Battlefront 2 vs Halo Infinite

Games Halo Infinite
1

Before I get started: This is not a rant. I have ranted before about halo infinite, but this is just a prediction. I have a lot of respect of 343i and it’s employees.

Does anyone remember the Battlefront 2 microtransaction controversy? I am starting to see 343i heading down the path for halo infinite that EA took with battlefront 2. If 343i can’t learn from EA’s mistakes regarding battlefront 2, I can see the game dying before it even reaches it’s planned 10-year mark. Now, granted, Halo infinite is going to be a million times bigger than battlefront 2 was. But that doesn’t make it invincible.
I just wanted to remind everyone that Battlefront 2 is actually a good game now, (at least, I like it). It is a better now because the negative reaction to the game was so intense that EA actually backed off, and tried to fix it by removing a ton of the microtransactions (almost all of them), and started listening to the fans on what new content should be put in the game. Unfortunately, the player base is only a fraction of what it was at launch, and they have now stopped making updates for it. It lasted about 2 years. If 343i doesn’t fix it’s game before launch, (or at least soon after launch) I give it about 5 years before people simply get tired of 343i trying to squeeze every single penny out of their bank account, and stop playing. But again, this is just a prediction, and shouldn’t be taken too seriously.

Does anybody disagree? Let me know if you do, I would like to hear your opinions. Also let me know if I sound too much like the weird oracle professor lady from Harry Potter who was always predicting certain doom.

P.S. Battlefront 2 at launch was still a beautiful game, and the gameplay was pretty cool. Microtransactions aren’t enough to keep me from gunning down some battle droids, and it won’t be enough to keep me from gunning down some Banished.

2

The armor coating situation has clearly caused a lot of controversy, but i doubt it is enough to make 343 change its decision

3

> 2535424229992654;2:
> The armor coating situation has clearly caused a lot of controversy, but i doubt it is enough to make 343 change its decision

I agree. I am simply stating if they do change it, it will be after release.

4

Interestingly, Battlefront 2 got support and additional content over 2.5 years. And it wasn’t really missing content in the strictest sense. So, the new stuff added to the game was really new. However, I get why this can be viewed in different ways by people. At launch, the game was solid and worked well, but the microtransactions were absolutely abhorrent. That was the reason I did not play it when the game was brand new. I agree with you, BF2 became an incredible game and I absolutely loved my time with it. I played it after the predatory junk was removed.

Reason I bring up the points I did in my first sentence is because I wanted to contrast that with 343i’s handling of H5. H5 launched with a bad campaign (albeit, it was a solid technically) and a barebones MP (again, technically solid with smooth gameplay and locked 60fps) with promises of new content AND fixes to come later. Fast forward 2 years, when the unnecessary Overtime Update launched and H5’s support period ended with a Theater mode that barely worked right, an unenjoyable weapon sandbox (when the v1.0 sandbox was perfectly balanced and extremely fun), a UI that froze every time you hit anything, an invasive REQ system, and so on (the list is very long)…

Even though I have put in magnitudes more time into H5, I believe BF2 is a better game. It was also a major turning point in the way EA handled their games. EA’s new releases (save for the yearly sports games) are pretty solid and memorable. Perfect example is NFS Heat. I should also mention I don’t think H5 is bad by any means since I find at least some enjoyment in playing, just very flawed and filled with poor decisions that made it fail to reach its potential.

All this to say, I agree with your point about 343i following the same path as EA did with BF2. I and many others don’t like where things are headed because it’s starting to seem like all the predatory and boring garbage that ruined H5 will be present in Infinite, but disguised behind a very convoluted system like what we have with Gears 5. As I have said before, I think we need to wait and see how things turn out because nothing is set in stone, obviously, but voicing our distaste and concern is important to try and make sure the game is a game before it launches in a shoddy state. I’m sure there will be lots of backlash if the system is no good and then 343i will likely change course, just like EA did.

This sort of stuff is why I miss the gaming culture of the 2000’s since gamers would hotly anticipate a game, criticize upcoming features, have theories about how a story may / may not play out, etc. Instead, the prevalent topic everywhere is whether or not the microtransactions will be invasive. The anticipation has been partially soured for me because it’s not based purely around the game anymore. And I think that is an injustice to the employees of 343i who put in the most effort toward the story, gameplay, art, music, etc. All the talented people who do the heavy lifting of developing the game itself have no say over certain decisions and it’s a shame their work specifically is not getting the full focus it deserves.

