Don't let Infinity go to waste

Infinity Slayer is a pretty controversial gamemode, people hate it, people like it, I’m one who enjoys it (but I’ve been playing Legendary Slayer and CE MP more recently), I don’t want to see everything 343 has done with it go to waste, to identify some issues:

  1. Active Camo and Jetpack
  2. Plasma Grenades, Boltshots and Plasma Pistols
  3. Ordnance
  4. Instant Respawning
  5. Weapon Markers

To offer some solutions

  1. Active Camo should become a power up again, if people can spaen with a camping machine that’s an issue, remove the Jetpack or make it Campaign exclusive, it breaks maps

  2. The only way I feel to deal with this would be to not remove loadouts, but remove the choice of Secondary and Grenade (multiplayer only, have SpOps/FF with the choice of secondary) so make us spawn with Magnum, One frag grenade, choice of primary, choice of AA

  3. It’s ridiculous you can get a few kills and get a Rocket Launcher, I’m not suggesting remove Ordnance, just fix it by making it ammo for your Primary, Grenade and Secondary and don’t let them kill vehicles

  4. Especially coupled with Sprint, the game goes way too quick, just remove Instant Respawning and we’ll have a decent pace

  5. I’m sure people also agree, the weapon markers don’t need to be there, if they do return, make them visible for 3-5 seconds before they disappear, I’d prefer they wouldn’t be there, but some sort of return like that would be a little better than the current one

Yeah, I prefer classic, but I’d hate to see Infinity go. With some tweaks it could be a great mode.

I think ordnance options should be:
ammo/grenades
armor abilities
power ups
semi-power weapons (sticky detonator, needler, etc.)
Extra perks

> Yeah, I prefer classic, but I’d hate to see Infinity go. With some tweaks it could be a great mode.

I prefer Infinity, but I know some people like Classic so I hope there are Classic options also

I agree, don’t completely gut Infinity, but I don’t think it is the best way to move the franchise forward and if it remains front and center moving forward, I don’t think Halo 5 will win very many people back.

> To offer some solutions
>
> 2. The only way I feel to deal with this would be to not remove loadouts, but remove the choice of Secondary and Grenade (multiplayer only, have SpOps/FF with the choice of secondary) so make us spawn with Magnum, One frag grenade, choice of primary, choice of AA
>
> 3. It’s ridiculous you can get a few kills and get a Rocket Launcher, I’m not suggesting remove Ordnance, just fix it by making it ammo for your Primary, Grenade and Secondary and don’t let them kill vehicles

Good post, I like how you’re offering solutions instead of just whining and complaining like many of the other threads.

For ordinance, how about we make it balanced by having the drops not be random. Instead, when called in you receive the exact same ordinance in the same sequence as everybody else, starting off with simple pick-ups like frags and ammo and moving up to slightly stronger weapons (but NOT power weapons) like the Railgun and speed boost.

Keep Jetpack and Active Camo, just modify them to work differently. Jetpack with a longer recharge and more bloom during use, maybe limit weapon use during flight to pistols, maybe even design maps to compensate for JP use, AC… I posted my idea near the bottom of the third page
https://forums.halowaypoint.com/yaf_postst221823p3_Reverse-the-effects-of-Camo.aspx

Ordinance can go, im fine without it. It would free up some buttons for other stuff

Not too sure about instaspawns…same with ordinance markers…but they do help when I first play on a map, and in other halo games im never sure if the weapon is gone until i get killed by it…not a fun way to learn weapon spawns

As for the Boltshot and the Plasma Pistol and Grenades, i dont use them anyway, but i do like having the option to if i feel that i need to…although hitting a Warthog head on with the Splaser is much more satisfying than with the PP and PGs

EDIT: still not sure what the hell “breaking maps” even means. What I think is that if you want to camp or hold a position, then you should have to work hard to keep it. It also has the benefit of allowing players to be unpredictable, so they dont get instakilled the moment they walk up a ramp or go up a gravity lift by someone “controlling” a high up area with a shotgun or rocket launcher (eg Abandon, Settler, Sword Base, and someone’s going to complain that these arent valid examples because they are bad maps. Settler and Sword Base tend to be the maps i end up playing most, so im not sure if that means they are popular, or they are good maps). And besides, killing jet packers is really, really easy with any loadout weapon (barring the PP or BS)
End mini edit rant

I think these are terrible ideas. You say we shouldn’t let Infinity go to waste, but instead you suggest we strip it down and destroy it completely. Your Infinity would not be appealing to its target audience. If 343i actually do split the multiplayer, they should find ways to fix these issues instead of just removing features. Except for perks, which have to go…

  1. I agree completely. AC has to be a power up and Jet Pack should only be in Forge and Campaign and maybe as a map placement (in very specific maps).

