All 4 programs of the Spartans have had genetic augmentations done to them (duh). My question is, if any Spartan bore a child, would they posses some of their parents augmentations? Of course not to the extent of the Spartans themselves, but maybe a little more strength than usual, speed, ect? I know IIs have reduced -Yoink!- drive, I’m just speaking hypothetically.
If the genetic augmentations were heritable, I don’t think ONI would allow it. Why would you allow the skills of Spartans to be inherited by offspring that may not enter the military and reproduce with regular people, resulting in admixture? It would be a catastrophic if something like that wasn’t controlled. Imagine if the Insurrectionists recruited people with those skills. ONI already has enough of a problem with Spartan-IVs defecting to the Insurrection.
I do think it’s humanity’s destiny to one day become as powerful as Spartans, as Halsey and the Librarian seem to imply. But ONI wouldn’t allow anything like that to occur in modern times. I think that explains why Spartans have their augmentations reversed in the odd event that they retire. The same happened for Randall.
By the way, the “reduced -Yoink!- drive” of Spartan-IIs was only listed as a possible risk.
There were spartan I.I’s mentioned in the halo 2 promotional stuff I think, but beyond that, we’ve heard nothing.
I don’t really see it positively working though. I’m not really sure how many of them actually effect genes, I mean they aren’t splicing them with stuff, they just shoot them full of stuff or add extra little palet things. Even then, many of the risks of the augmentations in the first place would probably have some really negative ramifications on a baby’s development, especially without presumably getting the full package.
All generations require careful procedures to avoid negative side effects, I don’t see how the human body could just mimic that and produce it naturally.
I remember in Mortal Dictata Naomi saying that she was sterile along with the rest of the Spartan IIs, so passing along their abilities is impossible but I guess it might be possible for the IVs as I don’t know if they are sterile or not.
> 2533274886377917;4:
> I remember in Mortal Dictata Naomi saying that she was sterile along with the rest of the Spartan IIs, so passing along their abilities is impossible but I guess it might be possible for the IVs as I don’t know if they are sterile or not.
Which is kinda wierd. I think it was just her though. Look at Maria-062, she left to start a family and have a life.
I’m thinking Travis saw that the Spartan-IIIs were sterile and decided to put it to the IIs as well, without knowing it could be wrong.
> 2533274837720524;5:
> > 2533274886377917;4:
> > I remember in Mortal Dictata Naomi saying that she was sterile along with the rest of the Spartan IIs, so passing along their abilities is impossible but I guess it might be possible for the IVs as I don’t know if they are sterile or not.
>
>
> Which is kinda wierd. I think it was just her though. Look at Maria-062, she left to start a family and have a life.
>
> I’m thinking Travis saw that the Spartan-IIIs were sterile and decided to put it to the IIs as well, without knowing it could be wrong.
Aye it is possible. So much is in this universe now it is hard to keep track of what is the accepted canon and what isn’t.
> 2533274964189700;3:
> There were spartan I.I’s mentioned in the halo 2 promotional stuff I think, but beyond that, we’ve heard nothing.
>
> I don’t really see it positively working though. I’m not really sure how many of them actually effect genes, I mean they aren’t splicing them with stuff, they just shoot them full of stuff or add extra little palet things. Even then, many of the risks of the augmentations in the first place would probably have some really negative ramifications on a baby’s development, especially without presumably getting the full package.
>
> All generations require careful procedures to avoid negative side effects, I don’t see how the human body could just mimic that and produce it naturally.
Im not too sure if the Spartan 1.1s were born with their enchancements because a cop mentions to one of them, “Sometime when you were a baby, somebody stuck you with a needle and shot you full of miracles”, However its possible this injection could of been some sort of booster shot to prevent negative side effect of being the child of Spartan 1s. I gucess we’ll never know unless 343i gives us more info about the Spartan 1.1s, as for now everything from i love bees is in this weird canon limbo.
