Explain CSR to me

Games Other Halo
#1

Sorry, it’s been years since I looked at 1-50 in Halo 3, can someone remind me how it’s calculated? Is it based purely on top three placing and win/loss? Or will the Halo 4 iteration work K/D into it as well, or instead of?

I ask because JIP has made me a serial quitter - meaning my win/loss is shot to buggery. I insta-quit mid-game starts and will continue to do so.

I can’t see CSR meaning much to me while JIP is in place; I’m not interested in a shiny number next to my name if it’s at the expense of preferable and enjoyable matchmaking experiences.

So does anyone know how they plan to track one’s skill in order to gauge one’s CSR in Halo 4?

Thanks!

#2

good question… not sure with JIP…

#3

your shiny number is going to be viewable only on waypoint btw, its not an in game rank…

#4

Nobody here has any idea. We don’t have any more info than you.

BTW, Halo 3’s Trueskill-based ranks weren’t ‘top 3 finishers’ at all - it was far more organic than that. It was all about who you beat or were beaten by and what their’s and your rank was - you couldn’t guarantee that ‘place x will raise your rank.’ Even ranking 1st would raise your mean skill, sure, but if the people below you were far below your level, your uncertaininty might raise and that might lower your visible rank anyway.

#5

Halo 4 Competitive Skill Rank Announcement

The Halo Bulletin: 1.23.13

Everything else is speculation.

#6

> Nobody here has any idea. We don’t have any more info than you.
>
> BTW, Halo 3’s Trueskill-based ranks weren’t ‘top 3 finishers’ at all - it was far more organic than that. It was all about who you beat or were beaten by and what their’s and your rank was - you couldn’t guarantee that ‘place x will raise your rank.’ Even ranking 1st would raise your mean skill, sure, but if the people below you were far below your level, your uncertaininty might raise and that might lower your visible rank anyway.

Ah indeed, I remember now. But win/loss was the absolutely the key contributing factor which decided whether you went up a number, or down.

Which means JIP and CSR won’t be compatible. If JIP remains in operation in the affected playlists, the whole thing will be a joke.

I’m not about to stop quitting mid-game joins for the sake of a number, especially one which isn’t even viewable in game. Lol, no.

#7

You guys realize that a true ranking system IS NOT FOR E-PEEN.

It is so that people of equal skill will get matched up to play against each other.

I HATE getting in a match and carrying the team, and I hate being carried even more. Most people who play online games, want to play against equal skilled people, they don’t want to get their butts handed to them, and they certainly don’t want to have to carry the rest of their team.

So, to all those out there crying because you can’t get your e-peen up by seeing a skill rank in game…build a bridge, and get over it. (Soo cliche, but soo perfect!)

#8

> You guys realize that a true ranking system IS NOT FOR E-PEEN.
>
> It is so that people of equal skill will get matched up to play against each other.
>
> I HATE getting in a match and carrying the team, and I hate being carried even more. Most people who play online games, want to play against equal skilled people, they don’t want to get their butts handed to them, and they certainly don’t want to have to carry the rest of their team.
>
> So, to all those out there crying because you can’t get your e-peen up by seeing a skill rank in game…build a bridge, and get over it. (Soo cliche, but soo perfect!)

The in game ranks that have always been present in every Halo game created incentive for certain players to keep going, Halo wouldn’t have lasted nearly as long without them (Yes, yes, I know Arena was awful, but then again so was never giving Reach a TU until the end of the games lifespan so…)
Do we need an VIGR? (Visible In Game Rank) No. But why not? Wee have had it for years, and I think the large part of the community that played solely because for the ranking systems they have come to know, and love are being cast aside to an extent.
I am a very competitive/competent player, and regardless of whether or not I get a ranking system (Which I know I will not get, At least not the one I would want, or would matter) I will still play Halo, and I will inevitably be dissapointed.

#9

They don’t think it be like it is but it do.

#10

Basically the CSR is most likely going to be a 1-50 system that won’t be visible in game. I have no problems with this as long as it does it’s damn job.

#11

> > You guys realize that a true ranking system IS NOT FOR E-PEEN.
> >
> > It is so that people of equal skill will get matched up to play against each other.
> >
> > I HATE getting in a match and carrying the team, and I hate being carried even more. Most people who play online games, want to play against equal skilled people, they don’t want to get their butts handed to them, and they certainly don’t want to have to carry the rest of their team.
> >
> > So, to all those out there crying because you can’t get your e-peen up by seeing a skill rank in game…build a bridge, and get over it. (Soo cliche, but soo perfect!)
>
> <mark>The in game ranks that have always been present in every Halo game created incentive for certain players to keep going</mark>, Halo wouldn’t have lasted nearly as long without them (Yes, yes, I know Arena was awful, but then again so was never giving Reach a TU until the end of the games lifespan so…)
> Do we need an VIGR? (Visible In Game Rank) No. But why not? Wee have had it for years, and I think the large part of the community that played solely because for the ranking systems they have come to know, and love are being cast aside to an extent.
> I am a very competitive/competent player, and regardless of whether or not I get a ranking system (Which I know I will not get, At least not the one I would want, or would matter) I will still play Halo, and I will inevitably be dissapointed.

Rank =/= Incentive

The SR levels and commendations are incentive, while the CSR is the ranking system.

SR is for e-peen, and rightfully so. While the CSR is to make sure players get a fun, and competitive experience.

Doesn’t matter who says what. If someone goes 30-0 in a 4v4 slayer match, there was NOT any competition for them in the game.
And the flip side is true, if someone goes 0-30 in the same like match, they didn’t have a chance.

The SRs and Commendations are the incentive to keep playing, and keep striving to achieve something.

