> Nothing cooler than combination duel wielding!!
And nothing more likely to break the sandbox.
Duel wielding is a cool in campaign however in multiplayer it brings a ton of problems with balancing.
Dual wielding is nowhere near as unbalanced as people claim. I would love to see it return, but it will not any time soon. And for those who get mad, sorry for the hot take.
The main “balance” arguments can easily be fixed by:
- Increasing spawn times of dual wieldables
- decrease the quantity of dual wieldables placed on the map
- making locations of the “scary” dual wieling combo guns harder to reach to complete the 2 piece set.
simple, I feel dual wielding adds more to the sandbox, with the simple plan above. If anything, it should be an option in custom games and forge.
> 2533274855864618;5:
> The main “balance” arguments can easily be fixed by:
>
> 1. Increasing spawn times of dual wieldables
> 2. decrease the quantity of dual wieldables placed on the map
> 3. making locations of the “scary” dual wieling combo guns harder to reach to complete the 2 piece set.
>
> simple, I feel dual wielding adds more to the sandbox, with the simple plan above. If anything, it should be an option in custom games and forge.
It’s not that simple though. Those weapons would have to be nerfed and made less useful still. The ONLY solution I can logically think of is a pick up which allows you to duel wield for a specific time.
> 2533274792737987;6:
> > 2533274855864618;5:
> > The main “balance” arguments can easily be fixed by:
> >
> > 1. Increasing spawn times of dual wieldables
> > 2. decrease the quantity of dual wieldables placed on the map
> > 3. making locations of the “scary” dual wieling combo guns harder to reach to complete the 2 piece set.
> >
> > simple, I feel dual wielding adds more to the sandbox, with the simple plan above. If anything, it should be an option in custom games and forge.
>
> It’s not that simple though. Those weapons would have to be nerfed and made less useful still. The ONLY solution I can logically think of is a pick up which allows you to duel wield for a specific time.
It is VERY simple, in halo 3, dual wielding decreases power per bullet, accuracy slightly and increases recoil slightly, lookup the ttk tables on dual wielding weapons and you can clearly see that the data does not lie.
> 2533274855864618;7:
> > 2533274792737987;6:
> > > 2533274855864618;5:
> > > The main “balance” arguments can easily be fixed by:
> > >
> > > 1. Increasing spawn times of dual wieldables
> > > 2. decrease the quantity of dual wieldables placed on the map
> > > 3. making locations of the “scary” dual wieling combo guns harder to reach to complete the 2 piece set.
> > >
> > > simple, I feel dual wielding adds more to the sandbox, with the simple plan above. If anything, it should be an option in custom games and forge.
> >
> > It’s not that simple though. Those weapons would have to be nerfed and made less useful still. The ONLY solution I can logically think of is a pick up which allows you to duel wield for a specific time.
>
> It is VERY simple, in halo 3, dual wielding decreases power per bullet, accuracy slightly and increases recoil slightly, lookup the ttk tables on dual wielding weapons and you can clearly see that the data does not lie.
Well spoken
> 2533274855864618;7:
> > 2533274792737987;6:
> > > 2533274855864618;5:
> > > The main “balance” arguments can easily be fixed by:
> > >
> > > 1. Increasing spawn times of dual wieldables
> > > 2. decrease the quantity of dual wieldables placed on the map
> > > 3. making locations of the “scary” dual wieling combo guns harder to reach to complete the 2 piece set.
> > >
> > > simple, I feel dual wielding adds more to the sandbox, with the simple plan above. If anything, it should be an option in custom games and forge.
> >
> > It’s not that simple though. Those weapons would have to be nerfed and made less useful still. The ONLY solution I can logically think of is a pick up which allows you to duel wield for a specific time.
>
> It is VERY simple, in halo 3, dual wielding decreases power per bullet, accuracy slightly and increases recoil slightly, lookup the ttk tables on dual wielding weapons and you can clearly see that the data does not lie.
