I would just like to say that Halo 4 would be A LOT better if all playlists had CSR (that was in game) that were Win/Loss rather than based off individual scoring. Individual scoring CSR encourages players to just rush in over and over creating very messy gameplay where no one cares if they go -10 as long as they top the leader-board. Win-Loss encourages players to team up with each other, communicate and support each other creating a much more competitive experience. To be honest I don’t understand the logic behind implementing individual CSR into a playlist as it rewards aggressive play rather than smart play. I don’t see how they couldn’t implement CSR into the lobby either as spartan rank is a pointless number that is no indication of skill, just replace the spartan rank with the individual’s win/loss based CSR in the lobby. Halo 4 would be so much better if this happened.
I think a better solution would be to have a system that deducts from the CSR for deaths.
This encourages camping too much and still doesn’t support team play as you are still competing against your team mates, where you are not only trying to beat the other team, but trying to beat each other as well. This is not how a team game is meant to be played as you are meant to be fighting for the greater good of the team, fighting to WIN… not to be top of the leader board.
I like playing to win in team scoring as it encourages team play but I do think there are some semi competitive playlists that require individual scoring. Like Rumble Pit for example.
Still think both should be displayed on waypoint. We should be able to see our Team CSR and Individual CSR for every playlist.
That would give more information about how skilled and what kind of skill you employ.
It would be nice to see both ranking systems at the same time. If you care more about Wins, look at your Team CSR. If you play with the same team long enough you guys might have the same Team CSR but you will be able to tell eachother apart by your Individual Rank. And this doesnt get in the way of Casual players because the can view their Individual Rank for every playlist, not just the ones playlists that are considered “social”
Besides, how freaking awesome would it be to reach a double 50? Must be nearly impossible to get a Team 50 and Individual 50 at the same time. Now there would be a challenge for them MLG types
> Still think both should be displayed on waypoint. We should be able to see our Team CSR and Individual CSR for every playlist.
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> That would give more information about how skilled and what kind of skill you employ.
>
> It would be nice to see both ranking systems at the same time. If you care more about Wins, look at your Team CSR. If you play with the same team long enough you guys might have the same Team CSR but you will be able to tell eachother apart by your Individual Rank. And this doesnt get in the way of Casual players because the can view their Individual Rank for every playlist, not just the ones playlists that are considered “social”
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> Besides, how freaking awesome would it be to reach a double 50? Must be nearly impossible to get a Team 50 and Individual 50 at the same time. <mark>Now there would be a challenge for them MLG types[</mark>/quote]
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> I think Ninja PGL (former MLG player) has like 9 Halo 4 50s so far…
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> Edit: Sorry, he has 8, plus one 43 and a 27.
> I think a better solution would be to have a system that deducts from the CSR for deaths.
Agreed, I hate it when I get one of the best K/D’s in BTIS/BTS but I know I still won’t do as good as the guy above me who barley scraped +1.
Deaths matter in slayer.
I personally don’t think skill-based ranking should be based purely on winning or individual score. While Halo 3’s ranks were vastly superior to CSR, there were flaws. You shouldn’t be at risk for losing skill if you’re clearly doing the best in the game but have crap teammates. I know people will just say “Search with parties”, but I don’t think most people are willing to wait for full teams to play.
There needs to be a balance between how much you win and how well you perform. You win a lot of your games but are consistently the lowest scorer? In a purely win-based system, you would basically get a high rank because you were carried there.
And to everyone who says deaths should be a factor, consider how much boosting that could entail.
> Still think both should be displayed on waypoint. We should be able to see our Team CSR and Individual CSR for every playlist.
>
> That would give more information about how skilled and what kind of skill you employ.
