When he was fighting red team he got shot allot and stabbed multiple times and he didn’t seem to even acknowledge his injuries.
So i ask is his skull bullet proof?
2 Likes
Nope…just a whole bunch of plot armor.
3 Likes
This is the first time we ever get to see Atriox or even hear of his or the Banished existence. As for his head being bullet proof, It’s called plot armor, they were trying to make Atriox seem like an unstoppable force that even Red Team couldn’t stand up to alone.
Atriox being a badass is acceptable, but there is no way he would be able to take on Jerome and Red Team by himself lol because if you play Halo Wars 2, you’ll find out real quick Atriox and the Banished get their butts kicked really badly by a stranded Spirit of Fire.
2 Likes
He seem to do well in the begining of the game
No. For the same reason a horses head wouldn’t. As others have said, plot armour is only reason he’s not been killed in the fights we’ve seen. A Brute can’t beat a Spartan in combat one on one for same reason a horse wouldn’t.
Plus we see his face is pretty torn up by whatever explosion hit him whilst his armour is intact. So he’s clearly mortal and can feel pain. If it’s like the Hound from Game of Thrones then he’s probably in major and constant agony. Not sure why his eye is glowing red now beyond being a Terminator reference.
2 Likes
Power armour? Regular armour? Evasion? It’s not just plot armour. He’s surprised the Spartans and has them on the run. Their shooting is more suppression than killshots
Their Spartans! Every one of their shots is a killshot!
1 Like
Not necessarily when they’ve been ambushed and are aware they’re being encircled. Extraction is more important- especially when at that point their equipment is 30 years out of date and they don’t know who they’re dealing with.
Red Team fought Brutes in Halo Wars. It shouldn’t take them aback.
He shouldn’t be able to sneak up on them.
Jerome beats a whole squad of Brutes by himself. Three Spartans should handily be able to deal with a dozen brutes and a Chieftain. You fight those odds all the time in game.
Doesn’t matter. Spartan armour is vastly superior to any Covenant technology and the Banished shouldn’t be able to make improvements. This is all meant to be Forerunner technology which they’ve crudely reverse engineered and don’t really understand how it works.
This is why in game and in cutscenes Red Team are still demolishing whole Banished units in their outdated armour.
This is an interesting idea, OP. There are several novels that can shed light on this subject. Remember, gameplay is not equal to canon—but it may reflect some elements of canon. Likewise, even cinematics are not always accurate to the lore, such as when Spartans in Mark V-and-upward-Mjolnir are depicted without energy shields, or when Palmer destroyed Promethean Knights on the Infinity with only single shots from her M6H magnums.
The first appearance of Brutes (afaik) from a real-world perspective was in the release of the novel Halo: First Strike. Blue Team is ambushed on the Unyielding Heirophant by a squad of Brutes, one of whom manages to grab John and attempt to strangle him. This passage highlights the durability of Jiralhanae hide:
“The tendons in the Brute’s forearms were solid bands of steel—and the creature was so determined to rip John’s head off that a full clip from a rifle into its chest hadn’t even slowed it down.” - page 374, 2010 edition.
During this fight, John was using a BR55, so the Brute tanked 36 rounds of high-powered semi-armor piercing ammunition.
Later on, in Ghosts of Onyx, Blue Team engages a group of Brutes with an SRS99C sniper rifle and MA5B assault rifles. Linda-058, as you might expect, is able to dispatch three Brutes with one headshot each using the sniper rifle. She shoots them through the eye, the most obviously vulnerable part of their heads. Fred-104 is forced to engage a Brute that was advancing on him in close range, and fires a portion of a magazine of 7.62x51mm ammunition into the Brute’s center mass. It doesn’t do much, but he finally kills the Brute after hitting its neck with his rifle butt and “[unloading] the remaining rounds in his magazine into the Brute’s open mouth.” - page 208.
So Ghosts of Onyx establishes that Jiralhanae mouths and eyes are weak spots. But we get even more information two pages later!
Fred races into an elevator car to stop a squad of Brutes with stolen nukes. First, he shoots two grenades from a Brute Shot into the elevator, and then slips through its nearly-closed doors. He “[sees] the open-mawed expressions of the three stunned Brutes. He [levels] his rifle and [shoots] one in the face.
