Constructive suggestion on the booting system

Games Other Halo
1

Hi guys!

I saw a lot of topics about betrayals making people crazy and some of them propose solutions, that are debated and usually rejected, because too constraining and/or leading to some abuses.

IMO, the most important problem around betrayal/boot is the ability that teammates have to actually betray you on purpose to get the power weapons (especially in BTB :wink: ). Another, less important, issue is that people sometimes rage-boot you, without even trying to think about what happened. The latter point is, unfortunately, uncurable. Personnally, when I get betrayed, I always take a few seconds to understand what happened, and usually don’t boot my teammates (lost rocket/nade, accidental noscopes,…).

I want here to propose some improvement to avoid most of the inconveniences related to the main problem, which is the power weapon obsession. Most of on-purpose-betrayals share some characteristics that can be pointed out and transformed into algorithms.

Leads to a booting option after the first betrayal:

  • a) Every betrayal done with more than one shot/nade/melee. Hitting a teammate more than once is most likely done on purpose.
  • b) CQC one-shot betrayal are also most likely to be intentionnal. (And if it is not, players are smart enough to sort out the accidental cases, c.f. above).
  • c) (Tough implementation, I guess) If the betrayer has no enemies in a certain cone around the shooting vector within a certain range. This is most likely on purpose.
  • d) You get stuck by a teammate within a radius with no enemies (somehow related to c)), in a middle-to-short range fashion. Most likely on purpose.

Can also be included in some manner cases where a teammate no-shields you several times in a row, actually trying to weaken you in order to make you an easy target for the enemy team.

I don’t know if this is possible, but a causality check might be nice too. I mean, you fire with the Wraith and an allied Hog comes out of nowhere and gets hit by your plasma artillery. You usually shot before they even thought to go in that direction. That kind of betrayal should not lead to a first betrayal booting option (if it happens twice or more, it most likely means that the guy in the wraith is somehow brain-damaged* ^^ or not careful enough).

That’s it for what I had to suggest. Even though some of my suggestions are probably difficult to implement, points a) and b) shouldn’t be such a problem. And it would most probably make things easier for everyone, especially when it is about BTB on Hemorrhage, where the sniper rifle is so desired.

Let us know what you think about these ideas and if you have some improvements/criticism.

Thanks for reading.

*(without any politically incorrect thoughts)

2

If most betrayals are for taking possession of weapons…

Simply make all weapons dropped by a ‘betrayed’ player empty of ammo.

It would suck a bit for the team when a genuine accidental betrayal happens… but it takes away the incentive to kill your team ‘mate’.

3

-2 betrayals per game
-get the option to boot after the second one

people betraying for weapons only started in reach, kind of shows how mature the community was

4

Good tips.

Also, something that really pisses me off is this BS where a teammate takes your shields down, and an enemy gets the kill and the betrayer gets NO punishment.

It worked the other way too, an enemy takes your shields down (Hell, they don’t even have to do that, all it takes is a small speck of damage) and your teammate can kill you freely and it will credit the enemy with a kill.

I really think your ideas would work, I think they’re awesome. But honestly, if they fixed the two issues above, I’d be happy with just that, at the very least…

5

@ Darwi :

Yeah, that’s an option too.

The advantage of what I propose is actually that it takes care of most of the on-purpose-betrayals, and not only the ones related to power weapons. Actually, I mentionned it because it is the type of betrayal that makes me the more angry.