5

> 2533274824050480;4:
> Interestingly, Battlefront 2 got support and additional content over 2.5 years. And it wasn’t really missing content in the strictest sense. So, the new stuff added to the game was really new. However, I get why this can be viewed in different ways by people. At launch, the game was solid and worked well, but the microtransactions were absolutely abhorrent. That was the reason I did not play it when the game was brand new. I agree with you, BF2 became an incredible game and I absolutely loved my time with it. I played it after the predatory junk was removed.
>
> Reason I bring up the points I did in my first sentence is because I wanted to contrast that with 343i’s handling of H5. H5 launched with a bad campaign (albeit, it was a solid technically) and a barebones MP (again, technically solid with smooth gameplay and locked 60fps) with promises of new content AND fixes to come later. Fast forward 2 years, when the unnecessary Overtime Update launched and H5’s support period ended with a Theater mode that barely worked right, an unenjoyable weapon sandbox (when the v1.0 sandbox was perfectly balanced and extremely fun), a UI that froze every time you hit anything, an invasive REQ system, and so on (the list is very long)…
>
> Even though I have put in magnitudes more time into H5, I believe BF2 is a better game. It was also a major turning point in the way EA handled their games. EA’s new releases (save for the yearly sports games) are pretty solid and memorable. Perfect example is NFS Heat. I should also mention I don’t think H5 is bad by any means since I find at least some enjoyment in playing, just very flawed and filled with poor decisions that made it fail to reach its potential.
>
> All this to say, I agree with your point about 343i following the same path as EA did with BF2. I and many others don’t like where things are headed because it’s starting to seem like all the predatory and boring garbage that ruined H5 will be present in Infinite, but disguised behind a very convoluted system like what we have with Gears 5. As I have said before, I think we need to wait and see how things turn out because nothing is set in stone, obviously, but voicing our distaste and concern is important to try and make sure the game is a game before it launches in a shoddy state. I’m sure there will be lots of backlash if the system is no good and then 343i will likely change course, just like EA did.
>
> This sort of stuff is why I miss the gaming culture of the 2000’s since gamers would hotly anticipate a game, criticize upcoming features, have theories about how a story may / may not play out, etc. Instead, the prevalent topic everywhere is whether or not the microtransactions will be invasive. The anticipation has been partially soured for me because it’s not based purely around the game anymore. And I think that is an injustice to the employees of 343i who put in the most effort toward the story, gameplay, art, music, etc. All the talented people who do the heavy lifting of developing the game itself have no say over certain decisions and it’s a shame their work specifically is not getting the full focus it deserves.

Thanks for the input. Do you still play BF2?

6

I think 343 and the fan base could come to a compromise if 343 was willing. Give us the standard colors as a base and use coatings to add, for lack of a better term, Bling to our armor. Think of Rainbow Six Siege. I use Siege as an example in nearly every comment I make like this because its formula is so good, the game continues to gain players even though it is approaching its 6 year anniversary. Over 60 Million players in 6 years. The game has microtransactions, Player skins, weapon skins, etc. But it is not invasive in the slightest.

What if we got special armor designs, or “coatings” the way 343 Has already intended but allow us to chose the basic colors to start out. I am willing to even go the Halo Combat Evolved route and only have a primary color. No Secondary or tertiary. And the coatings are color combos or designs that are different or unique. This would satisfy both 343’s need for monetization and our desire for a bit of personalization.

7

Slot machine mechanics should never be in console/pc games, if I wanted to play a slot machine, I’d fly to Vegas.

8

> 2533274807540513;7:
> Slot machine mechanics should never be in console/pc games, if I wanted to play a slot machine, I’d fly to Vegas.

Yet they will still be in every big non-indie multiplayer game from now on. Sucks. The most we can hope for is a slightly less intrusive loot box

9

I can easily see 343i going down the BF2 path, and changing the coatings from paid to earned a year or two into the lifespan of the game. The main problem is for 343i is that people will buy the coating they like, and then no more. They would be earning less money than they did from H5’s REQ packs if this happens, and I think more people would buy Infinite if there was a big amount of good news, like micro transactions being taken away.

10

The distinction I see with BF2 compared to 343 is that the microtransactions EA implemented affected the gameplay and supported a Paid to win nature. While Battlefront 2 is far from being the only game with microtransactions the BF2 progression system was solely designed to make players purchase loot crates. Furthermore, the players that did purchase the loot crates got a far more advantage compared to someone that didn’t pay money. Add that with the 60$ and how heavily mtx affected gameplay, it was a road to disaster.

343’s approach to monetization is more based on cosmetics rather than gameplay (excluding H5 warzone). While the recent monetization on HI’s multiplayer can be outrageous at times it isn’t as detrimental as BF2. In addition, from what I’ve heard, some progression pieces such as armor coatings are not restricted to an RNG system and can be earned through challenges. Although I disagree with how 343 is approaching monetization on the Multiplayer so far I don’t see them having a backlash similar to BF2.

The mtx influenced will most likely benefit
A: Players that are new to the Halo franchise and don’t want to buy the campaign
B:343, MS and all the other studios working on HI

But it will hurt the people who bought the campaign who has to go through the monetization on top of the 60$ and piss off other halo fans.

Halo Infinite’s progression system is solely designed on cosmetics making monetization through mtx more impactful compared to other triple AAA games.

