Change the secondary weapons for halo 5.

Games Halo 5: Guardians
1

My idea is that secondary weapons in loadouts need an overhaul. ATM we have the magnum, boltshot and the plasma pistol. Of those 3 only the magnum is balanced whilst the boltshot is too good in CBC and the PP (+ stickies) too good against vehicles. So 343 should really change these and reintroduce some fan favourites.

My ideal selection would be as follows.

Magnum : Pretty much the same as halo 4, it’s pretty balanced.

The SMG : Yes, bring back this beauty, with its high ROF but abysmal range it is balanced for a last resort secondary but would be by most things futher than 2 meters. It’s kill time should be marginally less than the surpressor.

The plasma rifle: TBH I think this would be fine if ported from reach. It would have, probably, the fastest kill time but the bullet speed would be very slow and would make this a weapon only for the skilled.

The Boltshot, but changed: The boltshot should be to the magnum what the carbine is to the DMR. By buffing up the normal shots damage and removing the shotgun fire you get a rapid fire HS capable pistol but with no scope so only fot close quarters.

The Spiker: Like a middle ground from the SMG to the PR this would sit confortably in the middle.If brutes where to return this would be perfect. If however they where not then a forunner equivalent could be made.

The plasma pistol would now instead be a on map spawn.

I believe this would bring some variety into the secondary weapons and not make them so radically different and balance them out…

So what do you think?

2

This is the best idea on this forum in a while. Love it especially since it brings back the SMG, the Spiker and the Plasma Rifle

3

This is a great idea, and with the possible return of Dual-Wielding, having them as secondary weapons makes it so that dual-wieldable weapons are no longer useless by themselves.

4

I don’t even want loadouts…

5

> I don’t even want loadouts…

I don’t want them either, but I doubt that 343i is intent on removing them.

6

> This is a great idea, and with the possible return of Dual-Wielding, having them as secondary weapons makes it so that dual-wieldable weapons are no longer useless by themselves.

I was pitching something like this too in another thread, and I agree completely. The one issue I have is the Boltshot without the overcharge is a completely unoriginal weapon and definitely doesn’t sound Forerunner. I had an idea once to replace it with basically an exact opposite- a small and quickfiring shotgun that is 3sk at close range (similar to the mauler), but the more you hold the shot the gun becomes more accurate and slightly more powerful. By the end, it would shoot a very accurate and powerfull spray that is a 2sk (mid-long range) and has the possibility to kill in one shot (but only if the other player has less than half shields). Secondaries should be as unique as primaries, and I think this along with OP’s idea to reintroduce some old weapons could work very well.

This is definitely a good bridge to Dual Wielding too, but I would rather that you can only dual wield by finding your second weapon on the map. Dual wielding should give a significant damage buff (around 150% damage of using one weapon) at the cost of low accuracy and high recoil.

7

> > This is a great idea, and with the possible return of Dual-Wielding, having them as secondary weapons makes it so that dual-wieldable weapons are no longer useless by themselves.
>
> I was pitching something like this too in another thread, and I agree completely. The one issue I have is the Boltshot without the overcharge is a completely unoriginal weapon and definitely doesn’t sound Forerunner. I had an idea once to replace it with basically an exact opposite- a small and quickfiring shotgun that is 3sk at close range (similar to the mauler), but the more you hold the shot the gun becomes more accurate and slightly more powerful. By the end, it would shoot a very accurate and powerfull spray that is a 2sk (mid-long range) and has the possibility to kill in one shot (but only if the other player has less than half shields). Secondaries should be as unique as primaries, and I think this along with OP’s idea to reintroduce some old weapons could work very well.
>
> This is definitely a good bridge to Dual Wielding too, but I would rather that you can only dual wield by finding your second weapon on the map. Dual wielding should give a significant damage buff (around 150% damage of using one weapon) at the cost of low accuracy and high recoil.

Yh, Your boltshot sounds good too. Also yes people shouldn’t be able to spawn with two weapons otherwise there will be a whole new breed of noobs.

8

This is really a great idea you came up with.
I really would like to see the SMG, Spiker and Plasma Rifle in exchange for the Boltshot and Plasma Pistol as secondary weapons for loadouts and of course the return of dual-wielding if balanced.

If 343i keeps the perks in Halo 5, there could be a perk that allows you dual-wielding but you have to find the second weapon on the battlefield like mentioned before.
But I would rather see it return as an default mechanics to be honest.

