Equipment was a more better and balanced option compared to AAs. Some might say that they’re predecessors of AAs. But how much and how well would it work concerning Halo 4 gameplay?
Would you like to see them mixing together? They won’t be the same and will be reusable( at least the ones that can).
Would you like to see them differ? This would make for a cluttered controller and sandbox, but more variety.
Would you like the AAs to become Equipment?
Much can change in these ideas.
Which Idea do you all most like. After 10 Posts I’ll go over their advantages, disadvantages, and will feature dialogue from the majority’s post. Say which ones you want integrated from which side, or say why not.
I haven’t seen many people discuss this thing before and would like you to decide.
I feel like both could work, and to an extent they’re already combining them in Halo 4 (picking up an AA only through ordinance). Something like camo or jetpack could be a one time use pickup like the Halo 3 Grav Lift (maybe a finite fuel amount, good for a few seconds of lift), whereas subtler abilities like evade or hardlight shield would be your built-in Armor Ability. No need for two separate buttons, the temporary and more powerful equipment pickup would simply replace your AA until you’ve used it up.
Equipments are anti fun.
I don’t like the idea of the Jetpack replacing the Grav Lift.
I was playing Halo 3 BTB on Rat’s Nest.
A large number of players were having a standoff in one area.
To end the stalemate, I dropped a Grav Lift and four of us used it to lift up on top of the pipes.
We were then able to surprise the enemy and we also gained the height advantage.
If Jetpack were to replace Grav Lift, this awesome teamwork-oriented event would’ve never happened.
Instead, it would just be me.
Grav Lift is much better than Jetpack.
EDIT:
Deployable Cover is also better than Hardlight Shield.
As it can be more effectively used by your team, and it can be turned against your team if the enemy begins to use it as cover.
Ultimately, Equipment is infinitely better than Armor Abilities.
As Equipment usually affects the map and and/or other players.
-Bubble Shield
-Power Drain
-Trip Mine
-Grav Lift
-Regenerator
-Radar Jammer
-Flare
-Deployable Cover
That’s the full list of Equipment in Halo 3.
They all affect the map and/or other players.
While Armor Abilities usually affect the player using the ability.
-Thruster Pack
-Evade
-Jetpack
-Active Camo
-Promethean Vision
-Armor Lock
-Hardlight Shield
-Sprint
-Hologram
The only other ones are Auto Sentry, Regeneration Field, and Drop Shield.
Also, AAs negate equal spawns.
Which is a core aspect of Halo MP.
> I don’t like the idea of the Jetpack replacing the Grav Lift.
>
> I was playing Halo 3 BTB on Rat’s Nest.
> A large number of players were having a standoff in one area.
> To end the stalemate, I dropped a Grav Lift and four of us used it to lift up on top of the pipes.
> We were then able to surprise the enemy and we also gained the height advantage.
>
> If Jetpack were to replace Grav Lift, this awesome teamwork-oriented event would’ve never happened.
> Instead, it would just be me.
>
> Grav Lift is much better than Jetpack.
>
> EDIT:
> Deployable Cover is also better than Hardlight Shield.
> As it can be more effectively used by your team, and it can be turned against your team if the enemy begins to use it as cover.
>
> Ultimately, Equipment is infinitely better than Armor Abilities.
> As Equipment usually affects the map and and/or other players.
>
>
>
> -Bubble Shield
> -Power Drain
> -Trip Mine
> -Grav Lift
> -Regenerator
> -Radar Jammer
> -Flare
> -Deployable Cover
> That’s the full list of Equipment in Halo 3.
> They all affect the map and/or other players.
>
>
> While Armor Abilities usually affect the player using the ability.
>
>
>
> -Thruster Pack
> -Evade
> -Jetpack
> -Active Camo
> -Promethean Vision
> -Armor Lock
> -Hardlight Shield
> -Sprint
> -Hologram
> The only other ones are Auto Sentry, Regeneration Field, and Drop Shield.
>
>
> Also, AAs negate equal spawns.
> Which is a core aspect of Halo MP.
I agree, returning to halo 3, I’ve come to the general conclusion that equipment are more ‘offensive’ but it can equally be used against you or used for an advantage by the enemy team. I think that this takes more skill and affects gameplay less, but with a bigger impact.
I did however vote for both separately as i would like to be able to, say, have a trip mine or gravity lift and hologram or drop shield.
General ideas of mine are:
Equipment:
- Trip mine
- Power drain
- Flare
- Radar Jammer
- Bubble shield
- Grav. Lift
- Deployable Cover
- Generator
- 2 New Equipments
AAs:
- Dropshield (yes as well as bubble shield and re-gen) (less damage resistance than Bubble shield and slower re-gen than the re-gen fields)
- Hologram (should act more like a real player - hiding/crouching behind cover, reloading, ect.)
