Asian dad says, "B-R? Why you no get A-R?"

Games Halo 5: Guardians
1

Just wanted to make some points about the assault rifle that I have yet to see discussed here.

First off, I enjoy most of the weapons in the Halo arsenal. The weapons of Halo have always aspired to fill their own special situational niche on the battlefield. I think for the most part Halo has done a good job with this, despite a few exceptions. Halo 4 having the majority of these exceptions due to it’s loadout fiasco.
This is one of the core pillars of what makes Halo what it is. This makes me think fans concerns should be the balancing of the weapons in their particular niche, not having one weapon better than the other. Obviously power weapons are a different story, but we’re talking about AR/BR specifically.

To me, AR starts make more sense for a number of reasons.

  1. The assault rifle fills the most base role of Halo’s weapons. It’s a center mass, mid range, mid accuracy, medium damage, fire rate, etc…
  2. The assault rifles lack of long range accuracy, and basic utility encourages players flow through the map in an attempt to gain advantagice firing positions and skirmish for their weapon of choice.
  3. The magnum is less dominant lower range alternative to a br/dmr when you’re in the need for a headshot.
  4. The argument that the br is a more skill based weapon is shallow. The br simply benefits from higher accuracy, and not much higher at that for how easy headshots are in this game. Accuracy, however important a skill in any fps, is only one of many skills required to be a well rounded and versatile Halo player. A player with an AR who can successfully gain ground on a player with a BR and still outdamage and kill him at medium range is arguably more skilled. He had to use map knowledge and intelligent movement to get rid of his enemies advantage and still kill him on equal ground.
  5. BR starts discourage diversity in weapon usage during a match, and generally turn the game into ranged firefights. In my opinion Halo shines when people are fighting it out with different weapons in different places, with both long range snipes and short range brawls.

Just my two cents, I like Halo when things get crazy. BRs can make things mundane.

2

Yes, the player with an AR who beats a BR player is more skilled. But, it isn’t a fair test of skill. To test skill fairly, all variables need to be removed.

BR starts is the more competitive option, as everyone starts off on an equal playing field. Thus, purely their skill and team work is tested.
AR starts is more fun in casual play, as it forces people to use other more varied weapons, making more interesting matches.

Playlists should be split into Social and Ranked, with AR starts for the former and BR starts for the latter. Its as simple as that.

3

That’s not a new argument.

The AR is certainly more powerful in Halo 5 than in previous Halos. I can see why so many players would favor the AR as a starting weapon now that it’s utility is improved by having more range. I still prefer the BR though, precision weapons are a defining aspect of Halo for me, and I don’t want to part with them.

4

> 2533274820845938;2:
> Yes, the player with an AR who beats a BR player is more skilled. But, it isn’t a fair test of skill. To test skill fairly, all variables need to be removed.
>
> BR starts is the more competitive option, as everyone starts off on an equal playing field. Thus, purely their skill and team work is tested.
> AR starts is more fun in casual play, as it forces people to use other more varied weapons, making more interesting matches.
>
> Playlists should be split into Social and Ranked, with AR starts for the former and BR starts for the latter. Its as simple as that.

well put. I am hoping this exact thing happens for final launch.

5

> 2533274820845938;2:
> Yes, the player with an AR who beats a BR player is more skilled. But, it isn’t a fair test of skill. To test skill fairly, all variables need to be removed.
>
> BR starts is the more competitive option, as everyone starts off on an equal playing field. Thus, purely their skill and team work is tested.
> AR starts is more fun in casual play, as it forces people to use other more varied weapons, making more interesting matches.
>
> Playlists should be split into Social and Ranked, with AR starts for the former and BR starts for the latter. Its as simple as that.

I whole heartedly disagree.
The true test of skill is how to use all facets of the game to their utmost potential in order to come out on top.
Two players standing in a field with BRs is only a test of their accuracy, and nothing else

6

> 2533274797604373;3:
> That’s not a new argument.
>
> The AR is certainly more powerful in Halo 5 than in previous Halos. I can see why so many players would favor the AR as a starting weapon now that it’s utility is improved by having more range. I still prefer the BR though, precision weapons are a defining aspect of Halo for me, and I don’t want to part with them.

It’s not a question of power, but game flow.
BR still beats out AR more often than not, but that’s not even the issue.
I enjoy their precision weapons as well, and there’s plenty on the map. I just think the pistol is plenty adequate for a starting weapon.
Not at all asking to get rid of them.

