Consequences for Quitters and AFK players!

This weekend I was thinking about some consequences for quitters and players who do not play (AFK) during a game.

AFK players:
1) Any player who finishes a game with zero kills, should not get any credits for the game. None, period! That’s an easy and effective punishment for screwing up the game for everyone else on your team.

2) For the dirt bags that would still do this after rule one was implemented. 343 should auto detect 0 credit games like they do credit boosters and let the ban hammer fly.

Quitters:
1) Quit before the match starts because you are a baby and do not like the map or game type gets you a credit reduction of 5,000 credits. Move to China or Venezuela if you can’t handle a democratic vote!

2) Quit during the game gets you a reduction of 3,000 credits plus no credits for that game, or challenges you completed prior to quitting.

3) Players booted for betraying other players, reduction of 5,000 credits plus no credits for the time you did play, or challenges you completed prior to quitting.
— This is to address those who lack the ability to accept the consequences of quitting by betraying just to get booted instead of being a man and taking the penalty for quitting in the first place!

4) Finally, for rule breakers of 1 & 2, reset all challenges to the prior game levels. (i.e., had 24 kills towards a 25 kill challenge, you still have only 24).

The side note to rule 3, would be that people would be more careful about spamming grenades if they were afraid of being booted for betrayals!

Some members of my family sometimes obtain a score of 0, even my wife. They are decent players (my wife can manage MVP sometimes), but in a team game against a well coordinated group, my team can get slaughtered (because of my family) and they may end up with 0 kills. Plus some games don’t involve kills.

Quitting definately should penalize you for 15min automatically. I am seriously sick of players quitting before a game starts. Sure, sometimes my father-in-law and I can win by 30 kills in a sniper game or something, but seeing my wife as the last remaining player in a BTB is just sad.

Booting should count as quitting, as some players will intentionally get betrayed by you.

This really wouldn’t solve anything. The 0 credits for people with 0 kills wouldn’t prevent idlers at all. It would only force them to get 1 kill then idle.

The quitting rule wouldn’t prevent people from quitting. It would encourage people to idle instead of quitting or playing the game.

As to that booting thing. No. Just no. I think a better fix would be to just turn off friendly fire.

There really is no simple solution to the quitters and idlers. Even if something was put into place, people would do their best to find away around it.

> 2) For the dirt bags that would still do this after rule one was implemented. 343 should auto detect 0 credit games like they do credit boosters and let the ban hammer fly.

It’s been proven that Reach Matchmaking autodetects and credit bans players for multiple 0-kill games. However, the system can’t detect AFKing itself, and this has led to a lot of false positives and wrongful bans on people who actually were playing.

> 3) Players booted for betraying other players, reduction of 5,000 credits plus no credits for the time you did play, or challenges you completed prior to quitting.

Which would work well if the Betrayal Booting system wasn’t a spectacular failure.

> 4) Finally, for rule breakers of 1 & 2, reset all challenges to the prior game levels. (i.e., had 24 kills towards a 25 kill challenge, you still have only 24).

This is a good idea.

> The side note to rule 3, would be that people would be more careful about spamming grenades if they were afraid of being booted for betrayals!

  • No, they wouldn’t.
  • It would do absolutely nothing to stop a teammate from stalking you, constantly depleting your shields, and getting you killed by the enemy. Which is extremely common in the Reach “community”.

I really like your thinking OP.

The only thing I would tweak is there needs to be an exception for objective game types, otherwise you’ll scare everyone into playing objective games like slayer - not good.

For objective games make it no kills AND no points scored for the objective. Some will focus on the objective and not kill at all.

For example, one guy can jump in the hill, while his buddy covers him from outside.

I think accounting for objective game types like that and it’s good to go.

Afk and quiting,sounds good they should be penalized,betrayal could be a problem as sometime people walk in front of the(insert anything they are not supposed to walk in front of) and just get a huge kick out of booting you.Does not happen alot,but enough that I could not support credit loss.

