In Halo 4 we weren’t simply able to pick up grenades like we did in past games. Instead we had to equip an armor mod in order to pick up grenades from dead players.
Some people see this as a base player trait being stripped away so that 343 could fill in their list of armor mods.
While others see this as a way to put a strangle hold on grenade spamming.
Personally I was very pleased to see grenade spamming slow down. I believe it’s made people be a lot smarter with how they use their grenades and I’d like to see things stay this way in Halo 5.
Maybe taking away a base trait that’s been there since CE isn’t the best way to solve grenade spamming though. If so should grenade pick up become a base player trait again and do you think there is a better way to stop grenade spamming?
Do you even think grenade spamming is that much of an issue? Do you think Halo 4 has made grenade spamming worse? Or has nothing changed?
I have never thought of grenade spamming as an issue? What even is grenade spamming?
I think 343 removed the option to pick up grenades to make the game more accessible for players and to mitigate the skill level between the players.
Grenades in Halo 2 and Halo 3 were extremely identical. Both were capable of completely dropping a shield if thrown accurately enough. The blast radius on these were quite small, but players were able to throw them with great accuracy due to predictable bounces and short timers.
Not only is the grenades in Halo 4 and Reach unpredictable and has a larger blast radius, then the grenades before them - In Halo 4 they are also limited to no pick up so that great players can’t pick them up and use them to their advantage.
Having no grenades on the ground also takes away the skill to handle some moments of tough and timeconsuming situations. A good player could get chased and think “I will survive if I pick up that grenade, and throw it behind me”. A stressed low level player would not think like this.
Now it doesn’t help that if even the good player still thinks like this, it will help him just as little as players who don’t think like this.
And with less things on the map, you have to think less of map movement and positioning.
Spamming implies that it is just random nade throwing in hopes of getting kills you wouldn’t otherwise get with little to no skill involved.
Nades in Halo play such an important role at high levels of play. They can stop pushes, flag caps, power positions, weapon control ect… Removing that as a viable tactic stagnates gameplay and removes clutch moments that keep so many players coming back for more.
In a game where they continue to make it more difficult to single-handedly out skill multiple opponents… removing having nades handy is just sillyness.
I’d definitely prefer to be able to pick up grenades again. Because of the inability to pick them up, grenades in Halo 4 (frags especially) are much stronger than their predecessors. If we go back to the blast radius and strength found in the original trilogy, then grenade spamming wouldn’t be an issue (and I don’t really think it ever was.)
As someone that starts with Plasmas, I never seem to get the chance to use Frag grenades anymore. I miss them dearly.
I don’t really buy into this Grenade spamming thing as being an issue. What… killing someone with a grenade is too easy? Shooting is pretty dam easy at the moment, what with the aim assist levels… Bullet Spamming? melee isn’t particularly hard either, the melee lock on angle I swear nearly encompasses the players’ entire field of view at the moment…
I don’t know, I think Grenading is a skill that does take time to master and fully exploit. I also think positioning, awareness and the ability and knowledge of how to avoid nades is a skill. You’ve got to learn trajectories, you have to get good at angling ricochets, you have to get good at leading you enemies and predicting their movements and equally you have to posses good map knowledge to know how to avoid nades and punish players who don’t.
I think grenades play too large a role in gameplay balancing to be marginalised.
They provide a near instant kill ability to players who have not yet picked up a power weapon like say for example a Rocket Launcher. Having counters like this freely available is vitally important in the balancing of a power weapon system. They also provide a counter to camping and close range weapons. If someone is camping around a corner with a shotgun, even if you know they are there, you can’t approach them, you cant engage them without getting close… unless you have grenades. If someone is camping a power position and hiding every time they get shot, you can only engage them unless, again, you get close and infiltrate their position… or you can use grenades. Grenades make the battle field less safe for passive players. That’s a good thing in my books. Even if you are hiding behind cover, you are not completely safe. You have to be on your toes, you have to be aware and play smart to survive.
Vehicle flipping also played a huge role in vehicle balancing back in the day. I don’t know… I prefer it to emp spamming.
Yes if the blast radiuses are too big they can be a problem. If maps are designed with too many choke points they can be a problem. If grenades blow up too quick and are unavoidable they again can be a problem… of course they have to be balanced. But I don’t recall them being unbalanced in H2/3.
Removing grenade pick up is just a way of helping spawners. If you die a lot you will have more nades made available to you. You spawn with 2 nades and the maximum you can carry of each grenade type is 2… What’s up with that?
Resupply should become a default ability once again… It never should have been removed in the first place.
I could care less about it in multiplayer, but it affects campaign it’s pretty infuriating
I would hope resupply is a default ability. I think there is no such thing as grenade spamming. I think that is something that was created by campers who kept getting double-naded while hiding in their spot.
If I know a guy is camping a corner with a shotty, if I drop 2 grenades (because 1 nade doesn’t kill), that’s not spamming, but I believe that is what campers consider to be spamming.