Stating it is “very simple” just shows you are not thinking about it in-depth. Nothing about game design is “very simple”. It adds too much bloat without having much of a reward and then balancing becomes an issue. TTK doesn’t reflect actual in-game combat with duel wielding. The amount of variables with increased fire rate makes TTK less meaningful to reference.
> 2533274792737987;9:
> > 2533274855864618;7:
> > > 2533274792737987;6:
> > > > 2533274855864618;5:
> > > > The main “balance” arguments can easily be fixed by:
> > > >
> > > > 1. Increasing spawn times of dual wieldables
> > > > 2. decrease the quantity of dual wieldables placed on the map
> > > > 3. making locations of the “scary” dual wieling combo guns harder to reach to complete the 2 piece set.
> > > >
> > > > simple, I feel dual wielding adds more to the sandbox, with the simple plan above. If anything, it should be an option in custom games and forge.
> > >
> > > It’s not that simple though. Those weapons would have to be nerfed and made less useful still. The ONLY solution I can logically think of is a pick up which allows you to duel wield for a specific time.
> >
> > It is VERY simple, in halo 3, dual wielding decreases power per bullet, accuracy slightly and increases recoil slightly, lookup the ttk tables on dual wielding weapons and you can clearly see that the data does not lie.
>
> Stating it is “very simple” just shows you are not thinking about it in-depth. Nothing about game design is “very simple”. It adds too much bloat without having much of a reward and then balancing becomes an issue. TTK doesn’t reflect actual in-game combat with duel wielding. The amount of variables with increased fire rate makes TTK less meaningful to reference.
View ttk tables in halo 3 like I said, they had it figured out 13 years ago, using buzzwords like “bloat” and claiming others aren’t thinking “in-depth” doesn’t change that at all? it really is very simple.
> 2533274855864618;10:
> > 2533274792737987;9:
> > > 2533274855864618;7:
> > > > 2533274792737987;6:
> > > > > 2533274855864618;5:
> > > > > The main “balance” arguments can easily be fixed by:
> > > > >
> > > > > 1. Increasing spawn times of dual wieldables
> > > > > 2. decrease the quantity of dual wieldables placed on the map
> > > > > 3. making locations of the “scary” dual wieling combo guns harder to reach to complete the 2 piece set.
> > > > >
> > > > > simple, I feel dual wielding adds more to the sandbox, with the simple plan above. If anything, it should be an option in custom games and forge.
> > > >
> > > > It’s not that simple though. Those weapons would have to be nerfed and made less useful still. The ONLY solution I can logically think of is a pick up which allows you to duel wield for a specific time.
> > >
> > > It is VERY simple, in halo 3, dual wielding decreases power per bullet, accuracy slightly and increases recoil slightly, lookup the ttk tables on dual wielding weapons and you can clearly see that the data does not lie.
> >
> > Stating it is “very simple” just shows you are not thinking about it in-depth. Nothing about game design is “very simple”. It adds too much bloat without having much of a reward and then balancing becomes an issue. TTK doesn’t reflect actual in-game combat with duel wielding. The amount of variables with increased fire rate makes TTK less meaningful to reference.
>
> View ttk tables in halo 3 like I said, they had it figured out 13 years ago, using buzzwords like “bloat” and claiming others aren’t thinking “in-depth” doesn’t change that at all? it really is very simple.
It was not figured out 13 years ago lol. The duel wielding system had a ton of issues and was heavily neglected in games. I would rather have more unique weapons than duel wielding anyways because they contribute far more variety to the gameplay. I know the TTK tables. I played a stupid about of Halo 3 and they don’t just translate perfectly. They are hypotheticals.
