Evolution of ordnance

Games Other Halo
#1

Look, it’s no secret that ordnance drops have received polarizing feedback. The majority of the forums is against them however, and call for their removal. I don’t think this is the correct approach. Ordnance drops as is are bad for gameplay, one might say detrimental, but I think there is a way to fix them. To make them halo-fied.

Ordnance drops are now team based, and any weapon dropped is by kills only, preferably a killing spree. These now only exist in team based sayer game-types, and are more limited but encourage map movement and team play, things halo is all about.

How they work goes like this: there are 3 power weapons on the map that can only be on the map if someone puts them there, but these weapons are mid level power weapons that have a skill gap. They are the same weapons every time.nWhen one player gets killing spree medal they have a choice to call down one weapon to its location, this can only be done twice for each of the two or three positions. When a killing spree is reached, a message across the HUD will say “ordnance drop imminent”, but will not say who is refilling it. Once someone calls down a drop, the message will change to “position x resupplied”. So you know when someone has an ordnance drop ready, you know when it’s dropped, where it’s dropped and what weapon is dropped in that spot. The weapons that are dropped can not be used by the person who called in the drop and when one person has an ordnance drop ready, some one else can use his or hers until the person who got it first uses it and can’t refill the same position until 2 minutes has passed.

The same thing can be done with vehicles. There would be 2 vehicle spawn points that adhere to the same rules as the other type of ordnance drop stated above. These vehicles are team based vehicles such as warthogs, prowlers, or specters. These positions can only be refilled once or twice depending on the game type. This type on ordnance drop occurs in big team objective games only and can not be in the same match as the other type of ordnance drop. As with gun drops, these can’t be used simultaneously, and positions have refill timers.

This would work with halo map design rather well as they both require skill to pull of, are predictable, promotes team work and map movement. All classic halo qualities, all of which were sort of messed with in halo 4. ( they were not destroyed however, just lessened a little bit )

Just to be clear, this does not replace weapons spawning normally on the map. It merely gives players some control over that aspect of the game.

#2

I think a better solution would be to have armor abilities as ordinance drops instead of… We’ll just about everything else…

That way they wouldn’t be abused and would be MUCH more appreciated in halo compared to now…

#3

> I think a better solution would be to have armor abilities as ordinance drops instead of… We’ll just about everything else…
>
>
> That way they wouldn’t be abused and would be MUCH more appreciated in halo compared to now…

That’s debatable. The problem with AAs right now are that there are three inherently game breaking ones. Jet pack, camo and pro vision. Removing those 3 would greatly benefit the game and would allow us to choose AAs at spawn because they would be better balanced. There isn’t a problem with spawning with a hologram or thruster pack because those two require some sort of skill to work and don’t impact the map at all.

#4

I like it when people try to balance broken aspects to the game like AC and Ordnance. However I always have to disagree and argue the point that even still they are out of place and still give some form of an unfair advantage. I wouldn’t mind having AAs in Ordnance drops (just like in Throwdown) but then again it feels completely out of place, not needed and its just not Halo.

I would rather they strip the game of all these game breaking mechanics in Halo 5 but not to the point where it is identical to Halo 3. Halo 4 brought allot of good stuff to the table like loadouts, however they were executed poorly (broken weapons, grenades, perks, AAs ect). Ordnance just isn’t Halo and really needs to be removed.

#5

> I think a better solution would be to have armor abilities as ordinance drops instead of… We’ll just about everything else…
>
>
> That way they wouldn’t be abused and would be MUCH more appreciated in halo compared to now…

I’ve seen this suggestion around the forums a lot and I think it works for some things but not others.

If Hologram, Thruster Pack, Autosentry and possibly Hardlight Shield were ordnance drops it would serve to make them more or less pointless or redundant. I severely doubt that people would run and compete for those in the same way that they would run and compete for a weapon.

