But I just want to try and set some things straight as alot of people seem quite confused on the subject.
First off I am not trying to vouch for a 5sk br, 4sk br or anything else. I think we need to actually play the game, yes the game, not just the E3 build we have seen before we can conclude whether the BR will be balanced or not.
However let me just get some things of my chest…
“The BR has a kill time of 1.656464515… which means it is not going to be as good compared to the DMR’s kill time of 1.456564547812…”
First off, where are these people getting these numbers from? Apart from the fact that the figures seem to constantly change, how on Earth have they calculated the ‘kill time’ of a BR? More importantly I don’t think they understand themselves what they even mean by a kill time? I have yet to see a single comprehensive anaylsis of the ‘kill time’ of a BR compared to a DMR or carbine. I await one with bated breath…
Second. The ‘kill time’ of a weapon is not the only thing that determines whether a weapon is balanced against another. The BR and DMR are two different weapons, one fires in bursts one in single shots. One has bloom the other doesn’t. One has more ammo than the other etc etc… They are for all intents and purposes two different weapons. You can’t simply pull an random ‘kill time’ figure out the air and proclaim therefore the BR is not balanced against the DMR.
Third. What videos are you people watching? Nearly every single video I have seen of H4 multiplayer so far has show the BR to be doing just fine. It seems to work fine at medium range, and pretty good at long range too, however from what I have seen the DMR clinches it at long ranges. I am fairly sure this is what 343 intended.
Taking these three points into consideration I just don’t understand what people are complaining about…
Thank you for posting this toward the players who are complaining how the br should be more overpowered or have less power. even though that they continue to argue about this to and after halo 4.
The weapon needs to be balanced and a 4 shot kill is just to overpowered. the game would be over before you you know it. this is why the more shots the better the gameplay.
basically to those who complain its not 343’s fault you cant get a kill.
> The weapon needs to be balanced and a 4 shot kill is just to overpowered. the game would be over before you you know it. this is why the more shots the better the gameplay.
I don’t know whether it needs to be a 4sk weapon or not, for the simply reason that I haven’t actually played to game. Nobody outside of 343 has.
Maybe it does, maybe it doesn’t. But you simply can not pull a random ‘kill time’ figure out of you head and proclaim that this is what makes it unbalanced compared to the DMR/Carbine when there are various other factors you need to consider.
Again they must all be watching totally different videos of H4 multiplayer than I am as from everything I can see the BR seems to perform fine against the DMR and carbine. More importanly it doesn’t seem to be a one size fits all weapon. The AR and SR seem to be more than capable of keeping up against it at short ranges, the pistol seems like a fairly respectable weapon in certain scenarious too. Hopefully the BR will be balanced against other weapons, which means we will be able to use other weapons other than the BR.
> > The weapon needs to be balanced and a 4 shot kill is just to overpowered. the game would be over before you you know it. this is why the more shots the better the gameplay.
>
> I don’t know whether it needs to be a 4sk weapon or not, for the simply reason that I haven’t actually played to game. Nobody outside of 343 has.
What are you talking about tons of people have played the game already.
> > Everyday I’m believing more and more that the Halo community has no idea what “balance” actually is.
>
> I’ve known that the majority of the community doesn’t have a clue what balance is, for a long time now.
Pfft, you don’t understand balance. The BR takes 1.6543537 seconds to kill someone while the DMR takes 1.4309976. Obviously the DMR is OP and the BR needs to be buffed to the killtime of 0.9374565, therefor the game will be balanced and I can kill all you n00bs with the same weapon I’ve been using since 2004! ]:<
These killtimes are a huge difference, especially considering the obvious fact that every single human can count in milliseconds.
> What are you talking about tons of people have played the game already.
Yeah I forget. When a game company tells us straight off the bat that what they are showing doesn’t represent the final build of a game that they are lying and it actually does. I mean of course what we have seen at E3, RTX and SDCC is for sure going to what the final games is like… right…?
