Call of Halo - unlocking abilities...

I’ve mentioned this in another discussion, but I was curious about more people’s thoughts beyond those willing to read through 11 pages of previous posts.

I loved the original multiplayer style for Halo. That said, the ability to customize loadout and gear sounds pretty cool, and I’m excited for that too. It opens a lot of possibility for depth in gameplay. I do have two serious reservations though.

  1. The more you let people customize, the greater the chance that you have openned the door for players to find loopholes and combinations that were unforseen and are rediculously imbalanced. Once that golden loadout or loophole is found, then all other setups become non-viable from a practical standpoint. You actually have fewer options than you would have had with limited assigned loadouts. You can see it in every online PC game in existance (and on console games like COD), which is why games end up with balancing patches. I don’t see the patch system working so well here though. Not saying customization should be dropped, just that I’m nervous and hope care is taken, or it will get very boring, very quickly as 99% of players have the same 1-2 loadouts and then what was the point to begin with?

  2. I’ve read that not all loadouts are available and that some must be unlocked in a COD style promotion system. If this is true, then it’s the one piece of information about the game that would make me not want to play it. In fact, it’s why I never got into COD multiplayer. Don’t get me wrong, I agree with having skins, armor pieces and such unlocked as you play as a reward, but reward items should be cosmetic only. Options that actually change gameplay should be open for all people to use and choose from the start. This is not WOW. If you want WOW, go play WOW. WOW is an RPG, based on clicking and watching, where while strategy exists, what you have is more important than any sort of practiced skill.

In a truly competitive environment all gameplay options need to be available for all the players, otherwise the competition isn’t legitimate. Would the superbowl be legitimate if one team were told they couldn’t use helmets? Or the NBA finals if players had to wear sandals until they had played a certain number of games in their careers? Would a chess tournament count if players who attended the previous year got 3 queens instead of 1? Of course not, that would be stupid. Having gameplay options unlocked in a competitive environment is for children too afraid to lose without having the excuse of “but they had guns I can’t have” to protect their egos. For those that actually want to test themselves versus the skills of other players, even if that means you’re going to get legitimately spanked from time to time, nothing sucks the fun out like running into a player with no skill that’s dual wielding automatic shotguns because they unlocked the option and you haven’t.

As I said, I like the idea of having different loadouts for different styles of gameplay. Choosing the right loadout for a given situation, or for your personal strengths, is a skill in itself and adds to the depth of the game. To be taken seriously though, all the options that affect gameplay need to be available to all players at the same time. Otherwise any victory comes with an asterisk beside it.

There isn’t even as much costomization as CoD,they’ve thought this through. CoD has way to much and ridiculous amount of stupid things you can do Halo isn’t like that and hopefully wont be.

It’s too late to change anything so we will have to deal with it. But I don’t care at all if someone has a few gun and spec’ combo that I don’t have I will probably win anyway. If Reach is any indication of how people are skilled at the game then it’s pathetic at best for someone who play mostly in Objective/BTB and Invasion.

Not another thread like this…

> Not another thread like this…

Yeah, it’s just annoying at this point.

I’m a little uncomfortable with the “What you have is more important than any sort of practiced skill” blanket statement. While I understand where you’re coming from with that in terms of WoW, the very same statement can be taken over from RPG’s to MOBA games.

Which to the untrained or generally unfamiliar eye can be seen as “based on clicking and watching, where while strategy exists, what you have is more important than any sort of practiced skill”. Which any player of considerable time and skill level can tell you is completely pants.

Your item set or loadout do give you certain advantages. So do spells, runes, masteries, skill points, etc but you can’t exactly just faceroll on your keyboard and win in competetive play. No matter who your character is and how you set them up. You do have to know how to play them, how to play them in association with your team make up, how to play against your opponents, know how the opponents are going to react, set your combos up well, know you hard counters and prepare for them.

The same can be said of class-based shooters.

While Halo isn’t anywhere near truly classbased players do have to take on roles. Although these tend to be lose and rather ad hoc. We haven’t been in the realm of Arena Shooter in a very long time. Being in the murky middle-ground of standard shooter with little definative forms governing the genre.

It’s not necessarily about handing everyone the same cards. It’s about how individuals use the cards they have.

> > Not another thread like this…
>
> Yeah, it’s just annoying at this point.

I know right?

> Not another thread like this…

It concerns me that players make new threads when there are hundreds of posts like this. It shows how ignorant they are.