> This weekend I was thinking about some consequences for quitters and players who do not play (AFK) during a game.
>
> AFK players:
> 1) Any player who finishes a game with zero kills, should not get any credits for the game. None, period! That’s an easy and effective punishment for screwing up the game for everyone else on your team.
>
> 2) For the dirt bags that would still do this after rule one was implemented. 343 should auto detect 0 credit games like they do credit boosters and let the ban hammer fly.
>
> Quitters:
> 1) Quit before the match starts because you are a baby and do not like the map or game type gets you a credit reduction of 5,000 credits. Move to China or Venezuela if you can’t handle a democratic vote!
>
> 2) Quit during the game gets you a reduction of 3,000 credits plus no credits for that game, or challenges you completed prior to quitting.
>
> 3) Players booted for betraying other players, reduction of 5,000 credits plus no credits for the time you did play, or challenges you completed prior to quitting.
> — This is to address those who lack the ability to accept the consequences of quitting by betraying just to get booted instead of being a man and taking the penalty for quitting in the first place!
>
> 4) Finally, for rule breakers of 1 & 2, reset all challenges to the prior game levels. (i.e., had 24 kills towards a 25 kill challenge, you still have only 24).
>
> The side note to rule 3, would be that people would be more careful about spamming grenades if they were afraid of being booted for betrayals!

Afk players can’t be detected because of low skilled players playing with them so it would be unfair to those less skilled. Quitters should be penelazed but sometimes uncontrolable events can occur.(Red-rings, power goes off, lag ETC.)Not only that but i love when my enemy is handicapped.On the betrayals it would be unfair since accidents do happen even tho someone is at fault.Plus i like to get booted instead of quiting so i can re-assure myself i never quit.

> Plus i like to get booted instead of quiting so i can re-assure myself i never quit.

You teamkill people with the intention of being forced to leave the match, because you think that that is better conduct than simply quitting?

> AFK players:
> 1) Any player who finishes a game with zero kills, should not get any credits for the game. None, period! That’s an easy and effective punishment for screwing up the game for everyone else on your team.

Yes.

> 2) For the dirt bags that would still do this after rule one was implemented. 343 should auto detect 0 credit games like they do credit boosters and let the ban hammer fly.

Only in multiplayer. AFKers are harmless in firefight, it’s really just more points for everyone else.

> Quitters:
> 1) Quit before the match starts because you are a baby and do not like the map or game type gets you a credit reduction of 5,000 credits. Move to China or Venezuela if you can’t handle a democratic vote!

I will. Democracy’s a flawed theory anyway.

> 2) Quit during the game gets you a reduction of 3,000 credits plus no credits for that game, or challenges you completed prior to quitting.

Whatever. But then again I could give a -Yoink- about credits.

> 3) Players booted for betraying other players, reduction of 5,000 credits plus no credits for the time you did play, or challenges you completed prior to quitting.

How about this.

10,000 credit reduction and reduction of one kill from your score (just your score, not the team score), for the first betrayal. Which 99% of the time is all people will get in one game accidentally. Double each for a second betrayal in that same game. For every subsequent betrayal in the same game, 50,000 credit reduction and a two hour matchmaking ban. In the third straight game where you log at least one betrayal, you’re on probation for the rest of the day and from then on the penalty starts at stage 2.

The first penalty is also applied if you damage a teammate within 30 seconds after they just picked up a power weapon or got in a vehicle. It doesn’t stack however.

You’ll never completely stop these failed abortions but this would go a decent way I think.

> > Plus i like to get booted instead of quiting so i can re-assure myself i never quit.
>
> You teamkill people with the intention of being forced to leave the match, because you think that that is better conduct than simply quitting?
>
>

Basically if my teammates really do Stink i will not let myself nor my K/D suffer such “mental stress”. I rather be that -Blam- who goes around team killing than be known as the guy who quits games.

something like you said. I just dont think it needs to be so complicated.
-5000cR for getting no kills, lagging out, getting booted, quitting, dashboarding, and leaving the pregame lobby.
If that doesnt stop people I dont know what will.