9

> This is really a great idea you came up with.
> I really would like to see the SMG, Spiker and Plasma Rifle in exchange for the Boltshot and Plasma Pistol as secondary weapons for loadouts and of course the return of dual-wielding if balanced.
>
> If 343i keeps the perks in Halo 5, <mark>there could be a perk that allows you dual-wielding but you have to find the second weapon on the battlefield like mentioned before.</mark>
> But I would rather see it return as an default mechanics to be honest.

Absolutely not.

I’m tired of legitimate gameplay elements being removed just so that they can make a “perk” for it. It’s unbalanced and unacceptable and it deeply negates Custom Games.

10

I posted something similar to this in the Halo 5 Community Suggestion Thread.

Secondaries:
Magnum (same as Halo 4)
Plasma Pistol (same as Halo 4)
Spiker
Boltshot (same name, but acts like the cut Burst Pistol)
Bishop Pistol (the cut pistol that shoots like a Sentinel Beam)

The reason why the Plasma Rifle isn’t there because the Storm Rifle is a way better version. Plus, the Spiker is the replacement of the Plasma Rifle, in a way.

Now, for the SMG, I classified it as a primary. Reason is because it would have the scope from ODST, 48 bullets in clip, 22 bullets to kill someone, bloom, and recoil.

11

Storm rifle is just a projectile based assault rifle. Plasma Rifle has stun, increased damage to shields, increasing fire rate, and a better design.

If the SMG is THAT weak and inaccurate, it wouldn’t ever get picked.

12

I’d much prefer they simply apply a magazine buff, and accuracy nerf to the Magnum, and then make the secondary choices Magnum, AR(/SMG), Storm Rifle(/Plasma Rifle/Plasma Repeater), and suppressor. And then have only precision weapons as primary choices.

Either that, or bring back Dual Wield as a viable excuse to nerf the Plasma Pistol’s EMP length and tracking, as well as the Boltshot to a 2 burst kill (1 burst doesn’t completely break shields), and then introduce the SMG, Plasma Rifle, and Needler tweaked similarly to Halo Reach, where it only detonates when Needles impact AFTER shields are drained.

As well, the Sticky Detonator, and Energy Sword would be interesting to have Dual Wieldable, especially since both weapons are pretty gimped right now compared to their direct equivalents (with the exception of the Hammer, which could use a pretty big buff). Imagine being able to finish enemies off with a Magnum after your sticky det doesn’t get the kill. Or have an Energy Sword in one hand, and a Needler in the other for longer ranged foes.

13

What if, instead of duel wielding, you can throw grenades while shooting a secondary?

14

> What if, instead of duel wielding, you can throw grenades while shooting a secondary?

??? You can already do this

15

> Storm rifle is just a projectile based assault rifle. Plasma Rifle has stun, increased damage to shields, increasing fire rate, and a better design.
>
> If the SMG is THAT weak and inaccurate, it wouldn’t ever get picked.

That Plasma Rifle design was from Halo CE. If you brought back that version, then I could see it being in.

As for the SMG, it doesn’t have to be 22 bullets. Also, it wouldn’t be that inaccurate. It’s supposed to be a longer range, more accurate automatic (but isn’t too good to be able to dominate precision weapons). To do that, it’s kill time needs to be longer than 14 or so bullets to kill someone. It can be 18, but it can’t kill faster than the other automatics. Otherwise, it’d be the best. Have to find that perfect middle ground.

16

> > What if, instead of duel wielding, you can throw grenades while shooting a secondary?
>
> ??? You can already do this

I mean that you can throw grenades while shooting a secondary, potentially melee as well (punching with the other hand). This way, secondaries actually have an advantage in certain situations over primaries, fulfilling their design philosophies of comboing with other mechanics.

17

> > > What if, instead of duel wielding, you can throw grenades while shooting a secondary?
> >
> > ??? You can already do this
>
> I mean that you can throw grenades while shooting a secondary, potentially melee as well (punching with the other hand). This way, secondaries actually have an advantage in certain situations over primaries, fulfilling their design philosophies of comboing with other mechanics.

Secondary weapon roles are for backup you can do fine with just a secondary though. Also a melee damage increase would make the game unfair with people only punching with their secondaries. Punching with the other hand would be a cooler animation though.