- Hardlight shield (faster deploy/undeploy - less damage resistance than dropshield)
- Sprint (I want default sprint, but if not AA would be next best)
- Evade (this should be default like battlefront II, double tap B or tap when sprinting)
- Thruster (should return)
- Jetpack (faster propulsion but faster depletion and regen)
- Armour lock (for customs)
AAs should have limited usage which can be recharged the same way weapons are reloaded.
Tripmines were a great addition to Halo3 and a easier way to um troll , i mean take out enemy warthogs and other veichels.
Both. The idea of only having things solely on the map is a buzzkill… If they could have programmed AAs for halo 3, bungie would have. However, Halo 4’s implementation of AAs was hampered by broken camo a few other misfires. The happy ground is somewhere in the middle.
In halo 5, keep AAs, just make them more difficult to use. Bring back equipment, just five them a specific purpose (e.g. Mines/EMP for destruction, or bubble shields/recharge fields /autosentries for defense).
I believe in a future where AAs will be a Halo standard feature… We just haven’t seen the best implementation of them yet…
I prefer the idea of AAs at spawn over equipment on map because equipment has lacked relatively often in its usefulness in my eyes because all depended too much or too often on the “right moment” or on other environmental influences.
Nonetheless, I definitely do not prefer the current implementation of AAs.
I think aside some individual major and minor tweaks, each Armor Ability should have specific limited uses per life to balance them, to require some tactical thinking before using an AA and to prevent thoughtless and constant AA-spam. (More about that idea: here)
Besides, I would say AAs as well as equipment can both be used for a personal advantage or to give your team an advantage. It just depends on how you or your team is using them.
However, I would be ok with on-map equipment with limited uses as well but the concept of AAs at spawn has simply become more appealing to me.
I’m OK with it all, as long as everything has to be picked up from the maps and has limited use.
As soon as people have unique advantages at all times and without having to compete for them, then there are problems.
I want Equipment to return.
But unlike Halo 3 Equipment, some equipment would have multiple uses.
Ie) Bubble Shield and Power Drainer would have a single use. As these are powerful Equipment.
But weaker equipment like “Hologram, Thruster Pack” etc could have 3-5 uses before being discarded.
I think this is a great evolution step for Equipment from Halo 3.
So I see you all prefer hybrids(in voting)
We would need a limiting on AAs due to how they can turn the tide or give advantages.
I propose that AAs be single use -5 uses like what THOMSY Aus said.
We haven’t seen AAs to their fullest potential yet so I doubt that it would be discarded at all.
Grav lift would be integrated with jet-pack 3 uses
Trip mines are now 3 uses and take the AA spot
Hardlight Shield and Bubbleshield could work with maybe the HS being a pick-up and drop thing…
Drop Shield and Bubbleshield would be together(although there would be no changes) and Regen field is now gone due to the Drop Shield regenerating shields faster and Regenerator. 2 uses
Power Drain could be mixed with Auto Sentry to make it more of a menace( Wherever its shot lands, it does a corroding effect on the shields and the area around the blast radius.-3-5 uses
Flare and Promethean Vision could be mixed to better give promethean vision users possibly better vision in vision mode, but give away the user more.
These are possible integrations…
> I don’t like the idea of the Jetpack replacing the Grav Lift.
>
> I was playing Halo 3 BTB on Rat’s Nest.
> A large number of players were having a standoff in one area.
> To end the stalemate, I dropped a Grav Lift and four of us used it to lift up on top of the pipes.
> We were then able to surprise the enemy and we also gained the height advantage.
>
> If Jetpack were to replace Grav Lift, this awesome teamwork-oriented event would’ve never happened.
> Instead, it would just be me.
>
> Grav Lift is much better than Jetpack.
>
> EDIT:
> Deployable Cover is also better than Hardlight Shield.
> As it can be more effectively used by your team, and it can be turned against your team if the enemy begins to use it as cover.
>
> Ultimately, Equipment is infinitely better than Armor Abilities.
> As Equipment usually affects the map and and/or other players.
>
>
>
> -Bubble Shield
> -Power Drain
> -Trip Mine
> -Grav Lift
> -Regenerator
> -Radar Jammer
> -Flare
> -Deployable Cover
> That’s the full list of Equipment in Halo 3.
> They all affect the map and/or other players.
>
>
> While Armor Abilities usually affect the player using the ability.
