So I went back and played some ODST firefight the other day and put it on Legendary difficulty and it was hard…real hard. It feels like with firefights most recent iteration it is only hard at times because the enemies are bullet sponges when in the original they had a decent amount of health but more than that their AI was challenging.
It seems to me fighting AI in Halo has changed since halo 4 where it is less about strategy and more about bullet sponges as enemies (i.email. any boss in firefight, Knights from halo 4) and also not to mention the fact that halfor the enemies weapons track you. Why is this? This is not fun, it is mindlessly pressing buttons.
You’re preaching to the choir, man. I’ve made many posts on here about how we need a more classic, survival based Firefight like ODST’s with the customization of Reach’s.
Let’s hope 343 hears us. If not for Halo 5 then hopefully for Halo 6.
I disagree. The legendary warzone firefight is just as tough as the odst firefight. You are still made of paper compared to enemies. Enemies still are very accurate with their shots. The only reason it may seem easier is because you have teammates and access to way better weapons if you want to use them.
> 2533274814289862;2:
> You’re preaching to the choir, man. I’ve made many posts on here about how we need a more classic, survival based Firefight like ODST’s with the customization of Reach’s.
>
> Let’s hope 343 hears us. If not for Halo 5 then hopefully for Halo 6.
Thanks for using common sense. I honestly expected the first comment on here to be someone calling me an idiot and telling me how Halo 5 is the best game ever made.
> 2533274816788253;3:
> I disagree. The legendary warzone firefight is just as tough as the odst firefight. You are still made of paper compared to enemies. Enemies still are very accurate with their shots. The only reason it may seem easier is because you have teammates and access to way better weapons if you want to use them.
> 2533274824807326;1:
> So I went back and played some ODST firefight the other day and put it on Legendary difficulty and it was hard…real hard. It feels like with firefights most recent iteration it is only hard at times because the enemies are bullet sponges when in the original they had a decent amount of health but more than that their AI was challenging.
>
> It seems to me fighting AI in Halo has changed since halo 4 where it is less about strategy and more about bullet sponges as enemies (i.email. any boss in firefight, Knights from halo 4) and also not to mention the fact that halfor the enemies weapons track you. Why is this? This is not fun, it is mindlessly pressing buttons.
You’re right about how the AIs were smarter and they didn’t seem like bullet sponges but you should keep in mind that in Halo 3: ODST, you play as an ODST not a Spartan. There’s a big difference in health and abilities so it makes sense that a Spartan’s firefight would feel easier than an ODST’s.
Hopefully Halo 6 has a Firefight mode that’s closer to Halo: Reach’s Firefight or Halo 3: ODST’s Firefight. I like the new one but if the old one returned, many fans would be happy. Or they could just add lives and revive to the current Firefight…
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> > I disagree. The legendary warzone firefight is just as tough as the odst firefight. You are still made of paper compared to enemies. Enemies still are very accurate with their shots. The only reason it may seem easier is because you have teammates and access to way better weapons if you want to use them.
>
> Did you read the post?
Yeah it seemed you are trying to say the enemies are easier to fight just bigger bullet sponges.
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> > > I disagree. The legendary warzone firefight is just as tough as the odst firefight. You are still made of paper compared to enemies. Enemies still are very accurate with their shots. The only reason it may seem easier is because you have teammates and access to way better weapons if you want to use them.
> >
> > Did you read the post?
>
> Yeah it seemed you are trying to say the enemies are easier to fight just bigger bullet sponges.
That’s my point, they are not fun or challenging to fight now. They do not possess any complicated ways of attack like they did in ODST IE brutes with a variety of weapons, brutes pushing crates to get to you, jackal snipers in hard to kill spots, brute choppers moving around. The key is in game play diversity.
> 2533274824807326;4:
> > 2533274814289862;2:
> > You’re preaching to the choir, man. I’ve made many posts on here about how we need a more classic, survival based Firefight like ODST’s with the customization of Reach’s.
> >
> > Let’s hope 343 hears us. If not for Halo 5 then hopefully for Halo 6.
>
> Thanks for using common sense. I honestly expected the first comment on here to be someone calling me an idiot and telling me how Halo 5 is the best game ever made.
No, trust me, ever since I found out how Warzone Firefight was going to be, I immediately went into the feedback thread to speak my mind. I’ve made my own version of ODST Firefight in Reach that needs to be played on Legendary to work properly. I really wish they would’ve done the same here.
I think the ai has changed in a way that imitates other players cause say if I need to reload or I’ve used my thruster they take advantage of it just like a player would.
