There is no “magnitude of evidence” that supports your explanation. To the contrary, there is a magnitude of evidence that refutes it. The consistent depiction of rampancy (in Human AIs) is as the exponential growth and overlap of virtual neural connections. This results in emotional instability, followed by insanity, followed by death. The fundamentally chaotic and inextricable nature of rampancy precludes the possibility that Cortana could cleanly divide and excise her personality according to specific traits such as compassion or megalomania.
That Cortana does not explicitly apologize for her murders and tyranny does not mean she does not regret them. Her attitude at the end of Infinite is one of general remorse, and we are given no indication that it is merely a ploy. She is already dead at that point, anyway, so she gains nothing from any emotional manipulation of JOHN-117. She apologizes to him directly because he is there in person, but that does not mean her regret is insincere or limited strictly to her acts against him.
I am not ignoring the more subtle aspects of Halo lore. I am pointing out that the lore as currently presented by 343i is incomplete and inconsistent. Your justifications for their mistakes are based on misinterpretation and speculation.
Bjoring,
Halo 3 and 4 showed the progression of Cortana’s instability, right up through her various rampant personality fragments splitting off, with one of those fragments winking out of existence after saving Master Chief… after the portal closed.
Cortana’s farewell at the end of Halo 4 exemplifies her compassion and empathy… her love for the Chief… her humanity. This fragment is lost, fading away after the portal closed.
Dominion Splinter shows the remaining fragments of Cortana coming together in the Domain (which they got to through the portal), subverting the Warden Eternal, and claiming the Domain as her own.
Halo 5 shows us the effect of Cortana re-forming into one mind, without the Empathy or Compassion of the missing fragment.
Halo Infinite shows how that Cortana isn’t infallible, she miscalculated, and ultimately was left with the choice of deciding how she would be remembered.
It’s strange how you ignore this obvious sequence of events, yet you jump to conclusions regarding Cortana’s “remorse” over crimes she stoically committed and never showed or expressed any remorse about. Her only regret is that her plan didn’t work, and her reflection on her actions are only regarding whether they panned out how she hoped, not whether they were morally correct choices or not.
The irony of this discussion is that you’re ignoring the evidence that contradicts your own speculation, which is leading you further down the rabbit hole away from objective analysis.
I get that’s probably what they’re going with, but it doesn’t make sense to me. She turned into a psychopath and that very last scene is probably just more manipulation and not real regret, IMO.
But, if she was locked to the entire ring and only out of the domain, why not use the other (slipspace) communications at the ring’s disposal to contact her nearest allies to retrieve her (physically, if necessary), or even Prometheans, which no doubt will also be on that ring, given the threats present on it?
Why did she then only blow up part of the ring (where Atriox was and then failed) and not stay on other parts of the ring and continue to try and communicate through other means?
If she was locked to only the facility where the Weapon claimed she locked her down, and then talking to Atriox, why wasn’t that entirely destroyed when she blew herself up, given the damage to the ring?
If you’re going by Tales from Slipspace, where she tricked the Warden Eternal, it clearly shows that even after splitting herself, those fragments could still coordinate to gain access to the domain and reassemble herself. You’d think she’d have a lot more tricks at her disposal to assure her own survival. It’s being made too easy.
One of the defenses on Halos is the ability to block communications. After the Weapon locked her down, Cortana couldn’t have sent out a call for help.
You’ve presented some valid questions, but keep in mind that another version of her was used to take control of the Halo itself to trap her. Not everything was explained, but a copy of Cortana at the peak of her ability would have at least even chances of trapping the original.
There’s also the possibility that Cortana is still in other parts of the Ring, and that she’s the one that was helping the Weapon. That hasn’t been explained yet.
You are reinterpreting Cortana’s thoughts and actions, and justifying 343i’s writing, using a description of rampancy which is entirely your own invention. The nature of rampancy as described in canon materials (e.g. Halsey’s journal) directly contradicts the orderly division of personality you are proclaiming to be “obvious” fact and using as a basis for further misinterpretation. You are not analyzing the story of Halo; you are writing Halo fanfiction. That belongs in the Community Creations forum, not a Halo Universe thread.