>
>
>
> -Thruster Pack
> -Evade
> -Jetpack
> -Active Camo
> -Promethean Vision
> -Armor Lock
> -Hardlight Shield
> -Sprint
> -Hologram
> The only other ones are Auto Sentry, Regeneration Field, and Drop Shield.
>
>
> Also, AAs negate equal spawns.
> Which is a core aspect of Halo MP.
Fighting for equipment is much more satisfying than spawning with AA’s.
> > I don’t like the idea of the Jetpack replacing the Grav Lift.
> >
> > I was playing Halo 3 BTB on Rat’s Nest.
> > A large number of players were having a standoff in one area.
> > To end the stalemate, I dropped a Grav Lift and four of us used it to lift up on top of the pipes.
> > We were then able to surprise the enemy and we also gained the height advantage.
> >
> > If Jetpack were to replace Grav Lift, this awesome teamwork-oriented event would’ve never happened.
> > Instead, it would just be me.
> >
> > Grav Lift is much better than Jetpack.
> >
> > EDIT:
> > Deployable Cover is also better than Hardlight Shield.
> > As it can be more effectively used by your team, and it can be turned against your team if the enemy begins to use it as cover.
> >
> > Ultimately, Equipment is infinitely better than Armor Abilities.
> > As Equipment usually affects the map and and/or other players.
> >
> >
> >
> > -Bubble Shield
> > -Power Drain
> > -Trip Mine
> > -Grav Lift
> > -Regenerator
> > -Radar Jammer
> > -Flare
> > -Deployable Cover
> > That’s the full list of Equipment in Halo 3.
> > They all affect the map and/or other players.
> >
> >
> > While Armor Abilities usually affect the player using the ability.
> >
> >
> >
> > -Thruster Pack
> > -Evade
> > -Jetpack
> > -Active Camo
> > -Promethean Vision
> > -Armor Lock
> > -Hardlight Shield
> > -Sprint
> > -Hologram
> > The only other ones are Auto Sentry, Regeneration Field, and Drop Shield.
> >
> >
> > Also, AAs negate equal spawns.
> > Which is a core aspect of Halo MP.
>
> Fighting for equipment is much more satisfying than spawning with AA’s.
I believe that everyone can agree on that, however, as said we haven’t seen the full use of AAs
> > I don’t like the idea of the Jetpack replacing the Grav Lift.
> >
> > I was playing Halo 3 BTB on Rat’s Nest.
> > A large number of players were having a standoff in one area.
> > To end the stalemate, I dropped a Grav Lift and four of us used it to lift up on top of the pipes.
> > We were then able to surprise the enemy and we also gained the height advantage.
> >
> > If Jetpack were to replace Grav Lift, this awesome teamwork-oriented event would’ve never happened.
> > Instead, it would just be me.
> >
> > Grav Lift is much better than Jetpack.
> >
> > EDIT:
> > Deployable Cover is also better than Hardlight Shield.
> > As it can be more effectively used by your team, and it can be turned against your team if the enemy begins to use it as cover.
> >
> > Ultimately, Equipment is infinitely better than Armor Abilities.
> > As Equipment usually affects the map and and/or other players.
> >
> >
> >
> > -Bubble Shield
> > -Power Drain
> > -Trip Mine
> > -Grav Lift
> > -Regenerator
> > -Radar Jammer
> > -Flare
> > -Deployable Cover
> > That’s the full list of Equipment in Halo 3.
> > They all affect the map and/or other players.
> >
> >
> > While Armor Abilities usually affect the player using the ability.
> >
> >
> >
> > -Thruster Pack
> > -Evade
> > -Jetpack
> > -Active Camo
> > -Promethean Vision
> > -Armor Lock
> > -Hardlight Shield
> > -Sprint
> > -Hologram
> > The only other ones are Auto Sentry, Regeneration Field, and Drop Shield.
> >
> >
> > Also, AAs negate equal spawns.
> > Which is a core aspect of Halo MP.
>
> I agree, returning to halo 3, I’ve come to the general conclusion that equipment are more ‘offensive’ but it can equally be used against you or used for an advantage by the enemy team. I think that this takes more skill and affects gameplay less, but with a bigger impact.
>
> I did however vote for both separately as i would like to be able to, say, have a trip mine or gravity lift and hologram or drop shield.
>
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> General ideas of mine are:
>
> Equipment:
> - Trip mine
> - Power drain
> - Flare
> - Radar Jammer
> - Bubble shield
> - Grav. Lift
> - Deployable Cover
> - Generator
> - 2 New Equipments
>
> AAs:
> - <mark>Dropshield</mark> (yes as well as bubble shield and re-gen) (less damage resistance than Bubble shield and slower re-gen than the re-gen fields)
> - Hologram (should act more like a real player - hiding/crouching behind cover, reloading, ect.)