So yes, we absolutely should be able to pick up grenades.
Worst part was that it affected Co-op Campaign.
Simply lowering the grenade count/number of grenades you spawn with or taking away the ability to pick them up just ruins the game.
I’ve always wondered why devs love making these changes across every game mode… are they that lazy?! The Halo 3 AR and Magnum were balanced for MP, not for Campaign. To that end, they came up with lousy canon excuses so they could include them unchanged. People ended up tossing them aside when they came across a better weapon. That kind of mentality is suitable for MP, not Campaign!
> <mark>I would hope resupply is a default ability. I think there is no such thing as grenade spamming. I think that is something that was created by campers who kept getting double-naded while hiding in their spot.</mark>
> <mark>If I know a guy is camping a corner with a shotty, if I drop 2 grenades (because 1 nade doesn’t kill), that’s not spamming, but I believe that is what campers consider to be spamming.</mark>
>
> So yes, we absolutely should be able to pick up grenades.
Then the problem was never the grenades - It was the player all the time. Not because he was camping, but he died because it was purely his fault.
Maybe that Is why I can’t relate to grenade spamming.
It’s not the same with Armor Abilities for example, because they are random.
I greatly prefer a solution of balancing grenades in a way that results in grenades being rewarding to intelligent, skillful game play while not rewarding blind throws and punishing their use in situations they are not warranted.
Removing the ability to pick them up removes the problem of grenades dominating game play, but it doesn’t actually solve the issue of balance.
We should be able to pick them up off the map / body’s
But they would need to be a little less powerful
Correct me if I’m wrong but weren’t you only able to pick up grenades in the old games if the person died whilst still in possession of a grenade?
I use Resupply now and I know you get a grenade every time you run over a body but when I come to think of it, I didnt always have grenades on me in the older games after I did so.
I find that pretty balanced and fair.
Grenades are an integral part of Halo game play. Grenade jumps, pre-nading, flush outs, you name it.
If you wanted to prevent ‘grenade spam’ why not just limit the grenade count of spawn or something?
If anything 343 made grenade spamming far worse with 3 grenade loadouts, and instant respawns. They probably stripped pick up to keep their new controllers from retiring early from left trigger abuse.
Removing the ability to pick up grenades had a similar effect on me as finding out that the ability to run would require a special apparatus in Reach:
“Genetically enhanced, cybernetically augmented, rigorously trained super-soldier in a self-contained, perpetually energized power suit. Cannot survive a 20 foot drop. Cannot survive in 4 feet of water. Cannot exceed walking speed without an override.”
And then I learned about Halo 4’s removal of plundering grenades from dead bodies, and all I could picture was that same uber-enhanced super soldier staring at a grenade on the floor, sweating so profusely it’s flooding the inside of his helmet, thinking “Oh. My. GOD! How do I pick this thing up?! I don’t know how to pick this thing up!! Do I…do I need some kind of special equipment? Where are the technicians? Someone explain this to me in small words, I’m begging you! I know it can fit in my hand. I know I can carry them around on my belt. I know I can throw it. But for the love of God, how do I pick it up?!”
So yea, I have to go with this being a base player trait that was, in my opinion, removed for absolutely no sane or justifiable reason whatsoever. You want to reduce “nade spam?” Give people just one grenade on spawn, and don’t put more than a couple, if any at all, on the map. Or perhaps make it so that only one grenade from whichever stock is active on that player is dropped upon death. This will ensure that the only people who can “spam” grenades are those skilled, and quick, enough to take down multiple opponents and loot their bodies before any of them have a chance to throw their own grenade. If they’re spamming nades, it’s because at that point, they’ve earned it.
Personally I don’t usually live long enough to use the two grenades I spawn with anywhere outside of Campaign and Co-op (Spartan Ops, firefight).
> And then I learned about Halo 4’s removal of plundering grenades from dead bodies, and all I could picture was that same uber-enhanced super soldier staring at a grenade on the floor, sweating so profusely it’s flooding the inside of his helmet, thinking “Oh. My. GOD! How do I pick this thing up?! I don’t know how to pick this thing up!! Do I…do I need some kind of special equipment? Where are the technicians? Someone explain this to me in small words, I’m begging you! I know it can fit in my hand. I know I can carry them around on my belt. I know I can throw it. But for the love of God, how do I pick it up?!”
That legitimately made me smile. 
> > And then I learned about Halo 4’s removal of plundering grenades from dead bodies, and all I could picture was that same uber-enhanced super soldier staring at a grenade on the floor, sweating so profusely it’s flooding the inside of his helmet, thinking “Oh. My. GOD! How do I pick this thing up?! I don’t know how to pick this thing up!! Do I…do I need some kind of special equipment? Where are the technicians? Someone explain this to me in small words, I’m begging you! I know it can fit in my hand. I know I can carry them around on my belt. I know I can throw it. But for the love of God, how do I pick it up?!”
>
> That legitimately made me smile.
To quote Noble Six, “I aim to please.”