Classic Halo or -Yoink-

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*Original post. Click at your own discretion.

Dont get it twisted. The community is not split 50/50 on these things. A large portion of the older fanbase has left halo for good and are either completely over it, or are silently waiting to see how infinite turns out.

What you are seeing on this forum and on youtube is the vocal minority of new fans that actually like the mediocrity of what halo has become and are vocally trying to keep the game from reverting back to its glorious state.

I mean honestly, anybody that thinks halo 4 was an acceptable halo game has bad artistic taste. period. these are the same type of people that think mcdonalds is an acceptable type of food to put in your body.

same thing goes for halo 5’s storyline, art style and spartan abilities. anybody that defends these has very low quality taste.

these things are not good.

I dont want to hear any art is subjective nonsense that will inevitably get posted here. thats only true to a certain degree. personal preference is one thing but quality of art is another entirely. if you cant understand what made halo 1-3 and reach all masterpieces then you are not a true halo fan.

there is a reason halo is not nearly as popular as it used to be and thats because the newer games are not very good. its as simple as that. stop defending them and stop trying to get the devs to compromise to your wishes. if they capitulate with new fans at all this could be the final nail in the coffin. Infinite has to be a perfect halo game.

If you really love the new stuff thats fine and dandy, but keep it to yourselves. you are part of the reason halo has become a mediocre franchise.

Trying to act like you’re making a valid point and then turning around and saying ‘I’m right, you’re wrong and anyone who disagrees with my vision is stupid’ isn’t going to get you very far.

I personally loved Halo 4’s story (how does that have anything to do with McDonald’s? I feel like you were grasping at straws when you made that comparison), the multiplayer wasn’t that great, but the story was pretty good. It did have parts that could have been delivered much better though. Halo 5 however really dropped the ball. The story required you to look outside of the game for way too many answers to the questions we were asking. That’s never a good thing. Overall, I think the art for both 4 and 5 were great, but not something a lot of people would have put for Halo considering it came from a fantasy cartoon yet realistic like design. A lot of people seem to think more realistic art styles aren’t Halo, despite a lot of people talk about wanting to feel more immersed in Halo.

Art is quite subjective, just like fun is subjective. Something can’t just NOT be subjective because everyone will have different takes on it. And if you can’t accept other people might like what you don’t, then maybe you should take a break from the internet. What you have is an opinion, and you have a right to it, but opinions are always subjective.

The newer games have their rough patches (especially 5) but don’t throw them under the bus because you don’t like them as other people may very well enjoy them. You have the right to voice your concerns and dislike for any game that is released. You do NOT however, have any right to tell someone they are not allowed to have fun or enjoy something just because you don’t like it. Plus, you should never try to be the voice for those you feel might share your view. I don’t doubt there are others out there that dislike Halo 4 and 5, but please, let THEM express their dislike if they so wish.

There is probably many reasons why Halo isn’t as popular as it once was and it’s more than just not being what Halo USED to be. The generation that grew up with Halo lost interest because of many reasons or simply had to stop playing because of every day life activities. Or perhaps they lost interest in gaming and so even their kids don’t play games. A lot of people are focusing on work so they can afford the luxury of playing games when they have free time. And in general, genres come in and out of style, so do long standing series. I used to have 14 people always ready to play Reach with me and Halo 3 after school, now a days they spend only about 2 hours online before they get off because they have other things to do before they go to bed. So, no, popularity declines aren’t always just because ‘the game isn’t what it used to be’ and I will defend games and developers when people throw flak at them for not doing things the way they dictate. I do so because I enjoy what is being done and even when I don’t, I defend them because I want to see them learn and grow from things they did that failed. I let them know when I’m not happy with the product, but I don’t crap on them because they failed to meet expectations.

I agree, to an extent. Infinite will never be a perfect game because someone will always find something they don’t like about it. They can’t tailor games towards one irate individual who voices their concerns on the internet. However, I would like for Infinite to be a great game that I will enjoy for years just like I did Reach. Just like I do all the Halo games.

That’s rather hypocritical, don’t you think? How is it fair for you to talk down to others that their opinions are wrong and then tell them they’re not allowed to share how they feel? If you hate what they’ve done, that’s fine, you don’t have to like it, but don’t tell people they’re not allowed to like it because you don’t.

<mark>This post has been edited by a moderator. Please refrain from making non-constructive posts.</mark>

*Original post. Click at your own discretion.

“I personally loved Halo 4’s story”

this is exactly what im talking about.

there are things that I personally love that I understand are not high quality. I understand I love them for strange specific reasons and that they are not generally accepted as being good.

I can separate the two of them. You cannot.