Fred [turns] as the other [blinks] and [charges] him. He [blasts] it point-blank between the eyes.
The Brute [bowls] him over and its fists [come] down in twin hammer blows that [stun] Fred and [drain] his shields to a quarter charge.
Blood [streams] from its snarling face… and then it finally [registers] the rounds that had penetrated its thick skull. It [topples] upon Fred, inert.”
The third Brute is killed by two sniper rifle rounds to the back of its head, but the deaths of the first two suggest that the general face region is a vulnerable area.
Sequences in the novels Broken Circle and Shadows of Reach reinforce the idea that a Brute’s mouth and eyes are weak spots.
From Broken Circle, during the Honor Guard ambush in Delta Halo’s control room:
“If he could get close enough, jam his [plasma] rifle into the Brute captain’s mouth, he might do it…” - page 250.
From Shadows of Reach, during Blue Team’s infiltration of a Banished camp:
“John dropped to a knee and brought up his weapon—then heard two soft huffs as Fred opened fire with his suppressed MA40.
The heads of both Jiralhanae rocked backward, a single round taking each of them through an eye, and they toppled over backward.” - page 220.
So I think we can safely say that yes, Atriox could be killed by shooting him through an eye, or in the mouth.
However…
Both times Atriox has engaged Spartan(s), he’s done so with the advantage of a surprise attack. The average Jiralhanae is not only larger than most Spartans, but also just as fast and almost as durable, even without armor. And Atriox is an exceptional Brute.
We’ve also seen that when surprised in close quarters, a Spartan instinctively aims for center mass, which is the most reliable target—but is unfortunately extremely resilient in the case of a Brute.
We can therefore conclude that neither of his encounters with S-IIs have an unreasonable amount of plot armor.
3 Likes
The books aren’t consistent. They have parts where Spartans wrestle hunters to the ground and have entire armies of grunts shooting them without shields and being okay.
In the Halo Wars 2 cinematic Jerome kills a fully armoured brute with a shotgun to the chest. He’s also shown dodging their blows and handles them pretty well. This is in the same story in which Atriox beats three Spartans and ignores their gun fire because reasons.
It’s also not reasonable that Atriox would surprise the Chief or Red Team. Brutes are big, smell disgusting and are not exactly subtle. How often has a Brute Chieftain came at you from an unusual direction and you’ve come out on top? Chief wouldn’t be caught with just a pistol and should have heard the guy coming.
The only reason Atriox has won both fights is to establish him as a threat. Despite there being no reason he should be any more dangerous than the literal thousands of Brutes we’ve killed over the games. No augmentations, no special powers, no equipment. There’s no justification for this beyond putting him into this role in the story.
There’s also a mismatch in that he’s supposed to be a smart fighter when in both cases he’s relied on surprise and then overpowering his opponents with Brute strength to win. They don’t show him as a smart or skilled fighter. I doubt he could have beaten Chief if he had an energy sword or gravity hammer. I doubt he could beat a Hunter or Promethean with those “tactics” either.
1 Like
There’s a sequence with thousands of Grunts in TFoR’s prologue, but the Spartans aren’t actually getting hit by them iirc. The books are fairly consistent in how they portray plasma damage to unshielded Mjolnir.
I’m not sure what scene you’re talking about with Hunters? The closest one would be where Will-043 fights with Hunters in CQC in Ghosts of Onyx, but they kill him.
As I said about cinematics, things are often simplified to make less work for the animators. Perhaps canonically the Brute was a little more difficult for Jerome to kill ala Palmer and the Knights, or perhaps a shotgun kills Brutes easier in close quarters than either a BR55 or an MA5B. I would opt for the latter.
Atriox does have a cybernetic gauntlet that augments his strength, for what it’s worth. I’m not sure what you mean by no equipment? He’s heavily armored? And again, it’s not reliable to compare gameplay to canon fights.
Being a smart fighter means using *every *advantage, no matter what that advantage is. It doesn’t mean gaining the upper hand in a fair fight.
