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> > > > > wouldn’t the competitive tryhard -Yoink- crappers go into the casual section anyway because… well because their -Yoinks!-. Take people who farm in warzone for example. Warzone used to be heaps fun and I played that non-stop. But now it’s just. the fun died out because of people. People love to ruin the fun in games for casuals like me. Heck the whole ranking thing in halo 5 with gold and diamonds has turned me into someone I dont wanna be (competitive) and I hate it. I 100% agree with OP. These MLG and casual sections would be nice to have. Halo 5 is just way too competitive. I never noticed any competitiveness in halo reach or 4.(didn’t play CE, 2 or 3 enough to care about their multiplayers) But in halo 5 it’s just… damn. And yet halo 5 is still my favorite game. And probably always will be.
> > > > >
> > > > > PS. no one’s going to agree with me when I spread my OPINION here but I think all ranked playlists should become social as of now. No more competing for golds or onyx. Let’s make it fun again. Or at least have the ranked section then social section. Cause like I said these ranks are making me be someone I don’t wanna be. I get a gold 5 after qualifying in breakout then get all aggressive and crap just to get that gold 6 up to a platinum but go down to a gold 5 and then 4. Getting super rage and then realizing wow this isn’t me I play for fun like I used to. I shouldn’t care
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > You open your post with an untrue stereotype that represents a portion of the community that isn’t even competitive. And I’m supposed to take your opinion seriously?
> > > >
> > > > And you’re trying to blame the fact that you suddenly cared about ranking on other people? Like, it’s THEIR fault that you wanted a higher rank? Unbelievable.
> > >
> > >
> > > yes calm your snake down its my own opinion not yours. I aint aware of any stereotypes okay trust me. i read your post and agree with you. although i would prefer none of the playlists being rank i full out dont care either way. Not everyone is bad but there are some serious mega a holes out there. although i was too harsh on my post bad day thats on me. and no your not supposed to take my opinion seriously hence it being my opinion you know. the blaming one was true though. i get so ahead of myself last night. will be taking a break off halo 5 and in the next month or so i’ll be back to my normal happy self and i wont even care about farmer, or tryhards or mlgs or lag or ranks.
> >
> >
> > My friend, don’t get me wrong, you can have any opinion you want. If you think Halo would be better off without a ranking system, hey, that’s fine.
> >
> > But opening with insults didn’t help. And I understand you weren’t having the best of days, which is also fine. I just didn’t see it as okay that a player should be insulted because of the type of Halo they like to play.
>
>
> That is on me I get I should actually control my anger a little more cause that’s like if someone insulted me for liking to play halo casual. Gotta make an impression of kindness. They replaced the word with yoink but it wasnt too bad of a word. Not like an f bomb or c bomb. But my apologies nonetheless mate 
You’re good. Its not entirely your fault I came in here guns blazing lol.
Halo 4 was too casual and CoDesque. Halo 5 encourages partying up and pubstomping in clans and full teams because the matchmaking algorithm sucks unless you fit what I just described.
Competitive isn’t the problem it is how 343 has handled it. Go back to Halo 2. That was competitive, but popular, but there was no partychat and playing online wasn’t an exercise in dealing with immature -Yoink-. Go to Halo 3. Party chat still wasn’t huge, but there was ranked and social stratification. You want ranked you got it go play it and be with others who are doing the same thing as you. You want social go play with those guys.
People need to learn that it isn’t the fault of either main crowd, be you casual, competitive, or someone who goes back and forth. This is 343 being unable to address the needs of both audiences competently and catering to one instead of the other, and if you ask me they can’t even do that right. I find the competitive play inherently unfair due to the poor matchmaking and terrible spawns and Halo 4’s balance was terrible for the time it was actually relevant.
Realize that this is the devs needing feedback and not “the game is for casuals or sweaties”
Halo 5 has the competitive scene down, God forbid if they ever mess with it. However, OP is correct that they need to throw casual just a little more love. We really need unranked team slayer to make a decent amount of people happy.
