Can you at least accept H5 as a good arena shooter

Games Halo 5: Guardians
1

Blind haters aside, to those who are legitimately distraught by the direction that 343 is taking the Halo franchise, let me ask you this. Even if you hate H5 as a Halo game, can’t you agree that it’s one of the most exciting arena shooters we’ve had in a decade?

People are constantly comparing halo 5 to COD, but how can that be an accurate description? COD is one of the most awfully balanced games of the century. Halo 5 gives you set weapon starts and let’s you maneuver the map to find various tiers of guns to dispatch your foes. COD’s “abilities” that are supposed to be soo similar to h5’s spartan abilities are load out specific, (and if you really look at it, COD ripped active camo from the Halo franchise). Halo 5 gives you all the same abilities from the start. COD is all about everyone running around like chickens with their heads cut off with no regard for who’s on whose team, H5 promotes team play like no other game I’ve seen.

343 has changed so much of our beloved franchise because they have the balls to do it. What other AAA franchise has changed its image so heavily? Halo 4’s problem was that it took the core of halo and threw a bunch of mismatched junk in. It’s like painting some sunglasses and a mustache on the Mona Lisa. Halo 5 is a brand new beast though. I’d say this game gives respect to the past in a way that Halo 4 didnt. Instead of throwing disjointed crap into the game, 343 built a new game from the ground up with Halo 2 in mind. Just like Halo 5 carries Midship into the future, it carries the spirit of Halo 2 with it. It may be a completely different game, but the Halo 2 roots make this my new favorite arena shooter on Xbox. I can’t wait to see what other surprises 343 has for multiplayer as we get closer to launch. I think that this may be the smallest halo launch there’s been, but it think the population will be around to stay this time.

2

It’s not an arena shooter, the maps are too big. Play Midship on Halo 2, that is the size map of an arena shooter. Truth or whatever the remake is more like the size of half high ground, that’s way too big for an arena.

3

> 2533274850926786;2:
> It’s not an arena shooter, the maps are too big. Play Midship on Halo 2, that is the size map of an arena shooter. Truth or whatever the remake is more like the size of half high ground, that’s way too big for an arena.

You can’t define a genre by the size of its maps. -_-

4

Whether you call it an arena shooter or not, if you compare the gameplay to the gameplay on Midship, there’s no comparison.

5

Traditional arena shooters as we know them are more than just FPS games that give equal starts. The mechanisms in arena shooters promote a certain level of flow and continuous gameplay.

Running with Guns Lowered is the sprint mechanism being used in Halo 5. Notice how I said its the mechanism they chose. They didn’t need to choose that in order to give the player a boost of speed or quicken map navigation. The sprint mechanism in Halo 5 is fundamentally incompatible with arena-shooters as we know them. Arena shooters traditionally allow for a player to shoot while moving at all times. Something like Thruster is actually compatible and can work on a fundamental level.

Another problem with Halo 5’s “arena” gameplay is that there is ADS (aim down sights) scoping on many guns. The traditional zoom in Halo truly immersed the player when using it with certain weapons. The ADS in Halo 5 breaks the flow of movement and action. Its true that it doesn’t penalize a player’s actual movement while ADS’ing, but the animation actually encourages consistent popping in and popping out. So now on a casual level, people are ADS’ing even at extremely close range because it doesn’t immerse you enough in the field of view. The Light Rifle is an example of 343 doing it right. Notice how it would be slightly uncomfortable to pop into zoom if someone was very close? The other kind of iron-sight ADS on the BR encourages people to pop in and out of it. This harms the flow of play.

As Hair on Fire mentioned, map design is also affected. Arena-style maps tended to be smaller in Halo because of the base movement speed being what it was. There is no law against larger maps in arena gameplay but its about adapting to the pace of play. A game like Unreal Tournament can have larger sized arena maps because the base movement speed is faster. The problem with Running With Guns Lowered in Halo is that now maps have lots of dead zones. Meaning much of the map is designed to accommodate the sprint mechanism just for the heck of it. The smaller forge maps like Pegasus or Orion do have an arena vibe, but there is so much open space cross-map to account for the sprint mechanism and other mechanisms in gameplay. You can see the potential Halo 5 has, but it can’t actualize and grasp it potential because there is too much fundamentally incompatible.

