Constructive Feedback Thread For Halo 4!

Games Other Halo
1

Please be very constructive and qualitative. Maybe 343i will listen when we’re not out to go down their throats with how they manage Halo 4, or posting by making flame wars with other community members about any of the previous Halo games against Halo 4. Post why you dislike or like H4 overall, but try and post what you think future installments of this franchise needs to keep that Halo composition intact.

You know guys, for me, I’ve tried getting the feel for Halo 4 and tried to get myself to like it. The problem is that I just can’t, you know. It’s too similar in many ways with the combat, gameplay, and other features to a similar FPS juggernaut that’s out on the market right now which certainly has had a brutal rivalry with this game for years and still does. One of the reasons why I initially liked—I mean LOVED—Halo is because it had its differences to other certain FPS and it really just stood out. The composition was purely exhilarating and it just kept wanting me to play the game every day and every night competitively and casually.

Secondly, another reason that really pulled me into the Halo gameplay was its uniqueness in its gameplay. The pace of the multiplayer was neither too fast nor too slow. I felt like the pace was just almost always perfect and it was fun to play competitively because of the pace. Many of the weapons also weren’t so OP like I’ve seen with many of the new weapons in H4. Trying to play competitively was extremely rewarding, and now it’s like some of the weapons are just one shot, one kill or you can just sit camping for like the whole game and killing enemies that pass by you. The gameplay is too fast-paced like this franchise’s main enemy has been and it’s so easy to just use “nooby” tactics to win games. I apologize for resulting to use the word “nooby”, but it just feels too easy now. Playing this game the first day it came out and it was just too easy.

The ranking system back in Halo 3 also separated the elites, the casuals and the noobs altogether. H3 had one of the best ranking systems ever, and you truly had to work hard and gain lots of skill in order to increase your general rank and increase the rank in the certain playlist(s) you played it. Both Reach and H4 (I had to mention Reach even though it’s developed by Bungie) lack a ranking system like Halo 3’s, and it’s just about playing as long as you can until you hit cap. There’s nothing rewarding about it. You feel no sense of accomplishment whatsoever from ranking up. Just stupid armor, loadouts and specializations (the ones after armor only counting for H4) that anyone else could unlock because it’s mainly based on how much you play—not by how much skill you have.

I also think H4 has an identity crisis. 343i, you really tarnished H4 gameplay without providing the fans to switch to Elites (that could additionally be customizable like they were in H3). I am an Elite at heart, and not being able to play as an Elite is sorta game-breaking for me. There have also been role-playing maps in Reach where the immersion really increased with players that used the Elite characters. I played as an Elite all the time in the Reach role-playing game known as “Countries of Reach”. It was fun being bigger than Spartans, running a bit faster than them and even at times, escaping death because you could sprint faster than the Spartans.

On another note, 343i didn’t decide to bring back dual-wielding nor did they decide to dedicate resources to machinimists. These aren’t biggies as they’re both mentioned last, but to me they are because dual-wielding was another thing that made Halo gameplay a lot more immersive whether the use of dual-wielding was OP or not. In fact it was so much fun going up against players who dual-wielded, and the challenge it brought forth was amazing. I always loved that feeling of taking down a guy using holding two SMGs back in H3. Another thing I loved with dual-wielding is that it could bring more to the machinima atmosphere like Elites did. You could customize characters with dual-wielding and allow for the characters to be distinguishable, and it was these little things that just really mattered in H3 and even Reach that made making machinima and creating role-play gametypes so much fun.

Didn’t know where to fit this, but I’m also unsure as to why communication severely dropped post-H3. Like, many people are now only in party chat, don’t have their mics activated or just don’t flat-out have a mic at all. I remember H3 being very talkative in many playlists in matchmaking, and now it’s just so quiet which makes it boring.Lastly, I remember hearing about Frank O’connor saying something along the lines of “We could have done a lot better,” (quoted pretty close) and that is just something no developer should ever say. It’s inexcusable. The point is to take the time to make something to the best of your ability, and after 4 years that’s what was delivered.