Having a weapon is always going to be relevant to gameplay and that is the major difference. With the AAs listed you only ever use them in the moment. They aren’t always going to be useful in every situation and why would people waste their time running/fighting something that they potentially won’t even want or get to use. Spawning with these is relatively harmless.

Now for the other AAs…

PV should be scrapped, straight up. Takes away the player’s responsibility of understanding patterns in player movement, maintaining map awareness and undermines the skill of anticipation.

AC should return as a powerup

I’m on the fence with Regeneration field being an AA over a pickup. It’s a defensive ability and leaves you vulnerable upon deployment. I think it’s cool having myself or one other guy playing a support/medic role with the regen field. It adds to the value of team work.

Finally Jetpack. To be honest I really don’t give a damn. I really don’t. I don’t use it nor do I really see the problem with others using it. This whole “map breaking” argument is just BS to me. Yes it gives you increased mobility and yes you can go to areas otherwise non-reachable at the cost of becoming a CLAY PIGEON. I’ve bagged so many kills from jetpackers that I could go as far as to implore their use.

#6

> I like it when people try to balance broken aspects to the game like AC and Ordnance. However I always have to disagree and argue the point that even still they are out of place and still give some form of an unfair advantage. I wouldn’t mind having AAs in Ordnance drops (just like in Throwdown) but then again it feels completely out of place, not needed and its just not Halo.
>
> I would rather they strip the game of all these game breaking mechanics in Halo 5 but not to the point where it is identical to Halo 3. Halo 4 brought allot of good stuff to the table like loadouts, however they were executed poorly (broken weapons, grenades, perks, AAs ect). Ordnance just isn’t Halo and really needs to be removed.

What unfair advantage is given here? I even explained at the bottom how this method encourages classic halo aspects. There nothing inherently imbalanced about ordnance drops, just how they were executed is the problem. And please, dispense with that stupid “it’s not halo argument”. Halo changes every game. You most likely didn’t even read my most. If something encourages classic halo gameplay, then it’s halo. It doesn’t have to do it in the same manner every time.

#7

> > I like it when people try to balance broken aspects to the game like AC and Ordnance. However I always have to disagree and argue the point that even still they are out of place and still give some form of an unfair advantage. I wouldn’t mind having AAs in Ordnance drops (just like in Throwdown) but then again it feels completely out of place, not needed and its just not Halo.
> >
> > I would rather they strip the game of all these game breaking mechanics in Halo 5 but not to the point where it is identical to Halo 3. Halo 4 brought allot of good stuff to the table like loadouts, however they were executed poorly (broken weapons, grenades, perks, AAs ect). Ordnance just isn’t Halo and really needs to be removed.
>
> What unfair advantage is given here? I even explained at the bottom how this method encourages classic halo aspects. There nothing inherently imbalanced about ordnance drops, just how they were executed is the problem. And please, dispense with that stupid “it’s not halo argument”. Halo changes every game. You most likely didn’t even read my most. If something encourages classic halo gameplay, then it’s halo. It doesn’t have to do it in the same manner every time.

Correct me if I misunderstood but in some way or form you are still calling down a power weapon. If that is the case, there is the unfair advantage.

Halo is simple, every player is on an equal starting. If players want a power weapon they have to fight for it and time it. Not get a few kills and call a weapon down for yourself or your teammates. Halo is a unique simple game. Anybody will tell you Ordnance isn’t classic Halo. It is however Halo 4 which ultimately drove 90% of the community away in a couple of months. There is my “stupid” argument.

