people have been complaining about bloom sense Reach was released. everyone thinks that bloom completely ruined this game, and i agreed with everyone until i realized that it wasn’t bloom that ruined Halo Reach. In fact it was the way that bungie implemented it into the game that made it not work.
they made two huge mistakes with the bloom system. number one they used a single shot weapon for the main utility weapon and number two it was random and uncontrollable.
if they had done it right first of all they would have used the battle rifle because it is a three shot burst. this would work better because sense it has three shot burst you would only get all three of the bullets to hit when the reticle was at its smallest. when it was larger then only one or two bullets would hit. if this was done of course it would only be a 4 shot kill for the BR if all 3 bullets hit or else it could be up to 12 shot becuase of bloom
also it shouldnt have been so random. you should have been able to master it, both with spamming and with pacing or anything between. in my opinion it would have been nice if they split the redicle for the BR(if it was in the game of course, but hey h4 is comin) into three sections, and have each section represent a general area were the bullet will land. so you could be able to spam the trigger as fast as you can, but you would have to be better at aiming the edges of the bloom and it would take more shots.
Bloom should be kept out of Halo 4 not because of its issues as a game mechanic, but because of the negative vibes the community will instil upon the game because of it.
> Bloom should be kept out of Halo 4 not because of its issues as a game mechanic, but because of the negative vibes the community will instil upon the game because of it.
it wouldnt have had any negative vibes if it were only put in correctly.
> it wouldnt have had any negative vibes if it were only put in correctly.
You may very well be right, but unfortunately that’s not how things turned out. In all honesty I too am a little sad that its going, if merely from an aesthetic perspective, the bloom on reticle actually looked pretty cool IMO.
> > it wouldnt have had any negative vibes if it were only put in correctly.
>
> You may very well be right, but unfortunately that’s not how things turned out. In all honesty I too am a little sad that its going, if merely from an aesthetic perspective, the bloom on reticle actually looked pretty cool IMO.
yeah it is sad becuase it actually could have INCREASED the skill gap instead of decreasing it, and it seems like everyone wants a skill gap.
> > it wouldnt have had any negative vibes if it were only put in correctly.
>
> You may very well be right, but unfortunately that’s not how things turned out. In all honesty I too am a little sad that its going, if merely from an aesthetic perspective, the bloom on reticle actually looked pretty cool IMO.
Then again, they could implement the same mechanic but just change the visible part of it and call it something else, like “random spread” or “recoil”. Just as long as it got a new name and does not exactly look like bloom, it’ll be fine.
Especially if it works as intended this time around, that would be a good start
A rifle kicks up. An automatic will kick in a more random fashion.
The dmr should have had an upward kick that would correct itself if fired slowly or required player correction if fired quickly (which lends itself to aiming at the chest at certain ranges and allowing the recoil to drive your aim up for the head shot, but thats cool with me)
> > > it wouldnt have had any negative vibes if it were only put in correctly.
> >
> > You may very well be right, but unfortunately that’s not how things turned out. In all honesty I too am a little sad that its going, if merely from an aesthetic perspective, the bloom on reticle actually looked pretty cool IMO.
>
> Then again, they could implement the same mechanic but just change the visible part of it and call it something else, like “random spread” or “recoil”. Just as long as it got a new name and does not exactly look like bloom, it’ll be fine.
> Especially if it works as intended this time around, that would be a good start
Bupkiss. Its not the visual that caused the problem but that bloom didn’t work as intended.
Implementing the same mechanic without the visual will not help it work as intended. Implementing a similar mechanic might.
> A rifle kicks up. An automatic will kick in a more random fashion.
>
> The dmr should have had an upward kick that would correct itself if fired slowly or required player correction if fired quickly (which lends itself to aiming at the chest at certain ranges and allowing the recoil to drive your aim up for the head shot, but thats cool with me)
>
> Bloom works great for autos.
yeah kicks are more realistic, but your a super soldier no gun should ever kick when you shoot it
> > A rifle kicks up. An automatic will kick in a more random fashion.