I know SOMEONE is going to argue with my points I’ve given but in the end, it’s just my opinion. After playing H4 I’m just not feeling what I used to in the games prior. To me, H4 just missed the mark in some areas, but by a long shot in others. If you love H4, think it’s the best thing ever, etc. then that’s great for you because you’ve found enjoyment in a game that I can’t for some very strong reasons. I’m not done with the franchise yet as I want to give 343i another chance, but I think I’ll be sticking by with H3 and Reach for machinimas and Custom Games until things improve—which is something we’ll hopefully see in the next installment.

2

After fighting with Competives I’ve come to the conclusion they are not really such a massive group as they like to think. Vocal yes, but really they are adrift on a sea of Randoms and Casual players. They want their playlist and weapons to be primary tools of Halo. That used to infuriate me. So I began wondering why it was getting under my skin. The answer I found was they were right to want the changes they are demanding but going about it in the wrong fashion.

Halo should be a socially communicative game. It’s supposed to rely on teamwork, but that’s been lost in due part to the abusive nature found throughout Halo 3 or many other competitive FPS on XBL and the blowback of visible stats being used as cudgels and immaturity inherit in anonymous online abuse rather than important social cues offered by veterans to help lesser players get better and build bonds and friend lists.

So the DMR and Boltshot, Ordanance drops, AAs are actually tools to help players who are now socially cut off from each other rather than Developers working towards creating features that should be inspiring teamwork and building those Halo Friend Lists that negate such solo mechanics in open simulated combat.

I believe that’s why Halo 3 was so popular was because you had more communication present, but at the same time it also suffered because you also had the wrong types of communication driving wedges in and throughout the experience, where the final out come ends in completely silent matches and now players have to rely on mechanics like AAs as crutches because they have to in order to enjoy this game rather than the real human enjoyment of team efforts.

I really suggest to the community to throw out all the old vehicles and weapons and start anew. Vehicles need to be like the Warthog. Falcon, and the Hornet. They need to be team oriented in order to work. Solo vehicles have to go. The Scorpion is gone and so is the Ghost. This is one major game mechanic that can build fast friendships. Gunners search for good Pilots and drivers and these small micro teams form and broaden out forming clans and larger Halo friend lists. Everything in Halo should be geared towards the reduction of players having to be Randoms on every front.

Firefight is an important tool. PVP players degrade PVE players all the time but in reality Firefight teaches basic Halo movements and increase skills on weapon and map awareness for new players, If anything 343 needs to look at Horde modes and enemy Ai and focus them on forcing players to band together in order to survive as a team.

This game type could be a major tool in social interaction and the first steps to solve Competitive player demands for better players. It’s just not being used correctly. There’s a reason why everyone loves fighting the Hunters. 343 really needs to look at the psychological impact each Ai can bring to the battlefield and gear them towards the the over all experience that makes players bond in battle.

That should be the focus of Halo 5 for competitive players. If you really want the DMR and AAs gone you have to fundamentally change how Halo works so instead of driving players apart it actually builds player co=operation so they don’t have to rely on these tools when they have instead friend and allies backing them up.

There you go some constructive observation

3

> After fighting with Competives I’ve come to the conclusion they are not really such a massive group as they like to think. Vocal yes, but really they are adrift on a sea of Randoms and Casual players. They want their playlist and weapons to be primary tools of Halo. That used to infuriate me. So I began wondering why it was getting under my skin. The answer I found was they were right to want the changes they are demanding but going about it in the wrong fashion.
>
> Halo should be a socially communicative game. It’s supposed to rely on teamwork, but that’s been lost in due part to the abusive nature found throughout Halo 3 or many other competitive FPS on XBL and the blowback of visible stats being used as cudgels and immaturity inherit in anonymous online abuse rather than important social cues offered by veterans to help lesser players get better and build bonds and friend lists.
>
> So the DMR and Boltshot, Ordanance drops, AAs are actually tools to help players who are now socially cut off from each other rather than Developers working towards creating features that should be inspiring teamwork and building those Halo Friend Lists that negate such solo mechanics in open simulated combat.
>
> I believe that’s why Halo 3 was so popular was because you had more communication present, but at the same time it also suffered because you also had the wrong types of communication driving wedges in and throughout the experience, where the final out come ends in completely silent matches and now players have to rely on mechanics like AAs as crutches because they have to in order to enjoy this game rather than the real human enjoyment of team efforts.
>
>
> I really suggest to the community to throw out all the old vehicles and weapons and start anew. Vehicles need to be like the Warthog. Falcon, and the Hornet. They need to be team oriented in order to work. Solo vehicles have to go. The Scorpion is gone and so is the Ghost. This is one major game mechanic that can build fast friendships. Gunners search for good Pilots and drivers and these small micro teams form and broaden out forming clans and larger Halo friend lists. Everything in Halo should be geared towards the reduction of players having to be Randoms on every front.
>
>
> Firefight is an important tool. PVP players degrade PVE players all the time but in reality Firefight teaches basic Halo movements and increase skills on weapon and map awareness for new players, If anything 343 needs to look at Horde modes and enemy Ai and focus them on forcing players to band together in order to survive as a team.
>
> This game type could be a major tool in social interaction and the first steps to solve Competitive player demands for better players. It’s just not being used correctly. There’s a reason why everyone loves fighting the Hunters. 343 really needs to look at the psychological impact each Ai can bring to the battlefield and gear them towards the the over all experience that makes players bond in battle.
>
> That should be the focus of Halo 5 for competitive players. If you really want the DMR and AAs gone you have to fundamentally change how Halo works so instead of driving players apart it actually builds player co=operation so they don’t have to rely on these tools when they have instead friend and allies backing them up.
>
> There you go some constructive observation

