Constructive Criticism Thread

Games Halo Infinite
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As a person who liked almost none of the changes 343 made in Halo 4 and 5, I’m glad to say that I’m loving Halo Infinite’s multiplayer. It feels like the true successor to the original trilogy.

That’s why I don’t like seeing how overwhelmingly negative everybody is being about the cosmetics in this game. It’s an overall minor aspect of how I PERSONALLY enjoy this game, and I hate seeing it overshadow all of the tremendous good that’s been done in terms of gameplay (and aesthetic, which is another personal opinion.)

That said, I don’t think cosmetics and how you acquire them are irrelevant. I also agree that the system that has been implemented needs a serious overhaul. I’ll try to organized my issues in a Problem - Answer format, and I encourage anyone commenting here to do the same.

Problem 1: The XP system is frustrating and unrewarding. The 50xp per match is not enough and some of the challenges seem unfair.

Answer 1: Tie earning XP and completing challenges to the in-game metal system. Every metal should grant some base amount of XP. Easy metals grant less, like 1XP for a back smack; while more challenging should grant more, like 10XP for a triple kill. Additionally, challenges should be about earning a certain number of a particular metal. I’m honestly surprised this wasn’t the way it was implemented; halo has been a pioneer in rewarding interesting gameplay achievements, and this seems like an obvious extension.

Problem 2: Too many things are locked behind battle passes. Customization might as well not exist for those players unwilling to pay into the system.

Answer 2: This is a simple question of quantity. Obviously the multiplayer needs some kind of monetization scheme, and I think cosmetics are the least egregious way to do that. I would personally be fine with a breakdown like this.
25% of customization options available for free through progression system.
25% of customization options available as event giveaways and purchasable with ingame currency.
50% of customization options available through battle pass system.
Additionally, iconic sets, such as the Mark V and Mark VI Mjolnir should NEVER be tied to the battle pass or ingame currency. They should either be attained through progression, or campaign accomplishments. I’d include ODST in this category as well.

Problem 3: The armor core system is frustrating and unnecessary.

Answer 3: Get rid of the armor core system.

Problem 4: The color palette system is frustrating and unnecessary.

Answer 4: Allow customization of armor color. Most of the basic colors should be locked behind progression. Textures locked behind the battle pass system should be those that are shiny, textured, or specially colored.

I think these changes are reasonable. If your read through this entire thing, leave a comment and give your opinion.

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I should have made it clear, this thread isn’t restricted to discussion about cosmetics. Gameplay issues are welcome too.

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For a second I thought this was going to be a “you guys like cosmetics? okay, and?” post, but this was very well written.

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More basic colours should be available for free. Although we don’t know how many will be released via weekly challenges so I’ll reserve my judgement for now. There’s plenty of free stuff that will come over the games lifespan, it just feels dry now because it’s so early on. If the weekly challenges are always pants though I will critique them on the forums.

Armour cores I like because it allows for them to retain artistic designs and they mentioned it allows them to add in more content and easier. So I get it, even if it is annoying. You unlock a visor and it’s for an armour core you don’t use :frowning:

Wish they didn’t have restricted kits though.

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I think that certain armor sets, like the Yoroi, would look like garbage if they were pick and choose, but I think the majority of armor pieces work fine together. Enough that I don’t think the arbitrary restriction against certain combinations are worth it.

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I agree that a certain subset of colors should be available right off the bat. That goes for armor pieces and emblems too. Just that it’s such a small component of armor detail that most of them should just be free.

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Before I give any feedback I do want to make it a point to mention, this is by far 343i’s best game, the core gameplay is rock solid and it is incredibly fun to play. I’ve been playing Halo since CE first came out, (saying that makes me feel really old, or… depending on how you look at it, way too young to have been playing CE when it arrived) and even after all these years remain a big fan and happily call Halo my favorite game

With than being said, I can honestly say that the overall monetization scheme of this game feels incredibly disappointing , predatory , and off-putting .
I feel disappointed because I put blind faith in the devs, that they wouldn’t make a predatory system after everything that happened with Halo 5 and yet, this somehow feels worse than Halo 5’s. I’ll attempt to break it down as best I can:

  • Monetization pricing/separating things from the battle pass, I think is incredibly pressing that has and is fundamentally changing the way people think about Halo as a title. I have always thought about Halo as a game above the rest. However, because of the way this game has been monetized it literally make it feel like a non-battle royal warzone, Fortnite, or mobile game. It is crucial to immediately stop adding items to the store which are cooler than items in the battle pass. This is extremely off-putting, feels very money grubby and honestly rude, it literally feels like 343i’s way of giving fans the finger for buying the battle pass and everyone sees right through this.