"There is probably many reasons why Halo isn’t as popular as it once was and it’s more than just not being what Halo USED to be. The generation that grew up with Halo lost interest because of many reasons or simply had to stop playing because of every day life activities. "

this is pure delusion. Halo isnt as popular because the games aren’t nearly as good anymore. thats the only reason. The generation that grew up with halo has moved on because we dont like the new games. its as simple as that.

Gotta agree with AgentMaryland93- this doesn’t sound like a constructive or useful conversation starter.

I prefer old Halo as well. But one thing that I think that people get twisted is that even if Infinite brings back a lot of the mechanics, tone and feel of classic Halo (also, which precisely which classic Halo?), it still won’t be the games you know and love. Just like Halo 3 isn’t Halo 2 and Halo 2 isn’t Halo CE. So while I wholeheartedly agree with the sentiment that Halo would be better if it went for being more similar to the OT in art and game design, I’m not interested in a remake of Halo 3 that isn’t an Anniversary game that I know isn’t happening.

Change happens, and while it’s definitely not all for the better, if all you want is exactly classic Halo you can go buy MCC today. Nobody’s taking those games away from you and 343, love them or hate them, have actually done pretty well at keeping them alive in comparison to almost every other similar type of games that came out as their contemporaries.

We don’t represent the majority of Halo players let alone Xbox and PC gamers on this forum, and you’re right to say we’d be kidding ourselves to pretend we do. But hopefully what we do represent is the impassioned core of the Halo fanbase who can have civilized and constructive conversations that 343i can take a peek on for ideas and, again, constructive criticism.

It’s important to approach these conversations with good faith and with a bit of an open mind. If we don’t, it won’t take long for Waypoint to turn into a flame-war troll playground. And -Yoink!- already exists to be that place on the internet.

<mark>This post has been edited by a moderator. Please refrain from making non-constructive posts.</mark>

*Original post. Click at your own discretion.

“Gotta agree with AgentMaryland93- this doesn’t sound like a constructive or useful conversation starter.”

I dont really care. the new fans have done more damage to the series with their crap opinions than I could possibly ever do.

It’s just a game, why you have to be mad?

Seriously OP, the level of anger you have over this is kind of unhealthy. Let people enjoy the video games they like and stop being a boomer.

> 2533274879757912;2:
> Trying to act like you’re making a valid point and then turning around and saying ‘I’m right, you’re wrong and anyone who disagrees with my vision is stupid’ isn’t going to get you very far.
>
> I personally loved Halo 4’s story (how does that have anything to do with McDonald’s? I feel like you were grasping at straws when you made that comparison), the multiplayer wasn’t that great, but the story was pretty good. It did have parts that could have been delivered much better though. Halo 5 however really dropped the ball. The story required you to look outside of the game for way too many answers to the questions we were asking. That’s never a good thing. Overall, I think the art for both 4 and 5 were great, but not something a lot of people would have put for Halo considering it came from a fantasy cartoon yet realistic like design. A lot of people seem to think more realistic art styles aren’t Halo, despite a lot of people talk about wanting to feel more immersed in Halo.
>
> Art is quite subjective, just like fun is subjective. Something can’t just NOT be subjective because everyone will have different takes on it. And if you can’t accept other people might like what you don’t, then maybe you should take a break from the internet. What you have is an opinion, and you have a right to it, but opinions are always subjective.
>
> The newer games have their rough patches (especially 5) but don’t throw them under the bus because you don’t like them as other people may very well enjoy them. You have the right to voice your concerns and dislike for any game that is released. You do NOT however, have any right to tell someone they are not allowed to have fun or enjoy something just because you don’t like it. Plus, you should never try to be the voice for those you feel might share your view. I don’t doubt there are others out there that dislike Halo 4 and 5, but please, let THEM express their dislike if they so wish.
>
> There is probably many reasons why Halo isn’t as popular as it once was and it’s more than just not being what Halo USED to be. The generation that grew up with Halo lost interest because of many reasons or simply had to stop playing because of every day life activities. Or perhaps they lost interest in gaming and so even their kids don’t play games. A lot of people are focusing on work so they can afford the luxury of playing games when they have free time. And in general, genres come in and out of style, so do long standing series. I used to have 14 people always ready to play Reach with me and Halo 3 after school, now a days they spend only about 2 hours online before they get off because they have other things to do before they go to bed. So, no, popularity declines aren’t always just because ‘the game isn’t what it used to be’ and I will defend games and developers when people throw flak at them for not doing things the way they dictate. I do so because I enjoy what is being done and even when I don’t, I defend them because I want to see them learn and grow from things they did that failed. I let them know when I’m not happy with the product, but I don’t crap on them because they failed to meet expectations.
>
> I agree, to an extent. Infinite will never be a perfect game because someone will always find something they don’t like about it. They can’t tailor games towards one irate individual who voices their concerns on the internet. However, I would like for Infinite to be a great game that I will enjoy for years just like I did Reach. Just like I do all the Halo games.
>
> That’s rather hypocritical, don’t you think? How is it fair for you to talk down to others that their opinions are wrong and then tell them they’re not allowed to share how they feel? If you hate what they’ve done, that’s fine, you don’t have to like it, but don’t tell people they’re not allowed to like it because you don’t.