It’s nice to see you care so much about the competitive feel and how you want social interaction to be improved on in multiplayer. :slight_smile: My reply on your post is down below this post!!

4

> After fighting with Competives I’ve come to the conclusion they are not really such a massive group as they like to think. Vocal yes, but really they are adrift on a sea of Randoms and Casual players. They want their playlist and weapons to be primary tools of Halo. That used to infuriate me. So I began wondering why it was getting under my skin. The answer I found was they were right to want the changes they are demanding but going about it in the wrong fashion.

I definitely agree here. Competitive players are very vocal indeed, but have always been the minority in just about every game.

> Halo should be a socially communicative game. It’s supposed to rely on teamwork, but that’s been lost in due part to the abusive nature found throughout Halo 3 or many other competitive FPS on XBL and the blowback of visible stats being used as cudgels and immaturity inherit in anonymous online abuse rather than important social cues offered by veterans to help lesser players get better and build bonds and friend lists.

Luckily, I never encountered much abusive behavior in H3 matchmaking. The maturity was satisfactory throughout the years I played H3, and that made the teamwork a lot easier. I really think 343i needs to take a step back into what H3 and Reach had and take those elements and put them in the installment that will succeed H4.

> So the DMR and Boltshot, Ordanance drops, AAs are actually tools to help players who are now socially cut off from each other rather than Developers working towards creating features that should be inspiring teamwork and building those Halo Friend Lists that negate such solo mechanics in open simulated combat.

I did gain a couple of great friends because of how socially communicative H3 and even Reach were. I do remember Reach being a lot quieter as the game was less socially communicative, but it still had its moments where I’d run into a few players to almost a full lobby of them with their mics on.

> I believe that’s why Halo 3 was so popular was because you had more communication present, but at the same time it also suffered because you also had the wrong types of communication driving wedges in and throughout the experience, where the final out come ends in completely silent matches and now players have to rely on mechanics like AAs as crutches because they have to in order to enjoy this game rather than the real human enjoyment of team efforts.

Although you can’t really change how vocally abusive the community can get, and throughout my overall great experience in H3, I can mostly agree with you here on this part.

> I really suggest to the community to throw out all the old vehicles and weapons and start anew. Vehicles need to be like the Warthog. Falcon, and the Hornet. They need to be team oriented in order to work. Solo vehicles have to go. The Scorpion is gone and so is the Ghost. This is one major game mechanic that can build fast friendships. Gunners search for good Pilots and drivers and these small micro teams form and broaden out forming clans and larger Halo friend lists. Everything in Halo should be geared towards the reduction of players having to be Randoms on every front.