But depending what the servers are like will depend on how well they behave at its worst ai will literally be frozen still.
> 2533274816788253;3:
> I disagree. The legendary warzone firefight is just as tough as the odst firefight. You are still made of paper compared to enemies. Enemies still are very accurate with their shots. The only reason it may seem easier is because you have teammates and access to way better weapons if you want to use them.
Legendary Firefight in Halo 5 and Firefight in ODST are hard for different reasons, though. In ODST, the enemy’s had standard health and damage output, depending on which difficulty you were playing, and they couldn’t snipe you from across the map with plasma pistols, nor did their weapons track you, unless they used needlers or overcharged the plasma pistol. The health of the enemies only increased when the corresponding skulls became active.
In Halo 5, enemies have buffed health and damage output, regardless of which difficulty you play, they have ungodly accuracy, they can snipe you from across the map with ridiculous weapons, and they track you. Literally the only “difficulty” in Halo 5’s iteration of Firefight is that the enemies are bullet sponges and they do absurd amounts of damage. The fact that we need to use over powered REQs just to put a noticeable amount of damage on them is all the proof you need that Halo 5’s Firefight had no thought put into how to make it an actual challenge. Bullet sponge enemies are a really cheap and lazy way of making something “challenging”.
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> > > > I disagree. The legendary warzone firefight is just as tough as the odst firefight. You are still made of paper compared to enemies. Enemies still are very accurate with their shots. The only reason it may seem easier is because you have teammates and access to way better weapons if you want to use them.
> > >
> > > Did you read the post?
> >
> > Yeah it seemed you are trying to say the enemies are easier to fight just bigger bullet sponges.
>
> That’s my point, they are not fun or challenging to fight now. They do not possess any complicated ways of attack like they did in ODST IE brutes with a variety of weapons, brutes pushing crates to get to you, jackal snipers in hard to kill spots, brute choppers moving around. The key is in game play diversity.
And I disagree. It may just seem that way since you have access to better weapons and are playing with a group instead of individually. Playing solo vs a lot of AI will almost always seem tougher then fighting with 7 other Spartans vs AI.
Warzone Firefight is and always was going to be more Warzone than Firefight. It certainly lacks to spirit of the original Firefight mode, which is unfortunate.
I too wish they used more dynamic, smart AI to increase difficulty as opposed to just lazy health/damage/accuracy increases.
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> > > > > I disagree. The legendary warzone firefight is just as tough as the odst firefight. You are still made of paper compared to enemies. Enemies still are very accurate with their shots. The only reason it may seem easier is because you have teammates and access to way better weapons if you want to use them.
> > > >
> > > > Did you read the post?
> > >
> > > Yeah it seemed you are trying to say the enemies are easier to fight just bigger bullet sponges.
> >
> > That’s my point, they are not fun or challenging to fight now. They do not possess any complicated ways of attack like they did in ODST IE brutes with a variety of weapons, brutes pushing crates to get to you, jackal snipers in hard to kill spots, brute choppers moving around. The key is in game play diversity.
>
> And I disagree. It may just seem that way since you have access to better weapons and are playing with a group instead of individually. Playing solo vs a lot of AI will almost always seem tougher then fighting with 7 other Spartans vs AI.
How does it just “seem” that way to him? Please explain that reasoning, because he’s actually right. The AI in Halo 5 do not have interesting ways of attacking the player. The either move towards you, or the move away from you in basically a straight line. They don’t throw grenades as a group like the Brutes and Grunts in Halo 3 and ODST. In those games, you could even hear the Brute leaders giving the orders to throw grenades.
The bosses just stand there in one place doing the same one or two insta-kill moves, eating all your bullets until they eventually die. Explain how that is fun. I want to feel like I’m in a fight for my life, like I’m being hunted by the enemy. In ODST and Reach, the AI actually looked for you if you were hiding. In Halo 5 they just stay in whatever area they spawned in and you have to go to them. And with how big some of the maps are, it’s a chore doing that, along with trying to kill everything within the measly 5 minutes they give us to do it.
> 2533274814289862;2:
> You’re preaching to the choir, man. I’ve made many posts on here about how we need a more classic, survival based Firefight like ODST’s with the customization of Reach’s.
>
> Let’s hope 343 hears us. If not for Halo 5 then hopefully for Halo 6.
I want this so bad, tired of bullet sponge bosses.
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> > > > > > I disagree. The legendary warzone firefight is just as tough as the odst firefight. You are still made of paper compared to enemies. Enemies still are very accurate with their shots. The only reason it may seem easier is because you have teammates and access to way better weapons if you want to use them.