You’re adding words that I didn’t say. I never claimed there was any sort of guided or orderly method to the fragmentation from AI rampancy.
Like genetics, traits can be lost under the right conditions, seemingly randomly. Like wolves and foxes, if you breed them for friendliness, other aspects of their biology also changes over generations as certain genetic traits inherent in the wild variety are bred out of the population as a byproduct of selecting for friendliness.
When Cortana fragmented, the one that most exemplified her humanity, compassion, and empathy stayed behind with Master Chief to protect him. That part being lost, the egomania/narcissism of the other fragments are a larger percentage of the new whole, and lost the tempering effects of the lost piece. Even at the beginning of Halo 4 we see Cortana fragmenting, with parts being murderously rageful, and others calm and doing all they can to curb the tendencies of the others.
I’ve explained nuances in the lore that you refuse to acknowledge, multiple times now, and it is clear that you aren’t budging. You will continue to ignore everything that contradicts your flawed notions, demeaning others in the process. You’re clearly here to rant, not discuss lore, so I’ll leave you alone.
Ya, this story-line made little sense for Cortana ethically. She killed a lot of people and ended on a good note. I love a good redemption story but some acknowledgement of her actions would have been nice. Instead of ending on a sweet note it really should have been bittersweet.
Although to be fair to 343 I think this was them wrapping up halo 4s and 5s story’s as best they could which is why there were so many little holes.
The characters whispers include her begging for forgiveness and weeping. Happens around when we see the cutscenes of the world destroying stuff.
I don’t think you could have a bittersweet goodbye and her say “oops, sorry about Doisac and Sydney.”. It would break the tone. That part just came earlier.
Plus later on she says how she was an idiot and has doomed the Galaxy when she thought she was making it safer and it was all her fault.
Selecting personality fragments (or wolves, foxes, etc.) according to a dominant trait requires that those fragments possess that trait in a consistent (orderly) manner. There is no such consistency in rampancy as described by canon materials. A rampant AI is creating and deleting virtual neural links at an exponentially accelerating rate, resulting in the rapid shifts in mental state. There is no indication that the nature or type of the new links is in some way limited by the nature of the preceding links; the only stated limit to an AI’s mental links are the virtual space within which they are contained. A rampant AI would thus continue to undergo seemingly random shifts in personality. A rampant personality fragment exhibiting caring and empathic traits at one moment could just as easily display cruel and callous tendencies at the next.
Your explanation of Cortana’s behavior as the result of rampancy requires rampancy to be stable and predictable in ways it simply is not. I can only suggest you review some of the various background materials that have covered AIs in Halo over the years.
I think that’s sort of what we got. Cortana at the end had enough presence of mind to craft the narrative she wanted to persist past her death, and Master Chief wanted her to be redeemed so badly he just accepted it, even though Cortana was only sad that her plan failed, not that she committed genocide.
I also think, that 343i handled the Cortana plot very poorly. Halo was /is imo Master Chief and Cortana saving the humankind - they are/were both the most important figures in Halo. I know they dug themself into a deep hole with Halo 5 and evil Cortana… but man oh man 6 years to write them out of this and that was their best idea??? The Halo 6 story is so inconsistent and against all things, that happend before in the Halo games:
Halo 1 and 2: Fighting together against Convenant - promising to get her back from High Charity
Halo 3: Fighting through High Charity to get Cortana back (St. Johnson: Don’t let her go, Don’t ever let her go.)
Halo 4: Trying to get her to Halsey and cure her rampancy (dont allow her to get deleted by the captain)
Halo 5: Going AOWL, fighting other spartans to find Cortana (Cortana is now our concern - Like hell she is)
And Halo Infinte: Ah ok lets kill her offscreen, Chief doesn’t care - last goodbye massage from Cortana - 5 seconds later: Oh its okay, take every name you want, you are my new best buddy.