#8

> > I think a better solution would be to have armor abilities as ordinance drops instead of… We’ll just about everything else…
> >
> >
> > That way they wouldn’t be abused and would be MUCH more appreciated in halo compared to now…
>
> That’s debatable. The problem with AAs right now are that there are three inherently game breaking ones. Jet pack, camo and pro vision. Removing those 3 would greatly benefit the game and would allow us to choose AAs at spawn because they would be better balanced. There isn’t a problem with spawning with a hologram or thruster pack because those two require some sort of skill to work and don’t impact the map at all.

what would even be the point of AA’s if you can only choose shield, hologram, thruster pack, sentry, regeneration field

just remove them and buff all the AA’s, make them map pick-ups or ordinance drops based on kill streaks (reset on death) or some kind of hybrid of personal/world ordinance. Make AA’s powerful would be a lot of fun.

one thing I wouldn’t mind is remove sprint, make base movement like 120% of what it is now and add thruster pack as a default AA

#9

> > > I like it when people try to balance broken aspects to the game like AC and Ordnance. However I always have to disagree and argue the point that even still they are out of place and still give some form of an unfair advantage. I wouldn’t mind having AAs in Ordnance drops (just like in Throwdown) but then again it feels completely out of place, not needed and its just not Halo.
> > >
> > > I would rather they strip the game of all these game breaking mechanics in Halo 5 but not to the point where it is identical to Halo 3. Halo 4 brought allot of good stuff to the table like loadouts, however they were executed poorly (broken weapons, grenades, perks, AAs ect). Ordnance just isn’t Halo and really needs to be removed.
> >
> > What unfair advantage is given here? I even explained at the bottom how this method encourages classic halo aspects. There nothing inherently imbalanced about ordnance drops, just how they were executed is the problem. And please, dispense with that stupid “it’s not halo argument”. Halo changes every game. You most likely didn’t even read my most. If something encourages classic halo gameplay, then it’s halo. It doesn’t have to do it in the same manner every time.
>
> Correct me if I misunderstood but in some way or form you are still calling down a power weapon. If that is the case, there is the unfair advantage.
>
> Halo is simple, every player is on an equal starting. If players want a power weapon they have to fight for it and time it. Not get a few kills and call a weapon down for yourself or your teammates. Halo is a unique simple game. Anybody will tell you Ordnance isn’t classic Halo. It is however Halo 4 which ultimately drove 90% of the community away in a couple of months. There is my “stupid” argument.

This is something anyone can do but may not have the skill can do, which practically how I sum up old halo. The weapons you call down go to pre ordained locations not at your feet. If the enemy team holds all 3 spawn spots than calling it down is a death sentence. People get a killing spree medal to get this. I know you know what that is, which means its much more difficult to get than the current version of ordnance. So we’re is the unfair advantage when a team secures a power position over the other team and one player kills enough consecutive enemies through skill to earn a weapon that only his team can use? I’m also not arguing if this is classic halo, but if it promotes classic halo elements, than what is the problem here?

#10

It’s still the same problem with CoD’s killstreaks: you reward players who are doing well with tools they can use to do even better, while the other players just watch. It’s still a “the rich get richer” mechanic.

#11

For custom games, I think that ordnance drops are absolutely amazing and perfect for players who are dedicated to making gametypes and maps in that department. For matchmaking though, I’m not sure if there is a way to make it work well… except for like action sack or something like that.

Your idea takes ordnance in the right direction, but it’s almost so restricted to the point where I end up wondering: why even have ordnance at all if this is how it’s going to be?

In the end, I think it’s just better to leave ordnance drops the way it is, but leave it to an action sack gametype and custom games… then 343 can do whatever they want with it.

#12

I too think that Personal Ordnance Drops are a redeemable addition to Halo (although the next Halo title should also have variants of these gametypes without features like Loadouts or Ordnance, thus appealing to and providing for the ‘traditional’ community). However, I have a different vision for how they should be implemented, including in modes other than multiplayer.

CAN Personal Ordnance Have a Place in Halo?

#13

> It’s still the same problem with CoD’s killstreaks: you reward players who are doing well with tools they can use to do even better, while the other players just watch. It’s still a “the rich get richer” mechanic.

What if the rewards given in PODs also had drawbacks (rather than being pure reward) and had a fixed selection of 3 weapons, thus eliminating the utter randomness from their inclusion?

