Assault Rifle's range

At first I though that not very many were too bothered about this, but I’ve learned that there are quite a few people who agree with this, so I though I’d make a thread for it and see where it goes.
I appreciate those who read it all to get a better picture of what I’m saying, but it’s your choice.

The AR in infinite has a very long effective range, with the ADS which can not be de-scoped it really creates an issue in my opinion. We can get peppered by this from the other side of the map now, and shooting back does not affect the accuracy of the opponent.
I can’t help but feel that the AR, BR and Commando are kinda wrestling in a bit of a sandbox role identity-crisis.

I wanna be clear, I love that the AR is now a better “killing machine”, this was a good move, I just don’t think it should be this from so far away to encourage usage of other non-power-weapons to compliment the flaws of the weapons you spawn with. I feel now I pick up certain weapons mostly because I want variation, not so much to be able to do something I can’t with the AR.
The way I interpret the role of the AR compared to the BR is, AR should have the advantage at close-mid range, BR should have the advantage at mid-long, where as now I feel like AR is very dominant and easy to use. The BR has perhaps been a bit too dominant in past games, I’m glad they tried to change that, but now I just think it’s the opposite.

Solution:
Well I really don’t know what would be best, but my gut tells me that removing ADS completely from the game would solve this problem, I would just be sooo pleased to not have ADS. Since that’s very unlikely maybe at least make us de-scope when we are shot or just reduce effective range.

EDIT: Since a lot of people point out that the ADS doesn’t increase range or decrease bloom, I want just wanna ad that I’m aware of this. But, the fact that ADS slows down your reticle just like all types of scopes, makes it easier to be precise, this makes a very noticeable difference imo. Could also shortly mention that it makes it slightly easier to see too.
Another funny afterthought is: They added a scope to every single weapon in the game, but only the weapons that are supposed to have scopes can be de-scoped, and the closer ranged weapons have untouchable scopes. Isn’t that kinda backwards?

Feel free to disagree that there is a balancing issue here. Also feel free to enjoy that the AR is dominant, I’m not trying to criticise your taste.

But most of all I’d like to hear different suggestion how you would improve the AR if you could. Any ideas? Or is it perfect?

I agree that the AR functioned a little two well
I’d like to see it get one of the following in an effort to push it back into the ambush assault weapon its meant to be

-A reduction to its RRR and lose the headshot modifier
-A reduction to its RRR and a recduction to its DMG output

Not both, theres no need to nerf it into the ground, its just gott abe pushed back into its niche

> 2533274832130936;2:
> I agree that the AR functioned a little two well
> I’d like to see it get one of the following in an effort to push it back into the ambush assault weapon its meant to be
>
> -A reduction to its RRR and lose the headshot modifier
> -A reduction to its RRR and a recduction to its DMG output
>
> Not both, theres no need to nerf it into the ground, its just gott abe pushed back into its niche

Yeah I could get behind any of those ideas, any slight change for the better would make me happy. And I also agree that they should be careful not to overdo it.

Reduce the range and remove the headshot multiplier. It literally is that simple.

I like the AR and think it functions pretty well as the default weapon

> 2533274792737987;4:
> Reduce the range and remove the headshot multiplier. It literally is that simple.

Yeah I’m all for that

> 2533274947805189;1:
> At first I though that not very many were too bothered about this, but I’ve learned that there are quite a few people who agree with this, so I though I’d make a thread for it and see where it goes.
> I appreciate those who read it all to get a better picture of what I’m saying, but it’s your choice.
>
> The AR in infinite has a very long effective range, with the ADS which can not be de-scoped it really creates an issue in my opinion. We can get peppered by this from the other side of the map now, and shooting back does not affect the accuracy of the opponent.
> I can’t help but feel that the AR, BR and Commando are kinda wrestling in a bit of a sandbox role identity-crisis.
>
> I wanna be clear, I love that the AR is now a better “killing machine”, this was a good move, I just don’t think it should be this from so far away to encourage usage of other non-power-weapons to compliment the flaws of the weapons you spawn with. I feel now I pick up certain weapons mostly because I want variation, not so much to be able to do something I can’t with the AR.
> The way I interpret the role of the AR compared to the BR is, AR should have the advantage at close-mid range, BR should have the advantage at mid-long, where as now I feel like AR is very dominant and easy to use. The BR has perhaps been a bit too dominant in past games, I’m glad they tried to change that, but now I just think it’s the opposite.
>
> Solution:
> Well I really don’t know what would be best, but my gut tells me that removing ADS completely from the game would solve this problem, I would just be sooo pleased to not have ADS. Since that’s very unlikely maybe at least make us de-scope when we are shot or just reduce effective range.
>
> Feel free to disagree that there is a balancing issue here. Also feel free to enjoy that the AR is dominant, I’m not trying to criticise your taste.
>
> But most of all I’d like to hear different suggestion how you would improve the AR if you could. Any ideas? Or is it perfect?

