With how the novels describe Forerunner’s technology all that, we often ponder about them. Why was their containment so weak enough to be breached by Covenant and humans?
Why were Sentinels built so weak? Shouldn’t they be at least 1/10 powerful as that outdated combatskin?
And with recent revelation of Forerunner’s new AI, it gives more doubt on their capacity. I know that Halo is not the only game that suffers from canon vs gameplay issue. Blizzard games, Warhammer, etc to name few.
I also know that casual gamers(which constitute majority) give jackshit about the lore. So what is your ratio of canon : gameplay mechanic?
I may be going too far, but about 7:3.(I believe going more than that would make game unplayable.)
Do you think 343I is ignoring their own set up or they are aware of this issue?
As to why the forerunners were so weak, the link to halo wiki describing the forerunners says:
“The Forerunners themselves were a race without conflict and at a point in their history where they had reached disarmament. This disarmament was the main factor that weakened the Forerunners against the Flood attack.”
Why they couldn’t quickly come up with weapons to combat the flood with all that technology? Who knows.
As to sticking to the lore, when Halo: Reach came out and it contradicted some of the lore from the book Fall of Reach, they just said they were going to re write the book to be in line with the game. So they are probably aware of and they’ve said before that lore from game trumps books. So anything in halo 4 the community finds to be inconsistent, they’ll probably come up with a reason to change the story. I wish they wouldn’t do that but that’s what’s been done before with the franchise.
> As to why the forerunners were so weak, the link to halo wiki describing the forerunners says:
>
> “The Forerunners themselves were a race without conflict and at a point in their history where they had reached disarmament. This disarmament was the main factor that weakened the Forerunners against the Flood attack.”
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forerunner_(Halo)
>
> Why they couldn’t quickly come up with weapons to combat the flood with all that technology? Who knows.
>
> As to sticking to the lore, when Halo: Reach came out and it contradicted some of the lore from the book Fall of Reach, they just said they were going to re write the book to be in line with the game. So they are probably aware of and they’ve said before that lore from game trumps books. So anything in halo 4 the community finds to be inconsistent, they’ll probably come up with a reason to change the story. I wish they wouldn’t do that but that’s what’s been done before with the franchise.
The Forerunner weren’t weak by any means. Why did they have such a hard time combating the Flood? Because as the Flood infected more worlds, they became more intelligent and adapted to what the Forerunners were doing.
Also, Halo Reach did not re-write the lore in Fall of Reach, for the most part, and a lot of that book’s facts have been overwritten by other Halo media long before Reach came along. Most of the events of Halo Reach fit in with The Fall of Reach pretty well. 343 never said they were going to re-write the books, either.
OP: By 2552, the Covenant had had centuries of experience hacking into Forerunner technology. Almost all of the Covenant’s technology is reverse engineered from Forerunner tech. As for Humans, all Forerunner tech was tuned to allow Humans to use it.
The sentinals are by no means weak, but the Flood is incredibly adaptive. As the Flood infects more hosts, it grows stronger, learns its enemies’ strategies, and constantly adapts. This is why the Halo Array had to eventually be activated.
Finally, every game has issue between how things work in game and how they work in fiction. This is because games have to balance weapons for the sake of gameplay. Mass Effect suffers from this, along with Halo, Gears, and every other sci-fi video game.
> > As to why the forerunners were so weak, the link to halo wiki describing the forerunners says:
> >
> > “The Forerunners themselves were a race without conflict and at a point in their history where they had reached disarmament. This disarmament was the main factor that weakened the Forerunners against the Flood attack.”
> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forerunner_(Halo)
> >
> > Why they couldn’t quickly come up with weapons to combat the flood with all that technology? Who knows.
> >
> > As to sticking to the lore, when Halo: Reach came out and it contradicted some of the lore from the book Fall of Reach, they just said they were going to re write the book to be in line with the game. So they are probably aware of and they’ve said before that lore from game trumps books. So anything in halo 4 the community finds to be inconsistent, they’ll probably come up with a reason to change the story. I wish they wouldn’t do that but that’s what’s been done before with the franchise.
>
> The Forerunner weren’t weak by any means. Why did they have such a hard time combating the Flood? Because as the Flood infected more worlds, they became more intelligent and adapted to what the Forerunners were doing.
>
> Also, Halo Reach did not re-write the lore in Fall of Reach, for the most part, and a lot of that book’s facts have been overwritten by other Halo media long before Reach came along. Most of the events of Halo Reach fit in with The Fall of Reach pretty well. 343 never said they were going to re-write the books, either.
>
> OP: By 2552, the Covenant had had centuries of experience hacking into Forerunner technology. Almost all of the Covenant’s technology is reverse engineered from Forerunner tech. As for Humans, all Forerunner tech was tuned to allow Humans to use it.