7

> 2533274861816391;5:
> > 2533274820845938;2:
> > Yes, the player with an AR who beats a BR player is more skilled. But, it isn’t a fair test of skill. To test skill fairly, all variables need to be removed.
> >
> > BR starts is the more competitive option, as everyone starts off on an equal playing field. Thus, purely their skill and team work is tested.
> > AR starts is more fun in casual play, as it forces people to use other more varied weapons, making more interesting matches.
> >
> > Playlists should be split into Social and Ranked, with AR starts for the former and BR starts for the latter. Its as simple as that.
>
>
> I whole heartedly disagree.
> The true test of skill is how to use all facets of the game to their utmost potential in order to come out on top.
> Two players standing in a field with BRs is only a test of their accuracy, and nothing else

then it should be dmrs because its random with the 3 bullet spread

8

> 2533274820845938;2:
> Yes, the player with an AR who beats a BR player is more skilled.

…no, you didn’t.

9

> 2533274913936758;8:
> > 2533274820845938;2:
> > Yes, the player with an AR who beats a BR player is more skilled.
>
>
> …no, you didn’t.

you edited my post in your quote and then disagreed with me. good job?

10

> 2533274913936758;8:
> > 2533274820845938;2:
> > Yes, the player with an AR who beats a BR player is more skilled.
>
>
> …no, you didn’t.

The player that beats a BR with an AR at close range is more skilled… In the aspect that they have better weapons knowledge and know which weapon has the distinct advantage in that niche range… But if a BR beats an AR player at that range, despite their blatant disadvantage, its obviously the more skilled player.

Can we please stop these nerf the BR threads? The AR is the most powerful it’s ever been in the entire franchise! This is the most balanced settings for AR enthusiasts, so please… Just stop. We finally have an AR that works outside of CQC, be happy for that.

11

> 2533274861816391;5:
> > 2533274820845938;2:
> > Yes, the player with an AR who beats a BR player is more skilled. But, it isn’t a fair test of skill. To test skill fairly, all variables need to be removed.
> >
> > BR starts is the more competitive option, as everyone starts off on an equal playing field. Thus, purely their skill and team work is tested.
> > AR starts is more fun in casual play, as it forces people to use other more varied weapons, making more interesting matches.
> >
> > Playlists should be split into Social and Ranked, with AR starts for the former and BR starts for the latter. Its as simple as that.
>
>
>
>
> I whole heartedly disagree.
> The true test of skill is how to use all facets of the game to their utmost potential in order to come out on top.
> Two players standing in a field with BRs is only a test of their accuracy, and nothing else

You’re confusing skill with competitive play. The two belong together, but they are still two different things.

Sure, a player who can beat everyone who has BRs, DMRs, Sniper and RL with just an AR is skilful. But it is not a competitive environment to play in. Treat it as a scientific experiment: You remove as many of the variables as you can in order to measure your results. If player A and B both have equal starts, then you can only consistently win if you are better than your opponent.

Moreover, you say it as if a test of accuracy is an insignificant thing. Accuracy is a huge part of being skilful in an FPS, and the more accurate you are, the more skill you have. Yet, it is not only accuracy that is tested in BR starts, but map control too. People think that map control only serves as a way to control power weapons. However, without power weapons, map control is still vital, as it allows you to gain vantage points AND control enemy spawns.

12

> 2533274851697025;10:
> > 2533274913936758;8:
> > > 2533274820845938;2:
> > > Yes, the player with an AR who beats a BR player is more skilled.
> >
> >
> >
> > …no, you didn’t.
>
>
> The player that beats a BR with an AR at close range is more skilled… In the aspect that they have better weapons knowledge and know which weapon has the distinct advantage in that niche range… But if a BR beats an AR player at that range, despite their blatant disadvantage, its obviously the more skilled player.
>
> Can we please stop these nerf the BR threads? The AR is the most powerful it’s ever been in the entire franchise! This is the most balanced settings for AR enthusiasts, so please… Just stop. We finally have an AR that works outside of CQC, be happy for that.

Not at all a nerf BR thread. I think it’s in a okay place. Headshots might be too easy, and the firing rate is pretty high, but nothing crazy.