  2. Remove the grenade choice- yes, I agree. We don’t need a grenade choice. But to remove the secondary option is just crazy. What’s the point in custom Loadouts if you only get two minimal options? We might as well return to Reach Loadouts. No, there should be a secondary option but both the Boltshot and the PP must go. Instead, the place should be filled by the SMG and the Plasma Rifle as weak automatics and possibly a new forerunner pistol that isn’t OP (or maybe a quick shotgun that is a 3sk at close range or something).

  3. Ordnance should give us high level grenades (plasma, buffed pulse, bubble shield?), power ups and one low-tiered power weapon (plasma pistol, Boltshot, Needler- it would be especially great if Dual Wielding returns because it could get you a second secondary) as options. None are too overpowered, all are rewarding. Instead of giving someone on a murder streak a huge advantage, you’re giving them a small boost. If AAs are removed from Loadouts and placed on-map (which will likely only happen if 343i won’t split the multiplayer) than AAs can come through Ordnance as well.

  4. No argument there. Just give us a quick, 5 second respawn and open up the Loadout screen as we die.

  5. I don’t think they have to be removed. Again, this is in a hypothetically split multiplayer and the weapon markers are there for players that don’t know the map. It doesn’t need to go unless multiplayer isn’t split. As long as Legendary has weapons on the map, I won’t care what Infinity has.

> I think these are terrible ideas. You say we shouldn’t let Infinity go to waste, but instead you suggest we strip it down and destroy it completely. Your Infinity would not be appealing to its target audience. If 343i actually do split the multiplayer, they should find ways to fix these issues instead of just removing features. Except for perks, which have to go…
>
> 1. I agree completely. AC has to be a power up and Jet Pack should only be in Forge and Campaign and maybe as a map placement (in very specific maps).
>
> 2. <mark>Remove the grenade choice</mark>- yes, I agree. We don’t need a grenade choice. But to remove the secondary option is just crazy. What’s the point in custom Loadouts if you only get two minimal options? We might as well return to Reach Loadouts. No, there should be a secondary option but both the Boltshot and the PP must go. Instead, the place should be filled by the SMG and the Plasma Rifle as weak automatics and possibly a <mark>new forerunner pistol that isn’t OP</mark> (or maybe a quick shotgun that is a 3sk at close range or something).
>
> 3. Ordnance should give us high level grenades (plasma, buffed pulse, bubble shield?), power ups and one low-tiered power weapon (plasma pistol, Boltshot, Needler- it would be especially great if Dual Wielding returns because it could get you a second secondary) as options. None are too overpowered, all are rewarding. Instead of giving someone on a murder streak a huge advantage, you’re giving them a small boost. If AAs are removed from Loadouts and placed on-map (which will likely only happen if 343i won’t split the multiplayer) than AAs can come through Ordnance as well.
>
> 4. No argument there. Just give us a quick, 5 second respawn and open up the Loadout screen as we die.
>
> 5. I don’t think they have to be removed. Again, this is in a hypothetically split multiplayer and the weapon markers are there for players that don’t know the map. It doesn’t need to go unless multiplayer isn’t split. As long as Legendary has weapons on the map, I won’t care what Infinity has.

Boltshot could be buffed with more powerful single fire and burst, same with the PP, and placed on-map (but would be available in their current form for casual game loadouts), and replaced with a new Forerunner Hardlight Pistol (i found it weird that the BS was the only Forerunner loadout weapon that didnt fire Hardlight), that fires bursts of Hardlight in a slow and powerful way, like a revolver carbine (haven’t had one of those in Halo before). There would also need to be a new Covenant pistol of some sort to replace the PP if its no longer in loadouts. Smaller, no overcharge version with the same damage and the ability to dump heat (for low ranking Grunts and Jackals?)