> >
> > The dmr should have had an upward kick that would correct itself if fired slowly or required player correction if fired quickly (which lends itself to aiming at the chest at certain ranges and allowing the recoil to drive your aim up for the head shot, but thats cool with me)
> >
> > Bloom works great for autos.
>
> yeah kicks are more realistic, but your a super soldier no gun should ever kick when you shoot it
Well red and blue Spartans shouldn’t be fighting over a flaming skull but THAT made it in. You really can’t control recoil no matter your strength. Recoil was in the beta but they took it out. I wish they hadn’t. LolHemorrhage would have been less problematic.
I’ll copy and paste from you’re other thread on this subject:
> From what I’ve been able to deduce, Bloom’s original intent was to provide the pin point accurate precision weapon that people wanted but to make utilizing that pin point precision to cross map ineffective with long kill times by forcing the user to wait for bloom to completely reset every time before the shot will stand any chance of hitting the target. Much like using SQBs with the AR to harass targets at midrange.
>
> And that at the more common ranges of engagement, players wouldn’t be firing at the slowest speed and would instead be able to fire faster. The problem however is that even at midrange, ignoring the distance of your target and adjusting your RoF accordingly and just spamming the weapon pays off far too much.
>
> That’s the problem with Bloom.
Halo Reach’s bloom ruined Halo Reach, along with many other things but that’s besides the point.
As others have stated already, Bloom works great on automatic weapons, where you can just hold down the trigger, but with semi-auto weapons like the BR and the DMR, bloom doesn’t work very well.
Let me put it this way:
For Semi-Autos:
-Even if bloom works to perfection and punishes spammers 100%, it does not add skill to the game. Bloom on semi-autos forces players to take more time in between shots to play optimally, giving players with worse aim more time to correct it, while at the same time, forcing players with superior aim to slow down their RoF.
For Autos:
-Bloom works perfectly for Automatic weapons. I think a perfect example is looking at the Halo CE pistol, which is in fact an automatic weapon. Holding down the trigger on the CE pistol activated the bloom while shooting in a semi-auto manner was bloomless (on console at least). This effectively punished players who chose the “noobier” or “less difficult” fashion of firing the weapon. Bloom on the AR works almost ideally in Halo: Reach, but i’ll touch on what I think could be improved.
Basically what I am trying to say is this:
Bloom is a system that is supposed to punish players for using the easier function of the gun. The problem with bloom on semi-autos is that “spamming” is not the easier way of firing the gun.
In Halo 4, we should have:
-A bloomless BR with a RoF ideally around that of the Halo 2 BR undoubleshotted (SUPER WORD)
-An AR/Automatic Weapon with a very punishing bloom, but with higher damage, so it dominates its niche (CQC) like in Halo CE (and could be even better), especially if players skillfully pulse their shots.
If autos are like this in Halo 4, I bet the competitive community would be more open to their use.
> > A rifle kicks up. An automatic will kick in a more random fashion.
> >
> > The dmr should have had an upward kick that would correct itself if fired slowly or required player correction if fired quickly (which lends itself to aiming at the chest at certain ranges and allowing the recoil to drive your aim up for the head shot, but thats cool with me)
> >
> > Bloom works great for autos.
>
> yeah kicks are more realistic, but your a super soldier no gun should ever kick when you shoot it
> A rifle kicks up. An automatic will kick in a more random fashion.
>
> The dmr should have had an upward kick that would correct itself if fired slowly or required player correction if fired quickly (which lends itself to aiming at the chest at certain ranges and allowing the recoil to drive your aim up for the head shot, but thats cool with me)
>
> Bloom works great for autos.
Funny thing is, the beta DID have a recoil effect on the DMR. With hindsight i feel that it should have been kept in, its an added incentive to pace and punishes spamming more. I seem to remember people making more of an effort to line up their shots in the beta. Check it out http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yrkd6ylXWiY
You have to realise though that recoil was cut based on player feedback at the time. Yet people then complained bitterly about how bloom worked in the retail game.
It doesnt really surprise you that they cant work out what this schizophrenic fanbase really wants.