In past Halo games someone might rage after losing in a 4v4 or 8v8 and they would challenge you to a 1v1. The mechanics allowed for Halo to still thrive in a 1v1 2v2. In Halo 5 it would just be awkward and almost unnatural. The base mechanisms allow for too much randomness. Halo has always embodied the arena spirit for allowing 1v1, 2v2 to thrive while also providing tactical depth for 4v4, 8v8, etc. Halo 5 does not.

Look at the beauty of a map like Damnation from CE with all the intricacies. The vertical variability, numerous ways to navigate the map, importance of small nuances like jumping, mobility balance and timing, etc. Its a shame we will never have anything like this due to the numerous mechanisms currently in Halo 5. You want "arena" gameplay, well there you go.
6

It’s not even an arena shooter. Halo Ce arguably wasn’t even an arena shooter, but Halo 5 is definitely not an arena shooter.

> 343 has changed so much of our beloved franchise because they have the balls to do it

Whatever you say man.

7

Loll I don’t know how you guys play on truth it’s not a big map at all. Obviously big compared to midship the damn bases touch each other at the bottom. Went back and played midship on halo 2 and when you see Spartans bunny hopping to cause the illusion of speed while going across the bottom

8

Personally, I’ve never really got the “it’s a good game, just not a good Halo game” attitude. I don’t really see why I should have different standards for Halo and other games. It’s not as if the context changes the gameplay, or even how much I can enjoy it.

Compared to everything else out there, Halo 5 is a fairly unexciting game. But I don’t expect it to be exciting, because it’s a triple-A game, and last time I experienced a truly exciting triple-A game was… never. That’s the reality of the triple-A industry: there’s so much money going around that every game has to be a safe bet. There’s no innovation or uniqueness in the triple-A game industry because nobody’s going to fund a game that doesn’t have a clear market niche and isn’t guaranteed to sell at least a few million copies.

For sequels, there’s even less room for innovation because the market is already known, and there’s no reason to deviate from it. While for Halo players the changes in Halo 5 may seem major, they certainly are to me, the reality of it is that from an outsider’s perspective, and completely objectively, Halo 5 isn’t a major departure from the other games. It’s still something that anyone who plays Halo would recognize from the gameplay alone. It’s not as if the health system, the movement system, or the weapon sandbox had been completely reworked. Halo 5 is less of a departure from Halo than Titanfall is from the generic military shooter, and even Titanfall seems oddly familiar once you disregard the mechs and parkour.

Moreover, on the level I care about–the depth of gameplay–Halo 5 isn’t exciting. It’s potentially an improvement over Halo 4, but with Halo 4 scraping the bottom of the barrel, that’s not much of a compliment. “Better than Halo 4” isn’t exciting. “Better than Halo 3” is still a bar set too low. “Better than CE” is the kind of statement I could get excited about. Anything less and it’s really nothing new.

Halo 5 is not unique, innovative, or exciting. It’s nothing more than another sequel in a triple-A franchise that has practically gone the road of yearly releases to keep its name in the news.

> 2533274850926786;2:
> It’s not an arena shooter, the maps are too big. Play Midship on Halo 2, that is the size map of an arena shooter. Truth or whatever the remake is more like the size of half high ground, that’s way too big for an arena.

I don’t think you really know what an arena shooter is. Map size is a completely irrelevant aspect. Map size is determined by multiple factors, one of which is the expected movement speed of the player. Halo actually has relatively small maps compared to actual arena shooters because actual arena shooters usually have very fast movement speeds (which is part of the reason why Halo isn’t really an arena shooter).

The reality of it is that Halo (as in the whole franchise from CE onwards) isn’t a full fledged arena shooter, but more of a cut down and dumbed down version for consoles. For proper arena shooters, see Quake, Unreal Tournament, Xonotic, Toxikk, etc.

9

> 2533274850926786;2:
> It’s not an arena shooter, the maps are too big.

This. Halo 5 isn’t an arena shooter. I wish it was. But it’s not. Between large maps and CoD-ish gimmicky gameplay elements it barely feels like Halo much less arena.

10

The Halo series plays nothing like actual “arena” shooters. They have elements for sure but they really play nothing like the Quakes and Painkillers of the world.

11

> 2533274850926786;2:
> It’s not an arena shooter, the maps are too big. Play Midship on Halo 2, that is the size map of an arena shooter. Truth or whatever the remake is more like the size of half high ground, that’s way too big for an arena.