Here’s the part where I kind of don’t agree. I think Scorpions and even Ghosts can be game-changers and really decide the fate between win or lose. The Scorpion can help a team who’s behind by a lot get many kills before the gigantic beast of a vehicle is destroyed, and the Ghost can ram through many foes before it crashes and hijacked or destroyed in someway. Although it’s not used much, I have seen allies hop into a friendly’s Scorpion to help them with the Machine Gun turret. I think everything else you said, I do agree on. :slight_smile:

> Firefight is an important tool. PVP players degrade PVE players all the time but in reality Firefight teaches basic Halo movements and increase skills on weapon and map awareness for new players, If anything 343 needs to look at Horde modes and enemy Ai and focus them on forcing players to band together in order to survive as a team.
>
> This game type could be a major tool in social interaction and the first steps to solve Competitive player demands for better players. It’s just not being used correctly. There’s a reason why everyone loves fighting the Hunters. 343 really needs to look at the psychological impact each Ai can bring to the battlefield and gear them towards the the over all experience that makes players bond in battle.

I never really PvE’d. I always found it boring since I had grinded it a lot with my guilds in MMOs. That’s where I found the PvP to be extremely fun and always dynamic. But I do agree, because I’ve seen PvP players discuss how PvE can improve coordination in PvP and better the team overall in these PvP instances.

> That should be the focus of Halo 5 for competitive players. If you really want the DMR and AAs gone you have to fundamentally change how Halo works so instead of driving players apart it actually builds player co=operation so they don’t have to rely on these tools when they have instead friend and allies backing them up.
>
> There you go some constructive observation

Had to re-type a lot of this since I lost the info. It was worth it, however, to show 343i how dedicated players like you and I are into bringing back a lot of old Halo features which can certainly keep this game’s composition intact.

5

Hey, Copperfield. Dont know if you remember me, but Im also on “that other forum” :wink:

Totally agree. Lone wolfing was lame in reach, and its lame here too. I remember times in halo 3 when my whole team would be riding on the elephant on sandtrap, cooperating and killing the enemy whenever they showed up.

You dont get that kind of teamwork anymore, and if it takes a gauss hog on exile just to do that, you know something is wrong.

6

In regards to the Scorpion you could really change the dynamics of the game on a even more dramatic effect if it takes say Three players to actually work it. A driver, a main Gun Operator and a Machine gunner. Now the rest of BTB team has to make a serious decision to protect such an asset because it’s taken three bodies off the main group formation to use such a platform’s power. The idea though behind the removal of the single Tank driver is to form component skills that broaden out each player’s skill set that they can take into the next match and find that perfect isync coordination that will end in a Friend invite or mics suddenly becoming key for surviving in BTB.

7

> In regards to the Scorpion you could really change the dynamics of the game on a even more dramatic effect if it takes say Three players to actually work it. A driver, a main Gun Operator and a Machine gunner. Now the rest of BTB team has to make a serious decision to protect such an asset because it’s taken three bodies off the main group formation to use such a platform’s power. The idea though behind the removal of the single Tank driver is to form component skills that broaden out each player’s skill set that they can take into the next match and find that perfect isync coordination that will end in a Friend invite or mics suddenly becoming key for surviving in BTB.

That feature would make things a lot more interesting. Back in the day, my clan members and I would always have a certain formation for defending these moveable behemoths. Almost always I was the driver, and we did have a gunner in it with one person in front of us and at least two people behind us. Though almost always we used this technique for the Wraith as the Scorpion was a lot easier to maneuver, and we pretty much only formed this style of defending the Scorpion/Wraith if we were in close-quarters.

Really improved our communication, skills and teamwork within the game. :slight_smile:

8

> Hey, Copperfield. Dont know if you remember me, but Im also on “that other forum” :wink:
>
> Totally agree. Lone wolfing was lame in reach, and its lame here too. I remember times in halo 3 when my whole team would be riding on the elephant on sandtrap, cooperating and killing the enemy whenever they showed up.
>
> You dont get that kind of teamwork anymore, and if it takes a gauss hog on exile just to do that, you know something is wrong.

Guess you know of my infamy/status.

Luckily in Reach, I didn’t have to lone wolf all that much since I had a good group of friends who many were also my clan-mates. Sadly, I did notice something quite odd about Reach and its gameplay. A lot of it felt more as going out as an individual and not working together as a team. Now that I do think of it, I do remember many occasions in which more than half of my team or the enemy’s team would just leave the game if one person or more lagged out or if they would start losing quickly.

Halo 4 is just way too much for lone wolfing, and in War Games I hear no communication almost at all. People just go their own separate ways killing others and dying and it’s almost as if the word “team” doesn’t exist in gameplay.

