Define Simpler Stories...

Community Halo Universe
1

To 343i,
The statement made by Ms. Bonnie Ross promising the permanent return of split screen was warmly welcomed to put it mildly. However, the additional statement about future Halo games having “simpler stories” had drawn significant concern over the future of the Halo storyline.

By “simpler stories,” does 343 simply intend to write the stories for future Halo games in such a way that players will not need to be familiar with the EU in order to understand what’s going on, or does the company actually intend to discontinue their efforts to creative a deep, emotional, and character-driven storyline in favor of a more action-focus storyline?
This is a point of concern for many fans who are invested in Halo’s lore because we do not want the deeper aspects of Halo’s story to be limited to the extended media. We DO want the game stories to be accessible, but that doesn’t mean the story needs to be overly simplified.
The problem with Halo 5’s campaign was not that it told too much story, it because the story was disorganized and did not meet its full potential by failing to build upon the character development that made Halo 4’s camoaign so great.
Finally, on a personal level, I don’t want Chief’s journey as a character and as a person to cast to the side. Can the lore community be assured that "simpler stories do not equate to a decrease in quality of characters and overall story telling?
Sincerely,

A fellow Halo fan.

2

They mean “simpler” as in the way Halo 2, Halo 3, and Rogue One were simple.

3

> 2533274904397463;2:
> They mean “simpler” as in the way Halo 2, Halo 3, and Rogue One were simple.

Less emphasis on the external lore, once again forcing those of us who actually go out of our way to enjoy it to suffer.

4

> 2533274907200114;3:
> > 2533274904397463;2:
> > They mean “simpler” as in the way Halo 2, Halo 3, and Rogue One were simple.
>
> Less emphasis on the external lore, once again forcing those of us who actually go out of our way to enjoy it to suffer.

I’m not a fan of the change but I can see it’ll be better for the community as a whole. Also, if you haven’t read Grim’s whole statement yet you should

5

> 2533274904397463;4:
> > 2533274907200114;3:
> > > 2533274904397463;2:
> > > They mean “simpler” as in the way Halo 2, Halo 3, and Rogue One were simple.
> >
> > Less emphasis on the external lore, once again forcing those of us who actually go out of our way to enjoy it to suffer.
>
> I’m not a fan of the change but I can see it’ll be better for the community as a whole. Also, if you haven’t read Grim’s whole statement yet you should

Wait, which statement? Can you post the link?

6

> 2533274907200114;3:
> > 2533274904397463;2:
> > They mean “simpler” as in the way Halo 2, Halo 3, and Rogue One were simple.
>
> Less emphasis on the external lore, once again forcing those of us who actually go out of our way to enjoy it to suffer.

Not necessarily so. Halo C.E. thru 3 had plenty of ties to extended lore but still told self contained stories that didn’t require reading the books to enjoy. The great Schism was almost entirely told thru Halo 2 and O.D.S.T. before being fleshed out in extended canon. I think that “simpler” just means more straight forward story telling , with nods to the EU but not a full on connected story. Many of the early books (unless trying to tell a more detailed emotional account of events) were not directly tied to events happening in the games. The flood is the only real exception I can think of as it retold the story of C.E. , but most of the early books were about events that led to Halo C.E. or other events in the universe not tied to the games.
The Forerunner saga and Halo 4 tried to integrate both mediums and set us on the current path of disjointed story telling. Keep the games and the books telling different stories that compliment one another not telling half of the same story in two different mediums.

7

> 2533274847627340;6:
> > 2533274907200114;3:
> > > 2533274904397463;2:
> > > They mean “simpler” as in the way Halo 2, Halo 3, and Rogue One were simple.
> >
> > Less emphasis on the external lore, once again forcing those of us who actually go out of our way to enjoy it to suffer.
>
> Not necessarily so. Halo C.E. thru 3 had plenty of ties to extended lore but still told self contained stories that didn’t require reading the books to enjoy. The great Schism was almost entirely told thru Halo 2 and O.D.S.T. before being fleshed out in extended canon. I think that “simpler” just means more straight forward story telling , with nods to the EU but not a full on connected story. Many of the early books (unless trying to tell a more detailed emotional account of events) were not directly tied to events happening in the games. The flood is the only real exception I can think of as it retold the story of C.E. , but most of the early books were about events that led to Halo C.E. or other events in the universe not tied to the games.
> The Forerunner saga and Halo 4 tried to integrate both mediums and set us on the current path of disjointed story telling. Keep the games and the books telling different stories that compliment one another not telling half of the same story in two different mediums.