> The BR takes 1.6543537 seconds to kill someone while the DMR takes 1.4309976. Obviously the DMR is OP and the BR needs to be buffed…
The worrying part? I am struggling to see the difference between your obvious sarcasm and some the the genuine posts people make on this forum.
Again I simply don’t understand where people have got these ‘kill time’ figures from? Is there a video out there that comprehensivley shows the ‘kill time’ of a BR compared to a DMR? I have yet to see a single one…
> > > Everyday I’m believing more and more that the Halo community has no idea what “balance” actually is.
> >
> > I’ve known that the majority of the community doesn’t have a clue what balance is, for a long time now.
>
> Pfft, you don’t understand balance. The BR takes 1.6543537 seconds to kill someone while the DMR takes 1.4309976. Obviously the DMR is OP and the BR needs to be buffed to the killtime of 0.9374565, therefor the game will be balanced and I can kill all you n00bs with the same weapon I’ve been using since 2004! ]:<
> These killtimes are a huge difference, especially considering the obvious fact that every single human can count in milliseconds.
It’s more like the DMR killing in 1.48, and the BR in 1.8. Buffing the BR into a 1.4s killtime would balance it out. How would it not? The BR has spread at range, so you won’t be hitting every shot from the burst, while the DMR is able to hit every shot at range. The farther away you get, the worse the BR becomes, and vice versa. Your exaggeration does not work here because it is not that much of a gap between the DMR and BR.
And who says that we don’t want all the other weapons to fall in line with the two current utilities while making the BR a third utility? Balance should revolve around those weapons. Even DICE got that right with the M16A3 in Battlefield 3. It’s great all-around, but is defeated in certain niches by specific weapons.
Or do you want every single bullet in the game to be a spark that pings off the shield and does no damage? Will you not stop until teamshot is required to get a killtime below one minute.
Thank you. Someone finally understands that there is more to weapon balancing than kill times. Variables such as aim assist strength, magazine capacity, effective range, and reload speed are a few examples among others which comprise the functionality of a weapon.
It’s not all about kill times. If it were, everyone would complain the sniper is overpowered.
> Thank you. Someone finally understands that there is more to weapon balancing than kill times. Variables such as aim assist strength, magazine capacity, effective range, and reload speed are a few examples among others which comprise the functionality of a weapon.
>
> It’s not all about kill times. If it were, everyone would complain the sniper is overpowered.
The BR has:
-A slower rate of fire than both the Carbine and DMR.
-Spread to limit it at range.
-Recoil to limit it at range.
-The 36 round magazine at 5SK only allows for 2 kills per reload.
-Aim assist and magnetism are irrelevant when I can miss a DMR shot and still kill a BR user before he can get off his fifth shot.
-The Carbine has enough power to take over the BR’s effective range. It’s higher fire rate allows for quicker follow up shots. The Carbine is able to miss at least 2 shots before the BR can fire its fifth. Even at medium range where the Carbine would be more apt to missing, the BR still can’t compete.
-The spread and recoil on the BR does not allow it to contest with the DMR at longer ranges.
The Sniper Rifle and other power weapons are not in direct competition with other weapons like the spawning weapons are. The power weapons are excused from the killtime argument due to their requirement to pick them up off a map.
If the Carbine and DMR beat the BR at almost any situation, there is just no reason to use it. Especially when you can just use an all-around better weapon. The “it has higher aim assist, so it is easier to use” is a moot point to anyone who can properly aim. Once you are able to hit consistent shots with a Carbine or DMR, there would be no reason to actually use the BR. It will become a throwaway decorative weapon the higher level you are, much like the AR.
I understand and respect the fact that solid conclusions can’t be reached with what we have seen, but as it stands it currently seems incredibly probable that the DMR is going to outclass the BR in most, if not all ranges. It has greater accuracy, a faster kill time, (I believe, but I may be wrong) greater zoom in, and perhaps the potential for more kills per magazine than the BR, but i’m not 100% sure on that.