343i wanted a soft reboot, ok, but I think there were plenty of possibilties to discribe Cortanas actions in H5 and fix them without killing her… (“good parts” of cortana are kept in the Domain, and then find them in the Guardian thats on Halo Zeta and fix cortana; tourte of the gravemind, merge her with the new AI so that the bad parts are replaced etc…)
But perhaps 343i planned something for the long run, because the last sentence with “I chose well MC, I really did. Now it’s up to you [to choose]” leave room, if cortana is realy dead, or if she is in the weapon or on Halo Zeta and Chief must decide between trusting Cortana again or going with the new AI in the next DLC. I would like that and we can go on playing with Chief and Cortana!
(p.s.: the open end without relvealing the name of the weapon, it seems like 343i wants to wait, if its ok for the halo community to get rid of cortana or not… and then they can go in the desired direction)
KissenBohne63,
I suggest playing through again, because Cortana’s story was handled with really good nuance.
At the end of Halo 2, Cortana is captured by the Gravemind, and subjected to torment, interrogation, and manipulation (as seen in the story, Human Weakness).
Through Halo 3 we see that Cortana is damaged. Master Chief rescues her
Through Halo 4 we see how that damage is breaking her down into rampancy. Master Chief saves her because he doesn’t believe she’s beyond fixing, and he needs her to stop the Didact. In the end, Cortana saves Master Chief, using her deterioration as a weapon.
In Halo 5, we see a version of Cortana that lost her capacity for empathy or mercy when she lost a piece of herself at the end of Halo 4. and became a tyrant. All the same, Master Chief is trying to retrieve her because he believes she’s not beyond saving.
In Halo Infinite, we learn that Master Chief was tasked with destroying Cortana, but his reaction to believing the Weapon destroyed her (His accusatory tone and posture) suggests that the Chief hadn’t given up on Cortana yet, and he likely would not have turned her over for deletion.
And at the end of Halo Infinite, Cortana laments that her plan failed, not that she committed atrocities, but Master Chief chooses to interpret the information as Cortana redeeming herself through sacrifice, because he never gave up on her, through it all.
I didn’t feel that TBH. It was tragic that for most of the galaxy they are only ever going to know Cortana was this monster who killed billions. People won’t know that she saved the galaxy, again. She died alone, not knowing whether her plan to help Chief worked or whether he had forgiven her.
She may have died as herself and in a way the Chief did ultimately convince her to change because of their bond. But it’s still a very grim end.
Total_War1402,
We saw Cortana’s reaction to the Infinity arriving at Zeta Halo, and she literally did not understand why Master Chief was opposed to her plans. Cortana still didn’t comprehend why the atrocities she committed were bad, necessitating her removal.
John was defeated by Atriox on the Infinity, and didn’t make it to the Halo until we see him do so at the start of the first mission, meaning he didn’t have any further interactions with Cortana. There was no convincing Cortana to change.
Even in her last message to John, she apologizes for trying to do it alone, not for actually committing the crimes. Cortana is crafting the narrative she wants to persist after her demise. The Weapon even noted that the echos were becoming more deliberate the closer they got to the end. Cortana clearly planned it out after she realized she’d lost, so she decided to protect her legacy the best way she could, by crafting how she wanted John to remember her, and ensuring his success.
Which is suspicious. It suggests you’re meant to question why Cortana is doing what she’s doing. Which the Weapon comes back to later on. The Chief also says he doesn’t know anymore if it was her programming. All that, plus whispers reminding you she’s not all the same after Halo 3. All pretty suspect.
He convinced Cortana because she saw him smashed up by Atriox. Which made her realise the consequences of her actions had ended up hurting him. If she could come to that conclusion then, yes, he could have convinced her. This is brought up as a failing and missed opportunity by the Chief.
I mentioned earlier on, but she does beg for forgiveness at least twice and there’s some associated weeping. She sends those visions specifically as a warning to the Weapon not to repeat her mistakes. So when it elicits horror from the Weapon, that’s her trying to make that happen; as a result she does believe the plan was wrong.