> > > > >
> > > > > Did you read the post?
> > > >
> > > > Yeah it seemed you are trying to say the enemies are easier to fight just bigger bullet sponges.
> > >
> > > That’s my point, they are not fun or challenging to fight now. They do not possess any complicated ways of attack like they did in ODST IE brutes with a variety of weapons, brutes pushing crates to get to you, jackal snipers in hard to kill spots, brute choppers moving around. The key is in game play diversity.
> >
> > And I disagree. It may just seem that way since you have access to better weapons and are playing with a group instead of individually. Playing solo vs a lot of AI will almost always seem tougher then fighting with 7 other Spartans vs AI.
>
> How does it just “seem” that way to him? Please explain that reasoning, because he’s actually right. The AI in Halo 5 do not have interesting ways of attacking the player. The either move towards you, or the move away from you in basically a straight line. They don’t throw grenades as a group like the Brutes and Grunts in Halo 3 and ODST. In those games, you could even hear the Brute leaders giving the orders to throw grenades.
>
> The bosses just stand there in one place doing the same one or two insta-kill moves, eating all your bullets until they eventually die. Explain how that is fun. I want to feel like I’m in a fight for my life, like I’m being hunted by the enemy. In ODST and Reach, the AI actually looked for you if you were hiding. In Halo 5 they just stay in whatever area they spawned in and you have to go to them. And with how big some of the maps are, it’s a chore doing that, along with trying to kill everything within the measly 5 minutes they give us to do it.
I did explain it. Playing a game solo vs being on a team is different. AI in H5 don’t throw grenades? They throw plenty imo. I am constantly thrustering away from grenades. But yeah I can agree in some cases they don’t seem to move around the map as much but in other cases they do. Warzone firefight is different than original fire fight so of course they will play different.
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> > > > > > 2533274816788253;3:
> > > > > > I disagree. The legendary warzone firefight is just as tough as the odst firefight. You are still made of paper compared to enemies. Enemies still are very accurate with their shots. The only reason it may seem easier is because you have teammates and access to way better weapons if you want to use them.
> > > > >
> > > > > Did you read the post?
> > > >
> > > > Yeah it seemed you are trying to say the enemies are easier to fight just bigger bullet sponges.
> > >
> > > That’s my point, they are not fun or challenging to fight now. They do not possess any complicated ways of attack like they did in ODST IE brutes with a variety of weapons, brutes pushing crates to get to you, jackal snipers in hard to kill spots, brute choppers moving around. The key is in game play diversity.
> >
> > And I disagree. It may just seem that way since you have access to better weapons and are playing with a group instead of individually. Playing solo vs a lot of AI will almost always seem tougher then fighting with 7 other Spartans vs AI.
>
> How does it just “seem” that way to him? Please explain that reasoning, because he’s actually right. The AI in Halo 5 do not have interesting ways of attacking the player. The either move towards you, or the move away from you in basically a straight line. They don’t throw grenades as a group like the Brutes and Grunts in Halo 3 and ODST. In those games, you could even hear the Brute leaders giving the orders to throw grenades.
>
> The bosses just stand there in one place doing the same one or two insta-kill moves, eating all your bullets until they eventually die. Explain how that is fun. I want to feel like I’m in a fight for my life, like I’m being hunted by the enemy. In ODST and Reach, the AI actually looked for you if you were hiding. In Halo 5 they just stay in whatever area they spawned in and you have to go to them. And with how big some of the maps are, it’s a chore doing that, along with trying to kill everything within the measly 5 minutes they give us to do it.
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> > > > > > > 2533274816788253;3:
> > > > > > > I disagree. The legendary warzone firefight is just as tough as the odst firefight. You are still made of paper compared to enemies. Enemies still are very accurate with their shots. The only reason it may seem easier is because you have teammates and access to way better weapons if you want to use them.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Did you read the post?
> > > > >
> > > > > Yeah it seemed you are trying to say the enemies are easier to fight just bigger bullet sponges.
> > > >
> > > > That’s my point, they are not fun or challenging to fight now. They do not possess any complicated ways of attack like they did in ODST IE brutes with a variety of weapons, brutes pushing crates to get to you, jackal snipers in hard to kill spots, brute choppers moving around. The key is in game play diversity.
> > >
> > > And I disagree. It may just seem that way since you have access to better weapons and are playing with a group instead of individually. Playing solo vs a lot of AI will almost always seem tougher then fighting with 7 other Spartans vs AI.
