Armor Effects Like Halo: Reach?

Games Halo 5: Guardians
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> > 2533274873580796;494:
> > Ohh, well you’ve really learned me a good one… you’re doing a really great job man. Dude, it’s great that a lot of this community likes armor customization and cosmetic effects… really, it is… but that doesn’t change the REALITY.
>
> I’m well aware you aren’t listening, I’m not sure why you seem completely incapable of percieving that other people have different opinions than you…

Let me ask you this… if we use the successful OG trilogy as a benchmark. How was a certain fraction of the fanbase in H3, for example, ever NOT supported? The point you’re making about getting rid of BTB, HCS/MLG, etc. Couldn’t be further off the mark… Nothing like that needs to be removed, because it’s all a way to PLAY the game… If you’re 343, you incorporate ALL staple experiences, but you don’t segregate content apart from each other. Gametypes should use the same pool of maps like they did in the past, that’s what I’m saying…

Otherwise you’re spreading content and resources thin, and the segregation of content is where the issue lies, more or less. You’ve said in the past that specialized content is the best way to go… and I disagree and say “absolutely no, it’s not” because what good is the specialized Breakout content for the vast majority of the player base? Nobody plays it… The very few that do, could’ve played the same gametype on small, symmetrical Arena maps and the time 343 spent on producing the Breakout mode in its entirety, could’ve been devoted to improving the actual map pool as a whole… because it’s not a successful mode, it was costly content produced to very minimal value output.

There’s more value in the old system because it supported the full variety of gametypes in a way where most game modes still played very well, despite the map selection. Some were more focused on certain game modes than others, but that’s ok… different experiences. Everyone could find something to do on any map, with any game mode.

Now you can’t play BTB on Warzone maps, or CTF, or anything… it’s strictly WZ and if people don’t like WZ, they have no use for WZ maps/content. The value isn’t maximized, and to those people there is minimal/no value. It’s why I think it’s important to “conjoin” experiences once again… develop a multi-faceted single map pool, but all I’m saying too is that to better utilize playspaces and provide ever MORE value to players, smaller maps could essentially be designed within larger environments and work for large scale games utilized in smaller games with minimal Forge editing. And since all maps are designed to support all community preferences and playstyles, value is maximized. Players take full advantage of dev content, regardless of how they like to play.

I mean, frankly, when armor sets are so abundant and we can’t even have game modes that were in the ORIGINAL Halo, there’s something wrong here… the remix/segregated map system was once again changing up the successful formula, offered players lower value experiences and less variety in the meantime… there’s just a lot of room for improvement man.

And THIS is what people play Halo for. Players want the full Halo experience, and when we have all this extra stuff pulling away effort and resources from providing the full experience at Triple A quality. We have an ESTABLISHED franchise here… built on a successful formula… it’s important that it meets expectations with each iteration. Traditionally cosmetics were out of the question and players had all of these great ways to play. Now we have all these little things getting on the way, pulling resources away…

And no, I don’t know 343’s internal processes or anything, but its product development! It’s how development teams work… Every company does things a little different internally, but it’s the business. It’s taking something that doesn’t exist and realizing a vision, and developing ideas into an end product. I know what it takes… and how money plays into the picture. I’ve worked in a similar environment for a few years now…

At the end of the day, they have to value stream, what are the most important factors that contribute to player enjoyment and sustainment… it has to happen. It determines what the end product becomes. Sustaining players requires a fun and addicting experience. Something that is only graphical would (or should) fall very low on the list. It’s a cost for very minimal value added. Reducing unnecessary costs while creating the most value… through innovative design, the value added can be even more potent.

We can have all of these extra content pieces, but when things are already lacking, more armor effects, helmets, assassination animations, entirely useless stances… the game could go without this stuff, and from a design standpoint, it would ONLY benefit. More REQ content, simply put, does not fix the game’s problems, or the franchise’s problems.

The game needs to support all communities, but it needs to do it effectively. As proven by the state of H5, sacrifices will have to be made… management will have to shift their focus in a few areas… design teams will have to execute. Again, do you play Halo to play a fun and satisfying Triple A shooter, or do you “play” it to play dress up? Something’s gotta give… when you look at it critically, this isn’t even subject to interpretation what matters more.

343’s main objective going forward should be, “how do we not compromise the experience?”

502

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> Let me ask you this… if we use the successful OG trilogy as a benchmark. How was a certain fraction of the fanbase in H3, for example, ever NOT supported?

Where was the no-equipment playlist? Why were people locked out of specific playlists, because they couldn’t purchase dlc. Iremember the endless debates over the bloody melee system. Not everyone was happy with Halo 3. Every playlist in the game gets support, even if it isn’t what you’d like. There have been far more ‘arena’ refreshes than anything else. More importantly why are you trying to deflect? You’ve yet to actually answer the questions.