Also, @OP, Overwatch is very fun, but your reasoning is half correct. OW is simple in terms of the goal (get this point, escort this thing), but so is Halo (kill these guys, get this point, score this goal). Halo’s complexity comes from movement, map awareness, weapon knowledge and gunfight skills. OW is just as complex in very different ways (what character counters what character, who will benefit the team the most in this portion of the map, what position do I need to fill). Believe me, OW is going to become hyper competitive very soon.
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> For example, over watch have over 7 million registered accounts, wherever I go on social media I see someone is playing it or doing fan art for it because it’s a game for everyone!
I played the beta of Overwatch and was really disappointed for a few reason:
- shooting enemies is not gratifying because they don’t flinch or react to getting shot at least not that I could tell.
- it was one of the most unbalanced MP shooter games I’ve ever played.
- Very heavily depends on teamwork , so if you are a solo player, Good luck.
The only thing worse is Battleborn and it being a MOBA.
Obviously a lot of people like it. But I think in part that is due to it being a Blizzard game and the hype of it.
youre kidding right? halo 1-3 were halos prime when it was by far the most popular. and those were its most competitive games. reach and the catering to casuals and dumbing down of halo is what is destroying the franchise. halo reach, 4, and 5 are way less competitive and much less popular
I just want them to fix the banhammer and its problem with wrongful bans.
Social should have no hidden rank and banhammer needs to be less aggressive in social playlists.
And I really want to see them do an Action Sack playlist once the Warzone Firefight update is out.
And actually, just bring in more social gametypes.
I’d love to see the Juggernaut gametype come back.
A little more love to the casual side could go a long way.
> 2533274831961512;22:
> Halo 4 was too casual and CoDesque. Halo 5 encourages partying up and pubstomping in clans and full teams because the matchmaking algorithm sucks unless you fit what I just described.
>
> Competitive isn’t the problem it is how 343 has handled it. Go back to Halo 2. That was competitive, but popular, but there was no partychat and playing online wasn’t an exercise in dealing with immature -Yoink-. Go to Halo 3. Party chat still wasn’t huge, but there was ranked and social stratification. You want ranked you got it go play it and be with others who are doing the same thing as you. You want social go play with those guys.
>
> People need to learn that it isn’t the fault of either main crowd, be you casual, competitive, or someone who goes back and forth. This is 343 being unable to address the needs of both audiences competently and catering to one instead of the other, and if you ask me they can’t even do that right. I find the competitive play inherently unfair due to the poor matchmaking and terrible spawns and Halo 4’s balance was terrible for the time it was actually relevant.
>
> Realize that this is the devs needing feedback and not “the game is for casuals or sweaties”
I was just thinking that actually, you can replace the first word of the bolded sentence by many things gone wrong in past Halo’s, and the sentence will still be close to truth.
By the way, I wholeheartedly agree with your entire post. There are many aspects of the game that became bad because 343i only partially addressed a concern or addressed it in the laziest way you could imagine (region servers, playlists, quit bans, competitive/social equilibrium, sandbox balance, etc.).
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> Halo had 6 years of being based strictly around casual gameplay and we saw our sharpest declines in population ever.
>
> This forum not only is blatantly ignorant when it comes to competitive gameplay, many of you are PROUDLY ignorant. You refuse to listen to any intellectual competitive argument and instead throw all competitive players into this “MLG Try hard, KD ratio loving” stereotype that is honestly fairly ridiculous.
>
> It seems you guys believe a fellow Halo fan is entitled to whatever opinion they want… so long as it isn’t one that promotes competitive Halo.
>
> I’ve witnessed dozens of threads similar to this get so much support its downright troubling.
>
> What if I told you competitive want the same things you guys do? What if I told you the competitive crowd was asking for a balanced sandbox as far back as Halo 2? What if I told you the competitive crowd has no qualms against a compelling campaign, splitscreen, Grifball, infection, and the like? Would any of you believe me? Not many of you.