Before you say “I was playing the whole game, and I didnt get any kills so I got a -5000cR!!! thats not fair”. If you are that big a discredit to your team, why should you be rewarded?
No cR for you.

It should not be a crime to be either:
A) A noob
How is the players online count going to increase with all the noob bashing? if all of you are such tryhards why dont you carry you team a little?
b) A person who needs to leave matchmaking for valid reasons
everyone has lives. the occasional quitting is not bad. but for tose who quit too much… let em have it.
but yes,nuke the betrayers etc. plz :3

> Move to China or Venezuela if you can’t handle a democratic vote!

How can you call that democratic if the first choice always wins when the voting numbers for choice 1 and, let’s say, choice 2 are the same?

> It should not be a crime to be either:
> A) A noob
> How is the players online count going to increase with all the noob bashing? if all of you are such tryhards why dont you carry you team a little?
> b) A person who needs to leave matchmaking for valid reasons
> everyone has lives. the occasional quitting is not bad. but for tose who quit too much… let em have it.
> but yes,nuke the betrayers etc. plz :3

I am sorry but me I’m fed up about players who leave because:

  1. The Map or the mode of game does not suit to them.
  2. Because ’ in Objective they lose the 1st round while there is another 3 round to be played.
  3. Because they fall on more hardly than them.

You say : A person who needs to leave matchmaking for valid reasons
everyone has lives
I say : I agree with you but me in that case there if I have something planned I launch no party knowing that I am going to penalize the other players

LEAVE GAME PENALIZE OTHER PLAYER ESPECIALLY in OBJECTIF !!! And many players with whom I play complains about it, I hope that will change with HALO 4.
IF I would decide on rules I would deprive 50,000 CR by gameleaving to the persons who leave regularly + ban to play during 1 week.

Sorry for my writting—> english are not my language.

The quitters really affect both teams, especially in 4 vs. 4 games.

On the small tight maps where it is easy to camp, than the team with less players has an advantage. Mainly because there are fewer people to kill at any given time. Also, a lot of 4 man teams seem to think it is a great time for them to rush the other team since they are down a player. My friends and I win a lot of these types of games because we recognize this behavior and capitalize on it.

If we are on the 4 man team, then we try to play more controlled and not run into obvious ambush spots.

A lot depends on whether we have a full party, or have to pick players up in matchmaking. If we are in a party, then we can usually win a majority of these games as well, but when we pick players up in matchmaking, than that is another story depending on whether they play smart or rush in to be slaughtered.

You all know the ones I am talking about. Oh I got 21 kills, but you also died 30 times, or they got 7 kills and died 16 times. Both are equally bad in my opinion.

On large open maps with lots of power weapons, then the 4 man team has a huge advantage especially if they have a player good with either the sniper or needle rifle. That player can keep the other team pinned down while the other three spam them with grenades and such. I have played in too many of these games, and it is very frustrating! Oh, and I do not usually quit either. I finished plenty of games here it was me against 4 player because my other thee teammates quit.

I am more interested in my K/D then credits, but credits is about the only way to punish a player short of banning them.

343 could also monitor players who frequently get negative credits, and ban them as well.

As for monitoring 0 kill games:

My guess is that most of the AFK players aren’t even watching the game, so they aren’t going to get 1 kill then stand around. They just join matchmaking, then try off the TV and go to school, work, bed, ect.

No matter how new or unpolished you are as a player, you are not going to play many games in a row where you do not get at least 1 kill.

Trust me, I remember very well what it was like the first few nights I play online in Halo 2. Brutal would be the best work for it, but I soon realized that I had to learn the maps and weapon locations, than I also needed to change my style of play to match my skills.