If this is the case, then maybe it won’t be so bad. I just don’t want 343 to disregard proper character development in future games, especially when it comes to Chief.
That said, HW 2’s story was decent, so maybe all is not lost.

8

They used Halo Wars 2 as an example of the new simple story format so I would expect something similar going forward.

9

> 2533274904397463;2:
> They mean “simpler” as in the way Halo 2, Halo 3, and Rogue One were simple.

This is the correct answer.

They do not mean simple as in a dumbed-down story that even a child can easily understand. They mean simple in regards to not having to rely on outside sources (novels, comics, etc.) to get a full grasp on the story they are trying to tell.

This is a good thing.

> If this is the case, then maybe it won’t be so bad. I just don’t want 343 to disregard proper character development in future games, especially when it comes to Chief.
> That said, HW 2’s story was decent, so maybe all is not lost.

I am on mobile, so pardon the formatting. No one wants them to disregard proper character development, I believe they know that. Any writer worth their salt should know that, no matter what the franchise.

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> 2533274900686411;5:
> > 2533274904397463;4:
> > > 2533274907200114;3:
> > > > 2533274904397463;2:
> > > > They mean “simpler” as in the way Halo 2, Halo 3, and Rogue One were simple.
> > >
> > > Less emphasis on the external lore, once again forcing those of us who actually go out of our way to enjoy it to suffer.
> >
> > I’m not a fan of the change but I can see it’ll be better for the community as a whole. Also, if you haven’t read Grim’s whole statement yet you should
>
> Wait, which statement? Can you post the link?

I honestly can’t remember where I saw it. My bad. Hopefully you can still find it

11

Doesn’t matter what anyone from 343i says anyway. They’ve lied or played lip-service to lore fans plenty of times now. So there’s no way to really tell what they intend to do with the story in the future until the next game actually comes out.

12

I saw someone on here say Halo Wars 2’s story was so simple it would order a pumpkin spice latte at Starbucks. Gave me a good laugh, but I really can’t disagree … Halo Wars 2, from my experience, didn’t have an engaging story. Make no mistake, the story worked, but I was only drawn-in during a few individual moments rather than by the story as a whole. Halo 4, in contrast, had my full attention throughout the entirety of the campaign; every loading screen left me breathlessly awaiting what would happen next.

Now, I do not believe simplicity necessarily leads to a story that sends you snapchats sporting the notorious dog filter. I just hope they don’t use Halo Wars 2 as a business model for storytelling.

13

> 2533274900686411;1:
> To 343i,
> The statement made by Ms. Bonnie Ross promising the permanent return of split screen was warmly welcomed to put it mildly. However, the additional statement about future Halo games having “simpler stories” had drawn significant concern over the future of the Halo storyline.
>
> By “simpler stories,” does 343 simply intend to write the stories for future Halo games in such a way that players will not need to be familiar with the EU in order to understand what’s going on, or does the company actually intend to discontinue their efforts to creative a deep, emotional, and character-driven storyline in favor of a more action-focus storyline?
> This is a point of concern for many fans who are invested in Halo’s lore because we do not want the deeper aspects of Halo’s story to be limited to the extended media. We DO want the game stories to be accessible, but that doesn’t mean the story needs to be overly simplified.
> The problem with Halo 5’s campaign was not that it told too much story, it because the story was disorganized and did not meet its full potential by failing to build upon the character development that made Halo 4’s camoaign so great.
> Finally, on a personal level, I don’t want Chief’s journey as a character and as a person to cast to the side. Can the lore community be assured that "simpler stories do not equate to a decrease in quality of characters and overall story telling?
> Sincerely,
>
> A fellow Halo fan.