You’re right about his delivery but you just can’t refute the facts he states. he IS right and thats the harsh truth

I miss Halo being what it was. This is what is known as nostalgia.

In this community, the term has developed a negative connotation because a group of people who are okay with what Halo has developed into over the years will argue against those who argue that the old formulas were superior, and this has occurred all throughout Halo’s lifetime. Arguments have occurred over and over about “what should be done” for both sides of the argument. But I think that up to a certain point, people were more okay with what was going on despite some things that could have simply been done better.

I would argue that that point is when AA’s became a thing which lead halo down the path it is at currently with SA’s taking their place. The issue is that most of the additions aren’t altogether unique and many shooters have mechanics like them that make them less pertinent. Whether this was down as a reaction or as a legitimate change for the better, Halo is no longer the trendsetter it used to be, and there is no argument against the fact that Halo is behind the curve, perhaps because of it.

Really, the fundamental issue as it stands is that modern Halo’s identity simply isn’t that unique, which makes it easier for other games to take its place.

The reason people keep trying to create alternatives to modern Halo by making grassroots returns to classic Halo is because classic Halo is still unique for what it is: there aren’t really any simple competitive shooters out there anymore that exist within the current generation of gaming. People might argue MCC takes place in that void, but MCC is merely the past with a poorly maintained H2A multiplayer that wasn’t going to go anywhere without proper support in the first place.

What the people who desire classic Halo want is not stagnation. Changes that occur in Halo that support its identity are perfectly fine, as seen in vehicle boarding and dual wielding.

The changes that keep Halo a simple competitive shooter, whose depth is determined by environmental stigma and not based on some abilities that other games arguably pull off better, is what future Halo development should aim for because this will ultimately maintain an identity unique in the market and allow for trends to be set because, honestly, these types of changes in the shooter market simply aren’t being looked at.

The multitude of potential game modes, the variety in map interactions, different types of maps and player environments (developer created or otherwise) different types of weapons and equipment and vehicles are all things that can be changed and manipulated and thrown around because they don’t inherently change Halo as a game but they do change the player experience. And, above all else, these things can, without drastically changing how Halo is played, be removed.

I would argue that recent changes in the Halo formula infringed upon this notion because, despite the fact that you can turn off SA’s, the entire game was manufactured down to a map design level with them in mind, and, therefore, there is a fundamental problem with playing Halo in its original state.

The bottom line is that everything that came before, everything that is now, and everything that comes later should be looked at with the idea in mind “does this make for a simple competitive shooter” and “can we remove this without harming the rest of the game?” Because while I believe that sometimes risks should be taken, it is so easy with a game like Halo to make changes that don’t involve risking the fate of the entire franchise, because Halo is not as popular as it once was and people are getting tired of it not living up to its legendary name. I don’t expect that changes to Halo that don’t infringe upon its identity to be easy to make in time, but those are the things that Halo needs to survive and I would encourage more creativity in that respect.

Not gonna tell you what to do OP, but making a post that shows you clearly won’t listen to any opposing viewpoints is kinda, well, pointless. I come to this forum for stimulating conversation about something I’m passionate about, not for crap like this that only serves to divide the community.

I’m an OG halo fan. My favorite games are the Bungie-era games. But that doesn’t mean I have to automatically reject any new material. Halo 4’s campaign was incredible and showed a side of Chief many fans wanted to see but didn’t get from the Bungie games. Gameplay wise, I didn’t have as much fun in H4 as I did in the old games, but I still enjoyed the story. The art style was shockingly different, and I didn’t much care for it, but that doesn’t mean I’m right and anyone who likes the new art style is wrong. Halo 5’s campaign was a dumpster fire imo, but those who liked it can like it, and I won’t lose any sleep over it.

The people who are ruining Halo are toxic fans who don’t welcome new fans to the community, but instead ridicule them for simply enjoying a game. You catch more flies with honey. So instead of shouting “new halo bad, old halo good”, you’d be better served to explain what you like about the old games, which demonstrates why you find the new games to be less than stellar in a less adversarial tone.

And idk what you mean about all the old fans leaving Halo. There are tons of people on Waypoint who have voiced emphatically the fact that they didn’t like H5. If you don’t believe me, then just look at 343’s response. They’ve specifically stated that they are going back to Halo’s roots with Infinite. Why would they do that if all the old fans left and they are only catering to new fans who prefer H4 and H5 to the old games?