9

When people say that Halo 4 is a copying CoD it annoys me. CoD is and always will be an “I play for me” kind of game. There is no teamwork, all you worry about is staying alive and trying to get kills. Even the objective game types in CoD feel this way.

When I play Halo 4 I usually play with a group between 4-8. If there are 4 of us we do infinity slayer, swat or team snipers. When there are 6 or more we do BTB. We are in an XBOX Live party so that leaves up to two people unable to hear our conversations. Halo has always been a team game. If you play against a team that has coordination and trust in their teams abilities you do so much better.

The other night I was playing CTF with my wife and a few friends. My wife grabbed the flag and all she had to say was Chris and I new exactly what I needed to do. She was being chased by two enemies so I came and killed them for her. She did not have to turn around and fight or hide. She trusted I would protect her and she could run freely.

Part of what I feel is lacking in Halo 4 is BTB Objective. This game type required much more teamwork than regular objective because you had twice the number of people able to shoot at you. This promoted TEAM gameplay by having your team protect the carrier, picking them up in a warthog or mongoose, or having a pocket ghost protect the carrier.

The biggest problem with Halo 4 is not the balancing or the AA’s or custom loadouts. The biggest problem with Halo is the lack of team dynamics. You can play with two people one game and the next game they are your opponents. Ranking may be one of the problems with Team Dynamics. With no rank that changes your opponents every round you get poor matches. You never build bonds with your teammates because you see them for 1 game maybe 2 tops until they get switched to the opposing team or leave.

Going forward in the future I believe 343 needs to focus on two main things.

  1. Halo needs to be a team game. This needs to be promoted any way possible by either with a popup when you start matchmaking saying you do not have a mic plugged in. This will limit your in game experience. Or by bringing BTB Objective back. Most of the time team mates do not care if you die because they are protecting their KDR and as long as they live they call it a win. Nerfing the DMR and causing people to team shot more may also help.

  2. Forge and Custom Games. They are the most fun I have had in any Halo game. I love magnets in forge but many objects need more magnets and thin objects do not need 2 on each side of their sliver. Custom Game options need to be open. I do not care what setting you think we should be able to change. We should be able to change all of them.

10

This is the future for Halo multiplayer.

Original post in my thread here: Making AAs work in Halo

> I’ve been giving some more thought on the subject, and I think this would make a vast improvement to AAs as we know them now. What if they were given a purpose, and you must decide on a role to play in order to gain access to a particular AA. I will start by talking about Classes. Now I know what you’re thinking… “NO, classes do not belong in Halo”.
>
> This may sound crazy, but just here me out. It could take a while to explain, but I will try to keep it as brief as I can.
>
> What if, instead of having the ability to choose multiple Loadouts for which to spawn with in a match, particularly in gametypes which revolve around arena-style gameplay, we were only allowed the use of just one? This choice would have to be made at the start of your matchmaking career, and the “class” you choose will grant you unique items to give you proficiency in a particular field.
>
> Say, for example, you have these four basic classes: Recon, Assault, Support, Technician.
> (I would’ve called that last one Engineer, but then it would conflict with one of the Specializations… perhaps they should swap those names if all this was going to happen)
>
> In the arena, players are still required to spawn with the same starting weapons & work for PWs, but for each of these classes, you will be given priority for equipment most suited for your role. Certain power weapons, & AAs more importantly (particularly the greater powered AAs), will be given to you through Personal Ordnance after earning enough points towards it.
>
> With Tactical Packages & Support Upgrades however, the basic items can be unlocked by everyone through a progression system much like the one already in Halo 4, but here is where things get interesting. Once the highest possible rank is achieved in a basic class, it will then branch off into two Specializations unique to that class.
>
> Then you will have to progress through these Specializations to unlock their corresponding weapons (which can be used in other gametypes, but for the sake of balance in the arena, they will be disabled), Tactical Package/Support Upgrade, and a lesser powered AA to spawn with.
>
> The beauty of this however is not so much of what I went through above, but the ability to re-enlist into another class and/or Specialization (“re-rolling” as I would call it). If you wish to try something different, you can simply do this by accessing the Loadout/Career menu, and selecting another Class/Specialization.
>
> Note that by doing so, you will still keep all the basic items which you unlocked from progressing through the standard ranks, but you will lose your Specialization & all items which are linked to it, and if you want access to these items later on, you will have to re-role in the Class/Specialization and rank up through it again.
>
> What this will do is create an ongoing cycle of progressing & unlocking items, and will always give people something to work towards. It will actually give more meaning to the word “Infinity”.
>
> One of the other ideas with this is to control what players can have immediate access to, & I believe it would work out much better in Infinity Slayer. Encounters would be far less random because you can have a much better prediction of what your opponents move is going to be. You will also be given a visual indicator, so players can easily identify what your Class/Specialization is.
>
> Ultimately, classes will have a greater meaning in gametypes featuring large teams, & big open environments, which will give you full access to weapons & equipment for your chosen role. I believe this, as a whole, will create a much more immersive experience.
>
> …
>
> So, Like Sniping? The Recon class is for you.
>
> Maybe you prefer meeting head on with the enemy… with the Assault class, you can’t go wrong.
>
> Do you find it rewarding to provide assistance & defend objectives? Why not pick the Support Class?
>
> If you love vehicles & heavy weapons, perhaps the Technician class is the right choice to make.
>
> …
>
> …
>
> Although this would create a very interesting & fun, yet still a very much competitive IS experience in the arena… for those of you that prefers to keep things simple however, No problem!
>
> If you’d much rather put your raw skills & talent to the ultimate test, then gametypes which place restrictions on what players spawn with, so everyone starts equally to create the most basic arena experience, can do just that. AAs will be reverted to pickup equipment here, which players must fight for, much in the same way as PWs and the more traditional Powerups.
>
> For a more classic experience, AAs can be disabled to keep those die-hard Halo 2/3 fans happy.
>
> So, how do you feel about it… could this be what we’re missing, and be the way to make AAs work?