  • Now I realize money needs to be made so how can this be done? Throughout this feedback I have included a bunch of different ways to monetize the multiplayer while still putting the player first, which is necessary anyway because if the player is not put first then they will stop playing, which then is bad for shareholders. A player first mentality geared towards value also creates a way to make content last longer and therefore elongates the lifespan of the game (10 years actually meaning 10 years). Right now It does not feel like there is any value in the battle pass. If the current multiplayer monetization system does not change the game’s player base will decrease and people likely just won’t buy anything.

  • For example, on day one I bought a credit pack to unlock the battle pass and future passes , then I see that items in the store are prohibitively more expensive than the pass and (for some) store items are way cooler than anything even in the pass… this just makes no sense, and - for lack of a better phrase - feels like you did me dirty. Everyone sees this as being incredibly greedy and personally I refuse to spend any more money on the game after this. I don’t even know that I will get the next battle pass, and to be perfectly honest I want a refund. Especially since I bought credits day one and now, they are cheaper than what I paid so, at the very least I feel I am owed $10.

  • The progression system, or of lack there of. More specifically there is no ranking system for playing the game in social, this (for most) is a bummer. There’s many things that could be done to duct tape and Band-Aid this but those options will never really fix the issue.

  • Another (arguably better) option is just to scrap it and follow the MCC template in a hybrid kind of way. Get rid of the store or make it’s only purpose used for buying the battle pass. Instead have all the customization items currently in and scheduled for the store (armors/coatings/effects, etc.) be the reward for completing capstone/seasonal challenges, but also make them more attainable. The goal here is to incentivize players to just play the game a lot, but not be pissed that they have to do it in a specific way. It should encourage player freedom and reward positive behaviors. Doing it like this also puts more emphasis on battle pass progression while working towards harder challenges (ie, capstone/premium seasonal ones) and lengthens the relevance of content. That would literally mean what’s been made already will last longer, the best part is people wouldn’t notice and would be happier because of the value and ability to obtain it through playing. There could be 10 weekly challenges then capstone, or just capstone and it’s based on something that promotes player freedom. Get rid of daily challenges and move to an XP per match system (calculated by match performance).

  • As for Ranking system and Battle pass/progression through both, an idea would be - every 10 ranks, the increasing XP needed for next rank progression resets almost like a mini prestige. This can be intertwined with the battle pass without making them conflicting things, it would also allow for some flexibility when changing which battle pass is turned on without changing rank. Most importantly, it would reward consistent progression, so people don’t feel it is taking too long.

  • What about the money? Charge more for the battle pass and people will buy it IF, AND ONLY IF THERE IS VALUE. Everything I mentioned above will add a significant amount of that. Final step is just charge a fair price, some people won’t buy anything regardless but I’d think most people will. Having a strong happy player base = millions of players buying something every 3ish months, which adds up pretty quick. 10 Years later those profits might amount to less than what is currently projected (even if savings from changes are taken into account) but if the monetization system doesn’t move away from its current model, those recent profit projections will be grossly overestimated.

If I recall the idea behind creating this system was to give players that ‘just one more game feeling’, however, the current setup literally does the opposite of that and makes it feel like a chore. If that ‘one more game feeling’ is what’s being sought after, just rely on the core gameplay to create this. It’s more than enough and the best bonus is rewarding players for enjoying it in their own way.

Lastly, to any devs/team members who that read this - Thank you! Thank you for hearing the community/fans. Thank you for all your hard work on this game and Thank you for creating something that truly is incredibly fun and special in so many ways. We all really appreciate it.

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Thanks BlitzGear02. While cosmetics don’t matter that much to me, I do still care, and I recognize that other can care more than me. I also think the progression system is important in keeping players engaged and feeling rewarded for their accomplishments. At least, that’s how it should be.

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Here is my gameplay feedback - they need to have the skewer sub in and out with the spartan laser just like the BR and Commando swap.

I personally don’t love the Skewer and want to use the laser on vehicles and aircraft.

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Personally I’m not just disappointed in/annoyed by the progression system and aggressive monetization, I’m also frustrated that it was prioritized over features that were PROMISED to us by 343, features that they were bringing back in order to gain back more trust from their fans.

Choosing to prioritize monetization and that side of things over splitscreen and forge sends a very clear message.

