Bulldog: Y'all do get how it works right?

Y’all the bulldog ain’t bad.

So I see a lot of Waypointers here, trying to say the Bulldog is bad or not as good as the old shotgun… Buuuut that’s… not true.

All the old shotguns, yeah, they can one-bang sure. But if you weren’t quite in one-bang range, you needed to melee them to ensure the kill. That has not changed at all.

But what has changed is the Bulldog’s effective range. It is much higher but yes, while it does do less damage, it also reloads much faster. Most of your kills will be three-shots, but it will kill any unshielded spartan with a single body shot. You can get off a two-bang pretty easily, but out of every shotgun we have ever had, this thing has the tightest cone and longest range. That three-bang goes out pretty far.

So long as you bang and punch at that “Should be” instant kill range, you will get that one shot kill. You aren’t going to beat a sword at point blank and you shouldn’t, that’s the whole point of this change.

But, you will beat the sword before he gets to you. You just need to round corners a little wider.

I’ve got pro player friends who are really happy with it, one who even said it was broken in the flight and - yeah, it was lol. But they slowed the RoF a little bit so that if you want that kill you gotta’ work for it.

This ain’t the slapcannon the old shotguns are. It’s a shotgun. It can reach way further. If they introduce the old shotgun, you can basically treat it like DOOM treats its shotguns, your standard and your super. That’s really what the relationship is.

But the Bulldog is here to stay and it ain’t meant to be like the old shotgun, nor should it be.


it also reloads much faster


Old shotgun reloaded one shell at a time, meaning if you spent all of them but someone else was coming around the corner you could quickly load one more shell and pop them. Bulldog reload takes roughly the same length of time as getting an associate’s degree.


Yeah I can’t speak to what pros may or may not be saying about it. But, as I said on another thread, I can speak to my experience, which is that the Bulldog is routinely left on the rack in ranked. It is not particularly an advantage over the Mangler you can pick up around every corner on most small maps–both are mostly only useful for one-shot and melee combo. If you’re at a range you need 3 shots, you probably already had the BR out and if you spend time switching to the Bulldog, you will already be toast.

In my experience, this three shot goldilocks zone you’re talking about is pretty small before you’re in danger of getting killed by a decent player with a four shot BR burst. Most people aren’t running around most parts of the map with the Bulldog out–it’s really only going to be in enclosed spaces, and at that point it’s functionally equivalent to the mangler (and heatwave),

Is it better than having no secondary? For sure. Is it better than the mangler or heatwave? In 95% of scenarios in my experience, no. In previous Halos, you would absolutely never see teams ignoring a shotgun during an entire match. That’s because it had legitimate CQB dominance and could clear a room–nobody’s getting multiple people with a Bulldog unless those people are awful because you’re going trade a melee with the first guy when you go for the shot-melee and the other one should finish you off. But again, the weapon’s frequently left alone in Diamond/Onyx ranked at the moment (admittedly, the ranks are all still shaking out), so take from that what you will. I’ve had plenty of time to use it because nobody else ever seems to pick it up!


Then grab a heatwave instead lol. You should not be loading this gun like the Bulldog that’s not what it’s FOR.

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Funny thing, I saw you post this almost verbatim elsewhere and my comp buddy says it’s generally better to have the dog out instead of the BR, since switching to a BR doesn’t automatically lose you BR fights.

I’d generally prefer having the bulldog over the mangler. I can’t two bang with the Mangler, but I can with the Bulldog. Just gives me options.

As for nobody getting a multi with the bulldog, idk. Whenever I’m on streets I grab it for cleaning duty. Came up to a spawn, saw two dudes without shields and pounded each one out without breaking a sweat. Wasn’t point blank either, but it was a sure kill.

My experience is different. I just find a lot of success with it.

Bulldog is melee the gun.

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At close range yeah. Beyond that, 2-3 bang it.

needing to punch to make it work defeats the purpose of having it at all, might as well use the mangler if you are going to risk putting yourself in melee range in the first place. from what experimenting i could stomach (because the bulldog is absolutely horrendous) to take advantage of the “extra” range on a moving target you have to lead your shots an unprecedented amount with a shotgun for the series. could be worked out altering the velocity of the shots.

regardless of if this is fixed the core issues remains. the ENTIRE series has had shotguns that work on similar premise, even if they insisted on nerfing each generation further and further. now the game has completely removed any trace of that and the only “replacement” is a gun that operates with an entirely separate philosophy of use.

as for your “pro” friends. pros opinions on the game mean nothing to me. less than 1/10 a percent of the player base are “pros” and catering major game facets to such a minority of people has been a mistake 343 has been repeatedly making


Catering to pros will kill the game, no excuse. Ask Gears 5


A lot of times it comes down to how a weapon feels. A shotgun is supposed to feel like an empowering weapon at a range. The player is likely to feel like the shotgun is a less viable option if it requires a melee or a lot of ammo in most cases. You can easily kill anyone with a few rounds and a melee. The player with the shotgun may feel upset when killed that way with the standard weapon. That directly affects the feel of the shotgun, making it generally associated as an unsatisfying weapon.

It is viable but in a different way. It is its own weapon. It’s a new twist on a classic but It can never really replace the feel of the old shotgun.


I’m very surprised a comp player can win duels when they’re a full shot behind from having to switch out for the BR, but I haven’t watched much comp.

What range are you two-shotting with the Bulldog? There must be like a foot of effective space where that works and a shot-melee doesn’t. To your multikill example, I mean, sure, if you come across two unshielded guys with any gun, you’re going to crank them.

It’s different experiences for different folks I guess, and I’m glad it works from someone. I’m not sure what matches you’re playing in, but in mine, it’s always there for the taking. So, you’ll certainly have the option!

Personally, I would much rather have the shotgun that can kill in one shot, up close, than a shotgun that requires multiple shots, up close or far away.


I’m not sure if this is relevant but I was still tap firing the bulldog like it was a shotgun. I had no idea it was fullauto.

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You’ve kinda’ always needed to punch if you were using it seriously. Like if you were using the old one and not punching to confirm idk what to tell you.

As for repeatedly making the catering to pros mistake you uh, no, no they’ve ignored them for like a decade now.


Whatever range doesn’t require three shots, requires two. I’m always ready for three though.

It’s just a high quality weapon. But it isn’t a power weapon. 343i has made a pretty clear distinction that pickup weapons are not strictly power weapons, but power weapons, are usually highlighted on the map now. It’s really interesting.


Wdym the heatwave is dogwater. You need to be laser precise with the alt fire mode to get a kill and the regular fire mode does less damage than a shot with the halo 2 pistol lmao. Not to mention the ROG is so slow that if you miss your first but you’re almost guaranteed to lose the engagement


I guess don’t miss then.

the entire point of the old shotguns in a pvp perspective is to kill someone just outside of melee range without having to gamble your entire shield on a melee yourself.

as for the pros bit idk how inviting them to come test the game in house during development consistently across halo 5 is ignoring them


Just because they invite them doesn’t mean they listen to them.

Just use the bulldog how it asks you to and you’ll do better.

Needs a fire rate increase imo. By the time you get the necessary 3-4 shots for a kill fired you have already lost all of your shields and almost all of your health from assault rifle fire, making you an easy mop-up for the inevitable enemy teammate that appears out of nowhere before your shields regen.