> 2533274792737987;11:
> > 2533274855864618;10:
> > > 2533274792737987;9:
> > > > 2533274855864618;7:
> > > > > 2533274792737987;6:
> > > > > > 2533274855864618;5:
> > > > > > The main “balance” arguments can easily be fixed by:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > 1. Increasing spawn times of dual wieldables
> > > > > > 2. decrease the quantity of dual wieldables placed on the map
> > > > > > 3. making locations of the “scary” dual wieling combo guns harder to reach to complete the 2 piece set.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > simple, I feel dual wielding adds more to the sandbox, with the simple plan above. If anything, it should be an option in custom games and forge.
> > > > >
> > > > > It’s not that simple though. Those weapons would have to be nerfed and made less useful still. The ONLY solution I can logically think of is a pick up which allows you to duel wield for a specific time.
> > > >
> > > > It is VERY simple, in halo 3, dual wielding decreases power per bullet, accuracy slightly and increases recoil slightly, lookup the ttk tables on dual wielding weapons and you can clearly see that the data does not lie.
> > >
> > > Stating it is “very simple” just shows you are not thinking about it in-depth. Nothing about game design is “very simple”. It adds too much bloat without having much of a reward and then balancing becomes an issue. TTK doesn’t reflect actual in-game combat with duel wielding. The amount of variables with increased fire rate makes TTK less meaningful to reference.
> >
> > View ttk tables in halo 3 like I said, they had it figured out 13 years ago, using buzzwords like “bloat” and claiming others aren’t thinking “in-depth” doesn’t change that at all? it really is very simple.
>
> It was not figured out 13 years ago lol. The duel wielding system had a ton of issues and was heavily neglected in games. I would rather have more unique weapons than duel wielding anyways because they contribute far more variety to the gameplay. I know the TTK tables. I played a stupid about of Halo 3 and they don’t just translate perfectly. They are hypotheticals.
The dual wielding system is a great way to make certain lesser weapons more fun to use, 343 will figure it out, but one opinion on another, I back mine up with ttk and damage data.
> 2533274855864618;12:
> > 2533274792737987;11:
> > > 2533274855864618;10:
> > > > 2533274792737987;9:
> > > > > 2533274855864618;7:
> > > > > > 2533274792737987;6:
> > > > > > > 2533274855864618;5:
> > > > > > > The main “balance” arguments can easily be fixed by:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > 1. Increasing spawn times of dual wieldables
> > > > > > > 2. decrease the quantity of dual wieldables placed on the map
> > > > > > > 3. making locations of the “scary” dual wieling combo guns harder to reach to complete the 2 piece set.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > simple, I feel dual wielding adds more to the sandbox, with the simple plan above. If anything, it should be an option in custom games and forge.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > It’s not that simple though. Those weapons would have to be nerfed and made less useful still. The ONLY solution I can logically think of is a pick up which allows you to duel wield for a specific time.
> > > > >
> > > > > It is VERY simple, in halo 3, dual wielding decreases power per bullet, accuracy slightly and increases recoil slightly, lookup the ttk tables on dual wielding weapons and you can clearly see that the data does not lie.
> > > >
> > > > Stating it is “very simple” just shows you are not thinking about it in-depth. Nothing about game design is “very simple”. It adds too much bloat without having much of a reward and then balancing becomes an issue. TTK doesn’t reflect actual in-game combat with duel wielding. The amount of variables with increased fire rate makes TTK less meaningful to reference.
> > >
> > > View ttk tables in halo 3 like I said, they had it figured out 13 years ago, using buzzwords like “bloat” and claiming others aren’t thinking “in-depth” doesn’t change that at all? it really is very simple.
> >
> > It was not figured out 13 years ago lol. The duel wielding system had a ton of issues and was heavily neglected in games. I would rather have more unique weapons than duel wielding anyways because they contribute far more variety to the gameplay. I know the TTK tables. I played a stupid about of Halo 3 and they don’t just translate perfectly. They are hypotheticals.
>
> The dual wielding system is a great way to make certain lesser weapons, more fun to use, 343 will figure it out, but one opinion on another, I back mine up with ttk and damage data, not buzzwords.
