it up.

Not being able to drop the flag is also foolish. I don’t want to use the pistol against someone that is out of the pistols niche range. I would like to drop the flag and kill the enemy with my BR thanks.

The flagnum is alright, but I’d prefer if they kept that in Infinity CTF. I just want a standard CTF plox.

Overall, CTF is way worse than what it was. Unnecessary change has ruined the play-list and also the game.

> As a long time Halo fan, the changes to capture the flag are really quite appalling and a downgrade as far as I’m concerned. Halo 4 has the worst capture the flag mode that I have ever seen an first person shooter( I’ve played a lot of first person shooters)in my entire life. The changes have taken away what made Halo 1/2/3/Reach Capture the Flag an interesting, exciting mode from a player and spectator point of view.
>
> In the current CTF offering in Halo 4, you can no longer drop the flag, and pick it up. This is a huge issue, firstly because you can no longer defend yourself with whatever other weapons you may have. Currently you have the "Flagnum, which solves the problem of the carrier defending himself, fixing a problem that Halo never really had to begin with. It was more interesting to not have a weapon while carrying the flag because you would have to make the decision of dropping the flag and getting the first shot on your attacker; at the risk of dropping the flag unnecessarily and revealing your position to the enemy team via the defend flag waypoint( another issue I’ll address later). In addition this removes the tactic of “flag juggling”, while some might argue that it is annoying to hear the announcer repeat the same lines over and over again; it gave the gameplay depth. Largely due to the decision making involved; if a player decides to juggle the flag, he will be rewarded with a faster capture at the risk of the entire enemy team knowing his position. While if said player were to not juggle the flag, the enemy team would have a harder time knowing his actual position, at the cost of moving slower. All of the following issues could be fixed by allowing flag pickup and dropping with no cooldown, and disabling auto-pickup.
>
> Unfortunatley flag dropping isn’t the only issue, the mode is also plagued by auto-pickup. This is a frustrating mechanic in every objective gamemode. It seizes control away from a player which should be a factor in a first person shooter, which revolves entirely around controlling your movement, and weapon. Once again a very simple fix; remove it. There’s literally no point in this mechanic; once again 343 fails miserably at trying to fix issues with a gametype that the gametype never actually had. People will play the objective if there is an incentive to win, not by forcing them to pickup the objective and taking it to the capture point so they can get rid of it. This incentive could be created simply by lowering the EXP bonus of capturing a flag in exchange for a 500-1000 win bonus.This would also solve the problem of betraying for the flag, or letting your teammates die because you wanted to cap it. By making these changes you are giving control back to players, and creating an objective gamemode that they WANT TO WIN.
>
> Furthermore, the mechanics of a resetting a flag has been changed for the worse. Instead of standing in a close proximity of the flag for a set amount of time, you know have to defend a flag for a full 30 seconds without an enemy player touching it. The problem this creates is that if the enemy team gets any amount of momentum(1/2 across the map), the flag is captured even if their entire team dies twice. That simply isn’t fair to the defending team. A reasonable solution would be to make the flag reset activated by a player standing close to the flag for 5-15 seconds, and then reset automatically after 30. This change is more interesting because it now will now give teams the option to punish a team where all the players in addition to returning their own flag. But wait there’s more…
>
>
> In the current brew, there is no way to punish a team that loses every player, because players respawn way too fast. You currently have the option to cut the respawn time by 5 seconds by hitting the X button. This make CTF boring; if the enemy team over extends currently they can get back into the game lightning fast and defend easily. If the fast respawn was removed, teams would be punished for losing large amounts of players all at once, and the enemy team in response can push forward and secure map control virtually uncontested to give themselves a small lead. The solution to the issue is to remove the fast respawn button in CTF, and have a straight up, no nonsense 10 second respawn timer.
>
>
>
>
>
> Don’t worry there’s just a little more.
>
>
>
> Another issue is the way that waypoints currently work. In the current mode, waypoints are shown for the flags at all times. Even when the flag is held by an enemy player, it still reveals them fully with the waypoint. This is just bad design, it should require communication to spot a carrier who isn’t juggling(see above.), not a giant kill marker over said person’s head.
>
> In conclusion to this giant wall of text. A lot of the pointless changes that were made, take away the spirit of the gametype for me.They should be reverted in addition to some other changes that will make CTF a more fun, and competitive game mode for casual and competitive players alike.
>
>
>
> TL;DR
> - Halo 4 CTF Bad
> - Halo 3 CTF Good
> - 10-20 XP bonus per flag capped per player
> - 500-1000XP Bonus to the winning team per player
> - Flagnum needs to be removed.
> - Auto pickup needs to be removed
> - Juggling needs to be made possible.
> - Respawn timer needs to be 10 seconds. No nonsense.
> - Flag return needs to be changed.
> - Flag dropping needs to be enabled.
> - Strong incentives for winning, over capping flags.

I have to agree fully to this post as CTF was also one of my favourites from previous halos. I wouldn’t really mind if the left the dubbed “flagnum” in however, as it would protect the player from enemies moving backwards while shooting, but I think you should only be able to use it if one of your equipped weapons is a magnum.