>
> What if I told you that the highest levels of competitive Halo, the players essentially just want a balanced arena shooter? You know, the thing that Halo was for nearly a decade before Reach and 4 tried to out-Call of Duty Call of Duty itself.
>
> Competitive Halo didn’t kill Halo. Halo isn’t dead. If you are curious as to why many people turned away from Halo, perhaps you should look at the games that turned away more fans than any other Halo game. I’m talking about Reach, Halo 4, and, for other reasons, MCC.
>
> Ignorance is OK to a certain degree. Wilfully remaining ignorant and relying on stereotypes to form your opinions just makes you look as ridiculous as you sound.
You said what needed to be said and I applaud you for it.
I think the issue is that not enough waypointers actually bother to research the history of competitive Halo, if they did they would realise why Halo almost died after Reach and 4.
This is like the third time in a week I have said to people research the history of competitive Halo, this argument is really becoming an unnecessary issue.
> 2533274849470050;6:
> The thing is in my opinion halo reach and halo 4 very nearly killed off the entire franchise. Halo 5 has breathed some badly needed life back into halo. I’m not very good but I enjoy hard fought games wether I win or lose and I haven’t enjoyed halo this much since halo 3.
>
> as for the pro/competetive scene, I’m so thankful that it’s back and popular on twitch etc, I really really enjoy watching the best in the business go at each other. Now you may wish to call me a tryhard or whatever but I admit I’m trash and know I will never be pro/competetive but that’s not the point. I enjoy playing ranked games and I enjoy watching the elite play halo. Halo’s back, baby and I’m loving it.
I’m with this person. I couldn’t disagree with you more. Reach and Halo 4 catered almost only to a social crowd. There wasn’t enough competition to keep me playing the game. Halo 5 is finally bringing back some of its old fanbase. I understand you guys like to think Halo should only be casual, but that’s not how Halo was when I started playing the game.
Overwatch is a more competitive game than h5 though.
> 2533274848763524;29:
> > 2533274849470050;6:
> > The thing is in my opinion halo reach and halo 4 very nearly killed off the entire franchise. Halo 5 has breathed some badly needed life back into halo. I’m not very good but I enjoy hard fought games wether I win or lose and I haven’t enjoyed halo this much since halo 3.
> >
> > as for the pro/competetive scene, I’m so thankful that it’s back and popular on twitch etc, I really really enjoy watching the best in the business go at each other. Now you may wish to call me a tryhard or whatever but I admit I’m trash and know I will never be pro/competetive but that’s not the point. I enjoy playing ranked games and I enjoy watching the elite play halo. Halo’s back, baby and I’m loving it.
>
>
> I’m with this person. I couldn’t disagree with you more. Reach and Halo 4 catered almost only to a social crowd. There wasn’t enough competition to keep me playing the game. Halo 5 is finally bringing back some of its old fanbase. I understand you guys like to think Halo should only be casual, but that’s not how Halo was when I started playing the game.
No. Halo shouldn’t focus entirely on one group or the other. Halo 3 had it right, just give the fans ranked and social playlists to satisfy everyone.
From my personal experience, Halo was a fun game until Halo 4 (well, my personal favorite and most enjoyable game). But since Halo 5, the competitiveness had not killed the game, I say it had made it less enjoyable. Now you can’t enjoy a match of Arena/Warzone without a lot of people being campers/farmers/etc.
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> > 2533274848763524;29:
> > > 2533274849470050;6:
> > > The thing is in my opinion halo reach and halo 4 very nearly killed off the entire franchise. Halo 5 has breathed some badly needed life back into halo. I’m not very good but I enjoy hard fought games wether I win or lose and I haven’t enjoyed halo this much since halo 3.
> > >
> > > as for the pro/competetive scene, I’m so thankful that it’s back and popular on twitch etc, I really really enjoy watching the best in the business go at each other. Now you may wish to call me a tryhard or whatever but I admit I’m trash and know I will never be pro/competetive but that’s not the point. I enjoy playing ranked games and I enjoy watching the elite play halo. Halo’s back, baby and I’m loving it.
