"But I thought Pros were helping 343i?"

I have been seeing a ton of posts from various threads and people questioning or even just mentioning the fact that former pro players are helping 343 build the game. While I really do think this is the absolute best way of building a balanced, competitive and fun game, I think most people misunderstand their role in the game.

After watching “The Sprint”, and reading tons of 343 employee posts over at Neogaf, Twitter and TeamBeyond, its become quite clear to me that while the pros have a say on the end tweaks of a map or game design choice, they are given very limited authority on high level decision-making instances.

For the most part, people like Quin Delhoyo and Josh Holmes, along with other 343 employees, are the ones making high-level decisions. Of course, they re the ones with the degrees and the job experience, so naturally they will be the ones who call the shots. I get that. What is frustrating to me, and most likely to the pros on hire as well, is that StrongSide, Dersky, Neighbour, etc. don’t get to design the game. They don’t get to choose if sprint is in, if ADS is in, if Ground-Pound is in, etc. They are there to test the game in-house and provide feedback. They are essentially 343 testers, much like we are Beta-testers right now. We can play the game, form an opinion, and report it to 343 all we want. However, it is ultimately 343’s decision to change anything about the game. What really bugged me watching The Sprint was the hierarchy and atmosphere at 343. Here you have a group of Tier 1 fans (the Pros), who know everything about the game, inside and out. They known exactly what makes a competitive game and know exactly what changes to make to build the greatest Halo game of all time. Then you have people like Quinn and Josh (I’m not picking on them, they were just the most prominent figures in The Sprint) who are obviously nice guys, and aren’t throwing their weight around or anything like that. Yet, they very obviously don’t understand the deepr workings of Halo or what made it great. They are quite clearly lacking skill in the game itself, yet it is them who get to make the final shots. It is Quinn and the gang sitting in the board room deciding which maps are in and how the game will play. I’m not claiming to understand exactly what goes on in 343 from just watching The Sprint. However, its sort of obvious when you watch that, coupled with the plethora of inside posts from all kinds of people who have worked with 343, that the pros are really at the bottom over there.

Then, to really put things into perspective, think about those pros, and what their best interests are. They may play the game, form their own opinion, and want to warn 343 of certain aspects of the game that need changing, but are halted by the inevitable fact that that they are being paid by 343. I’m not saying these pros are being paid to tell people the game is great, etc. I’m saying this - Imagine you are one of the pro testers. Lets say you don’t like one of the major changes Halo 5 has made. Lets also say that you know exactly why said change is bad for Halo, and that you can produce clear and valid reasons for why it is bad. Lastly, remember that you were offered a position by 43 to “help” them form the game. You’ve got people like Quinn and Josh whoare basically your bosses, and have the power to remove your opportunity at 343. What are you going to do?

Sure, you may provide some feedback on small-level design choices, but you are never going to come out and say something like “remove sprint” to the devs. The game has been largely designed at the high-level already. 343 and the executives above them have already determined the general direction the franchise is headed. The decisions by them have already been made - for reasons way beyond good gameplay or fan service. Remember, video games make money, and those that own the rights to it are going to try and make lots of money.

I know there will be sigh’s at this next point, but just hear me out. Look at sprint. Do you honestly think any of the pro players have given their honest opinion about it? Do you really think any of them could stand up in front of their bosses and exclaim 343’s backward-thinking, close-minded decisions? The game has been entirely designed around things like sprint, clamber, etc. A mere grunt in the company cannot change that.

To summarize: Don’t blame the pros. They are surely providing feedback to 343, and I don’t doubt there have been tons of changes brought about because of the existence of pros at 343. I’m not saying having them there is pointless or in vain. All I’m saying is that they want to stay where they are now and won’t risk their careers for the sake of a video game. 343 hired them to provide feedback, and not to argue with them. Theres a reason they chose people like StrongSide, Ghost, Neighbour, etc. - they are “nice guys”, “people pleasers”. They are great guys but before they were hired everyone knew thay they weren’t the type to stand up and shout their opinion everywhere. 343 deliberately avoided hiring anyone vocal and who would most likely butt heads with the devs. People like Ghandi, Snip3down, Ogre 2 and especially Lethul would have walked into the testing area, laughed and walked right out. Frankly, i wouldn’t want to be an in-house pro because I would be constantly frustrated; seeing something built infront of me that goes against everything that made me who I am, and not being able to have a true say on it. I couldn’t stand being torn between what is good for my job and what serves my passion.

I’m always amazed when people think people that play games professionally know how to design a game better than people that actually make the games. They may have some good ideas, but there is a reason they’re not making high-level decisions.

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> I’m always amazed when people think people that play games professionally know how to design a game better than people that actually make the games. They may have some good ideas, but there is a reason they’re not making high-level decisions.

exactly, and who watches pros anymore?? i never watched them in the first place, they just rinse and repeat BR headshots ooohhh soooooo skillfull sarcsim if they were to take out precision weapons in tournaments then that would take SOME skill.

During “The Sprint,” it honestly seemed like 343i was pretty much responding to the pros with a “yeah, whatever, okay” attitude.

As for thoughts that pros shouldn’t be making big decisions? Maybe. Who knows? They may very well be able to make good calls for an ideal Halo experience for competitive players.

A large number of 343i’s employees are, however, clearly not qualified to make the high-level decisions that they make. MCC launched completely broken. Halo 4 is widely despised, but very few people actually acknowledge how unfinished the game was upon release: features like campaign scoring were needlessly cut, the “red X” was missing in multiplayer, and a number of multiplayer options were broken. File share took months to be launched. Forge options were randomly missing for no apparent reason.

The most puzzling, however, was that Halo 4 was lacking Halo Reach’s weapon tuning backbone upon release. 343i actually created the weapon tuning patch for Reach, and Halo 4 was built off of Reach. Why this was missing is puzzling at best.

Also, to the guy who wants to pretend that pros are nothing without precision weapons: I once watched a video of Final Boss (“classic” - StrongSide/Walshy/Ogre1/Ogre2) win a match against MLG 50s on Guardian TS. They won the match without firing a single shot. The crazy thing about that? They honestly weren’t that great at Halo 3.

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> > 2533274793115123;2:
> > I’m always amazed when people think people that play games professionally know how to design a game better than people that actually make the games. They may have some good ideas, but there is a reason they’re not making high-level decisions.
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> exactly, and who watches pros anymore?? i never watched them in the first place, they just rinse and repeat BR headshots ooohhh soooooo skillfull sarcsim if they were to take out precision weapons in tournaments then that would take SOME skill.

Cant…take…troll…bait.

Yeah, 343 doesnt let them design the game because they are not game designers.

They are very talented testers. I dont know how you got the impression that these pro gamers were actually designing anything, but their role is offer input oh how to fine tune the gameplay.

And quite honestly, Halo 5 plays spectacularly. Their input is clearly felt in the balancing of the game.

> 2533274793115123;2:
> I’m always amazed when people think people that play games professionally know how to design a game better than people that actually make the games. They may have some good ideas, but there is a reason they’re not making high-level decisions.

I would trust people who know the mechanics in and out over the frat boys and business women making decisions at 343 right now.

pros lol