I’m glad the AR is the sort of powerhouse weapon it is right now. I’m a little tired of always having to have played precision weapon ranged based combat for basically at least the last ten years. I get more enjoyment from getting in people’s face, peppering them, then trying to land the melee kill without getting killed myself- that’s harder to do. But that’s where we start having problems. The AR currently in Infinite can be used at a fairly good range. I could be mistaken, but when playing the flight I could have sworn that (at least with the sidekick) when ADS the red reticle range was slightly extended. I think that ADS should be scrapped from the game- most certainly with the AR. I’m fine with it being a deadlier weapon but the range where it is useful needs to be fairly close. If you want to try and target someone further out you need to peck at them, not just be able to press a button to zoom right in and better adjust your aim.

> 2533274916415091;7:
> > 2533274947805189;1:
> > At first I though that not very many were too bothered about this, but I’ve learned that there are quite a few people who agree with this, so I though I’d make a thread for it and see where it goes.
> > I appreciate those who read it all to get a better picture of what I’m saying, but it’s your choice.
> >
> > The AR in infinite has a very long effective range, with the ADS which can not be de-scoped it really creates an issue in my opinion. We can get peppered by this from the other side of the map now, and shooting back does not affect the accuracy of the opponent.
> > I can’t help but feel that the AR, BR and Commando are kinda wrestling in a bit of a sandbox role identity-crisis.
> >
> > I wanna be clear, I love that the AR is now a better “killing machine”, this was a good move, I just don’t think it should be this from so far away to encourage usage of other non-power-weapons to compliment the flaws of the weapons you spawn with. I feel now I pick up certain weapons mostly because I want variation, not so much to be able to do something I can’t with the AR.
> > The way I interpret the role of the AR compared to the BR is, AR should have the advantage at close-mid range, BR should have the advantage at mid-long, where as now I feel like AR is very dominant and easy to use. The BR has perhaps been a bit too dominant in past games, I’m glad they tried to change that, but now I just think it’s the opposite.
> >
> > Solution:
> > Well I really don’t know what would be best, but my gut tells me that removing ADS completely from the game would solve this problem, I would just be sooo pleased to not have ADS. Since that’s very unlikely maybe at least make us de-scope when we are shot or just reduce effective range.
> >
> > Feel free to disagree that there is a balancing issue here. Also feel free to enjoy that the AR is dominant, I’m not trying to criticise your taste.
> >
> > But most of all I’d like to hear different suggestion how you would improve the AR if you could. Any ideas? Or is it perfect?
>
> I’m glad the AR is the sort of powerhouse weapon it is right now. I’m a little tired of always having to have played precision weapon ranged based combat for basically at least the last ten years. I get more enjoyment from getting in people’s face, peppering them, then trying to land the melee kill without getting killed myself- that’s harder to do. But that’s where we start having problems. The AR currently in Infinite can be used at a fairly good range. I could be mistaken, but when playing the flight I could have sworn that (at least with the sidekick) when ADS the red reticle range was slightly extended. I think that ADS should be scrapped from the game- most certainly with the AR. I’m fine with it being a deadlier weapon but the range where it is useful needs to be fairly close. If you want to try and target someone further out you need to peck at them, not just be able to press a button to zoom right in and better adjust your aim.

Yeah I agree with all of this, even though I’m more of a precision person myself, I don’t think it’s ideal that the BR was more or less equal to the AR up-close in other games, it kinda made the AR pointless. They are probably more balanced in Infinite than they have been in many other games but it’s still kinda turned the other way around. Yeah I could also have sworn that the ADS had a big impact.

> 2533274792737987;4:
> Reduce the range and remove the headshot multiplier. It literally is that simple.

The range i agree with, but the head shot multiplayer removes the randomness imo. Isn’t it better if you lose to someone or beat someone for aiming at their head instead of really making the weapon spray and pray completely…and have that random variable exist?