On betrayals, I usually will not boot someone for betraying me if they did not obviously do it. I always apologize if I betray someone, and usually don’t get booted. You betray me again, then usually you are gone.

Yes, the matchmaking voting is not purely democratic, but you knew that going in. Do I always get to play the types and maps I want to play. Hell no, but that is not a good reason to quit. I totally despise Elite Slayer and several of the maps, but I play the damn thing if that is what wins the most votes.

Thanks to those who have posted civil comments discussing this topic,

Additional thoughts after rereading the posts:

Objective games are a totally different topic.

A) Too many people in there playing Slayer while most are trying to complete the objective. Those people are obvious in the post-game report and find their way onto my avoided player list!

B) I think people that play objective games understand that betrayals are highly likely, and just is just a fact of so many people in close proximity to each other. People also need to start being more careful about spamming grenades, rockets, etc. Also refer to A as to why they are betraying people. If you have a full party, then it’s highly unlikely that you will boot someone on your team for betraying you.

C) If you aren’t going into this game type with a full party, then it is really a crap shoot as to whether you will win or not. Especially if you are going up against a full party. Chance are, you are going to lose far more than you will ever win.

AFK in Firefight does affect the other players. It makes it incredibly hard to get through the whole set when you are a player or 2 down. Especially when working on completing challenges like head shots and assists. Go AFK in score attack, and stop using our game to boost credits and possible commendations like not dying!

You AFK in my game, and I will make sure you get killed because I will intentionally draw enemies to you during at least 3 waves so you can’t get credits for not dying.

Cheating is cheating regardless of whether you are modding, manipulating the connection, or using other players to boost your credits, etc. Go play the cheaters game COD, and leave Halo to the non-cheaters. That is one thing that I really appreciated about Bungie and 343, the cheating has dropped significantly with each new game. Hopefully that trend will continue with Halo 4.

The real problem are those that have found a way to circumvent the banhammer and still AFK. They get a couple of kills, and then go hide.

There was a game I remember in FireFight Arcade. It was just me and a Forerunner. It was on holdout. While I played and scored a massive total, he used the jetpack and went underneith the map. When I went down to see what he had done, he had of course gotten a few kills, then was sitting on a beam. If he fell he would fall to his death. AND I made it a point every round to knock him off. And he would just go back and camp there to get the max Perfectionist Commendation. I have to wonder if he was even there or it was just a bot programmed to fly there. I’ll never know, but I’ll never play with him again that’s for sure.

You can’t be that black and white with this issue…

before I start, I have never intentionally quit a match - although i have had a few dropouts due to a) power cuts (live in fairly rural area), b) random internet connection interruption during host migration. I am a fairly casual player who has his good and bad days with Halo, and I don’t really care about ny overall K/D. I don’t like it when other people quit, and don;t do it myself for that very reason but, in all honesty, sometimes i really can’t blame them for quitting

As long as the game features no social playlists and a poor matchmaking system (completely unbalanaced teams/players, evenwhen ‘Skill’ search parameter is on), then in a number of cases you can’t blame some people for quitting:

a) 5th match in a single 2/3 hour session where you are matched against a team of 3/4 who only ever vote for sword base, lock down the power weapons, and just spawn-kill for the duration. Yes it’s a valid tactic, but you shouldn’t be matched against a team of unpartied casual players/‘noobs’

b) Playing an objective-type match where the opposing team decides to intentionally play keep away with the objective purely so they can use the match to pathetically pad their K/D ratio.

Both of these happen on a regular basis and are going to make people quit, especially when a casual player has specifically selected to play against people of their own skill level and yet are consistently matched up against parties of experienced players who all have a K/D of 1.5 minimum, or teams of players who play to boost K/D at the expense of targetting casual players, rather than through anything meaningful.

There are simple fixes to this - don’t record an overall K/D so it’s playlist-specific (taking away the point of being exploiting objective-type matches), and introduce a Casual playlist of mixed gametypes where stats are not recorded.