>
> It would be nice to see both ranking systems at the same time. If you care more about Wins, look at your Team CSR. If you play with the same team long enough you guys might have the same Team CSR but you will be able to tell eachother apart by your Individual Rank. And this doesnt get in the way of Casual players because the can view their Individual Rank for every playlist, not just the ones playlists that are considered “social”
>
> Besides, how freaking awesome would it be to reach a double 50? Must be nearly impossible to get a Team 50 and Individual 50 at the same time. Now there would be a challenge for them MLG types
I love this idea, but sadly I don’t think it would work. How would matchmaking work? Would it match players based on Team-CSR or Individual-CSR?
As a player who goes in as a random more often than not, Team-based CSR for all playlists would be very discouraging. I understand why some people prefer it as winning is the ultimate goal. Consistent winning requires a coordinated team, which is something not everybody has. I personally find matches to be much more even in playlists where individual CSR is utilized.
Individual CSR is a good concept but I think it should be altered in a way which more accurately measures your individual contribution to helping your team win. For example a cross-map grenade kill (20 pts) does not help your team any more than a short range AR kill (10 pts).
Basing solely on win/loss punishes players that are matched with randoms and people that don’t play in parties. Often times I’ve had matches where one player on the enemy team outdoes everyone else in the game, but my team wins. A win/loss system would unfairly punish that player on the other team when he’s really the best player in the game, it’s just his teammates that sucked.
It should be, but it won’t.
CSR Win/Loss playlists should be slightly easier to rank up in, it takes way too long atm.
But individual scoring CSR would work if for every death say -5 points was taken off, it’d quickly show who the better players were, taking into account K/d as well!
Some interesting ideas are in the CSR feedback section
https://forums.halowaypoint.com/yaf_postst203901p7_CSR-Feedback.aspx
> I think a better solution would be to have a system that deducts from the CSR for deaths.
This is even better.
I really think the CSR system is broken for individual based ranks. Currently the CSR depends on Individual score but people can still join a mid-game session in progress to only find a match where people already have 15 kills, and rank down for not being in top placements.
I have experienced countless matches where I have been the 2nd best player on the winning team and the 3rd best player overall in the match, won the game, had the highest KD ratio and still ranked down for that match. This shows that 343 industries simply claims those who are the most aggressive are more likely to attain a 50.
Not only has 343 ruined the ranking systems, but this is a clear cut example of exploiting their customers. As an avid halo player I don’t want to be thrown into some garbage ranking system that lures and forces users to have an addiction to rank up in a flawed system that only makes people frustrated and ranks people down because of the programming and mathematical incompetence at 343 Industries.
I go to college at Purdue University and am honestly appalled by the thought some programmer thought this CSR rank system is what the halo community wanted. What happened to Halo? What happened to teamwork in slayer?
Honestly that’s the biggest problem, 343 has single handedly ruined teamwork. People cannot even play slayer games with their friends without feeling a slight competition against them. This only creates conflict between friends, vs having friends play together to defeat their foes. Most teammates don’t call out in the higher 40 + ranks due to the fact everyone is competing vs everyone.
At the same time many players that are excellent communicators and call out are now punished because their communication skills only benefits others to get more points over them.
As a dignified player and member, I dont want to just bash 343 and point out the problems. So here is a solution that compromises both 343s style and the original halo crowd.
If you want to have individual ranking system, then that is fine, provided that people do not rank down for winning games. The weakest player in the winning team can either keep stagnant at his/her rank or rank up very slowly compared to the best player of the winning team. Likewise have the best player of the losing team also not rank down while the worst player in the losing team ranks down quicker than the other losing players.
Sure this still promotes competition among all 8 players but still does not punish players and thier CSR if their teammates do better than them while also winning games.
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The addiction part cracked me up. Don’t like it? Don’t worry about it. Its not even in game.
The system is clearly flawed. I would prefer to see a system that rewards performance as opposed to recklessness. Win/loss determines what direction you move. Individual performance (taking into account deaths) would determine how far. That way helping your team win is always prioritized, but you don’t unduly penalized for a good effort with poor teammates. Consistently contributing to giving your team an opportunity to win would be rewarded.