Again, TTK represents the perfect situation. It does not state range effectiveness and plenty of other variables that exist with in-game situations. Leaning so heavily on hypothetical data and neglecting actual application does not reflect actual impact. Not sure how I am using “buzzwords”? A lot of testing goes into these games and there is a reason why duel wielding in FPS games is not a common thing. Also, stating it is “very simple” is just ignorant. We will just disagree going forward so no need to continue.
> 2533274792737987;13:
> > 2533274855864618;12:
> > > 2533274792737987;11:
> > > > 2533274855864618;10:
> > > > > 2533274792737987;9:
> > > > > > 2533274855864618;7:
> > > > > > > 2533274792737987;6:
> > > > > > > > 2533274855864618;5:
> > > > > > > > The main “balance” arguments can easily be fixed by:
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > 1. Increasing spawn times of dual wieldables
> > > > > > > > 2. decrease the quantity of dual wieldables placed on the map
> > > > > > > > 3. making locations of the “scary” dual wieling combo guns harder to reach to complete the 2 piece set.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > simple, I feel dual wielding adds more to the sandbox, with the simple plan above. If anything, it should be an option in custom games and forge.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > It’s not that simple though. Those weapons would have to be nerfed and made less useful still. The ONLY solution I can logically think of is a pick up which allows you to duel wield for a specific time.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > It is VERY simple, in halo 3, dual wielding decreases power per bullet, accuracy slightly and increases recoil slightly, lookup the ttk tables on dual wielding weapons and you can clearly see that the data does not lie.
> > > > >
> > > > > Stating it is “very simple” just shows you are not thinking about it in-depth. Nothing about game design is “very simple”. It adds too much bloat without having much of a reward and then balancing becomes an issue. TTK doesn’t reflect actual in-game combat with duel wielding. The amount of variables with increased fire rate makes TTK less meaningful to reference.
> > > >
> > > > View ttk tables in halo 3 like I said, they had it figured out 13 years ago, using buzzwords like “bloat” and claiming others aren’t thinking “in-depth” doesn’t change that at all? it really is very simple.
> > >
> > > It was not figured out 13 years ago lol. The duel wielding system had a ton of issues and was heavily neglected in games. I would rather have more unique weapons than duel wielding anyways because they contribute far more variety to the gameplay. I know the TTK tables. I played a stupid about of Halo 3 and they don’t just translate perfectly. They are hypotheticals.
> >
> > The dual wielding system is a great way to make certain lesser weapons, more fun to use, 343 will figure it out, but one opinion on another, I back mine up with ttk and damage data, not buzzwords.
>
> Again, TTK represents the perfect situation. It does not state range effectiveness and plenty of other variables that exist with in-game situations. Leaning so heavily on hypothetical data and neglecting actual application does not reflect actual impact. Not sure how I am using “buzzwords”? A lot of testing goes into these games and there is a reason why duel wielding in FPS games is not a common thing. Also, stating it is “very simple” is just ignorant.
> 2533274792737987;13:
> > 2533274855864618;12:
> > > 2533274792737987;11:
> > > > 2533274855864618;10:
> > > > > 2533274792737987;9:
> > > > > > 2533274855864618;7:
> > > > > > > 2533274792737987;6:
> > > > > > > > 2533274855864618;5:
> > > > > > > > The main “balance” arguments can easily be fixed by:
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > 1. Increasing spawn times of dual wieldables
> > > > > > > > 2. decrease the quantity of dual wieldables placed on the map
> > > > > > > > 3. making locations of the “scary” dual wieling combo guns harder to reach to complete the 2 piece set.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > simple, I feel dual wielding adds more to the sandbox, with the simple plan above. If anything, it should be an option in custom games and forge.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > It’s not that simple though. Those weapons would have to be nerfed and made less useful still. The ONLY solution I can logically think of is a pick up which allows you to duel wield for a specific time.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > It is VERY simple, in halo 3, dual wielding decreases power per bullet, accuracy slightly and increases recoil slightly, lookup the ttk tables on dual wielding weapons and you can clearly see that the data does not lie.