>
> The sentinals are by no means weak, but the Flood is incredibly adaptive. As the Flood infects more hosts, it grows stronger, learns its enemies’ strategies, and constantly adapts. This is why the Halo Array had to eventually be activated.
>
> Finally, every game has issue between how things work in game and how they work in fiction. This is because games have to balance weapons for the sake of gameplay. Mass Effect suffers from this, along with Halo, Gears, and every other sci-fi video game.
Well compared to the flood, the forerunners were weak. Their weapons weren’t strong enough to stop them and they lacked the military intelligence to cope with the evolving flood. That would make them weaker in my eyes. Compared to humans and covenant, no they are not weaker.
But I don’t think that’s the question he’s actually posing. It seems like he’s asking why in the books they are this advanced race, but the the game their sentinels have a hard time tracking a simple flood infection unit. Or if humans and covenant reversed engineered their technology, why do weapons like a pistol that’s been around far longer than the humans knew about forerunners, seem to take a sentinel down faster than it can take the chief down with their “advanced” laser beams.
As for the re writing of the books. They did come out with a revised edition of Halo: The Fall of Reach but I was mistaken, they didn’t re write any of the lore just fixed some mistakes. However there are inconsistencies like captain keyes coming down with the Pillar of Autumn as reach is about to fall and retrieving Cortana. In the book he was in space the whole time. In First Strike, Halsey first finds out about the Spartan III program and is shocked to just now be realizing it, whereas in the game she encounters them before the events of First Strike. Then in Glasslands she mentions seeing the Spartan III’s on reach again. When bungie was asked about some of these they said something to the effect of they knew it wasn’t 100% consistent but they said that anything in the games trumps what’s in the book. Effectively re-writing the already established lore. Now bungie isn’t 343, but some of the people that worked on halo at bungie went over to 343. And unless they come out with new stuff explaining it, it’s just something we are going to have to accept.
As for what 343 is going to do? There isn’t much out there that is established canon so they don’t need to worry to much about contradicting anything. They are aware that it could happen but they also know that the game is going to turn a lot more profit if it’s fun than if it stays in line with the lore of the halo universe. So they’re going to do what’s fun over what makes sense.
TLDR: Yeah they are aware of the discrepancies between the books and the games. Just something we have to live with.
> > > As to why the forerunners were so weak, the link to halo wiki describing the forerunners says:
> > >
> > > “The Forerunners themselves were a race without conflict and at a point in their history where they had reached disarmament. This disarmament was the main factor that weakened the Forerunners against the Flood attack.”
> > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forerunner_(Halo)
> > >
> > > Why they couldn’t quickly come up with weapons to combat the flood with all that technology? Who knows.
> > >
> > > As to sticking to the lore, when Halo: Reach came out and it contradicted some of the lore from the book Fall of Reach, they just said they were going to re write the book to be in line with the game. So they are probably aware of and they’ve said before that lore from game trumps books. So anything in halo 4 the community finds to be inconsistent, they’ll probably come up with a reason to change the story. I wish they wouldn’t do that but that’s what’s been done before with the franchise.
> >
> > The Forerunner weren’t weak by any means. Why did they have such a hard time combating the Flood? Because as the Flood infected more worlds, they became more intelligent and adapted to what the Forerunners were doing.
> >
> > Also, Halo Reach did not re-write the lore in Fall of Reach, for the most part, and a lot of that book’s facts have been overwritten by other Halo media long before Reach came along. Most of the events of Halo Reach fit in with The Fall of Reach pretty well. 343 never said they were going to re-write the books, either.
> >
> > OP: By 2552, the Covenant had had centuries of experience hacking into Forerunner technology. Almost all of the Covenant’s technology is reverse engineered from Forerunner tech. As for Humans, all Forerunner tech was tuned to allow Humans to use it.
> >
> > The sentinals are by no means weak, but the Flood is incredibly adaptive. As the Flood infects more hosts, it grows stronger, learns its enemies’ strategies, and constantly adapts. This is why the Halo Array had to eventually be activated.
> >
> > Finally, every game has issue between how things work in game and how they work in fiction. This is because games have to balance weapons for the sake of gameplay. Mass Effect suffers from this, along with Halo, Gears, and every other sci-fi video game.
>
>
>
> Well compared to the flood, the forerunners were weak. Their weapons weren’t strong enough to stop them and they lacked the military intelligence to cope with the evolving flood. That would make them weaker in my eyes. Compared to humans and covenant, no they are not weaker.
>
> But I don’t think that’s the question he’s actually posing. It seems like he’s asking why in the books they are this advanced race, but the the game their sentinels have a hard time tracking a simple flood infection unit. Or if humans and covenant reversed engineered their technology, why do weapons like a pistol that’s been around far longer than the humans knew about forerunners, seem to take a sentinel down faster than it can take the chief down with their “advanced” laser beams.