> >
> >
> > I’m with this person. I couldn’t disagree with you more. Reach and Halo 4 catered almost only to a social crowd. There wasn’t enough competition to keep me playing the game. Halo 5 is finally bringing back some of its old fanbase. I understand you guys like to think Halo should only be casual, but that’s not how Halo was when I started playing the game.
>
>
> No. Halo shouldn’t focus entirely on one group or the other. Halo 3 had it right, just give the fans ranked and social playlists to satisfy everyone.
But it does already doesn’t it?
When I’ve had enough of arena playlists or at the end of the night I’ll crouch jump into a game of Btb, warzone assault, or whatever social playlists are on that week to relax.
I can see how the competitiveness can drive people away (and man, 343’s love of everything pro I think really pushes that feeling). But competitiveness is ok, IF matchmaking were done properly, everything would be fine. That’s the biggest issue I see. I’ve seen games where bronze players get matched against gold and even diamond players. It happens a lot. No one will get better if they keep playing overwhelmingly good or bad competition. Even the new focused search settings don’t seem to help at all (maybe they help with geography but definitely not with skills matching, those should be separate search preferences). The awful matchmaking is what will kill this game.
Competitiveness hasn’t killed Halo, it’s just that 343i hasn’t found the right balance between competitive and casual yet.
For me, Halo 3 nailed multiplayer just right. If you wanted casual gaming it was there, if you wanted competitive gaming it was also there, both in equal measure to please all crowds. This is what 343i should be aiming for, good symmetrical and asymmetrical map design, symmetrical and asymmetrical game types, game types that are fun to play even if they aren’t super serious, a ranking system that brings equally skilled players together and isn’t reset every month, good communication to it’s community, also to listen to all of the community not just cherry pick it’s favourites.
Halo has always been competitive way back in the days of Halo 2, it was its balance of competitive and social that really made it a game worth playing.
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> I remember back in the day when youtube channels were made just for halo because how much fun they have playing it and how everyone injoys it because it’s fun and simple, now day’s sense halo 4 came out and how much similar it looked to cod people start to loose interest and move on into new things. Halo back in the day had both competitiveness and casual fun gametypes in two different sections, now days halo is all about being sweaty and play on those hideous small looking maps. Every new game that is released and it’s about fun casual gameplay people go insane about it and play it non stop. For example, over watch have over 7 million registered accounts, wherever I go on social media I see someone is playing it or doing fan art for it because it’s a game for everyone! Just like how halo used to be. Halo is in no shape of being too focused on a competitive gameplay because it’s an exclusive game for a console that is barely selling well, you need to show how fun and simple the game is so that everyone can injoy it. Im not saying competitiveness in halo should go away, it’s been apart of halo sense ages but what I’m saying is they should do like they did in old halos where they put an mlg section for competitive players and a section for casuals and make the gameplay more simple and fun, not just completely ignore the fun aspects of the game and shove competitive gameplay into everyone’s throat like in halo 5 arenas.
100% agree
> 2533274859620752;35:
> Competitiveness hasn’t killed Halo, it’s just that 343i hasn’t found the right balance between competitive and casual yet.
But will they ever? They had three chances.
“____ killed Halo” threads killed Halo.
> 2533274816299345;8:
> Just play WZ Assault. Thats what i do at least.
The player base shouldn’t be subjected to playing a certain game mode just to escape the competitive nature of the game, if 343 have managed to alienate the player base so much to make them avoid certain game types then they have truly -Yoinked- up, I’ve made this point on multiple occasions before, the competitive players and the more social players need to be more prominently divided, the casuals have no fun again playing those who are competitive, the competitive players shouldn’t want to play the casuals, that just makes them bullies, and not competitive, rather just a bunch of -Yoinks- who take solace in beating those who are less skilled.
Rant over.
But 343 need to know that a social side as extensive as the competitive side is desperately in need of implementation