> - Hardlight shield (faster deploy/undeploy - less damage resistance than dropshield)
> - <mark>Sprint</mark> (I want default sprint, but if not AA would be next best)
> - <mark>Evade</mark> (this should be default like battlefront II, double tap B or tap when sprinting)
> - Thruster (should return)
> - <mark>Jetpack</mark> (faster propulsion but faster depletion and regen)
> - <mark>Armour lock</mark> (for customs)
>
> AAs should have limited usage which can be recharged the same way weapons are reloaded.
Dropshield is a waste. Thruster pack is more balanced and usable than Evade. Sprint ruins games, Jetpack destroys games, and Armour lock is OP. Other than that I agree as long as AA’s have a long spawn time.
> So I see you all prefer hybrids(in voting)
> We would need a limiting on AAs due to how they can turn the tide or give advantages.
> I propose that AAs be single use -5 uses like what THOMSY Aus said.
>
> Hardlight Shield being a pick-up and drop thing…
Halo 3, had a device similar to this. It would be nice if this could return. It works very different from the H4 Hardlight Shield, as it is not mobile.
The idea of some AA/Equipment having multiple uses and some not. Came from SWIFT.
> I don’t like the idea of the Jetpack replacing the Grav Lift.
>
> I was playing Halo 3 BTB on Rat’s Nest.
> A large number of players were having a standoff in one area.
> To end the stalemate, I dropped a Grav Lift and four of us used it to lift up on top of the pipes.
> We were then able to surprise the enemy and we also gained the height advantage.
>
> If Jetpack were to replace Grav Lift, this awesome teamwork-oriented event would’ve never happened.
> Instead, it would just be me.
>
> Grav Lift is much better than Jetpack.
>
> EDIT:
> Deployable Cover is also better than Hardlight Shield.
> As it can be more effectively used by your team, and it can be turned against your team if the enemy begins to use it as cover.
>
> Ultimately, Equipment is infinitely better than Armor Abilities.
> As Equipment usually affects the map and and/or other players.
>
>
>
> -Bubble Shield
> -Power Drain
> -Trip Mine
> -Grav Lift
> -Regenerator
> -Radar Jammer
> -Flare
> -Deployable Cover
> That’s the full list of Equipment in Halo 3.
> They all affect the map and/or other players.
>
>
> While Armor Abilities usually affect the player using the ability.
>
>
>
> -Thruster Pack
> -Evade
> -Jetpack
> -Active Camo
> -Promethean Vision
> -Armor Lock
> -Hardlight Shield
> -Sprint
> -Hologram
> The only other ones are Auto Sentry, Regeneration Field, and Drop Shield.
>
>
> Also, AAs negate equal spawns.
> Which is a core aspect of Halo MP.
I agree and also think Equipment is better than AA.
But with discussions with SWIFT and other people. Equipment needs to evolve.
And I think SWIFT’s idea of having the very powerful Equipment (Bubble Sheild, Power Drainer etc) having a single use. And the lesser powerful Equipment (Hologram, Thruster Pack, Etc) having multiple uses. Is a great way of evolving Equipment.
I think there should be an option that you can start with Equipment, as this would be great for Custom and Action Sack. And I guess you could always have in game settings, how many uses each Equipment have from 1 to Unlimited.
So for example, if you had unlimited, and picked up the Trip Mine, you could throw countless trip mines down. But I guess you would need to cap this. But you could have some fun custom games.
I think equipment is better.
First and foremost, implementing both would be a complete disaster. There would quite simply be just way too much chaos. Adding in more randomness would simply kill whats left of the core halo gameplay.
Halo was always at its best when it was simple and even. AAs detract from this significantly.
Also equipment also can be taken out of playlists and custom games without a major impact on gameplay, whereas AAs being removed from certain playlists present a radical change in gameplay.
- Why only equipment is better
- It doesn’t break the game, one-time use items are just that, one-time use. You can use them to avoid a death, or to aid in a kill one-time. It still benifits you, but it doesn’t overly change the game.
- AAs, in halo reach and halo 4, the AA each player chooses has major impacts on gameplay. Jetpack (in both reach and h4) breaks maps, and results in unfair gameplay. Promethean Vision - utterly ridiculous, kills gameplay, needs to go. Active Camo - also utterly ridiculous as an AA (the mere thought of making what was once a power-up to be fought over available on spawn is insane). Thruster Pack adds basically a get out of jail free card to get away and is a detriment to overall game play. Most of the other AAs that we have had are largely pointless and could pretty much be replaced by equipment.