You also have to remember that at that point Red Team has no idea about the Banished, the Banished have equipment far superior to that which the Brutes would have had at Arcadia or the Shield World (because at that point in the war the Brutes would have had sub-par equipment compared to the end of the war), and Atriox (with experience of Spartans) will likely know that these ‘demons’ have outdated equipment.
Yeah in Ghosts of Onyx the Spartan rugby tackles a Hunter and knocks it over. I think he kills one before the big death sacrifice speech with the villain.
Which would be selective. You could say Atriox had more trouble fighting Red Team than is suggested. I think the scenes intent is clear and it’s inconsistent. In one scene armoured brutes die like canon fodder and in the other one is able to beat an entire Spartan Team.
He has something on his hand but it doesn’t look like a power fist. Is this from an artbook? More to the point Brutes shouldn’t have access to advanced technology; much less be able to match human technology. Much less be able to analyse Forerunner Technology. Hopefully introducing the Endless means they can end this absurd overselling of the faction.
His armour looks like a heap of junk that he cobbled together with duct tape. He looks less well armoured than Bassus or Esharum. Plus he’s got no head protection and shouldn’t survive being punched by a Spartan in the face.
What advantage? Somehow Chief and Red Team do not notice a ten foot armoured tank, that stinks of rotten meat and carries a glowing energy mace. It does not make sense. They also get caught with weaker weapons. These are not things Atriox is doing. They are things the plot is doing. Give Chief an energy sword in that scene and he kills Atriox instead of punching him. It’s not evidence of Atriox being a clever fighter. It’s the plot bending to set up this epic showdown.
Plus if he only fights where he knows he’s certain to win then he’s a coward. Which fits with him rebelling because he wanted to be the one sending soldiers to die and save his own skin.
See, I don’t want an epic showdown. I feel like we got that with Esharum and let that be the whole Samurai duel thing. With Atriox it’s vengeance. I don’t want Atriox to have anything at the end of this. I think the idea of him needs to be destroyed and torn down as well.
All brutes aren’t equal, as all humans aren’t equal. It’s not because a spartan can kill easily a group of brutes than every brutes have to be easy to kill. Every warrior are different by their strenght, dextirity and intelligence.
Atriox have an armor and a exoskeleton which amplifies his strength, like Mjonir armor for spartans. I’m agree the cinematic are flattering him too much, but he is still a good warrior not to be underestimated. So yes, he can handle three Spartan in some conditions.
However, I’m agree that we always see him attacking Spartans (red team and chief) by surprise. It’s not really honourable, but with a big hammer, it’s very advantageous. I wish the chief has defended himself better against him, but I think it makes sense that Atriox beat him by attacking him from behind
How did the Brutes learn to make exo skeletons? They aren’t Orks who just instinctively know how to build these things. The Prophets gave them technology, which was itself crude reverse engineered Forerunner Tech. Humanity has the real thing and actually understand this stuff.
I just hope they don’t make him Thanos where he’s this ultimate god tier villain who can command Offensive Bias and the Endless. If they want people to take the Endless seriously then having them be servants to a Brute and his schemes would not be doing it. Have him be this petty Warlord with a cunning streak. Don’t try to make him this all knowing guy with insight into the secrets of the Forerunners. I mean I did not take it seriously when Donkey Kong ends up capturing Cortana. I assumed the Harbinger would do some Precursor nonsense to make that retcon happen. It’s too much and it’s out of step with how the Brutes have been depicted in the story. I don’t think this is like Ghaul from Destiny 2 where he doesn’t understand the power he seeks and gets burned. I think 343 are aiming for him to be this ultimate warrior whose own legend equals our own.
I am of the view that if the Endless or Flood get out then Atriox and the Banished should lose control of that situation very quickly. Right now they very much are putting him and the Banished on a pedestal; which is nearing obnoxious levels. Hopefully that doesn’t -Yoink!- the introduction of the Endless.
1 Like
The brutes aren’t stupid, they had their own technologie before the covenant arrived. And more important, the Banished have Hurakogs, so there is a lot of chance than Atriox asked to a Hurakog to create his armor.
I’m agree with you, it’s won’t be good if Atriox is the ultime threat like Thanos, but Atriox have something than Offensive Bias (and the endless for all we know) don’t have : he is a real personn. Even if the AI have their own mind, it is easier to identify with a biological person.