> > Not another thread like this…
>
> It concerns me that players make new threads when there are hundreds of posts like this. It shows how ignorant they are.

Yes, but half of the new thread topics are comparing Halo to CoD, even when what little there is that is similar has been drastically changed to accommodate Halo’s style of multiplayer.

…Please don’t post. I’m not even wasting my time on this message because of you saying “Call of Halo”. Halo 4 is amazing.

> There isn’t even as much costomization as CoD,they’ve thought this through. CoD has way to much and ridiculous amount of stupid things you can do Halo isn’t like that and hopefully wont be.

Yeah, I hope you’re right. I still like that customization is there. Just have to wait to see how much unlockable upgrades throw off (or don’t) in practice.

> It’s too late to change anything so we will have to deal with it. But I don’t care at all if someone has a few gun and spec’ combo that I don’t have I will probably win anyway. If Reach is any indication of how people are skilled at the game then it’s pathetic at best for someone who play mostly in Objective/BTB and Invasion.

Fair enough. I suppose the unlocks could end up more different than being actual upgrades. Then they wouldn’t be so bad, but still a disappointing direction that at least makes me skeptical of where 343 will go in the long run.

> …the very same statement can be taken over from RPG’s to MOBA games.

You’re right, you can. Don’t mistake me, even in RPG’s skill is necessary. It’s all a matter of degree. Halo, as everyone has had the same resources, has relied almost completely on the skill of the players, which is why it’s been more of a tournament game. Many RPGs exist far in the opposite direction. MOBA games lie somewhere in the middle, with how far in either direction depending on the game and how many unlockable levels exist to upgrade abilities (both character and weapons).

No, in most you can’t just slam your face into the keyboard and take home the gold, but the very moment you have items and abilities unlocked that are stronger than what you start with, you’ve decreased the skill necessary to defeat someone of lower level. The more level ups, the easier it is. Sure, vs others with upgrades of the same level you’re back into the pure skill game, but you’ve still added a “stuff” element. Of course this drives people to get more upgrades to once again not have to rely only on their ability to win. It’s a system that rewards seniority instead of pure capability. It’s the difference between a contest involving skill and a contest of skill.

Different options are good; they increase depth and add variety. As long as the options are available to everyone, the game remains a contest of skill and not one merely involving skill. As I said, it wouldn’t be accepted in any other game of skill, so why accept it here, you know? After all, as you pointed out, we already have a lot of options that offer the skill/stuff hybrid.

As for class-based shooters, if players are allowed to choose from all the classes, then it’s still a game of skill. If classes are unlocked, then it comes down to how much the unlocked classes are stronger as apposed to just being different.

I agree, it’s not about people having the same cards, but it is about having the same deck. You can only have so many cards at once in any given hand. This allows for strategy, variety, and luck. But only a fool plays cards with someone who has a stacked deck.

I can see it now: Call of Halo: Modern Reach!!!

The day they say the rocket lawnchair is a primary instead of a ordnance is the day Ill be concerned.

And Ive played Halo 4, it doesnt play like CoD at all. Quit comparing the two.

> …Please don’t post. I’m not even wasting my time on this message because of you saying “Call of Halo”. Halo 4 is amazing.

Has somebody finally perfected the time machine! Please oh please! I’ll take a dozen to go!

> The day they say the rocket lawnchair is a primary instead of a ordnance is the day Ill be concerned.
>
> And Ive played Halo 4, it doesnt play like CoD at all. Quit comparing the two.

That’s excellent! Then perhaps you can put my mind to ease then. How well balanced are the unlocked abilities when compared to the ones you start with? I would still prefer all abilities to be available from the beginning, and unlocks being cosmetic only, but if they balanced them well it wouldn’t be so bad at least.

Unlike CoD, you have 2 confirmed ways of ranking up and unlocking stuff. A third one is only speculation:

  1. Play Spartan Ops. They’re 10-15 minutes long, and you can play with three of your friends doing so. Quick as a Slayer match, and you can tackle them however you want.

  2. Play Wargames.

  3. Play Social games, or Action Sack-type games such as Infection, Grifball and social games.

So far on the list, the perks don’t even have affect your base traits at all. Most of them don’t even affect how a fight turns out. Even more so, you can select two premade loadouts that come with stuff appropriate to that map and gametype. You shouldn’t be forced to spawn with an AR and a Magnum unless you actually chose that loadout.

343 isn’t going to make you bash your head against the wall before you enjoy the game…unless you are a masochist.