13

> 2533274820845938;11:
> > 2533274861816391;5:
> > > 2533274820845938;2:
> > > Yes, the player with an AR who beats a BR player is more skilled. But, it isn’t a fair test of skill. To test skill fairly, all variables need to be removed.
> > >
> > > BR starts is the more competitive option, as everyone starts off on an equal playing field. Thus, purely their skill and team work is tested.
> > > AR starts is more fun in casual play, as it forces people to use other more varied weapons, making more interesting matches.
> > >
> > > Playlists should be split into Social and Ranked, with AR starts for the former and BR starts for the latter. Its as simple as that.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > I whole heartedly disagree.
> > The true test of skill is how to use all facets of the game to their utmost potential in order to come out on top.
> > Two players standing in a field with BRs is only a test of their accuracy, and nothing else
>
>
> You’re confusing skill with competitive play. The two belong together, but they are still two different things.
>
> Sure, a player who can beat everyone who has BRs, DMRs, Sniper and RL with just an AR is skilful. But it is not a competitive environment to play in. Treat it as a scientific experiment: You remove as many of the variables as you can in order to measure your results. If player A and B both have equal starts, then you can only consistently win if you are better than your opponent.
>
> Moreover, you say it as if a test of accuracy is an insignificant thing. Accuracy is a huge part of being skilful in an FPS, and the more accurate you are, the more skill you have. Yet, it is not only accuracy that is tested in BR starts, but map control too. People think that map control only serves as a way to control power weapons. However, without power weapons, map control is still vital, as it allows you to gain vantage points AND control enemy spawns.

Competitive play should be a test of skill? They’re absolutely not mutually exclusive.
What is this talk about equal starts? AR starts are just as equal as BR starts. That point made zero sense.
Accuracy is one of the most important skills, I’ve already stated this, that doesn’t mean the game should be pigeon-holed into one type of play.

14

> 2533274861816391;9:
> > 2533274913936758;8:
> > > 2533274820845938;2:
> > > Yes, the player with an AR who beats a BR player is more skilled.
> >
> >
> >
> > …no, you didn’t.
>
>
> you edited my post in your quote and then disagreed with me. good job?

I didn’t edit that sentence at all. You definitely said that. And you’re promoting AR starts so yes, I do disagree with you.

15

> 2533274913936758;14:
> > 2533274861816391;9:
> > > 2533274913936758;8:
> > > > 2533274820845938;2:
> > > > Yes, the player with an AR who beats a BR player is more skilled.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > …no, you didn’t.
> >
> >
> >
> > you edited my post in your quote and then disagreed with me. good job?
>
>
> I didn’t edit that sentence at all. You definitely said that. And you’re promoting AR starts so yes, I do disagree with you.

Look at your quote, and look at the original sentence, they’re not at all the same. You took the beginning and the end and removed the context.

16

Lol at the title. Kind of on the fence about the issue though.

17

> 2533274861816391;13:
> > 2533274820845938;11:
> > > 2533274861816391;5:
> > > > 2533274820845938;2:
> > > > Yes, the player with an AR who beats a BR player is more skilled. But, it isn’t a fair test of skill. To test skill fairly, all variables need to be removed.
> > > >
> > > > BR starts is the more competitive option, as everyone starts off on an equal playing field. Thus, purely their skill and team work is tested.
> > > > AR starts is more fun in casual play, as it forces people to use other more varied weapons, making more interesting matches.
> > > >
> > > > Playlists should be split into Social and Ranked, with AR starts for the former and BR starts for the latter. Its as simple as that.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > I whole heartedly disagree.
> > > The true test of skill is how to use all facets of the game to their utmost potential in order to come out on top.
> > > Two players standing in a field with BRs is only a test of their accuracy, and nothing else
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > You’re confusing skill with competitive play. The two belong together, but they are still two different things.
> >
> > Sure, a player who can beat everyone who has BRs, DMRs, Sniper and RL with just an AR is skilful. But it is not a competitive environment to play in. Treat it as a scientific experiment: You remove as many of the variables as you can in order to measure your results. If player A and B both have equal starts, then you can only consistently win if you are better than your opponent.
> >
> > Moreover, you say it as if a test of accuracy is an insignificant thing. Accuracy is a huge part of being skilful in an FPS, and the more accurate you are, the more skill you have. Yet, it is not only accuracy that is tested in BR starts, but map control too. People think that map control only serves as a way to control power weapons. However, without power weapons, map control is still vital, as it allows you to gain vantage points AND control enemy spawns.
>
>
>
>
> Competitive play should be a test of skill? They’re absolutely not mutually exclusive.
> What is this talk about equal starts? AR starts are just as equal as BR starts. That point made zero sense.
> Accuracy is one of the most important skills, I’ve already stated this, that doesn’t mean the game should be pigeon-holed into one type of play.