You seem to have never played a real arena shooter if that’s honestly how you feel.

12

> 2533274819302824;6:
> It’s not even an arena shooter. Halo Ce arguably wasn’t even an arena shooter, but Halo 5 is definitely not an arena shooter.
>
>
>
> > 343 has changed so much of our beloved franchise because they have the balls to do it
>
>
> Whatever you say man.

BALLS? he’s calling playing it safe by copying every franchise out there, even destiny with their little high five, BALLS?

13

I also agree Halo 5 doesn’t feel like an arena shooter due to ADS, low movement speed(poor strafing), and maps stretched to accommodate sprint. The good news is I might be playing an arena shooter as early as January 22nd thanks to Toxikk(unreal clone). Based on the trailer link below these developers appear to understand how the Unreal game behaved.

14

> 2533274913936758;9:
> > 2533274850926786;2:
> > It’s not an arena shooter, the maps are too big.
>
>
> This. Halo 5 isn’t an arena shooter. I wish it was. But it’s not. Between large maps and CoD-ish gimmicky gameplay elements it barely feels like Halo much less arena.

Well first of all, “arena shooter” has no actual definition, beyond some vaguely detailed style of games. Traditionally, arena shooters were always about map control and fair starts in a map designed to be balanced, typically symmetrical. But the size of maps has never mattered. Quake has numerous small team maps twice the size of Truth yet it’s the quintessential arena shooter. What matters is the flow; people run around twitch shooters like headless chickens but arena shooters are characteristically more precise. Attempting to run around like a psycho in halo 5 will get to killed–I know, I’ve tried. In fact it’s easier to run around aimlessly in Quake because movement speed is so fast that it’s allowed. It also makes escapes easier. But with halo 5, you need to have a coordinated team to be effective, another characteristic of arena shooters.

So by that logic halo 5 is more arena shooter than quake due to having more punishment for aimless sprinting. Otherwise there isn’t much to discuss, on account of “arena” having no official definition.

15

> 2752423165120539;10:
> The Halo series plays nothing like actual “arena” shooters. They have elements for sure but they really play nothing like the Quakes and Painkillers of the world.

The Halo series has always provided experiences in the arena genre (certainly 1-3). The difference is that the Quakes, Unreal Tournaments, etc are twitch-arena shooters. Halo’s arena experience was a slower/methodical approach. Gunplay was mainly based on steady-aim and shot consistency, besides the power weapons and close range burst weapons. Halo on a fundamental level provided in an arena experience on maps and game-modes that applied. Speed and pace of play does not define arena shooters. The mechanisms and principles a game is built on do.

16

> 2533274887613159;12:
> > 2533274819302824;6:
> > It’s not even an arena shooter. Halo Ce arguably wasn’t even an arena shooter, but Halo 5 is definitely not an arena shooter.
> >
> >
> >
> > > 343 has changed so much of our beloved franchise because they have the balls to do it
> >
> >
> >
> > Whatever you say man.
>
>
> BALLS? he’s calling playing it safe by copying every franchise out there, even destiny with their little high five, BALLS?

Get over it. There’s virtually nothing halo can do that’s new anymore. Halo hasn’t done anything truly new since Halo CE.

17

Halo lsnt halo anymore. It’s destiny. same controls, everything. I’m good at the game, halo 5, but its not as fun.

18

I have an issue with your question since you make this assumption that H5 is an arena shooter, which is not. At all.

19

Its not an arena shooter.

Arena shooters dont peanlise movement or shooting. H5 penalises shooting with sub optimal movement speed.

20

> 2737679237777606;13:
> I also agree Halo 5 doesn’t feel like an arena shooter due to ADS, low movement speed(poor strafing), and maps stretched to accommodate sprint. The good news is I might be playing an arena shooter as early as January 22nd thanks to Toxikk(unreal clone). Based on the trailer link below these developers appear to understand how the Unreal game behaved.
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FoYcjeHVbnI

Sad because I missed the pre-purchase deadline.

Happy because I get to play it in four days anyways.

> Get over it. There’s virtually nothing halo can do that’s new anymore. Halo hasn’t done anything truly new since Halo CE.

In that case the only two paths it has are imitating others and staying true to itself.

You can guess what I want.

Edit: Just to be clear I don’t believe there’s nothing new left for Halo to do.