The CSR is to keep the playing field even. As it should be, not for e-peen.

#12

> Rank =/= Incentive

Yes it does, It varies, and depends on the player. It is a matter of perspective which in my case, and many others were given incentive by the ranking system to press on, and keep playing.

> The SR levels and commendations are incentive, while the CSR is the ranking system.
>
> SR is for e-peen, and rightfully so. While the CSR is to make sure players get a fun, and competitive experience.

SR levels are eawsy to accomplish, and the incentive vanishes as soon as SR is completed. Too many people are already 130’s. I do agree when it comes to the commendations, but that can get exhausting, and once that is said and done the incetive vanishes once again.

> Doesn’t matter who says what. If someone goes 30-0 in a 4v4 slayer match, there was NOT any competition for them in the game.
> And the flip side is true, if someone goes 0-30 in the same like match, they didn’t have a chance.

I agree to an extent.

> The SRs and Commendations are the incentive to keep playing, and keep striving to achieve something.
>
> The CSR is to keep the playing field even. As it should be, not for e-peen.

Like I said SR is easily achievable, and in almost no time. (and that’s not even taking DXP into account) CSR will be a waypoint based ranking system, and leaving the system out of the actual game itself almost defeats the purpose of it.

Also CSR doesn’t keep the playing field even, balanced maps, gametypes, and a proper hidden trueskill system do that (Halo lacks almost all of that). For the most part the playing field in Halo has never really been even, and has been void of balance to a large extent.

#13

> Ah indeed, I remember now. But win/loss was the absolutely the key contributing factor which decided whether you went up a number, or down.
>
> Which means JIP and CSR won’t be compatible.

Not true. If CSR is based on Trueskill then you can weight that person’s affect on the skill rating updates by how long they spent in the game. So if you hopped into a game, saw it was a foregone conclusion, and left - that game would have little to no affect on your rating.

I’m not saying that this is what they’ve done, but I’m saying it doesn’t rule it out.

> You guys realize that a true ranking system IS NOT FOR E-PEEN.
>
> It is so that people of equal skill will get matched up to play against each other

Also not true. Skill Ratings are for close skill matches. Ranks are ALL about e-peen.

Ranks based on skill offer far more incentive than tenure/playtime ones ever will - because it can reflect a quality of you that others may never be able to achieve.

Achievements for ‘Legendary Complete’, for example, are far more highly regarded and sought after than ones for ‘complete mission 1’ - even though they are both achievements.

#14

@Believicide:

I agree…kinda, but my definitions are apparently different slightly.
Halo Reach’s ranks are incentive to keep playing.
While Halo 3’s trueskill was not incentive to keep playing, but to do better, and something like that is not a e-peen item, and has no need to be plastered everywhere.

I would be called a Casual player, I don’t play the game to make money, or to win prizes. I play to enjoy the game, and to relax from the real world.
If I join a game and someone is absolutely DOMINATING the board…well, it is not enjoyable.
However, if I start a match and own everyone’s faces, it IS fun for a few moments…but then becomes boring because I may as well play SpOps on easy.

So I want a skill ranking system that will set me against people of the same skill-set. Not a “skill” rank to enlarge my e-peen.

@Ultimate RC:
Visible ranks are all about e=peen. Always will be. If you can flaunt it, it is for your e-peen.
“I’m a SR130, Imma own you NOOBS!” -stereotype line- Has no basis on skill, only time spent.

A real SKILL ranking system, has no need to be flaunted because everyone else in the lobby will be of the same rank. Period.
“I’m a CSR 49, I’m better than all of you!..wait how are you all CSR 49 too?” -same skill rank, no e-peen-

#15

it’ll be like BPR. Online only and no one will care about it.

#16

Hopefully it will work in a similar way to the Gears of War 3 JIP ranking system in which all JIP games do not count towards rank. It really doesn’t make any sense to judge how good you were in a game if you weren’t in it the whole time.

I still think that Waypoint only ranks aren’t the solution.

#17

> A real SKILL ranking system, has no need to be flaunted because everyone else in the lobby will be of the same rank. Period.

So you never played Halo 2, or Ranked Halo 3, or Arena Reach then?

Otherwise you’d know that’s not true - you can’t guarantee tight enough skill matching with good connections in a reasonable amount of time for all players in all locations at all times of day.

Skill ranks are also useful for setting up teams for custom games.

In-game also increases the immediacy of feedback. Why is that good? Well have you have played Spartan Ops online and got a lot of input lag? Noticed how it wasn’t as fun as when you didn’t have lag? Immediacy of feedback.

#18

CSR=BPR=FAIL
TRUTH

#19

> The SRs and Commendations are the incentive to keep playing, and keep striving to achieve something.

I wholeheartedly disagree. It’s something you can strive for visually but I’m one to say that any preset goal is eventually going to ruin it’s own value once you achieve it. Just take a look at the SR system. When you hit the cap you’re left feeling pretty lost about where to go from there because at no point during that long grind have you had to think for yourself. The same applies to 1-50. Once you snatch the carrot from off the stick (ie. hit whatever cap there is) you find that you don’t really know how to direct yourself because you’ve never had to rely on personal initiative before. The rewards, while stimulating at first, are hollow and we shouldn’t try to base our multiplayer population on it because it’s not supportable over the long term.

Instead we should try to motivate people to try to find their own goals based on a much more diversified multiplayer experience. IE. stop reducing gameplay (see. the DMR, power weapons), stop relying on accessory systems to motivate people, and open the game up to personal initiative (ie. do what the hell you want to given a big, balanced, sandbox. See. Unreal, Section 8.)

#20

CSR is something everyone has been complaining about since Halo 4 first came out. That’s the best description I can give.