11

Keep up the great responses, everyone! If we keep it up like this, 343i may look through this thread and they can tell us they’ve been listening! :slight_smile:

12

AN ANALYSIS OF QUITTING AND HOW TO PREVENT IT
^^ Constructive Feedback

13

Integrate the maps from map packs to regular slayer playlist. And change to where ragnarak and exile arent the only maps in BTB. Campaign multiplayer if possible that would be great.

14

I’m not sure if this is possible but to make instant respawn an option and to be able to edit how long it takes to spawn, because I really want teabagging to be apart of the Halo experience. It makes Halo… Halo. :stuck_out_tongue:

15

All I gotta’ say is:

Ask what the fans want 343.

16

no instant respwan
no PV and camo on loadouts
no killcam
no power weapons on ordinances

17

> no instant respwan
> no PV and camo on loadouts
> no killcam
> <mark>no power weapons</mark> on ordinances

You know, I really do love the addition of some power weapons to change the tide of the games like rocket launches and fuel rods.

18

> > no instant respwan
> > no PV and camo on loadouts
> > no killcam
> > <mark>no power weapons</mark> on ordinances
>
> You know, I really do love the addition of some power weapons to change the tide of the games like rocket launches and fuel rods.

yeah who doesn’t like having a rocket launcher or a shotgun… but to many of anything doesn’t make it better, this is one the biggest problems in the game, the abundance of power weapons

19

> > > no instant respwan
> > > no PV and camo on loadouts
> > > no killcam
> > > <mark>no power weapons</mark> on ordinances
> >
> > You know, I really do love the addition of some power weapons to change the tide of the games like rocket launches and fuel rods.
>
> yeah who doesn’t like having a rocket launcher or a shotgun… but to many of anything doesn’t make it better, this is one the biggest problems in the game, the abundance of power weapons

I definitely agree here. There should be a lot less “OP”/“nooby” weapons than present in the game. H3/Reach was never like this. In my RPG gametype “Countries of Reach”, we had two rockets for each country (team) and both were max loaded. There were NO snipers as most of the versions are vehicle-based, and shotguns were available but not used that often since many of the fights were mid-to-long ranged.

20

> All I gotta’ say is:
>
> Ask what the fans want 343.

I feel like 343i has been trying this, but they need to try a lot harder. Sometimes trying just isn’t your best. And I’m no Bungie fanboy, but what I felt for them with what they did with the Halo community is that they babied us and really listened to us. As far as I know, I never ran into any issues in my years of Halo gaming I’ve never had issues with the franchise (only a few with Reach) up till H4 was released.