> 2533274842046585;9:
> > 2533274792737987;4:
> > Reduce the range and remove the headshot multiplier. It literally is that simple.
>
> The range i agree with, but the head shot multiplayer removes the randomness imo. Isn’t it better if you lose to someone or beat someone for aiming at their head instead of really making the weapon spray and pray completely…and have that random variable exist?

Then create no bullet magnetism and lower the headshot multiplier.

> 2533274792737987;10:
> > 2533274842046585;9:
> > > 2533274792737987;4:
> > > Reduce the range and remove the headshot multiplier. It literally is that simple.
> >
> > The range i agree with, but the head shot multiplayer removes the randomness imo. Isn’t it better if you lose to someone or beat someone for aiming at their head instead of really making the weapon spray and pray completely…and have that random variable exist?
>
> Then create no bullet magnetism and lower the headshot multiplier.

Thats good. As long as they still gotta aim for the head after shields are down to have an advantage to win against someone who isn’t aiming well. That way the players skill still is why they would win.

> 2533274842046585;11:
> > 2533274792737987;10:
> > > 2533274842046585;9:
> > > > 2533274792737987;4:
> > > > Reduce the range and remove the headshot multiplier. It literally is that simple.
> > >
> > > The range i agree with, but the head shot multiplayer removes the randomness imo. Isn’t it better if you lose to someone or beat someone for aiming at their head instead of really making the weapon spray and pray completely…and have that random variable exist?
> >
> > Then create no bullet magnetism and lower the headshot multiplier.
>
> Thats good. As long as they still gotta aim for the head after shields are down to have an advantage to win against someone who isn’t aiming well. That way the players skill still is why they would win.

I’m not used to headshot multipliers for automatic weapons in Halo, I haven’t had a very possitive feeling about it, but I guess you do have a point. I’d be down to keep it if they just attend to the issue in another way.

AR’s just flat out too good. But it needs to be good enough that the Sidekick doesn’t just overtake it entirely.

> 2533274947805189;12:
> > 2533274842046585;11:
> > > 2533274792737987;10:
> > > > 2533274842046585;9:
> > > > > 2533274792737987;4:
> > > > > Reduce the range and remove the headshot multiplier. It literally is that simple.
> > > >
> > > > The range i agree with, but the head shot multiplayer removes the randomness imo. Isn’t it better if you lose to someone or beat someone for aiming at their head instead of really making the weapon spray and pray completely…and have that random variable exist?
> > >
> > > Then create no bullet magnetism and lower the headshot multiplier.
> >
> > Thats good. As long as they still gotta aim for the head after shields are down to have an advantage to win against someone who isn’t aiming well. That way the players skill still is why they would win.
>
> I’m not used to headshot multipliers in Halo, I haven’t had very possitive feeling about it, but I guess you do have a point. I’d be down to keep it if they just attend to the issue in another way.

We would want to accomplish a few things imo.

  • slayer starts have to be effective enough to not feel severely under powered when someone is holding a non power weapon map pick up weapon.

  • still be accurate so that the more skilled player wins, and not because of a random factor…
    And not AUTOMATICALLY lose because his opponent can still destroy him with potato aim just because his enemies holding a BR and he doesn’t have one.

  • spawn weapons should be strong at specific ranges filling specific roles. Not strong at all ranges. (Actually each gun should be this way basically and I believe is usually the goal of achieving best balance.)

  • not have 1 spawn weapon become too dominant that the other one you migh as well press right on the D pad off your spawn cause you aren’t ever going to bother using it. They should both feel that you’d want to use 1 or the other under certain circumstances.

At the end of the day…everything just has to feel good to use and you want to feel that you either win or lose because you out skilled your opponent. Not because your weapon had such a massive advantage…like under certain circumstances…yes I believe some weapons should have those clear advantages. It gives the entire reason to pick them up over what you already have…and why they are designed the way they are…what role they fill and play style they compliment…but we can’t have our starting load out ever go back to something like the old slayer starts in the legacy games. Those were painfully bad…it became more and more clear why BR starts was created.