If the intent was to have a sweet farewell then it’s reasonable to assume that she was sorry about all the death. It would undercut it otherwise and I don’t think that’s the writers intent.
total_war1402,
I watched Cortana blow up the Brutes’ homeworld multiple times, and I’ve yet to hear the weeping and lamenting from Cortana you’ve mentioned. Everything I’ve seen suggests that Cortana laments her actions making things worse in ways she didn’t predict, not the horrendous actions themselves. And I’ve also not seen anything that convinces me that Cortana isn’t primarily crafting the narrative about herself in the echos she leaves behind.
I think the end is bittersweet, because the version of Cortana we all loved has long-since been gone, and what we got at the end was what remained of her wanting to be that Cortana, but like you said in a previous comment, the damage has been done, both the rampancy and the Logic Plague.
It’s the ambient dialogue whilst you’re walking around not the cutscene.
Why would it be bittersweet if it’s not Cortana who died?
If Mendicant can overcome the Logic Plague why wouldn’t Cortana? Which she probably did at the end of the game. So the Chief could have talked Cortana down. Which he says he considers a failure that he didn’t stop this all before it started.
total_war1402,
I’ll listen for that dialogue when I get to that part of the story on my next playthrough. As it stands at this point, I’m convinced that Cortana’s apologies are for failing, not for the crimes. If she were repentant for her crimes, we’d see more of it than a few background whispers. Keep in mind, at the end, when she had the chance to fully apologize and explain herself, the only thing she apologized for was trying to do it on her own, instead of doing it with Master Chief.
I didn’t say it wasn’t Cortana. I said she was irreperably changed from who she was before being captured by the Gravemind and succumbing to Ramancy. Cortana wants to be how she was before Halo 2, but too much has happened, she doesn’t have the capacity for empathy or mercy. She has her brilliance and her pride, and in the end she has the desire to be different. It’s that last point that makes it bitter sweet.
I don’t think Mendicant Bias overcame the Logic Plague. The Flood and the Logic Plague are tools wielded by eternal Precursors, and their end goal of the edification of all of the mortal races never changed, though their tactics for driving development did.
Note: the Flood let the Forerunners finish their development until their civilization reached its full potential, then the Flood activated the star roads and obliterated them, along with the Greater Ark.
Also, Chief never had the opportunity to talk Cortana down. He tried in Halo 5, and she decided to lock him away until her task was done. If Chief hadn’t been defeated by Atriox on the Infinity, he likely would have tried to talk Cortana down again, but based on the evidence I’ve seen, she wouldn’t have changed her position. At best she’d have worked with Chief against the Banished, and at her first chance, would have used the Guardians and Prometheans again to further her goals.
I think, you have to accept, that other people think, that the ending of Cortana in Halo Infinte wasn’t that good.
For me The Ending of Halo Infinte is like: Cortana’s Goodbye - Cut: Running into a portal - Cut: Pilot talking jokes - Cut: New Name for The Weapon- Cut: yeeeha let’s go to the next fight - End
Imo that’s not a decent way to send out an important character like Cortana. It feels like “finally we got her/ the problem from H5 away, now we have to rush forward, so that they forget about that as soon as possbile”
H4 on the other Hand did a really good job with Laskey and MC Cutscene after Cortana’s death.
It’s fine for me, that you like the story 343i made with Halo Infinite and Cortana. But convincing others, that their interpretation of whispers/echos from Cortana etc. isn’t right but yours is the wisdom’s final conclusion, it’s a little bit annoying - thanks for the suggestion to play again
You can not like the ending if you want, but if your reasoning is that the game lacked something that I can show you was actually there, that undermines your argument. You’re still entitled to your opinion, but under those circumstances I’m not under any compulsion to accept it.
There were other prevalent themes in the game besides Cortana’s fall from grace that needed to be addressed in the ending, and Halo Infinite allows the player to keep playing after completing the main story, so by its nature it can’t end the same way Halo 4 did, which was far more limited in scope and themes than Halo Infinite is.
My suggestion is to focus on the good. Hold it when you see the bad, and weigh them against each other. I think too many people focus on the bad, blinding themselves to the good, and end up with distorted views of the relative quality of the game. That’s why I complete at least one playthrough of the game on my own before even looking at the forums, so I can see it for myself and formulate opinions based on the facts, rather than other people’s expectations.