So as it stands, the DMR seems to be able to do everything the BR can, often better than the BR, along with extra stuff the BR is not capable of.
Now this could all be wrong, but discussions and debates on it are at least constructive to have.
Since the difference is like .2, why not just increase the RoF to the point where it’s pretty much the same? Anyway it’s not like it will matter to me since people will be strafing, jumping, crouching, etc… as in they won’t be stationary so in a way it won’t matter THAT much maybe a little but not huge.
My only concern is why the DMR has bloom while the carbine doesn’t.
> > Thank you. Someone finally understands that there is more to weapon balancing than kill times. Variables such as aim assist strength, magazine capacity, effective range, and reload speed are a few examples among others which comprise the functionality of a weapon.
> >
> > It’s not all about kill times. If it were, everyone would complain the sniper is overpowered.
>
> The BR has:
> -A slower rate of fire than both the Carbine and DMR.
> -Spread to limit it at range.
> -Recoil to limit it at range.
> -The 36 round magazine at 5SK only allows for 2 kills per reload.
> -Aim assist and magnetism are irrelevant when I can miss a DMR shot and still kill a BR user before he can get off his fifth shot.
> -The Carbine has enough power to take over the BR’s effective range. It’s higher fire rate allows for quicker follow up shots. The Carbine is able to miss at least 2 shots before the BR can fire its fifth. Even at medium range where the Carbine would be more apt to missing, the BR still can’t compete.
> -The spread and recoil on the BR does not allow it to contest with the DMR at longer ranges.
>
> The Sniper Rifle and other power weapons are not in direct competition with other weapons like the spawning weapons are. The power weapons are excused from the killtime argument due to their requirement to pick them up off a map.
>
> If the Carbine and DMR beat the BR at almost any situation, there is just no reason to use it. Especially when you can just use an all-around better weapon. The “it has higher aim assist, so it is easier to use” is a moot point to anyone who can properly aim. Once you are able to hit consistent shots with a Carbine or DMR, there would be no reason to actually use the BR. It will become a throwaway decorative weapon the higher level you are, much like the AR.
> It’s more like the DMR killing in 1.48, and the BR in 1.8. Buffing the BR into a 1.4s killtime would balance it out. How would it not?
Where are you getting these figures from? Point me in the direction of comprehensive analysis of the so called kill time of the BR and DMR. Whilst you are at it maybe you can explain what you even mean by a ‘kill time’ because I honestly think you lot that talk about this nonsense don’t actually understand what you are talking about.
> If the Carbine and DMR beat the BR at almost any situation, there is just no reason to use it.
Yes but they clearly don’t. Have you actually watched any H4 videos? Can you point me towards a video where a BR user is getting beaten in almost every situation by a DMR/Carbine user? I think you will find that the opposite seems to be the case.
Your analysis of the BR compared the DMR/Carbine misses one crucial thing. Any kind of negatives towards the DMR/Carbine. They aren’t perfect either, they both have their own ‘faults’ that balances them out to the BR.
I don’t know the #'s, but I do know that I’ve played enough Halo to know that after 20 min of playing Halo 4 w/BR/DMR/AR/Pistol that these weapons are all useful and well balanced in their proposed usage.
There is gonna have to be ALOT of ‘testing’ AFTER release and I’m confident that 343i will do it’s best to keep all the weapons balanced and useful.
> > If the Carbine and DMR beat the BR at almost any situation, there is just no reason to use it.
>
> Yes but they clearly don’t. Have you actually watched any H4 videos? Can you point me towards a video where a BR user is getting beaten in almost every situation by a DMR/Carbine user? I think you will find that the opposite seems to be the case.
>
> Your analysis of the BR compared the DMR/Carbine misses one crucial thing. Any kind of negatives towards the DMR/Carbine. They aren’t perfect either, they both have their own ‘faults’ that balances them out to the BR.
The fact that a few MLG players, namely Bestman, stated how the DMR completely owned the BR.