Also. Bringing back the SMG, Plasma rifle and Spiker could fill a few missing slots (the Suppressor doesn’t fit here due to its size, that thing is huge -enough laughing you dirty -Yoinks!–). The MA5K (Assault Carbine) and Plasma Repeater could also fir in here, with different characteristics to the other automatic secondaries (better range and damage on the MA5K but less ROF than the SMG, or the ability to dump heat with the Repeater). A Hardlight Carbine could also fit in here, arm mounted similar in shape to the Covenant Carbine, firing Hardlight as a continuous stream of kinetic impacts (like getting hit with a projectile sentinel beam?)

Plasma grenades i cant think of a solution to, so i won’t. Remove them or whatever everyone else wants. Dont use them, dont care. But the Pulse Grenade should stay, because its kinda useless in most standard grenade uses. What it is good for is blocking access to areas for a very brief period (although there are many ways of getting around that), and for finishing off an unshielded player .

There should also be other types of grenades available in place of the PG. Like a plasma grenade that throws out globules of plasma, that do low damage if they adhere to something, but have no magnetism and the grenade cannot actually stick anything itself. Or a Forerunner Hardlight grenade that hovers in the air and spins, spraying low powered bolts of Hardlight into an area, but the bolts dissipate outside a short radius.

And the spike grenade could return, and be able to be used in a similar manner to the PG, but not be able to stick vehicles (only the crew if they get hit directly), and have similar damage to the frag grenade but shorter radius.

> I think these are terrible ideas. You say we shouldn’t let Infinity go to waste, but instead you suggest we strip it down and destroy it completely. Your Infinity would not be appealing to its target audience. If 343i actually do split the multiplayer, they should find ways to fix these issues instead of just removing features. Except for perks, which have to go…
>
> 1. I agree completely. AC has to be a power up and Jet Pack should only be in Forge and Campaign and maybe as a map placement (in very specific maps).
>
> 2. Remove the grenade choice- yes, I agree. We don’t need a grenade choice. But to remove the secondary option is just crazy. What’s the point in custom Loadouts if you only get two minimal options? We might as well return to Reach Loadouts. No, there should be a secondary option but both the Boltshot and the PP must go. Instead, the place should be filled by the SMG and the Plasma Rifle as weak automatics and possibly a new forerunner pistol that isn’t OP (or maybe a quick shotgun that is a 3sk at close range or something).
>
> 3. Ordnance should give us high level grenades (plasma, buffed pulse, bubble shield?), power ups and one low-tiered power weapon (plasma pistol, Boltshot, Needler- it would be especially great if Dual Wielding returns because it could get you a second secondary) as options. None are too overpowered, all are rewarding. Instead of giving someone on a murder streak a huge advantage, you’re giving them a small boost. If AAs are removed from Loadouts and placed on-map (which will likely only happen if 343i won’t split the multiplayer) than AAs can come through Ordnance as well.
>
> 4. No argument there. Just give us a quick, 5 second respawn and open up the Loadout screen as we die.
>
> 5. I don’t think they have to be removed. Again, this is in a hypothetically split multiplayer and the weapon markers are there for players that don’t know the map. It doesn’t need to go unless multiplayer isn’t split. As long as Legendary has weapons on the map, I won’t care what Infinity has.

For loadouts we should choose primary weapon, armor ability, and the 2 perks. Secondary should always be magnum and the default grenade should always be frag.

I agree with this thread, I can see infinity to be more balance this way.
I hope 343 sees this post and will do just that.

Now, as you’ve stated, removing certain options from loadouts is the best way to balance them. But removing things limits our options. Without the choice of a secodary, perks, or nades. This gives us too few customizations to make personal loadouts a thing to begin with.

The reason i threw in removal of armor mods is because they really don’t add enough to Gameplay to even be relevant. None of them are really game breaking, which is good, but at this point they seem a bit unnecessary. Some of them however should be turned into custom game options such as motion tracker while scoped, unlimited sprint, and fast reload.

I’d like the Jetpack to return… But as a Vehicle.

Meaning that it will spawn on the map, and that it can be destroyed after taking enough damage.

Also, since it has become a vehicle, it can be stronger.