You dont understand, clearly. BR is the optimal utility weapon. If everyone starts with it, there is hypothetically no need to change weapons (albeit for power weapons). Therefore, it is fair to assume that with BR starts, BRs will remain a constant for the most part, thus removing a variable.

However, with AR starts, everyone usually seeks to replace it with a more optimal weapon ASAP. If one player manages to grab a BR on the map, thus giving his team a snowball effect (regardless of their own skill level), the match becomes uncompetitive, as the other team is handicapped. Sure, the player who grabbed the BR first demonstrated either some skill or luck by doing that, but consistent skill can no longer be measured throughout the match.

As per your final point, I have already stated that BR starts tests more than accuracy. It also tests teamwork through communication, map control and spawn control.

Lastly, I want to emphasise what I already made clear in my first post, I do not think this game should be BR starts only, but a mixture of both. BR for competitive play and AR for casual/social play.

18

I think AR starts would be more fun so you have to look for BR, like in Breakout. Everybody has SMG but there is an BR at the floor and its balanced.

19

> 2533274820845938;2:
> Yes, the player with an AR who beats a BR player is more skilled. But, it isn’t a fair test of skill. To test skill fairly, all variables need to be removed.
>
> BR starts is the more competitive option, as everyone starts off on an equal playing field. Thus, purely their skill and team work is tested.
> AR starts is more fun in casual play, as it forces people to use other more varied weapons, making more interesting matches.
>
> Playlists should be split into Social and Ranked, with AR starts for the former and BR starts for the latter. Its as simple as that.

> 2533274861816391;15:
> > 2533274913936758;14:
> > > 2533274861816391;9:
> > > > 2533274913936758;8:
> > > > > 2533274820845938;2:
> > > > > Yes, the player with an AR who beats a BR player is more skilled.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > …no, you didn’t.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > you edited my post in your quote and then disagreed with me. good job?
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > I didn’t edit that sentence at all. You definitely said that. And you’re promoting AR starts so yes, I do disagree with you.
>
>
>
> Look at your quote, and look at the original sentence, they’re not at all the same. You took the beginning and the end and removed the context.

OK, I’m not sure why you’re struggling with this.

  1. The bold is what he said.
  2. The bold is exactly what I quoted.
  3. The bold is one full statement ending in a period making it one complete sentence.

What are we not understanding about this? Btw, it’s not even your post that you’re talking about. You know that right?

20

> 2533274913936758;19:
> > 2533274820845938;2:
> > Yes, the player with an AR who beats a BR player is more skilled. But, it isn’t a fair test of skill. To test skill fairly, all variables need to be removed.
> >
> > BR starts is the more competitive option, as everyone starts off on an equal playing field. Thus, purely their skill and team work is tested.
> > AR starts is more fun in casual play, as it forces people to use other more varied weapons, making more interesting matches.
> >
> > Playlists should be split into Social and Ranked, with AR starts for the former and BR starts for the latter. Its as simple as that.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > 2533274861816391;15:
> > > 2533274913936758;14:
> > > > 2533274861816391;9:
> > > > > 2533274913936758;8:
> > > > > > 2533274820845938;2:
> > > > > > Yes, the player with an AR who beats a BR player is more skilled.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > …no, you didn’t.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > you edited my post in your quote and then disagreed with me. good job?
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > I didn’t edit that sentence at all. You definitely said that. And you’re promoting AR starts so yes, I do disagree with you.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Look at your quote, and look at the original sentence, they’re not at all the same. You took the beginning and the end and removed the context.
>
>
> OK, I’m not sure why you’re struggling with this.
>
> 1. The bold is what he said.
> 2. The bold is exactly what I quoted.
> 3. The bold is one full statement ending in a period making it one complete sentence.
>
> What are we not understanding about this? Btw, it’s not even your post that you’re talking about. You know that right?

lol, you responded with “you definitely said that” i think we were both confused for a minute there. my bad.