18

Heres my secondary list (everything is dual-wieldable unless stated otherwise):
Magnum:
-Same as it currently is

Suppressed Magnum
-7 shots to break shield, 4 to body or a headshot
-12 round magazine
-projectile
-vertical recoil, no bloom
-user does not appear on the motion tracker
-2x scope

SMG
-13 shots to break shield, 7 to kill
-60 round magazine
-lowish bloom, combined with the “traditional” vertical recoil
-hitscan

Suppressed SMG
-15 shots to break shield, 8 to kill
-48 round magazine
-no bloom, vertical recoil, fairly accurate
-2x sight
-non dual-wieldable
-shots are projectile
-shooter does not appear on motion tracker

Assault Carbine (MA5K)
-11 shots to break shield, 6 to kill
-30 round magazine
-same rate of fire as the MA5C
-no ammo counter?
-larger than normal muzzle flash
-quick reseting bloom, but slightly more than the Assault Rifle
-non dual-wieldable
-hitscan

Plasma Pistol:
-4 shots to break shield, 7 to kill
-overcharge has magnetism greatly reduced (need to lead shots)
-projectile

Plasma Rifle
-Whatever it was in Reach or H3

Plasma Repeater
-Whatever it was in Reach (maybe slightly weaker), non dual-wieldable

Brute Plasma Rifle:
-does 75% the damage of the regular Plasma Rifle, but has 1.5 times the rate of fire
-stun effect much lower than the Plasma Rifle
-shots are much shorter ranged, vaporise completely after 50-60 metres

Mauler
-2 shots to break shield, 1 to kill
-5 round magazine
-range the same as the gravity hammer splash radius
-slightly increased melee damage
-hitscan

Spiker
-10 shots to break shield
-5 to kill
-projectile, shots arc over distance
-40 round magazine
-slight melee damage increase

Boltshot
-9 shots to break shield, headshot or 5 body shots
-burst has longer charge time (less effective for camping)
-burst charging is significantly louder
-completely projectile (normal and charged)

Burst Pistol
-scopeable
-energy based (battery)
-6 shots to break shield, 3 to kill
-fires burst similar to the laser bursts from the spartan laser
-each burst is two shots
-hitscan

Basically to balance this, all dual-wieldable weapons would become more inaccurate (to avoid the need for reduced damage like in Halo 3).

19

> > > > What if, instead of duel wielding, you can throw grenades while shooting a secondary?
> > >
> > > ??? You can already do this
> >
> > I mean that you can throw grenades while shooting a secondary, potentially melee as well (punching with the other hand). This way, secondaries actually have an advantage in certain situations over primaries, fulfilling their design philosophies of comboing with other mechanics.
>
> Secondary weapon roles are for backup you can do fine with just a secondary though. Also a melee damage increase would make the game unfair with people only punching with their secondaries. Punching with the other hand would be a cooler animation though.

I forgot to mention that punching would also deal less damage than a regular melee, taking two punches to lower shields (to prevent magnum BXRing). Secondaries in halo don’t seem to really work as a backup weapon, and an extension to a primary not a very interesting mechanic anyways (and doesn’t work with anti-shield plasma weapons). The only time you should unpredictably run out of ammo in a clip is during a long streak. Its almost always quicker or more effective to just reload, throw a grenade, duck behind cover, or melee.

20

> > > > > What if, instead of duel wielding, you can throw grenades while shooting a secondary?
> > > >
> > > > ??? You can already do this
> > >
> > > I mean that you can throw grenades while shooting a secondary, potentially melee as well (punching with the other hand). This way, secondaries actually have an advantage in certain situations over primaries, fulfilling their design philosophies of comboing with other mechanics.
> >
> > Secondary weapon roles are for backup you can do fine with just a secondary though. Also a melee damage increase would make the game unfair with people only punching with their secondaries. Punching with the other hand would be a cooler animation though.
>
> I forgot to mention that punching would also deal less damage than a regular melee, taking two punches to lower shields (to prevent magnum BRXing). Secondaries in halo don’t seem to really work as a backup weapon, and an extension to a primary not a very interesting mechanic anyways (and doesn’t work with anti-shield plasma weapons). The only time you should unpredictably run out of ammo in a clip is during a long streak. Its almost always quicker or more effective to just reload, throw a grenade, duck behind cover, or melee.

Ill agree to that. Duel wielding needs to return though