> Funny thing is, the beta DID have a recoil effect on the DMR. With hindsight i feel that it should have been kept in, its an added incentive to pace and punishes spamming more. I seem to remember people making more of an effort to line up their shots in the beta. Check it out http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oZYqxdpApKg
>
> You have to realise though that recoil was cut based on player feedback at the time. Yet people then complained bitterly about how bloom worked in the retail game.
>
> It doesnt really surprise you that they cant work out what this schizophrenic fanbase really wants.
Fatal, this might be the first time I have actually agreed with you
> > A rifle kicks up. An automatic will kick in a more random fashion.
> >
> > The dmr should have had an upward kick that would correct itself if fired slowly or required player correction if fired quickly (which lends itself to aiming at the chest at certain ranges and allowing the recoil to drive your aim up for the head shot, but thats cool with me)
> >
> > Bloom works great for autos.
>
> Funny thing is, the beta DID have a recoil effect on the DMR. With hindsight i feel that it should have been kept in, its an added incentive to pace and punishes spamming more. I seem to remember people making more of an effort to line up their shots in the beta. Check it out http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yrkd6ylXWiY
>
> You have to realise though that recoil was cut based on player feedback at the time. Yet people then complained bitterly about how bloom worked in the retail game.
>
> It doesnt really surprise you that they cant work out what this schizophrenic fanbase really wants.
Seriously.
I’ve seen the videos. Recoil on top of bloom seems like a bad idea, so I understand that one had to go- too bad recoil was the easier of the two to take out.
> > A rifle kicks up. An automatic will kick in a more random fashion.
> >
> > The dmr should have had an upward kick that would correct itself if fired slowly or required player correction if fired quickly (which lends itself to aiming at the chest at certain ranges and allowing the recoil to drive your aim up for the head shot, but thats cool with me)
> >
> > Bloom works great for autos.
>
> Funny thing is, the beta DID have a recoil effect on the DMR. With hindsight i feel that it should have been kept in, its an added incentive to pace and punishes spamming more. I seem to remember people making more of an effort to line up their shots in the beta. Check it out http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yrkd6ylXWiY
>
> You have to realise though that recoil was cut based on player feedback at the time. Yet people then complained bitterly about how bloom worked in the retail game.
>
> It doesnt really surprise you that they cant work out what this schizophrenic fanbase really wants.
Recoil is a great, consistent way of keeping the semi-autos in check. I was surprised to see it removed.
Players could either wait for their barrel to settle between shots, or they could manually reset their reticule, thus creating a skill gap.
> Halo Reach’s bloom ruined Halo Reach, along with many other things but that’s besides the point.
>
> As others have stated already, Bloom works great on automatic weapons, where you can just hold down the trigger, but with semi-auto weapons like the BR and the DMR, bloom doesn’t work very well.
>
> Let me put it this way:
> For Semi-Autos:
> -Even if bloom works to perfection and punishes spammers 100%, it does not add skill to the game. Bloom on semi-autos forces players to take more time in between shots to play optimally, giving players with worse aim more time to correct it, while at the same time, forcing players with superior aim to slow down their RoF.
if they made the bloom faster you wouldnt have to have slower rate of fire. idealy you should be able to time your shots perfectly and still have time to get an over kill in a reasonable amount of time.
> if they made the bloom faster you wouldnt have to have slower rate of fire. idealy you should be able to time your shots perfectly and still have time to get an over kill in a reasonable amount of time.
If the bloom resets faster there really isn’t a point of having bloom at all. Besides, my point still stands that “spamming” is more skillful with Semi-Autos because it is more difficult to aim faster.
> > if they made the bloom faster you wouldnt have to have slower rate of fire. idealy you should be able to time your shots perfectly and still have time to get an over kill in a reasonable amount of time.
>
> If the bloom resets faster there really isn’t a point of having bloom at all. Besides, my point still stands that “spamming” is more skillful with Semi-Autos because it is more difficult to aim faster.
it would only be slightly faster not instant reseting. i mean it would still be bloom. also with my original idea in the op it wouldnt be spammer friendly unless in close range