6

> Hi guys!
>
> I saw a lot of topics about betrayals making people crazy and some of them propose solutions, that are debated and usually rejected, because too constraining and/or leading to some abuses.
>
> IMO, the most important problem around betrayal/boot is the ability that teammates have to actually betray you on purpose to get the power weapons (especially in BTB :wink: ). Another, less important, issue is that people sometimes rage-boot you, without even trying to think about what happened. The latter point is, unfortunately, uncurable. Personnally, when I get betrayed, I always take a few seconds to understand what happened, and usually don’t boot my teammates (lost rocket/nade, accidental noscopes,…).
>
> I want here to propose some improvement to avoid most of the inconveniences related to the main problem, which is the power weapon obsession. Most of on-purpose-betrayals share some characteristics that can be pointed out and transformed into algorithms.
>
> Leads to a booting option after the first betrayal:
>
> - a) Every betrayal done in more than one shot/nade/melee. Hitting a teammate more than once is most likely done on purpose.
> - b) CQC one-shot betrayal are also most likely to be intentionnal. (And if it is not, players are smart enough to sort out the accidental cases, c.f. above).
> - c) (Though implementation, I guess) If the betrayer has no enemies in a certain cone around the shooting vector within a certain range. This is most likely on purpose.
> - d) You get stuck by a teammate within a radius with no enemies (somehow related to c)), in a middle-to-short range fashion. Most likely on purpose.
>
> Can also be included in some manner cases where a teammate no-shields you many times in a row, actually trying to weaken you in order to make you a easy target for the enemy team.
>
> I don’t know if this is possible, but a causality check might be nice too. I mean, you fire with the Wraith and an allied Hog comes out of nowhere and gets hit by your plasma artillery. You usually shot before they even thought to go in that direction. That kind of betrayal should not lead to a first betrayal booting option (if it happens twice or more, it most likely means that the guy in the wraith is somehow brain-damaged* ^^ or not careful enough).
>
> That’s it for what I had to suggest. Even though some of my suggestions are probably difficult to implement, points a) and b) shouldn’t be such a problem. And it would most probably make things easier for everyone, especially when it is about BTB on Hemorrhage, where the sniper rifle is so desired.
>
> Let us know what you think about these ideas and if you have some improvements/criticism.
>
> Thanks for reading.
>
> *(without any politically incorrect thoughts)

I like your ideas. I think they are well thought out… Good job. I think the best way to solve the betrayal problem is to create a STAT for betrayals. This stat would consist of a betrayal count, team damage count, and frequency of betrayals. At the start of record keeping, the betrayal stat will keep track of every betrayal and every bit of team damage a player does. With this information in the system, the stat would show up on the players service record for all to see. Having a set limit on this stat will allow the system to determine exactly when the boot option shows up. If the game has been out for a week and a player already has 400 betrayals, first betrayal equals an automatic boot option. For those who don’t betray, the system will follow the 3 betayal limit per game. I think just having a stat on the service record will discourage betraying because it is clear as day if that player was a rampant betrayer or griefer.

7

I made a thread like this, though it expanded on those ideas a little more; sadly it was just abandoned after the first 2 days.

Your proposal was a lot like mine, so I support.

8

Some good ideas OP, i hope they use them in halo 4. the booting system was crap in the previous halos especially reach’s, it was really depressing when you get booted for an accident and then in another game someone genuinely betrays you and there is no boot option. Also this has happened to me a couple of times, in a game of invasion after the end of round timer finishes and everyone celebrates or takes their rage out on other players by mass betrayal and then you decide heck i wanna kill someone too and then suddenly a black screen? then a message “you got booted” AAARRRGGGGHHHHH!!! THE ROUND IS ALREADY FINISHED C’MON!! That’s when I usually decide to play halo 3 or halo wars or something.

9

Your idea actually sounds good, but personally my suggestion would be to just make it so teammates can’t kill each other. This solves all problems of betrayals. Actually if you wanted to make it so that you can just take out the teammates shields(for everyone who wants killable teammates because friendly fire helps them get kills) then this could solve that problem to. Just simply make the teammates not killable, and we won’t have betrayals.

10

Yeah… It seems to be the easiest way, but there are too many possible abuses, such as :

  • Grenade frenzy
  • Human bomb with a stuck grenade
  • Rocket Fest

Only to name a few.

11

I hated how in reach if you betrayed someone once they could kick you, for exsample, your splattering an enemy in a ghost, and a team mate jumps in front of you. “BETRAYAL”, you take the blame for that and get booted,and loose all your hard work and dont get exp. And it was so stupid how in reach, if your in the Falcon’s pilot seat, and the propellors are spinning, if a team mate jumps onto the propeller, they die, that counts as a betrayal, and they can boot you… Even though you didn’t do anything wrong! That should be a suicide, not a betrayal.

In Halo 4, they should have it so, if you betray the same person twice, then they can kick you. Reach’s betrayal system was stupid as hell.

12

The easiest and in my opinion, the best solution to this, and I mean that this could possibly be implemented even after the game ships with a title update, is this:

On your first betrayal, there’s no boot option.

On your second betrayal, there’s a boot option ONLY if you betrayed the same person twice.

On your third betrayal, boot option for anyone who was betrayed, it doesn’t matter if you betrayed three different people, the third person gets the option.

I feel like this is efficient because it easily weeds out and separates accidental betrayers from those who do it on purpose, or those who are just bad and do nothing but hurt their team’s score.