> 2533274886377917;6:
> > 2533274837720524;5:
> > > 2533274886377917;4:
> > > I remember in Mortal Dictata Naomi saying that she was sterile along with the rest of the Spartan IIs, so passing along their abilities is impossible but I guess it might be possible for the IVs as I don’t know if they are sterile or not.
> >
> >
> > Which is kinda wierd. I think it was just her though. Look at Maria-062, she left to start a family and have a life.
> >
> > I’m thinking Travis saw that the Spartan-IIIs were sterile and decided to put it to the IIs as well, without knowing it could be wrong.
>
>
> Aye it is possible. So much is in this universe now it is hard to keep track of what is the accepted canon and what isn’t.
I think being sterile was a Risk. But a low one. For Randall had a daughter and Maria left to start a family. But was in the Reserves (which means when the Covenant attacked Earth, she was totally recalled, ruining any hope of having a family for a while)
But I don’t even remember reading the S-IIs or IIIs were Sterile. I’ll look into. I can see birth control Meds bring thrown into their rotation of shots they regularly took. For you have to know that several spartans would start some for of sexual relationship with each other like Black team. ( Adrenaline is a hell of a intoxicant.)
And with 300 hundred boys and girls who were hitting puberty in each class of Spartan-III’s. You have to know some if not a lot of them were having a last minute fling right before they went on their suicide ops for they knew deep down it would be the only chance they got.
Short answer no. they Augmentations don’t actually alter DNA and are therefor not hereditary.
> 2533274886377917;4:
> I remember in Mortal Dictata Naomi saying that she was sterile along with the rest of the Spartan IIs, so passing along their abilities is impossible but I guess it might be possible for the IVs as I don’t know if they are sterile or not.
not sterile. Lowed/loss of -Yoink!- drive was a possible side effect.
> 2533274803137071;8:
> > 2533274886377917;6:
> > > 2533274837720524;5:
> > > > 2533274886377917;4:
> > > > I remember in Mortal Dictata Naomi saying that she was sterile along with the rest of the Spartan IIs, so passing along their abilities is impossible but I guess it might be possible for the IVs as I don’t know if they are sterile or not.
> > >
> > >
> > > Which is kinda wierd. I think it was just her though. Look at Maria-062, she left to start a family and have a life.
> > >
> > > I’m thinking Travis saw that the Spartan-IIIs were sterile and decided to put it to the IIs as well, without knowing it could be wrong.
> >
> >
> > Aye it is possible. So much is in this universe now it is hard to keep track of what is the accepted canon and what isn’t.
>
>
> I think being sterile was a Risk. But a low one. For Randall had a daughter and Maria left to start a family. But was in the Reserves (which means when the Covenant attacked Earth, she was totally recalled, ruining any hope of having a family for a while)
>
> But I don’t even remember reading the S-IIs or IIIs were Sterile. I’ll look into. I can see birth control Meds bring thrown into their rotation of shots they regularly took. For you have to know that several spartans would start some for of sexual relationship with each other like Black team. ( Adrenaline is a hell of a intoxicant.)
>
> And with 300 hundred boys and girls who were hitting puberty in each class of Spartan-III’s. You have to know some if not a lot of them were having a last minute fling right before they went on their suicide ops for they knew deep down it would be the only chance they got.
I’m pretty sure it said something about thwm being sterile in either Ghosts of Onyx or Glasslands. I’m most likely wrong here, but I think I remember a conversation with Halsey happening at the time it was stated.
> 2533274844984484;9:
> Short answer no. they Augmentations don’t actually alter DNA and are therefor not hereditary.
>
>
>
>
> > 2533274886377917;4:
> > I remember in Mortal Dictata Naomi saying that she was sterile along with the rest of the Spartan IIs, so passing along their abilities is impossible but I guess it might be possible for the IVs as I don’t know if they are sterile or not.
>
>
> not sterile. Lowed/loss of -Yoink!- drive was a possible side effect.