11

> 2535462294431567;1:
> Before I get started: This is not a rant. I have ranted before about halo infinite, but this is just a prediction. I have a lot of respect of 343i and it’s employees.
>
> Does anyone remember the Battlefront 2 microtransaction controversy? I am starting to see 343i heading down the path for halo infinite that EA took with battlefront 2. If 343i can’t learn from EA’s mistakes regarding battlefront 2, I can see the game dying before it even reaches it’s planned 10-year mark. Now, granted, Halo infinite is going to be a million times bigger than battlefront 2 was. But that doesn’t make it invincible.
> I just wanted to remind everyone that Battlefront 2 is actually a good game now, (at least, I like it). It is a better now because the negative reaction to the game was so intense that EA actually backed off, and tried to fix it by removing a ton of the microtransactions (almost all of them), and started listening to the fans on what new content should be put in the game. Unfortunately, the player base is only a fraction of what it was at launch, and they have now stopped making updates for it. It lasted about 2 years. If 343i doesn’t fix it’s game before launch, (or at least soon after launch) I give it about 5 years before people simply get tired of 343i trying to squeeze every single penny out of their bank account, and stop playing. But again, this is just a prediction, and shouldn’t be taken too seriously.
>
> Does anybody disagree? Let me know if you do, I would like to hear your opinions. Also let me know if I sound too much like the weird oracle professor lady from Harry Potter who was always predicting certain doom.
>
> P.S. Battlefront 2 at launch was still a beautiful game, and the gameplay was pretty cool. Microtransactions aren’t enough to keep me from gunning down some battle droids, and it won’t be enough to keep me from gunning down some Banished.

I feel like it could be a BF2 type situation, but not one that 343/Microsoft could immediately reverse. Unlike EA, 343/Microsoft has a ton of their microtransactions tied to product promotions from giant corporations. Even if they wanted to, they would have to wait for those giant contracts to expire, and wouldn’t just be able to say “Well, Nabisco, that microtransaction system we put in place for you and many other corporations to take advantage of is being canned for our fans, we’re cutting that giant advertising deal we made with you”, probably making the game die even quicker than BF2 did, because there would be deafening silence from 343 about those issues until contracts expire, but only after they’ll finally fix them.

12

> 2535462294431567;5:
> > 2533274824050480;4:
> >
>
> Thanks for the input. Do you still play BF2?

No, not anymore. Last time I hopped on was a few months ago to unlock a skin. Do you? I’m sure it’s a blast if you still play.

13

> 2535462294431567;8:
> > 2533274807540513;7:
> > Slot machine mechanics should never be in console/pc games, if I wanted to play a slot machine, I’d fly to Vegas.
>
> Yet they will still be in every big non-indie multiplayer game from now on. Sucks. The most we can hope for is a slightly less intrusive loot box

If that’s the case then I will cease buying those games, maybe it’s a sign to move on to something else. I am glad that Disney put their legal boot up EAs rear for the stunt they pulled but I fear 343 will get no such lickings, ah well. Sign of the times I guess.

14

> 2535462294431567;8:
> > 2533274807540513;7:
> > Slot machine mechanics should never be in console/pc games, if I wanted to play a slot machine, I’d fly to Vegas.
>
> Yet they will still be in every big non-indie multiplayer game from now on. Sucks. The most we can hope for is a slightly less intrusive loot box

Not loot boxes, “surprise mechanics”!

15

Personally I think the fact it’ll be free to play is likely to overcome any bad press from cosmetics.

16

> 2533274842327341;15:
> Personally I think the fact it’ll be free to play is likely to overcome any bad press from cosmetics.

I think you are right it won’t affect how many people play the game.

Most people think cosmetics have nothing to do with gameplay, however, this isn’t the case. I remember playing REACH and other previous halo games, and if someone had really good armor that you could only get after 100s of hours of grinding (like the flaming helmet, headshot confetti, or something) I would assume they were a good player and avoid confronting them in the game. Good armor has an intimidation factor that gets destroyed when it is done by random loot boxes.

The actual gameplay more enjoyable when it is based on achievements or grinding for “point” like was done in old halo games.

17

While I think you make some good points here, I would be hesitant in comparing this game with BF2’s launch for a couple of main reasons.

  1. Trying to be as objective as possible on a halo forum, I believe that Halo is not as ubiquitous in cultural importance as the Star Wars brand although they both are sci-fi franchises with deep lore and hardcore fans. I think the main reason why SWBF2 got so much flack was because they initially locked away iconic characters like Darth Vader behind huge grinds, incentivizing micro transaction purchases. Where EA failed is that they didn’t just piss off hardcore SW fans, they pissed off a mainstream audience because they messed with characters that everybody knows and loves; which allowed the situation to blow up like it did. I would be hesitant in saying that the average gamer has that same affinity for characters like Master Chief or Cortana in the same way they do for Darth Vader or Luke Skywalker.

  2. While Infinite appears to be locking away color customization (a staple of each game), they seem to be implementing a battle pass system in a F2P model, which has been widely received in games like Apex, Fortnite, Pubg… The problem with BF2 (in addition to my first point) is that they built their entire cosmetic/game play advantage unlocks behind lootboxes. Now, if Infinite implements a lootbox system in addition to locking away colors, then I think we have a controversy on the scale of EA’s.

What I think needs to happen is that people need to stigmatize greedy F2P, battlepass systems just as much as lootboxes are now stigmatized. However, I don’t think thats going to happen anytime soon. I appreciate your question to the community here, though!

18

Interesting theory. Some good ideas.