Equipment that could be implemented
- bubble shield / hardlight shield, can keep you alive, let your shields recharge, let a teammate help you
- regen field, as a single use item it works, helps you once then its gone
- power drain, reduces shields of anyone in range for an easy kill then its gone.
- flare, meh, not really usefull
- autosentry, could actually work well as a pickup, throw it out, it stays out for a set duration, puts a shot or two in a couple players then is gone.
- grav lift
A big thing that I really havent seen mentioned is powerups. They should all be on set timers and set locations on maps (no personal ordinance) (randomness is bad)
- Overshield, a staple in Halo games
- Active Camo, bring this back as a powerup (only as a powerup)
New ideas - Promethean vision as a powerup, If a good balance in duration and scale could be reached, then i could see it as viable
- damage boost/speedboost, worth a test, they could basically serve as lesser powerups (use instead of OS and camo on some maps perhaps)
- Jet Pack, give you a set amount you can use then runs out.
If AAs are to be implemented leave them on map as pickups
– All in all whatever is done, players should not start with any AAs or equipment. Even spawns are the biggest factor in preserving what Halo is.
> First and foremost, implementing both would be a complete disaster. There would quite simply be just way too much chaos. Adding in more randomness would simply kill whats left of the core halo gameplay.
> Halo was always at its best when it was simple and even. AAs detract from this significantly.
I agree with this statement.
I think you as previously mentioned by me, that it would be best that some equipment was single use, and some multi use. Depending on the strength and weakness of the equipment, is how many uses it has.
And these settings should be able be changes from game settings. To allow interesting game types.
What ever happens, Halo needs to be an Arena Shooter again. Having items as map pickups instead of being a part of your loadout does this.
Why Not Both? I think I would like to see what would happen if there was Equipment, Armor Abilities, and Pick Ups in one game. Of course I would like to see it in a beta to make sure the concept will work. Here is my definition of each category.
Armor Ability: A Power Up that is timed by the user and could be used repeatedly they don’t get pick up when the user dies
Equipment: A Power Up that is timed by the user and is only used once they can be picked up when user dies
Pick Up: A Power Up that is activated as soon as it is picked up, only used once
they can not be pick up when the user dies
I will focus on AA’s and Equipment right now because that is the biggest argument. One thing I noticed with the AA’s and the Equipment is they can be classified into two types. The AA/Equipment that is actually a part of your armor.
For Example:
Armor Lock
Hologram
Invincibility
Jet Pack
And there is the kind where you need to throw or drop the equipment to activate.
For Example:
Drop Shield/Bubble Shield
Regenerator (Halo 3)
Power Drain
My solution to the whole Equipment vs. AA debate is why not put in both? It will add new ways to play and it will leave players more options. The armor abilities/equipment that are a part of the armor should become AA’s for repeated use. Here is a list of Armor Ability Candidates:
Sprint
Hologram
Evade/Thruster Pack
Promethean Vision
Hardlight Shield
While the other Equipment/AA’s that are thrown or dropped will become equipment for single use. This is a list of possible equipment:
Bubble Shield
Power Drain
Flare
Gravity Lift
Auto Sentry/Turret
Trip Mine
Radar Jammer
Now I will Talk about Pick Ups. In my opinion Pick Ups should only be for those types of power ups that can be overpowered. Here are some pick ups that I think can make the cut:
Over shield/Invincibility
Active Camouflage
Damage Boost
Speed Boost
Jet Pack (Can be have a time use but is on a timer even when not in use)
I don’t think there will be much debate against me for the Pick Ups. Obviously Over shield/Invincibility should not be repeated use. The only way I can see them being equipment is if the user can still be assassinated with one melee to the back at any time. I think Camouflage should just stay down here. Every game it has been nerfed like crazy yet there are still people exploiting it. Using it as a Pick Up will help get rid of the “Camo Campers.” The only other way to stop it is by getting rid of it all together but it is too important of an ability (both gameplay and canon) to get rid of it. Jet Pack I can see being the only controversial one in this category. If you notice I said you can time it. This somewhat defies my rule of Pick Ups being timed power ups. However if you read I said that the timer for it still runs when it is not in use. For example let’s say that when pick up you can use the jet pack for twenty seconds. That clock runs whether you use it for that entire twenty seconds or you don’t use it at all.
In my opinion I think it will be possible to base a Halo game on all three Armor Abilities, Equipment, and Pick Ups. Whether it means you can have all three at a time, one at a time, or have specific maps or playlists with only one of them. The only challenge I can see with it is one making sure it’s balanced and flows nicely. And two the controller set up. I would like to see this in a beta first however. If it works great. But if it costs too much chaos and can’t be done then that’s ok.