JOTLORD is correct on both counts. The augmentation procedures are surgical, and in the case of the S-IIIs/S-IVs, chemical as well. These procedures altered their physiology, but not their actual DNA. Therefore any child of any Spartan would be completely unaffected. Though they might inherit their parents’ genetic predisposition for being smarter/faster/stronger than the “average” person (especially in regards to the Spartan-IIs). Also a lowered -Yoink!- drive was a risk associated with the catalytic thyroid implant the S-IIs received to boost their production of HGH, but this was a potential side effect only and we don’t know how many were effected by this - but either way it is not sterility.
> 2533274886377917;4:
> I remember in Mortal Dictata Naomi saying that she was sterile along with the rest of the Spartan IIs, so passing along their abilities is impossible but I guess it might be possible for the IVs as I don’t know if they are sterile or not.
as far as i’m concerned 343 seems to be moving away from most of the stupidity that was kilo 5
On the subject of sterility and families… You don’t need to be able to… reproduce… to have a family… There are multiple methods to have children, one of them being adoption…
> 2533274844984484;9:
> Short answer no. they Augmentations don’t actually alter DNA and are therefor not hereditary.
>
>
>
>
> > 2533274886377917;4:
> > I remember in Mortal Dictata Naomi saying that she was sterile along with the rest of the Spartan IIs, so passing along their abilities is impossible but I guess it might be possible for the IVs as I don’t know if they are sterile or not.
>
>
> not sterile. Lowed/loss of -Yoink!- drive was a possible side effect.
The augmentations DO alter the DNA. In Halsey’s Journal, in the “February 15, 2511” entry, she refers to the augmentations as “genetic augmentations”, and makes mention of “inserted gene sequences”. That’s pretty much why the augmentations don’t wear off after a while.
Now, Halsey was referring to the augmentations used by ORION, but she also points out that the reason why the genetic augmentations weren’t effective was because the ORION candidates were too old, and thus comes to the conclusion that the Spartan-IIs must be children. If Halsey decided to throw out genetic augmentation all together, then she would have no reason to conscript children.
And of course, this was all written by Nylund himself, so one cannot easily claim that the writer simply did not understand the subject matter, like we can with Traviss.
Weren’t the SPARTAN IV’s made sterile as a side effect to the augmentations just like the S-II’s?
So I don’t think offsprings are even possible.
> 2685405313546861;15:
> Weren’t the SPARTAN IV’s made sterile as a side effect to the augmentations just like the S-II’s?
>
> So I don’t think offsprings are even possible.
Well, first off, the S-II’s weren’t sterile. Randall had a daughter. Most simply had a reduced -Yoink!- drive.
Secondly, I highly, highly doubt the IV’s have a reduced -Yoink!- drive. Demarco and Madsen imply that they had some “relations” with the ladies of Rio De Janeiro. Likewise, who would join up with a slogan like “Join the Spartans! Never do it again!”
> 2533274860901607;14:
> > 2533274844984484;9:
> > Short answer no. they Augmentations don’t actually alter DNA and are therefor not hereditary.
> >
> >
> > > 2533274886377917;4:
> > > I remember in Mortal Dictata Naomi saying that she was sterile along with the rest of the Spartan IIs, so passing along their abilities is impossible but I guess it might be possible for the IVs as I don’t know if they are sterile or not.
> >
> >
> > not sterile. Lowed/loss of -Yoink!- drive was a possible side effect.
>
>
> The augmentations DO alter the DNA. In Halsey’s Journal, in the “February 15, 2511” entry, she refers to the augmentations as “genetic augmentations”, and makes mention of “inserted gene sequences”. That’s pretty much why the augmentations don’t wear off after a while.
>
> Now, Halsey was referring to the augmentations used by ORION, but she also points out that the reason why the genetic augmentations weren’t effective was because the ORION candidates were too old, and thus comes to the conclusion that the Spartan-IIs must be children. If Halsey decided to throw out genetic augmentation all together, then she would have no reason to conscript children.