I think Atriox will be complementary with the Endless or Offensive Bias. Maybe they will be allied or ennemy
Spartan armour is incredibly advanced and expensive. The UNSC can’t make every marine a Spartan. Why should the Brutes or an engineer be able to make an equivalent of it?
I don’t think they’re setting him up as the fool opening Pandora’s box. The final cutscene depicts him as releasing the Endless and very much seem to be in control. I don’t think they would go all the way just to undermine him like that in the first DLC. So this ancient race more dangerous than the Flood are just going to follow the goals of a random Brute? It would massively undermine Offensive Bias and the Endless if they subordinate themselves to Atriox.
I am also worried 343 aren’t going to challenge his character, ideology and motives. Yes, characters in Halo Wars and Infinite do repeatedly describe the Banished and Atriox as “monsters”. But they don’t go into why, with the reasons left ill defined and that leaves it unchallenged or granted too much dignity. If Atriox says humanity are an Imperialist power and he’s all about freeing people Id have a lot to say about how much bull that is. Especially coming from a Brute Warlord. But the narrative might not allow that and they may prefer to repeat what they did with Eshcarum.
Yeah in Ghosts of Onyx the Spartan rugby tackles a Hunter and knocks it over. I think he kills one before the big death sacrifice speech with the villain.
I re-read the pages where this happens. Linda shoots one of the Hunters in its abdomen, stunning it and giving Will-043 the chance to tackle one of them, knocking it into its bond-brother and sending all three of them tumbling down an incline. Will dances with one of the Hunters and manages to put a fist through its exposed back, which is consistent with depictions of Spartan-vs Hunter fights in-game and in Halo 4: Forward Unto Dawn. Unfortunately, Will is killed when one of the Hunters blasts him point-blank with its Fuel Rod Arm. I’m not sure how this scene is supposed to be inconsistent with anything.
He has something on his hand but it doesn’t look like a power fist. Is this from an artbook? More to the point Brutes shouldn’t have access to advanced technology; much less be able to match human technology. Much less be able to analyse Forerunner Technology. Hopefully introducing the Endless means they can end this absurd overselling of the faction.
There is concept art that explicitly states that Atriox has an augmented power gauntlet (it’s on Halopedia). If you’re not convinced, then you can see it in action in the cutscene where he whoops Red Team. He’s able to crush Douglas’s titanium alloy helmet because of the gauntlet he wears.
As for technology, the Banished were using captured Covenant technology that they customized. Covenant technology was largely superior to human technology until after the end of the Human-Covenant War. The discovery of Onyx’s Forerunner tech treasure trove gave humanity a huge leg up on the competition. Ans besides, Jiralhanae achieved nuclear technology all on their own on Doisac… before they nuked themselves back to a primitive state. That’s the condition in which the Covenant found them.
Humanity has the real thing and actually understand this stuff.
While Cortana did make on-the-fly improvements to Covenant computer programs, the alliance’s reverse-engineering capability was extremely sophisticated. Of course, like everything, it could’ve been better. But humanity doesn’t innately understand Forerunner technology to the extent that you’re implying; humans reverse-engineered both Covenant and Forerunner tech. Heck, check out this dialogue from a human scientist on a Spartan Ops level:
“We’re turning on dormant technology we don’t know the first thing about. We’re like monkeys hammering on a nuclear bomb because we like the sound it makes.”
I am also worried 343 aren’t going to challenge his character, ideology and motives. Yes, characters in Halo Wars and Infinite do repeatedly describe the Banished and Atriox as “monsters”. But they don’t go into why, with the reasons left ill defined and that leaves it unchallenged or granted too much dignity.
Maybe it’s been a while since you played Halo Wars 2, but the Banished are defined as monsters for a very clear and specific reason: they slaughtered everyone at the Henry Lamb Research Outpost without mercy or hesitation. In Halo Infinite, the Banished tortured Spartans and Marines both for intelligence and pleasure, and multiple NPCs mention that the Banished intend to use Zeta Halo against humanity.
It seems like you have a personal issue with the Jiralhanae and the Banished?
+20 to AC per each future game and book in which the character will make an appearance.