> >
> > How does it just “seem” that way to him? Please explain that reasoning, because he’s actually right. The AI in Halo 5 do not have interesting ways of attacking the player. The either move towards you, or the move away from you in basically a straight line. They don’t throw grenades as a group like the Brutes and Grunts in Halo 3 and ODST. In those games, you could even hear the Brute leaders giving the orders to throw grenades.
> >
> > The bosses just stand there in one place doing the same one or two insta-kill moves, eating all your bullets until they eventually die. Explain how that is fun. I want to feel like I’m in a fight for my life, like I’m being hunted by the enemy. In ODST and Reach, the AI actually looked for you if you were hiding. In Halo 5 they just stay in whatever area they spawned in and you have to go to them. And with how big some of the maps are, it’s a chore doing that, along with trying to kill everything within the measly 5 minutes they give us to do it.
>
> I did explain it. Playing a game solo vs being on a team is different. AI in H5 don’t throw grenades? They throw plenty imo. I am constantly thrustering away from grenades. But yeah I can agree in some cases they don’t seem to move around the map as much but in other cases they do. Warzone firefight is different than original fire fight so of course they will play different.
Please reread my post if you need to, I didn’t say the AI don’t throw grenades, I said they don’t do it in groups like in the two games I mentioned. And playing in a group versus playing solo has no bearing on how the AI’s behaviors play out in the game. So that point is thrown out.
I remember in the vidoc for Halo 3, Bungie talked about how they worked squad mechanics into the AI to make them more of a challenge for the player. The AI acting as if they are aware of each other and actually working together to defeat the player is what’s lacking in this game. They don’t feel “alive” so to speak. They really don’t do anything but stand there and shoot.
I feel we should be a little further into videogame AI, seeing as we’re almost in 2017, and more believable AI existed way back since Halo: CE.
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> > > > > > > > 2533274816788253;3:
> > > > > > > > I disagree. The legendary warzone firefight is just as tough as the odst firefight. You are still made of paper compared to enemies. Enemies still are very accurate with their shots. The only reason it may seem easier is because you have teammates and access to way better weapons if you want to use them.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Did you read the post?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Yeah it seemed you are trying to say the enemies are easier to fight just bigger bullet sponges.
> > > > >
> > > > > That’s my point, they are not fun or challenging to fight now. They do not possess any complicated ways of attack like they did in ODST IE brutes with a variety of weapons, brutes pushing crates to get to you, jackal snipers in hard to kill spots, brute choppers moving around. The key is in game play diversity.
> > > >
> > > > And I disagree. It may just seem that way since you have access to better weapons and are playing with a group instead of individually. Playing solo vs a lot of AI will almost always seem tougher then fighting with 7 other Spartans vs AI.
> > >
> > > How does it just “seem” that way to him? Please explain that reasoning, because he’s actually right. The AI in Halo 5 do not have interesting ways of attacking the player. The either move towards you, or the move away from you in basically a straight line. They don’t throw grenades as a group like the Brutes and Grunts in Halo 3 and ODST. In those games, you could even hear the Brute leaders giving the orders to throw grenades.
> > >
> > > The bosses just stand there in one place doing the same one or two insta-kill moves, eating all your bullets until they eventually die. Explain how that is fun. I want to feel like I’m in a fight for my life, like I’m being hunted by the enemy. In ODST and Reach, the AI actually looked for you if you were hiding. In Halo 5 they just stay in whatever area they spawned in and you have to go to them. And with how big some of the maps are, it’s a chore doing that, along with trying to kill everything within the measly 5 minutes they give us to do it.
> >
> > I did explain it. Playing a game solo vs being on a team is different. AI in H5 don’t throw grenades? They throw plenty imo. I am constantly thrustering away from grenades. But yeah I can agree in some cases they don’t seem to move around the map as much but in other cases they do. Warzone firefight is different than original fire fight so of course they will play different.
>
> Please reread my post if you need to, I didn’t say the AI don’t throw grenades, I said they don’t do it in groups like in the two games I mentioned. And playing in a group versus playing solo has no bearing on how the AI’s behaviors play out in the game. So that point is thrown out.
>
> I remember in the vidoc for Halo 3, Bungie talked about how they worked squad mechanics into the AI to make them more of a challenge for the player. The AI acting as if they are aware of each other and actually working together to defeat the player is what’s lacking in this game. They don’t feel “alive” so to speak. They really don’t do anything but stand there and shoot.
>
> I feel we should be a little further into videogame AI, seeing as we’re almost in 2017, and more believable AI existed way back since Halo: CE.
Also I think it can be due to in the original firefight the only mission for the AI was pretty much to kill the player. Now the AIs are given other missions at times, capture a location or destroy something. That could lead to them acting differently as well.