#14

> It’s still the same problem with CoD’s killstreaks: you reward players who are doing well with tools they can use to do even better, while the other players just watch. It’s still a “the rich get richer” mechanic.

They get rich because they are skillful players. The weapons are also minor power weapons, like the concussion rifle, which even ghost said required some form of skill. Your also not taking into account the fact that players call it in to one of 3 positions, and can’t use the weapons they call in. One player enriches his team by doing good.

Cod is different. Cod gives kills to the player. This method of pod gives a player the tool to get kills, not kills themselves. There are many factors that goes into this that make it better than what you say.

#15

> > It’s still the same problem with CoD’s killstreaks: you reward players who are doing well with tools they can use to do even better, while the other players just watch. It’s still a “the rich get richer” mechanic.
>
> What if the rewards given in PODs also had drawbacks (rather than being pure reward) and had a fixed selection of 3 weapons, thus eliminating the utter randomness from their inclusion?

Did I not type that? Sorry,that was always what would be in those three positions. The point of this method would be to eliminate the randomness of pods. 3 weapons would be for example, the concussion rifle, the rail gun( with no aim assist or magnetism), and the needler. Thanks for reminding me.

#16

> For custom games, I think that ordnance drops are absolutely amazing and perfect for players who are dedicated to making gametypes and maps in that department. For matchmaking though, I’m not sure if there is a way to make it work well… except for like action sack or something like that.
>
> Your idea takes ordnance in the right direction, but it’s almost so restricted to the point where I end up wondering: why even have ordnance at all if this is how it’s going to be?
>
> In the end, I think it’s just better to leave ordnance drops the way it is, but leave it to an action sack gametype and custom games… then 343 can do whatever they want with it.

The point would be that its a new way to encourage old halo gameplay, but I think that there should be gametypes without it. Not everybody would like this.

#17

I think we could keep power weapons in ordinance but have them in tiers. 1st tier ordinance would be things like a Needler, SAW, or other somewhat lighter weapon and/or powerup. If you call in ordinance immediately, that’s what you get and then the counter resets. However, if you don’t call in ordinance, a 2nd meter starts filling up. Now you get a chance at more powerful weapons like the various sniper rifles, concussion rifle, whatever. 3rd tier would be could be keep for the launcher weapons. I would still award ordinance based on points as opposed to kill streaks and keep the count going through death, but you no longer have someone getting a lucky splatter 30 seconds in and then racking up another dozen kills with an incineration cannon.

What we put on the various tiers can be played with in forge. I’d like to see AAs be turned into equipment and then have that also put into ordinance rotation. I’d also like to get some loadout weapons in the rotation as well. There’s little mroe annoying to me than when I’m dominating with my DMR only to run low on ammo and have no one else on the map using the damn thing, so I have to ditch it for a needler, as it’s the only useful thing in my ordinance selection, and I promptly get killed by someone my DMR would have put down easily. Being able to call in loadout weapons or even just an ammo box would be so nice. and again, it eats up some of the ordinance slots, so less odds of people spamming incineration cannons and rocket launchers.

#18

> I think we could keep power weapons in ordinance but have them in tiers. 1st tier ordinance would be things like a Needler, SAW, or other somewhat lighter weapon and/or powerup. If you call in ordinance immediately, that’s what you get and then the counter resets. However, if you don’t call in ordinance, a 2nd meter starts filling up. Now you get a chance at more powerful weapons like the various sniper rifles, concussion rifle, whatever. 3rd tier would be could be keep for the launcher weapons. I would still award ordinance based on points as opposed to kill streaks and keep the count going through death, but you no longer have someone getting a lucky splatter 30 seconds in and then racking up another dozen kills with an incineration cannon.
>
> What we put on the various tiers can be played with in forge. I’d like to see AAs be turned into equipment and then have that also put into ordinance rotation. I’d also like to get some loadout weapons in the rotation as well. There’s little mroe annoying to me than when I’m dominating with my DMR only to run low on ammo and have no one else on the map using the damn thing, so I have to ditch it for a needler, as it’s the only useful thing in my ordinance selection, and I promptly get killed by someone my DMR would have put down easily. Being able to call in loadout weapons or even just an ammo box would be so nice. and again, it eats up some of the ordinance slots, so less odds of people spamming incineration cannons and rocket launchers.