> > > > >
> > > > > Stating it is “very simple” just shows you are not thinking about it in-depth. Nothing about game design is “very simple”. It adds too much bloat without having much of a reward and then balancing becomes an issue. TTK doesn’t reflect actual in-game combat with duel wielding. The amount of variables with increased fire rate makes TTK less meaningful to reference.
> > > >
> > > > View ttk tables in halo 3 like I said, they had it figured out 13 years ago, using buzzwords like “bloat” and claiming others aren’t thinking “in-depth” doesn’t change that at all? it really is very simple.
> > >
> > > It was not figured out 13 years ago lol. The duel wielding system had a ton of issues and was heavily neglected in games. I would rather have more unique weapons than duel wielding anyways because they contribute far more variety to the gameplay. I know the TTK tables. I played a stupid about of Halo 3 and they don’t just translate perfectly. They are hypotheticals.
> >
> > The dual wielding system is a great way to make certain lesser weapons, more fun to use, 343 will figure it out, but one opinion on another, I back mine up with ttk and damage data, not buzzwords.
>
> Again, TTK represents the perfect situation. It does not state range effectiveness and plenty of other variables that exist with in-game situations. Leaning so heavily on hypothetical data and neglecting actual application does not reflect actual impact. Not sure how I am using “buzzwords”? A lot of testing goes into these games and there is a reason why duel wielding in FPS games is not a common thing. Also, stating it is “very simple” is just ignorant.
I am not ignorant for having a different opinion.
Dual wielding isn’t a bad concept on paper but you got to think about the game play and sandbox which will have to be completely reworked to accommodate. One example is the magnum/sidearm would be nerfed as a result, I don’t know anyone who wants that.
> 2533274855864618;14:
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> > > > > > 2533274792737987;9:
> > > > > > > 2533274855864618;7:
> > > > > > > > 2533274792737987;6:
> > > > > > > > > 2533274855864618;5:
> > > > > > > > > The main “balance” arguments can easily be fixed by:
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > 1. Increasing spawn times of dual wieldables
> > > > > > > > > 2. decrease the quantity of dual wieldables placed on the map
> > > > > > > > > 3. making locations of the “scary” dual wieling combo guns harder to reach to complete the 2 piece set.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > simple, I feel dual wielding adds more to the sandbox, with the simple plan above. If anything, it should be an option in custom games and forge.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > It’s not that simple though. Those weapons would have to be nerfed and made less useful still. The ONLY solution I can logically think of is a pick up which allows you to duel wield for a specific time.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > It is VERY simple, in halo 3, dual wielding decreases power per bullet, accuracy slightly and increases recoil slightly, lookup the ttk tables on dual wielding weapons and you can clearly see that the data does not lie.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Stating it is “very simple” just shows you are not thinking about it in-depth. Nothing about game design is “very simple”. It adds too much bloat without having much of a reward and then balancing becomes an issue. TTK doesn’t reflect actual in-game combat with duel wielding. The amount of variables with increased fire rate makes TTK less meaningful to reference.
> > > > >
> > > > > View ttk tables in halo 3 like I said, they had it figured out 13 years ago, using buzzwords like “bloat” and claiming others aren’t thinking “in-depth” doesn’t change that at all? it really is very simple.
> > > >
> > > > It was not figured out 13 years ago lol. The duel wielding system had a ton of issues and was heavily neglected in games. I would rather have more unique weapons than duel wielding anyways because they contribute far more variety to the gameplay. I know the TTK tables. I played a stupid about of Halo 3 and they don’t just translate perfectly. They are hypotheticals.
> > >
> > > The dual wielding system is a great way to make certain lesser weapons, more fun to use, 343 will figure it out, but one opinion on another, I back mine up with ttk and damage data, not buzzwords.