> 2533274842046585;14:
> > 2533274947805189;12:
> > > 2533274842046585;11:
> > > > 2533274792737987;10:
> > > > > 2533274842046585;9:
> > > > > > 2533274792737987;4:
> > > > > > Reduce the range and remove the headshot multiplier. It literally is that simple.
> > > > >
> > > > > The range i agree with, but the head shot multiplayer removes the randomness imo. Isn’t it better if you lose to someone or beat someone for aiming at their head instead of really making the weapon spray and pray completely…and have that random variable exist?
> > > >
> > > > Then create no bullet magnetism and lower the headshot multiplier.
> > >
> > > Thats good. As long as they still gotta aim for the head after shields are down to have an advantage to win against someone who isn’t aiming well. That way the players skill still is why they would win.
> >
> > I’m not used to headshot multipliers in Halo, I haven’t had very possitive feeling about it, but I guess you do have a point. I’d be down to keep it if they just attend to the issue in another way.
>
> We would want to accomplish a few things imo.
>
> - slayer starts have to be effective enough to not feel severely under powered when someone is holding a non power weapon map pick up weapon.
>
> - still be accurate so that the more skilled player wins, and not because of a random factor…
> And not AUTOMATICALLY lose because his opponent can still destroy him with potato aim just because his enemies holding a BR and he doesn’t have one.
>
> - spawn weapons should be strong at specific ranges filling specific roles. Not strong at all ranges. (Actually each gun should be this way basically and I believe is usually the goal of achieving best balance.)
>
> - not have 1 spawn weapon become too dominant that the other one you migh as well press right on the D pad off your spawn cause you aren’t ever going to bother using it. They should both feel that you’d want to use 1 or the other under certain circumstances.
>
> At the end of the day…everything just has to feel good to use and you want to feel that you either win or lose because you out skilled your opponent. Not because your weapon had such a massive advantage…like under certain circumstances…yes I believe some weapons should have those clear advantages. It gives the entire reason to pick them up over what you already have…and why they are designed the way they are…what role they fill and play style they compliment…but we can’t have our starting load out ever go back to something like the old slayer starts in the legacy games. Those were painfully bad…it became more and more clear why BR starts was created.

I more or less agree with all of this. It’s important that there should be a clear reason to pick up new weapons on the map, but at the same time that doesn’t mean that those should be objectively better weapon. The roles are key, so you can always beat people with your starting weapons by using those weapons the way they are best used against whatever weapon the opponent has.
And yeah since you mentioned 1 starting weapon to be too dominant, that is exactly how I feel with the AR and Sidekick. I’d really like them to complement each other, right now it’s just ar ar ar and I switch the sidekick with something else instantly. If the ARs range was slightly reduced I wouldn’t mind the Sidekick to get a x2 scope. How would you feel about that?

Honestly I like the AR as it is, but I can understand it feeling a bit OP.

If anything, de-scope should apply to the AR but it currently doesn’t. The fact that I can pepper enemies at medium range continuously because I stay scoped in even if hit by enemy fire is part of why its decent at medium range. A good enemy player (or one who has a longer range weapon) should be able to retaliate and keep the AR to short range by de-scoping the AR user. The BR and Sidekick should be able to consistently de-scope an AR user at medium range.

This small change may seem relatively minor and maybe there needs to be more changes, but I’d hate the AR to be relegated to a throwaway weapon like previous entries. This kind of balancing needs to be delicate since the weapon you start with is arguably the most important weapon to balance in the sandbox.

> 2535436188730137;16:
> Honestly I like the AR as it is, but I can understand it feeling a bit OP.
>
> If anything, de-scope should apply to the AR but it currently doesn’t. The fact that I can pepper enemies at medium range continuously because I stay scoped in even if hit by enemy fire is part of why its decent at medium range. A good enemy player (or one who has a longer range weapon) should be able to retaliate and keep the AR to short range by de-scoping the AR user. The BR and Sidekick should be able to consistently de-scope an AR user at medium range.
>
> This small change may seem relatively minor and maybe there needs to be more changes, but I’d hate the AR to be relegated to a throwaway weapon like previous entries. This kind of balancing needs to be delicate since the weapon you start with is arguably the most important weapon to balance in the sandbox.

It may be a minor change but I definitely think it would make a noticeable difference. It’s a step in the direction I’d like to go so I’d take it.

Please don’t nerf AR every time! Just keep the AR settings in Tech Preview, we noobs need efficient automatic weapon to fight. Don’t make Halo primary for headshot only again, that sxcks.

> 2533274791734613;18:
> Please don’t nerf AR every time! Just keep the AR settings in Tech Preview, we noobs need efficient automatic weapon to fight. Don’t make Halo primary for headshot only again, that sxcks.

I understand the concern, and it’s not about making it weak like in many of the other games, it’s about separating the weapons roles in the sandbox.
I recommend reading the 3rd column in in the OP.

Just make it de scope when hit. I enjoy the AR now, I’m glad I can use it now without compromise