>
> And of course, this was all written by Nylund himself, so one cannot easily claim that the writer simply did not understand the subject matter, like we can with Traviss.
Except nowhere in either ‘The Fall of Reach’ or Dr. Halsey’s personal journal, where the Spartan-II augmentation procedures are outlined, is there any mention of any of the effects of the processes altering the conscripts on a genetic level. Halsey also lists the other primary factor for requiring children is the need to be able to subject them to a very long training and indoctrination regiment. So based on the facts we do have right now, I think it is still safe to say the S-IIs augmentations did not effect their DNA and that that aspect of the ORION Project was phased out of what eventually became the SPARTAN-II Program.
> 2533274920039666;17:
> > 2533274860901607;14:
> > > 2533274844984484;9:
> > > Short answer no. they Augmentations don’t actually alter DNA and are therefor not hereditary.
> > >
> > >
> > > > 2533274886377917;4:
> > > > I remember in Mortal Dictata Naomi saying that she was sterile along with the rest of the Spartan IIs, so passing along their abilities is impossible but I guess it might be possible for the IVs as I don’t know if they are sterile or not.
> > >
> > >
> > > not sterile. Lowed/loss of -Yoink!- drive was a possible side effect.
> >
> >
> > The augmentations DO alter the DNA. In Halsey’s Journal, in the “February 15, 2511” entry, she refers to the augmentations as “genetic augmentations”, and makes mention of “inserted gene sequences”. That’s pretty much why the augmentations don’t wear off after a while.
> >
> > Now, Halsey was referring to the augmentations used by ORION, but she also points out that the reason why the genetic augmentations weren’t effective was because the ORION candidates were too old, and thus comes to the conclusion that the Spartan-IIs must be children. If Halsey decided to throw out genetic augmentation all together, then she would have no reason to conscript children.
> >
> > And of course, this was all written by Nylund himself, so one cannot easily claim that the writer simply did not understand the subject matter, like we can with Traviss.
>
>
> Except nowhere in either ‘The Fall of Reach’ or Dr. Halsey’s personal journal, where the Spartan-II augmentation procedures are outlined, is there any mention of any of the effects of the processes altering the conscripts on a genetic level. Halsey also lists the other primary factor for requiring children is the need to be able to subject them to a very long training and indoctrination regiment. So based on the facts we do have right now, I think it is still safe to say the S-IIs augmentations did not effect their DNA and that that aspect of the ORION Project was phased out of what eventually became the SPARTAN-II Program.
Except for the fact that Halsey still mentions how the IIs have to have a certain genetic quality. If she wasn’t going to use genetic augmentations in the first place, which Halsey concluded needed to be performed on children who pass her genetic screening, then the IIs would have just been ANY kids that ONI would have the easiest time abducting. Not 75 of the 150 Halsey identified as being as genetically perfect as possible. So, if anything, the logical conclusion is that the augmentations alter the DNA, we just weren’t made aware of that back when Fall of Reach was released. Which of course would be perfectly reasonable, given how much of Fall of Reach had already been altered by the time Nylund wrote the journal.
There’s also of course no mention of Halsey leaving genetic augmentation behind in favor of some other method. I mean, by the time Halsey thinks of the name “SPARTAN-II”, it had been two years since she originally wrote about the possible refinements for ORION, and the June 19, 2513 entry makes it appear that the Spartan-II Program is very much STILL meant to be a refinement of ORION and its results(and thus, its genetic augmentations). The only reason she changed the name was because she sick of calling her project “ORION Generation Two”, not because at that point the program had become a completely separate entity with a method of augmentation completely independent of ORION’s old methods.
> 2533274840469109;1:
> All 4 programs of the Spartans have had genetic augmentations done to them (duh). My question is, if any Spartan bore a child, would they posses some of their parents augmentations? Of course not to the extent of the Spartans themselves, but maybe a little more strength than usual, speed, ect? I know IIs have reduced -Yoink!- drive, I’m just speaking hypothetically.