Well they said that they consider HW2 to be an example of how they want to tell this sort of story; so a lot depends on your view of that game.

Personally I felt it never rose above “kill these Brutes” and didn’t explain key information like how we got there and what Atriox was up to.

I think 343 are trying to latch onto some sort of narrative where they can say “we’ve listened and we’re going to take on board what people have said” without admitting any failure on their part. So they probably are perfectly aware of Halo 5 being accused of being disorganized, Chief vs Locke fiasco and the break with Halo 4. But Bonnie Ross is not going to get up and say “yeah we screwed up”. In private they may very well, it could be the red wedding in that company for all we know.

So they have latched onto this criticism of Halo 5 having too much EU lore in and said “yep, we’ll do that”.

Now, in practice I do have to question that. For one thing, you have to have played all the FPS Halo titles to understand whats going on; which is why things like the Halo rings aren’t explained to the Spirits crew because its assumed knowledge. Plus a lot of the Saturday morning dialogue and action hero Spartans we saw in Halo 5 are perfectly present. Fighting the Banished was very shallow and not well explained but then neither was the Arbiters war with the Covenant. The only difference is that one war came from the EU whereas the other was brand new. Also, if Halo 5 had managed to get better dialogue and cinematics it probably would have sold a lot of the character stuff a lot better. I mean Isabel and Cutter are amazingly presented but they are very much 1D characters like in Halo 5. Isabel wants revenge on the Brutes who killed her people. Cutter is basically Nelson. You have a corny villain in Decimus like with the Warden.

Basically what I am trying to say is that this statement by Bonny Ross feels like spin. I don’t think they have actually changed their style of story telling, how could they if the game started development in 2014 before H5 was released? I just think they’re trying to find a way of saying they will improve the campaign without looking like fools.

Plus IMO the EU had nothing to do with Halo 5 and I never got the argument you needed to read it to understand. For example they say “We’re going to Sanghelios” and Laskey immediately says “Theres a Guardian on the elite homeworld” in case people don’t know where that is. Plus they do talk about the Arbiters war with the Covenant a lot in game and its reasonable to assume its for the same reasons we saw in Halo 2 and 3.

14

> 2533274920039666;11:
> Doesn’t matter what anyone from 343i says anyway. They’ve lied or played lip-service to lore fans plenty of times now. So there’s no way to really tell what they intend to do with the story in the future until the next game actually comes out.

You’re still spewing that nonsense? My god give it a rest.

As long as they use Halo 2 as the model and not Halo Wars 2 or Halo 3, I’ll be fine. I don’t need anymore stories like those two.

15

If Halo Wars 2 is the example of “simpler storytelling” then this is not a good thing. Halo Wars 2 as a story it worked, but the characters are one dimensional, the villains are not well explained, they are just evil. It is basically the same good vs evil and the only theme exploited is the same from the first trilogy: War. In other words Halo Wars 2 commits the same flaws of Halo 5, but in a non destructive way.
And I never understood the people who claimed Halo 5 uses EU too much. It is just bad and if you read everything from external media it won’t make Halo 5 any better.

Honestly I hope 343 knows what they are going to do, because after Halo 4, every story 343 tell that has character development and themes below Halo 4’s level is a dumped down story imo.
They need to explore a different theme than just war. It needs to be Halo 4/ Uncharted calibre. If you want to make a relevant story today using the same storytelling from the first game, then you are lazy or it will be just another forgettable story.

16

> 2533274883849234;14:
> > 2533274920039666;11:
> > Doesn’t matter what anyone from 343i says anyway. They’ve lied or played lip-service to lore fans plenty of times now. So there’s no way to really tell what they intend to do with the story in the future until the next game actually comes out.
>
> You’re still spewing that nonsense? My god give it a rest.
>
> As long as they use Halo 2 as the model and not Halo Wars 2 or Halo 3, I’ll be fine. I don’t need anymore stories like those two.

I say it because it’s true. We have no idea what 343i is actually going to do until they put something of actual substance out.