Aside from that, I’ve been loving the game. The one thing I wouldn’t mind seeing improved is the dialogue… holy crap it seems so cheesy! Halo 2 dipped a bit too far into the corny stuff, and Halo 3 struck a better balance (aside from the “to war” line from Keyes.) Reach finally figured it out just right and kept a serious tone. Would love to see more of that in Infinite.

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I think I agree with a lot of what you’ve said, but I absolutely disagree about the degree of the problem.

I think everybody on some level, dislikes the amount you pay influencing the gameplay experience, but Halo Infinite at least restricts it to cosmetics. Unlike Halo 5.

Also unlike Halo 5, there’s no RNG determining what you get. At least not directly like with the req packs in Halo 5.

There is RNG in the challenges you get, but that’s not nearly as bad IMO.

I can agree that the coolest stuff should be kept out of the store, and that purchasing a battle pass should almost alway be more rewarding than a simple in-store purchase.

In my opinion, the store should mostly be limited to niche customization options, like emblems of your favorite MLG clan. Things that would feel out of place in the typical progression system.

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How would you feel about a splaser rework so it functions similar to the skewer (no warm-up, long cooldown.)

I personally loved the splaser, but I can understand it’s removal. It was basically a no-fun button for vehicle users, and this game is chock full of those now (in a fairly balanced way IMO.)

I think the skewer works better in that regard, I just would have prefered that it was a laser rework rather than a replacement.

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Have they given an estimate on when forge will be available? If it’s out by the time the campaign drops, it’s all kosher, but some of my fondest memories are playing Jenga and Hurricane Katrina after school. :slight_smile:

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Love this post. Problem 2 is where I have the most trouble wrapping my head around the decision to monetize the unlocks. The Battle Pass system should not be infecting every game and especially not Halo. This is so disheartening to see Halo add this, even to the MCC. The biggest issue is that Halo’s armor customization was always the goal of multiplayer progression. Its why people grind in multiplayer. Its such a bad idea to now lock them down with a paywall to be able to unlock them the way you’ve always been able to earn them in other Halos. Its not the same as Call of duty or Fortnite when making your player look a certain way is an extra element of the mutiplayer that is allowed for purchase. Halo’s cosmetics IS the multiplayer and it can’t be treated the same way as it has been in other recent shooters. The unlocks all need to be available by earning them from progression, Fully customizable, not stuck in cores or color schemes, but indivicual colors and armor assignments. NO PAYWALLS. I would rather pay for the game than have to see this in plaguing the game I love. I’m sure most halo fan agrees.

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Seems like maybe next August? They said that co-op would come in “Season 2,” which has now been delayed to May 2022, and they said that forge would come in “Season 3,” which means if they follow through on their plans for each season to last three months, season three could be august 2022, if they decide that every season will be 6 months, then november 2022 for forge.

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That’s a big problem then. Forge especially was an important part of growing and maintaining Halo’s community.

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Agreed! Of course all the overpriced store items etc. were ready for an early launch, but the promised core gameplay features were delayed as soon as it was convenient.

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That’s an interesting take, although I respect that it’s important to you.
I think there’s a strong argument for the traditional monetization scheme of games (pay full price, get equal access to content), but unfortunately I think that ship has sailed for Halo Infinite.

Would you feel better if the coolest armor sets were still unlocked via progression only, with battle pass unlocks scattered between? I think that’s the most we can hope for…

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I think 343 should let every player start with 3 full sets of armor ( Halo 4’s “Warrior” Set, GEN1 Pilot and our current armor) so at the very least players still have a chance to customize their spartan’s.

The lack of player customization is hurting the game. whether it be emblems, armor coatings or armor, everyone feels like a copy and pasted spartan till you fork over some cash to “bling out” your spartan. I also feel the shops pricing is rather high for “chibis” and armor that should be included in the battle pass for free players.
If 343 are looking to add items to the store, why not make it worth it for the community. Make things that are ridiculous that people WILL pay for ( SPI armor, event theme’d armor, cross overs, patterns for armor, voice announcers, AI, voice’s for spartans, hell even more file share room).

Something that hasn’t been mentioned is I would like to see some drills related to vehicles and equipment.

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I guess it has unfortunately. I think if there were a larger amount of armors pertaining to Halo designs that were progression unlocks, it would be acceptable. For the Samurai armor that is completely besides Halo inspired and just a weird taste to have in the game, that seems like something that should be an extra, purchasable collection. I would have no problem with that.

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