> >
> > Again, TTK represents the perfect situation. It does not state range effectiveness and plenty of other variables that exist with in-game situations. Leaning so heavily on hypothetical data and neglecting actual application does not reflect actual impact. Not sure how I am using “buzzwords”? A lot of testing goes into these games and there is a reason why duel wielding in FPS games is not a common thing. Also, stating it is “very simple” is just ignorant.
>
>
>
> > 2533274792737987;13:
> > > 2533274855864618;12:
> > > > 2533274792737987;11:
> > > > > 2533274855864618;10:
> > > > > > 2533274792737987;9:
> > > > > > > 2533274855864618;7:
> > > > > > > > 2533274792737987;6:
> > > > > > > > > 2533274855864618;5:
> > > > > > > > > The main “balance” arguments can easily be fixed by:
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > 1. Increasing spawn times of dual wieldables
> > > > > > > > > 2. decrease the quantity of dual wieldables placed on the map
> > > > > > > > > 3. making locations of the “scary” dual wieling combo guns harder to reach to complete the 2 piece set.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > simple, I feel dual wielding adds more to the sandbox, with the simple plan above. If anything, it should be an option in custom games and forge.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > It’s not that simple though. Those weapons would have to be nerfed and made less useful still. The ONLY solution I can logically think of is a pick up which allows you to duel wield for a specific time.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > It is VERY simple, in halo 3, dual wielding decreases power per bullet, accuracy slightly and increases recoil slightly, lookup the ttk tables on dual wielding weapons and you can clearly see that the data does not lie.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Stating it is “very simple” just shows you are not thinking about it in-depth. Nothing about game design is “very simple”. It adds too much bloat without having much of a reward and then balancing becomes an issue. TTK doesn’t reflect actual in-game combat with duel wielding. The amount of variables with increased fire rate makes TTK less meaningful to reference.
> > > > >
> > > > > View ttk tables in halo 3 like I said, they had it figured out 13 years ago, using buzzwords like “bloat” and claiming others aren’t thinking “in-depth” doesn’t change that at all? it really is very simple.
> > > >
> > > > It was not figured out 13 years ago lol. The duel wielding system had a ton of issues and was heavily neglected in games. I would rather have more unique weapons than duel wielding anyways because they contribute far more variety to the gameplay. I know the TTK tables. I played a stupid about of Halo 3 and they don’t just translate perfectly. They are hypotheticals.
> > >
> > > The dual wielding system is a great way to make certain lesser weapons, more fun to use, 343 will figure it out, but one opinion on another, I back mine up with ttk and damage data, not buzzwords.
> >
> > Again, TTK represents the perfect situation. It does not state range effectiveness and plenty of other variables that exist with in-game situations. Leaning so heavily on hypothetical data and neglecting actual application does not reflect actual impact. Not sure how I am using “buzzwords”? A lot of testing goes into these games and there is a reason why duel wielding in FPS games is not a common thing. Also, stating it is “very simple” is just ignorant.
>
> I am not ignorant for having a different opinion.
Stating some is “very simple” without having any understanding on how complex it is in reality is ignorant. I never said you were ignorant for having an opinion about duel wielding. Completely different things.
> 2533274792737987;16:
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> > > > > > > > > 2533274792737987;6:
> > > > > > > > > > 2533274855864618;5:
> > > > > > > > > > The main “balance” arguments can easily be fixed by:
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > 1. Increasing spawn times of dual wieldables
> > > > > > > > > > 2. decrease the quantity of dual wieldables placed on the map
> > > > > > > > > > 3. making locations of the “scary” dual wieling combo guns harder to reach to complete the 2 piece set.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > simple, I feel dual wielding adds more to the sandbox, with the simple plan above. If anything, it should be an option in custom games and forge.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > It’s not that simple though. Those weapons would have to be nerfed and made less useful still. The ONLY solution I can logically think of is a pick up which allows you to duel wield for a specific time.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > It is VERY simple, in halo 3, dual wielding decreases power per bullet, accuracy slightly and increases recoil slightly, lookup the ttk tables on dual wielding weapons and you can clearly see that the data does not lie.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Stating it is “very simple” just shows you are not thinking about it in-depth. Nothing about game design is “very simple”. It adds too much bloat without having much of a reward and then balancing becomes an issue. TTK doesn’t reflect actual in-game combat with duel wielding. The amount of variables with increased fire rate makes TTK less meaningful to reference.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > View ttk tables in halo 3 like I said, they had it figured out 13 years ago, using buzzwords like “bloat” and claiming others aren’t thinking “in-depth” doesn’t change that at all? it really is very simple.