17

> 2533274883849234;14:
> > 2533274920039666;11:
> > Doesn’t matter what anyone from 343i says anyway. They’ve lied or played lip-service to lore fans plenty of times now. So there’s no way to really tell what they intend to do with the story in the future until the next game actually comes out.
>
> You’re still spewing that nonsense? My god give it a rest.
>
> As long as they use Halo 2 as the model and not Halo Wars 2 or Halo 3, I’ll be fine. I don’t need anymore stories like those two.

Well, considering how 90% of what 343 said about Halo 5’s story prior to launch was misinformation, it’s not too unreasonable to take these statements with a grain of salt.

18

> 2533274876631466;17:
> > 2533274883849234;14:
> > > 2533274920039666;11:
> > > Doesn’t matter what anyone from 343i says anyway. They’ve lied or played lip-service to lore fans plenty of times now. So there’s no way to really tell what they intend to do with the story in the future until the next game actually comes out.
> >
> > You’re still spewing that nonsense? My god give it a rest.
> >
> > As long as they use Halo 2 as the model and not Halo Wars 2 or Halo 3, I’ll be fine. I don’t need anymore stories like those two.
>
> Well, considering how 90% of what 343 said about Halo 5’s story prior to launch was misinformation, it’s not too unreasonable to take these statements with a grain of salt.

Keep in mind people are using this -Yoink- to create an excuse to bring Noble Six and other dead characters back because suddenly ‘343i’s word on character death’s isn’t final because they said Cortana was dead yet showed up in Halo 5 alive and insane’

No, that’s not how this works.

19

> 2533274883849234;18:
> > 2533274876631466;17:
> > > 2533274883849234;14:
> > > > 2533274920039666;11:
> > > > Doesn’t matter what anyone from 343i says anyway. They’ve lied or played lip-service to lore fans plenty of times now. So there’s no way to really tell what they intend to do with the story in the future until the next game actually comes out.
> > >
> > > You’re still spewing that nonsense? My god give it a rest.
> > >
> > > As long as they use Halo 2 as the model and not Halo Wars 2 or Halo 3, I’ll be fine. I don’t need anymore stories like those two.
> >
> > Well, considering how 90% of what 343 said about Halo 5’s story prior to launch was misinformation, it’s not too unreasonable to take these statements with a grain of salt.
>
> Keep in mind people are using this -Yoink- to create an excuse to bring Noble Six and other dead characters back because suddenly ‘343i’s word on character death’s isn’t final because they said Cortana was dead yet showed up in Halo 5 alive and insane’
>
> No, that’s not how this works.

Be mad at 343i for lying in the first place then when they literally had no reason to do so, and thus making everything they say inherently untrustworthy until proven otherwise. You can choose to continue to believe any statement they put out with nothing else to go on if you want, but you can’t rail on other people for (justifiably) not doing the same.

20

> 2533274900686411;1:
> To 343i,
> The statement made by Ms. Bonnie Ross promising the permanent return of split screen was warmly welcomed to put it mildly. However, the additional statement about future Halo games having “simpler stories” had drawn significant concern over the future of the Halo storyline.
>
> By “simpler stories,” does 343 simply intend to write the stories for future Halo games in such a way that players will not need to be familiar with the EU in order to understand what’s going on, or does the company actually intend to discontinue their efforts to creative a deep, emotional, and character-driven storyline in favor of a more action-focus storyline?
> This is a point of concern for many fans who are invested in Halo’s lore because we do not want the deeper aspects of Halo’s story to be limited to the extended media. We DO want the game stories to be accessible, but that doesn’t mean the story needs to be overly simplified.
> The problem with Halo 5’s campaign was not that it told too much story, it because the story was disorganized and did not meet its full potential by failing to build upon the character development that made Halo 4’s camoaign so great.
> Finally, on a personal level, I don’t want Chief’s journey as a character and as a person to cast to the side. Can the lore community be assured that "simpler stories do not equate to a decrease in quality of characters and overall story telling?
> Sincerely,
>
> A fellow Halo fan.

See Halo Wars 2 for example all you need to know about “simple”