Actually no, Spartans don’t have genetic augmentations. All of their changes are surgical and/or biochemical; their DNA is never altered. With that being said no, their kids can’t inherit their augmentations. The children of Spartan-IIs probably would inherit certain traits because their genes played a larger role in their selection. John-117 was described as being a head taller than his classmates, stronger, more determined, and having greater reflexes even before training. If this was uniform among all Spartan-II candidates (which it likely was) then it is possible that their children would be born with those traits as well.
> 2533274860901607;18:
> > 2533274920039666;17:
> > > 2533274860901607;14:
> > > > 2533274844984484;9:
> > > > Short answer no. they Augmentations don’t actually alter DNA and are therefor not hereditary.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > > 2533274886377917;4:
> > > > > I remember in Mortal Dictata Naomi saying that she was sterile along with the rest of the Spartan IIs, so passing along their abilities is impossible but I guess it might be possible for the IVs as I don’t know if they are sterile or not.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > not sterile. Lowed/loss of -Yoink!- drive was a possible side effect.
> > >
> > >
> > > The augmentations DO alter the DNA. In Halsey’s Journal, in the “February 15, 2511” entry, she refers to the augmentations as “genetic augmentations”, and makes mention of “inserted gene sequences”. That’s pretty much why the augmentations don’t wear off after a while.
> > >
> > > Now, Halsey was referring to the augmentations used by ORION, but she also points out that the reason why the genetic augmentations weren’t effective was because the ORION candidates were too old, and thus comes to the conclusion that the Spartan-IIs must be children. If Halsey decided to throw out genetic augmentation all together, then she would have no reason to conscript children.
> > >
> > > And of course, this was all written by Nylund himself, so one cannot easily claim that the writer simply did not understand the subject matter, like we can with Traviss.
> >
> >
> > Except nowhere in either ‘The Fall of Reach’ or Dr. Halsey’s personal journal, where the Spartan-II augmentation procedures are outlined, is there any mention of any of the effects of the processes altering the conscripts on a genetic level. Halsey also lists the other primary factor for requiring children is the need to be able to subject them to a very long training and indoctrination regiment. So based on the facts we do have right now, I think it is still safe to say the S-IIs augmentations did not effect their DNA and that that aspect of the ORION Project was phased out of what eventually became the SPARTAN-II Program.
>
>
> Except for the fact that Halsey still mentions how the IIs have to have a certain genetic quality. If she wasn’t going to use genetic augmentations in the first place, which Halsey concluded needed to be performed on children who pass her genetic screening, then the IIs would have just been ANY kids that ONI would have the easiest time abducting. Not 75 of the 150 Halsey identified as being as genetically perfect as possible. So, if anything, the logical conclusion is that the augmentations alter the DNA, we just weren’t made aware of that back when Fall of Reach was released. Which of course would be perfectly reasonable, given how much of Fall of Reach had already been altered by the time Nylund wrote the journal.
>
> There’s also of course no mention of Halsey leaving genetic augmentation behind in favor of some other method. I mean, by the time Halsey thinks of the name “SPARTAN-II”, it had been two years since she originally wrote about the possible refinements for ORION, and the June 19, 2513 entry makes it appear that the Spartan-II Program is very much STILL meant to be a refinement of ORION and its results(and thus, its genetic augmentations). The only reason she changed the name was because she sick of calling her project “ORION Generation Two”, not because at that point the program had become a completely separate entity with a method of augmentation completely independent of ORION’s old methods.
Spartan-II augmentations are chemical and surgical, not genetic. Halsey didn’t need to insert any gene sequences into the S-II candidates because the kids already had said genes, which is why they come from such a small selection pool. They were born with the genetic quality that Halsey was looking for which is why she carefully selected her candidates (a selection process that you’ll note occurs years before the candidates are actually augmented) otherwise (just as you said) she would’ve just picked any kid and implanted them with the genes she needed them to have.