> > > > >
> > > > > It was not figured out 13 years ago lol. The duel wielding system had a ton of issues and was heavily neglected in games. I would rather have more unique weapons than duel wielding anyways because they contribute far more variety to the gameplay. I know the TTK tables. I played a stupid about of Halo 3 and they don’t just translate perfectly. They are hypotheticals.
> > > >
> > > > The dual wielding system is a great way to make certain lesser weapons, more fun to use, 343 will figure it out, but one opinion on another, I back mine up with ttk and damage data, not buzzwords.
> > >
> > > Again, TTK represents the perfect situation. It does not state range effectiveness and plenty of other variables that exist with in-game situations. Leaning so heavily on hypothetical data and neglecting actual application does not reflect actual impact. Not sure how I am using “buzzwords”? A lot of testing goes into these games and there is a reason why duel wielding in FPS games is not a common thing. Also, stating it is “very simple” is just ignorant.
> >
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> > > > > > > > > > The main “balance” arguments can easily be fixed by:
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > 1. Increasing spawn times of dual wieldables
> > > > > > > > > > 2. decrease the quantity of dual wieldables placed on the map
> > > > > > > > > > 3. making locations of the “scary” dual wieling combo guns harder to reach to complete the 2 piece set.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > simple, I feel dual wielding adds more to the sandbox, with the simple plan above. If anything, it should be an option in custom games and forge.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > It’s not that simple though. Those weapons would have to be nerfed and made less useful still. The ONLY solution I can logically think of is a pick up which allows you to duel wield for a specific time.
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> > > > > > > > It is VERY simple, in halo 3, dual wielding decreases power per bullet, accuracy slightly and increases recoil slightly, lookup the ttk tables on dual wielding weapons and you can clearly see that the data does not lie.
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> > > > > > > Stating it is “very simple” just shows you are not thinking about it in-depth. Nothing about game design is “very simple”. It adds too much bloat without having much of a reward and then balancing becomes an issue. TTK doesn’t reflect actual in-game combat with duel wielding. The amount of variables with increased fire rate makes TTK less meaningful to reference.
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> > > > > > View ttk tables in halo 3 like I said, they had it figured out 13 years ago, using buzzwords like “bloat” and claiming others aren’t thinking “in-depth” doesn’t change that at all? it really is very simple.
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> > > > > It was not figured out 13 years ago lol. The duel wielding system had a ton of issues and was heavily neglected in games. I would rather have more unique weapons than duel wielding anyways because they contribute far more variety to the gameplay. I know the TTK tables. I played a stupid about of Halo 3 and they don’t just translate perfectly. They are hypotheticals.
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> > > > The dual wielding system is a great way to make certain lesser weapons, more fun to use, 343 will figure it out, but one opinion on another, I back mine up with ttk and damage data, not buzzwords.
> > >
> > > Again, TTK represents the perfect situation. It does not state range effectiveness and plenty of other variables that exist with in-game situations. Leaning so heavily on hypothetical data and neglecting actual application does not reflect actual impact. Not sure how I am using “buzzwords”? A lot of testing goes into these games and there is a reason why duel wielding in FPS games is not a common thing. Also, stating it is “very simple” is just ignorant.