>
> As for the re writing of the books. They did come out with a revised edition of Halo: The Fall of Reach but I was mistaken, they didn’t re write any of the lore just fixed some mistakes. However there are inconsistencies like captain keyes coming down with the Pillar of Autumn as reach is about to fall and retrieving Cortana. In the book he was in space the whole time. In First Strike, Halsey first finds out about the Spartan III program and is shocked to just now be realizing it, whereas in the game she encounters them before the events of First Strike. Then in Glasslands she mentions seeing the Spartan III’s on reach again. When bungie was asked about some of these they said something to the effect of they knew it wasn’t 100% consistent but they said that anything in the games trumps what’s in the book. Effectively re-writing the already established lore. Now bungie isn’t 343, but some of the people that worked on halo at bungie went over to 343. And unless they come out with new stuff explaining it, it’s just something we are going to have to accept.
>
> As for what 343 is going to do? There isn’t much out there that is established canon so they don’t need to worry to much about contradicting anything. They are aware that it could happen but they also know that the game is going to turn a lot more profit if it’s fun than if it stays in line with the lore of the halo universe. So they’re going to do what’s fun over what makes sense.
>
> TLDR: Yeah they are aware of the discrepancies between the books and the games. Just something we have to live with.
The Forerunners were late to the party. As Toa said, they had a period of disarmamanent after the Human-Forerunner War. Which means the military side of the Forerunners was getting very little attention.
Then the Flood came. The Forerunners didn’t react the right way to them. They treated the Flood as a disease, trying to contain it instead of destroy it. That was their fault. It was because of this lull in combat efficiency against the Flood, that they were able to grow and spread. By the time the Forerunners treated it as an actual enemy, it was far too late. They had to use AIs to combat the Flood, to minimize Warrior losses. Eventually the Flood had spread too much, and under the control of Me dicant Bias, assaulted the Forerunner’s last line of defense. The Forerunners activated the array.
The Forerunners were not weak, and neither was their AI. The thing is, that their AI was designed to fight the Flood. Not fully sentient and intelligent species with powerful militaries, like the UNSC (Master Chief Specifically). Same with Sentinels. They were designed to handle and contain smaller outbreaks, which they can do pretty well.
So, yes… technically speaking they were somewhat weaker when fighting the Flood. Bu -Yoink!- wasn’t because of their military tech being outdated or anything. It was the Flood’s intelligence and timing. The Forerunners waited too long to fight the Flood. By then, the Flood had spread significantly. They created Mendicant Bias, and it was corrupted by the Primordial. The Flood were also adapting. The Forerunners had to keep up and create new combat plans.
The Forerunners were builders, not fighters. The only time we can see that they used their military, it was outfitted to combat an adaptive parasite. That would be why they may seem so “weak” to us. But keep in mind, if we were to go up against a Forerunner Promethean, or a Forerunner Fleet… we would be crushed.
> > As to why the forerunners were so weak, the link to halo wiki describing the forerunners says:
> >
> > “The Forerunners themselves were a race without conflict and at a point in their history where they had reached disarmament. This disarmament was the main factor that weakened the Forerunners against the Flood attack.”
> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forerunner_(Halo)
> >
> > Why they couldn’t quickly come up with weapons to combat the flood with all that technology? Who knows.
> >
> > As to sticking to the lore, when Halo: Reach came out and it contradicted some of the lore from the book Fall of Reach, they just said they were going to re write the book to be in line with the game. So they are probably aware of and they’ve said before that lore from game trumps books. So anything in halo 4 the community finds to be inconsistent, they’ll probably come up with a reason to change the story. I wish they wouldn’t do that but that’s what’s been done before with the franchise.
>
> The Forerunner weren’t weak by any means. Why did they have such a hard time combating the Flood? Because as the Flood infected more worlds, they became more intelligent and adapted to what the Forerunners were doing.
>
> Also, Halo Reach did not re-write the lore in Fall of Reach, for the most part, and a lot of that book’s facts have been overwritten by other Halo media long before Reach came along. Most of the events of Halo Reach fit in with The Fall of Reach pretty well. 343 never said they were going to re-write the books, either.
>
> OP: By 2552, the Covenant had had centuries of experience hacking into Forerunner technology. Almost all of the Covenant’s technology is reverse engineered from Forerunner tech. As for Humans, all Forerunner tech was tuned to allow Humans to use it.
>
> The sentinals are by no means weak, but the Flood is incredibly adaptive. As the Flood infects more hosts, it grows stronger, learns its enemies’ strategies, and constantly adapts. This is why the Halo Array had to eventually be activated.
>
> Finally, every game has issue between how things work in game and how they work in fiction. This is because games have to balance weapons for the sake of gameplay. Mass Effect suffers from this, along with Halo, Gears, and every other sci-fi video game.
Mass Effect? You mean Shepard should be blown to pieces when he gets hit by a rocket? or Reaper beam?
And Gears? Not sure.
Which game do you think comes to closest to their other media counterpart?