> 1. Active Camo and Jetpack
> 2. Plasma Grenades, Boltshots and Plasma Pistols
> 3. Ordnance
> 4. Instant Respawning
> 5. Weapon Markers

  1. Although the biggest offenders, they are not the only armor abilities intrusive on competitive gameplay. I want to see the primary weapon and armor ability sandbox completely redesigned. Even assuming they are kept, they need visual indicators to prevent guesswork.

  2. I don’t think we necessarily have to remove secondary/grenade options altogether, but these specific options need removed.

  3. Just remove it. If it only gives ammo it serves no purpose except making the game ever so slightly easier and cluttering the HUD. Pointless addition.

  4. Depends on several factors, no opinion.

  5. I have absolutely nothing against weapon markers except for the fact they give away enemy positions. Fix that, and they have no effect on the skill gap at all besides making the game easier to grasp.

> I’d like the Jetpack to return… But as a Vehicle.

I actually do like this idea, I played on a Halo Custom Edition map that had jetpacks with turrets mounted to them. Played pretty well.

However, this would be redundant if the Hornet made a return.

Same here, OP. I’ve said this quite a few times in the past, but IMO, Halo 5 should have two separate Playlists:

Infinity Settings - Basically everything you see in Halo 4
Built-In Sprint, Personal Loadouts and Ord Drops, AA’s, Tact and Sup, Instant Respawn (thats a so-so), and Assassinations

Classic Settings - Everything from Halo CE to Halo 3
No Built-In Sprint, Pre-set Loadouts, Map Ords, No AA’s, No Tact and Sup, No Instant Respawn, and No Assassinations (only Beat Downs)

That way all players can enjoy both the “past” of Halo and the “future” of Halo.

I’m one of those people who prefers Classic.

Obviously, there are people who enjoy both, but the majority enjoys Classic (Halo 4 population numbers prove it).

A popular opinion around these forums is to split Matchmaking into both Classic and Infinity Halo.

While I’d rather have Infinity wiped out completely, this seems like a good solution, and would benefit everybody.

> I’m one of those people who prefers Classic.
>
> Obviously, there are people who enjoy both, but the majority enjoys Classic (Halo 4 population numbers prove it).
>
> A popular opinion around these forums is to split Matchmaking into both Classic and Infinity Halo.
>
> While I’d rather have Infinity wiped out completely, this seems like a good solution, and would benefit everybody.

How can you acknowledge that some players like Infinity and then say Infinity being scrapped completely would benefit everyone? If we had both classic and Infinity gametypes, I’d happily switch between both if 343 fixes the issues.

> > I’m one of those people who prefers Classic.
> >
> > Obviously, there are people who enjoy both, but the majority enjoys Classic (Halo 4 population numbers prove it).
> >
> > A popular opinion around these forums is to split Matchmaking into both Classic and Infinity Halo.
> >
> > While I’d rather have Infinity wiped out completely, this seems like a good solution, and would benefit everybody.
>
> How can you acknowledge that some players like Infinity and then say Infinity being scrapped completely would benefit everyone? If we had both classic and Infinity gametypes, I’d happily switch between both if 343 fixes the issues.

I’m pretty sure he was saying my solution would benefit everyone, also to clarify I think there should be classic options available also

agree on active camo being a powerup, and jetpack being gone except in campaign/spartan ops. ordanance markers should only be for power weapon spawns. Ordanance should NOT include power weapons or nades, and should be harder to get.

instant respawn is not great. let us just watch the killcams.

> > > I’m one of those people who prefers Classic.
> > >
> > > Obviously, there are people who enjoy both, but the majority enjoys Classic (Halo 4 population numbers prove it).
> > >
> > > A popular opinion around these forums is to split Matchmaking into both Classic and Infinity Halo.
> > >
> > > While I’d rather have Infinity wiped out completely, this seems like a good solution, and would benefit everybody.
> >
> > How can you acknowledge that some players like Infinity and then say Infinity being scrapped completely would benefit everyone? If we had both classic and Infinity gametypes, I’d happily switch between both if 343 fixes the issues.
>
> I’m pretty sure he was saying my solution would benefit everyone, also to clarify I think there should be classic options available also

Ooooooooooh. Okay, that makes more sense.