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> > I am not ignorant for having a different opinion.
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> Stating some is “very simple” without having any understanding on how complex it is in reality is ignorant. I never said you were ignorant for having an opinion about duel wielding. Completely different things.
Please re-read my posts if you are confused. TTK represents a perfect scenario like you said, meaning they will actually be slower among the listed times, adding the many variables that fighting will have, it makes the balance work, and will not be as busted as you claim. Halo 3 did it right, Halo infinite could do it even better. Calling people ignorant is unconstructive, and not an argument. So, here is the complete ttk list of weapons on halo 3, from least to highest in seconds. Going off of what you said: “TTK represents the perfect situation.” these can easily have a half second added on. either way, dual wielding has its strengths, but does not “nerf” other weapons or themselves when using only 1. This data is not hypthetical.
Flame Thrower 0.38, Fuel Rod 0.44, Machine Gun (spun up) 0.44, Mauler 0.52, Plasma Cannon (spun up) 0.56, Sentinel Beam 0.58, Needler (spun up) 1,
Needler 1.04, Brute Spiker (dual wield) 1.06, Machine Gun 1.14, Brute Shot1.16, Plasma Cannon 1.18, Plasma Rifle (dual wield) 1.28, Battle Rifle 1.34,
Carbine 1.34, SMG (dual wield) 1.36, Assault Rifle 1.4, Brute Spiker 1.44, Magnum 1.54, SMG 1.58, Plasma Rifle 2.24, Spartan Laser 2.34,
Plasma Pistol (dual wield) 3.06, Plasma Pistol 6.16.
Note how dual wielding 2 spikers did not cut the ttk down to an insane .6, it nerfed their damage down to a 1.06, which is high damage fast ttk, but as you said, “TTK represents the perfect situation.” so yes you are right, they are not as broken as people think. Halo 3 did this, Halo Infinite can DEFINITELY do it even better.
I have to say no. it’s cool and fun, but no.
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> > > > > The main “balance” arguments can easily be fixed by:
> > > > >
> > > > > 1. Increasing spawn times of dual wieldables
> > > > > 2. decrease the quantity of dual wieldables placed on the map
> > > > > 3. making locations of the “scary” dual wieling combo guns harder to reach to complete the 2 piece set.
> > > > >
> > > > > simple, I feel dual wielding adds more to the sandbox, with the simple plan above. If anything, it should be an option in custom games and forge.
> > > >
> > > > It’s not that simple though. Those weapons would have to be nerfed and made less useful still. The ONLY solution I can logically think of is a pick up which allows you to duel wield for a specific time.
> > >
> > > It is VERY simple, in halo 3, dual wielding decreases power per bullet, accuracy slightly and increases recoil slightly, lookup the ttk tables on dual wielding weapons and you can clearly see that the data does not lie.
> >
> > Stating it is “very simple” just shows you are not thinking about it in-depth. Nothing about game design is “very simple”. It adds too much bloat without having much of a reward and then balancing becomes an issue. TTK doesn’t reflect actual in-game combat with duel wielding. The amount of variables with increased fire rate makes TTK less meaningful to reference.
>
> View ttk tables in halo 3 like I said, they had it figured out 13 years ago, using buzzwords like “bloat” and claiming others aren’t thinking “in-depth” doesn’t change that at all? it really is very simple.
dual weilding was terrible in H3 so idk what your talking about. Its one reason why it was removed in ODST since the smg was a main weapon. Making it a dual wielded gun nerfed the solo version. No gun should be only useful in a dual wield situation. However, if you keep the power the same, it makes the mechanic pointless. As such, its removal is the best option.
Duel wielding felt akward in halo 2 and was made marginally better in h 3. It ruined balancing and my favorite smg is the odst one and its not dw. It alway felt like i giving an arm and a leg for a gimmick that i had to do or be beat out at longer ranges. In general i dont even dw anymore as im better off with one plasma rifle that i can melee and throw grenades with.