Problematically speaking, it would still be random in this method. It would also be an eventuality in that, no matter how well/poorly you played, you could still get a powerful weapon handed to you practically for being in the game/getting shot at.

#19

> I think we could keep power weapons in ordinance but have them in tiers. 1st tier ordinance would be things like a Needler, SAW, or other somewhat lighter weapon and/or powerup. If you call in ordinance immediately, that’s what you get and then the counter resets. However, if you don’t call in ordinance, a 2nd meter starts filling up. Now you get a chance at more powerful weapons like the various sniper rifles, concussion rifle, whatever. 3rd tier would be could be keep for the launcher weapons. I would still award ordinance based on points as opposed to kill streaks and keep the count going through death, but you no longer have someone getting a lucky splatter 30 seconds in and then racking up another dozen kills with an incineration cannon.
>
> What we put on the various tiers can be played with in forge. I’d like to see AAs be turned into equipment and then have that also put into ordinance rotation. I’d also like to get some loadout weapons in the rotation as well. There’s little mroe annoying to me than when I’m dominating with my DMR only to run low on ammo and have no one else on the map using the damn thing, so I have to ditch it for a needler, as it’s the only useful thing in my ordinance selection, and I promptly get killed by someone my DMR would have put down easily. Being able to call in loadout weapons or even just an ammo box would be so nice. and again, it eats up some of the ordinance slots, so less odds of people spamming incineration cannons and rocket launchers.

AAs really don’t NEED to go back to being equipment. The problematic ones should be scrapped, while thruster, hologram and regen field stay on spawn. With a little tweaks of course. The armor abilities in halo 5 should be made like these 3 were.

Equipment should come back but along with armor abilities. When picked up, they would replace your current AA.

#20

> > I think we could keep power weapons in ordinance but have them in tiers. 1st tier ordinance would be things like a Needler, SAW, or other somewhat lighter weapon and/or powerup. If you call in ordinance immediately, that’s what you get and then the counter resets. However, if you don’t call in ordinance, a 2nd meter starts filling up. Now you get a chance at more powerful weapons like the various sniper rifles, concussion rifle, whatever. 3rd tier would be could be keep for the launcher weapons. I would still award ordinance based on points as opposed to kill streaks and keep the count going through death, but you no longer have someone getting a lucky splatter 30 seconds in and then racking up another dozen kills with an incineration cannon.
> >
> > What we put on the various tiers can be played with in forge. I’d like to see AAs be turned into equipment and then have that also put into ordinance rotation. I’d also like to get some loadout weapons in the rotation as well. There’s little mroe annoying to me than when I’m dominating with my DMR only to run low on ammo and have no one else on the map using the damn thing, so I have to ditch it for a needler, as it’s the only useful thing in my ordinance selection, and I promptly get killed by someone my DMR would have put down easily. Being able to call in loadout weapons or even just an ammo box would be so nice. and again, it eats up some of the ordinance slots, so less odds of people spamming incineration cannons and rocket launchers.
>
> AAs really don’t NEED to go back to being equipment. The problematic ones should be scrapped, while thruster, hologram and regen field stay on spawn. With a little tweaks of course. The armor abilities in halo 5 should be made like these 3 were.
>
> Equipment should come back but along with armor abilities. When picked up, they would replace your current AA.

but what’s the point if they don’t go all out? What is the point of having holograms, regen fields, and thruster packs at spawn? WHY?!?!

Either go full on in a new direction or be what we all fell in love with in the first place, easy to learn extremely difficult to master arena shooter.