Mangler’s OP. The melee buff makes it worse than the shotgun at close range, thankfully. But at range?
Y’all haven’t seen how to use it properly. 2 Mangler shots + BR is right now, the fastest non Tier 3 kill in the game.
If that’s the most effective way to us it then why are people complaining about the melee? Why does this even matter?
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Because casuals don’t know how to actually use it. As a bludgeon is what you do when someone’s gotten close to you. You don’t run around with a 3-shot gun and use it as a cudgel.
Most casual players don’t even know how to 4-shot, Derk.
The melee IS however, overpowered. In a competitive sense, the mangler nerf DOES help, but that it’s at a Tier I spot still, means the problem of 3 existing on a map at any given time, high ammo reserves, etc., means it remains dominant at high skill play. Frankly, this nerf was made to protect lower skill players.
Not somebody like my friend @Liquid_Execute .
It is the most frequent issue the broadest spectrum of players face. The competitive players are not actually getting their way, how casuals think they are.
It still needs to be Tier 2, or off maps, even with this adjustment. It is too good.
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The global melee nerf makes more weapons LESS effective against the Mangler because melee cannot trade as effectively. Mangler needs to stay the same, buff the other weapons and severly reduce Mangler spawns to make it a power weapon as it rightfully is!
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You’re joking.
Nothing could trade with the mangler anyway.
Like, melee weapons like the sword and hammer sure.
But literally every weapon is being debuffed 10%. Are you sure you understand this?
It has to get nerfed!!! It is unfair for someone to be close to me and punish me with ease while I have to perfect him to get 25% the TTK. SMH clearly this is the only 1 shot melee wpn and nothing else would be replaced for that situation at all!!!
I get the angle but what makes The Mangler so bad is that it spawns in more than one spot and has serious midrange reach, where the other weapons you’re implying don’t have that at all.
Which is why they just need to adjust it’s weapon tier and make it less common on maps. It doesn’t have to be made useless in CQC to fix it. There are other ways to fix this. That’s what many of us have been saying all along.
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You realize that the mangler kills faster with a swap than any other normal gun, right?
That’s half the reason it’s broken.
It’s not useless in CQC.
Almost nobody here knows that.
Yes let’s decrease melee so the Mangler is just used to do the job of the plasma pistol. Prime the enemy for a headshot.
Honestly not the same, it’s harder than a plasma pistol and far more skill based. Thing is, it’s understood that it’s OP as it exists in competitive right now, too. Very few think it’s a good thing.
But it’s better for the Mangler to do ONE job than EVERY job. Dig?
I understand what you’re saying. You’re looking at it purely from a competitive point of view. I’m looking at it from an overall sandbox and purpose standpoint. It’s an alien revolver that fires shotgun slug rounds and has knife blades attached to the front for extra melee damage. It’s meant to be a CQC weapon that’s used in very close range. Nerfing it so that the most effective way to use it is to fire a few shots and swap makes absolutely no sense. It should be considered the power weapon it should be. It effectively is a shotgun, it just fire slugs instead of pellets. Which basically gives us 3 shotguns currently. Each with their own unique range effects and utility.
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Gameplay > Fluff, every time.
Sorry to say it, but when you’re developing a game that is meant to be competitive/have a competitive sandbox, how much sense something makes in lore takes a huge backseat to the performance. If we valued lore, plasma would be blowing off limbs once shields were down and would be strictly the best weapon type in the game and brute weapons would be pinning people to walls or melting them while they were still alive.
Besides.
With every gun at a 10% decrease, the Mangler still has a stronger melee than any other non bayoneted weapon.
The unsc has been fighting the covenant for so long that all the vehicles and armor they use is plated with a special heat and energy dispersing coating. Shields are helpful for keeping the armor of a Spartan from taking heavy damage quickly. The auto repair system then gets to work to fix any damage taken while shields were down.
I do agree with the brute weapons burning and pinning. I think the reason they don’t do that is because of the rating system.
It’s frankly because there’s nowhere in the sandbox to justify that system.
Point is, game balance is always more important than the lore.
There is no need to nerf any weapon or their melee.
There is a need to buff other weapons.
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Both are equally important. It’s makes no sense for a weapon to be designed and function a specific way, but do nowhere near the damage it should. Would it make sense for the needler to require two supercombines to kill if people consider it to strong killing in one?
I hate to say it, but in the Mangler’s case, firm disagreement and honestly, the only weapons that need buffs are…
Commando
Ravagar
Plasma Pistol
Plasma Carbine
That’s all the buffs. The Rocket Launcher needs more consistent AoE but I think that’s a desync issue tbh and the AR is… a little too strong. Again, what I’d do to it is as follows.
Damage Buff.
Maximum Spread decrease.
Minimum spread increase.
Headshot damage removal.
Rate of Fire reduction
Magazine Reduction.
Chunkier, consistent, more close range intended. Not able to compete with BRs or The Commando at long range but outperforms both in close range, like it should. It’s already a shredder but the whole… headshot thing makes it like, inconsistent. I don’t like it… and it’s definitely too damn powerful for a starting weapon.
Well no because that isn’t the needler’s design philosphy. It does what it does and nothing else. Unless you have overshields, then it probably does require two.
But no, lore is not as important as game balance. Never has been, never will be.
Anyone who’s ever played Lore Mods for any game can tell you how awful that can be. One case is Star Wars: Empire At War. Great balancing for the units on that game, but “Lore Accurate” mods get… really awful for balancing and incredibly spammy since no single thing has any notable use. It sucks.
If you want lore Halo, read the books or watch the TV show. That’s what you’re asking for in terms of game balance and let me tell you, you’d hate playing that.
Tell me, do you think the original shotgun should be able to kill in one shot at close range?