As for betrayals - there is no way that penalising is viable as it is too easy to accidentally betray someone. I have never betrayed intentionally, yet have been booted a fair number of times as a result of:

  • accidental grenade stick to camoflaged player between me and visible enemy,
  • accidental grenade stick/rocket/plasma launcher/spartan laser to someone running in front of me
  • accidental close-range one-shot from shotgun to team mate coming round a corner directly in front of me when i was expecting an enemy due to seeing a red dot on map
  • people intentionally running in front of my power weapon/vehicle with the intent of getting betrayed just so they can boot me and get the power weapon/vehicle for themselves.

> This weekend I was thinking about some consequences for quitters and players who do not play (AFK) during a game.
>
> AFK players:
> 1) Any player who finishes a game with zero kills, should not get any credits for the game. None, period! That’s an easy and effective punishment for screwing up the game for everyone else on your team.
>
> 2) For the dirt bags that would still do this after rule one was implemented. 343 should auto detect 0 credit games like they do credit boosters and let the ban hammer fly.
>
> Quitters:
> 1) Quit before the match starts because you are a baby and do not like the map or game type gets you a credit reduction of 5,000 credits. Move to China or Venezuela if you can’t handle a democratic vote!
>
> 2) Quit during the game gets you a reduction of 3,000 credits plus no credits for that game, or challenges you completed prior to quitting.
>
> 3) Players booted for betraying other players, reduction of 5,000 credits plus no credits for the time you did play, or challenges you completed prior to quitting.
> — This is to address those who lack the ability to accept the consequences of quitting by betraying just to get booted instead of being a man and taking the penalty for quitting in the first place!
>
> 4) Finally, for rule breakers of 1 & 2, reset all challenges to the prior game levels. (i.e., had 24 kills towards a 25 kill challenge, you still have only 24).
>
> The side note to rule 3, would be that people would be more careful about spamming grenades if they were afraid of being booted for betrayals!

Penalties are only as good as the possibilities of detection and verifying those possibilities for accuracy. with that said, I have a few, minor, modifications:

AFK players:

  1. Any player who finishes a game with zero kills over three consecutive matches, should receive a time suspension of twenty minutes. After five games, credit retraction of all five games. While I know it is difficult to ultimately determine these conditions at all, there are players that routinely will do badly to the effect of 0 kills. They simply enjoy the idea of walking around a battlefield wearing armor… and yes, they are grown men and women. however, Matchmaking was designed for a competitive and relaxed atmosphere, this is why I would like to see a semi-return of designated “competitive” playlists left to discretion of 343 and non-competitive, “I want to do crazy warthog stunts all match” playlists. Just my .02.

  2. There are still legit players that will still find the means to abuse rule 1, rule 2 addresses nothing other then a possible means to retaliate further against 343. Nothing good can come of this.

Quitters:

  1. "Failure to spawn in at the beginning of a match up to and including, one minute of match duration warrants a credit reduction of x credits/match/repeated offense. I’m not familiar if its possible for 343 to detect if someone bails on a lobby, but I’m sure its possible, on some level, to log match duration and players in a match, that if a 3v4 has occurred within one minute of the match, they could possibly take action. Once again though, I don’t know what 343 has up their sleeve and what they can/cannot do.

  2. "Quits, occurring after 1 minute match time, gets you a reduction of 3,000 credits in addition to no credits for that game/challenges you completed prior to quitting.

  3. Players booted at any time for betraying other players: No game credits for match, reduction of 3,000 credits from personal credit pool/challenges you completed prior to quitting, and a 15 minute ban from matchmaking upon third consecutive match offense.
    –The reasoning behind my addition to this one in particular is due to my personal matchmaking experience that betrayals have been done 90% of the time intentionally and furthermore, how on earth can a player be banned for a one time betrayal ban when the sword guy decided to run around a corner right as I tossed a nade on countdown? That is just an example as it hasn’t happened to me.

  4. Good as is.