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> The point you’re making about getting rid of BTB, HCS/MLG, etc. Couldn’t be further off the mark… Nothing like that needs to be removed, because it’s all a way to PLAY the game…

I recall you specifically saying grifball, breakout, and 12 man warzone we’re 'wastes of resources. As for using the same maps for every playlists; that’s absurd. I’m guessing you aren’t familiar with map design. A good CTF map/may be -Yoink- for slayer or vice versa. If you recall reach did the same you suggest with invasion/BTB. The maps were great for invasion and played horribly in BTB. The two game modes were too different for them to work. Would you really play doubles on Valhalla?

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> because what good is the specialized Breakout content for the vast majority of the player base? Nobody plays it…

Have a read of the breakout refresh thread at some point, mate. People play breakout. Some people like the new version and some people like the old. Why do you get to tell them that their content is a waste? Why do you get to say, “Screw you. You can’t have breakout. It isn’t worthwhile in my eyes.” If it’s simple majority than I would hazard to guess that Arena would lose to Warzone. Since the majority of players play warzone, then obviously arena is a waste of resources.

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> … because it’s not a successful mode, it was costly content produced to very minimal value output.

You have no idea what the resources put into it were or what (if anything) it would’ve taken time away from. Again Why is it a waste? Why do you get to decide that? Why is it not successful? Is it because you don’t play it, because I know quite a few people who do.

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> Everyone could find something to do on any map, with any game mode.

No. No they really can’t.

> 2533274873580796;501:
> Now you can’t play BTB on Warzone maps, or CTF, or anything… it’s strictly WZ and if people don’t like WZ, they have no use for WZ maps/content. The value isn’t maximized, and to those people there is minimal/no value. It’s why I think it’s important to “conjoin” experiences once again… develop a multi-faceted single map pool, but all I’m saying too is that to better utilize playspaces and provide ever MORE value to players, smaller maps could essentially be designed within larger environments and work for large scale games utilized in smaller games with minimal Forge editing. And since all maps are designed to support all community preferences and playstyles, value is maximized. Players take full advantage of dev content, regardless of how they like to play.

Been there, done that.

> 2533274873580796;501:
> I mean, frankly, when armor sets are so abundant and we can’t even have game modes that were in the ORIGINAL Halo, there’s something wrong here… the remix/segregated map system was once again changing up the successful formula, offered players lower value experiences and less variety in the meantime… there’s just a lot of room for improvement man.

Yet you aren’t asking for oddball are you? Again, “You can’t ask for this, I feel it’s pointless.” Ask for what you want, instead of telling people not to ask for what they want.

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> Traditionally cosmetics were out of the question and players had all of these great ways to play. Now we have all these little things getting on the way, pulling resources away…

Yes; cosmetics are so out of the question we got more option in Halo 2 than in CE and more in Halo 3 than 2. Bungie obviously felt they were important enough to add in the first place. I don’t recall arguing with you ten years ago that they were ‘wastes of resources.’

> 2533274873580796;501:
> And no, I don’t know 343’s internal processes or anything, but its product development! It’s how development teams work… Every company does things a little different internally, but it’s the business. It’s taking something that doesn’t exist and realizing a vision, and developing ideas into an end product. I know what it takes… and how money plays into the picture. I’ve worked in a similar environment for a few years now… At the end of the day, they have to value stream, what are the most important factors that contribute to player enjoyment and sustainment… it has to happen. It determines what the end product becomes. Sustaining players requires a fun and addicting experience. Something that is only graphical would (or should) fall very low on the list. It’s a cost for very minimal value added. Reducing unnecessary costs while creating the most value… through innovative design, the value added can be even more potent.

And again. You don’t know the internal workings. For all you know Microsoft wouldn’t have given them half the funding without the req system. You don’t have enough information to make those determinations. You can’t decide what is a ‘waste’ and what isn’t. It’s business and if there wasn’t a return for the effort they put in, they wouldn’t be doing it. That’s the way businesses work, giving fans what they want. Why do you get to decide that what they want is a ‘waste of resources.’ Answer the question for once.

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> We can have all of these extra content pieces, but when things are already lacking, more armor effects, helmets, assassination animations, entirely useless stances… the game could go without this stuff, and from a design standpoint, it would ONLY benefit. More REQ content, simply put, does not fix the game’s problems, or the franchise’s problems.

And telling people not to want things they enjoy does nothing to fix anything. You could be talking about whatever issues you think are there…you could be asking for them to fix them or add more maps. Instead you just repeat the same line over and over, “No, that’s a waste of resources. I don’t like it.”

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> The game needs to support all communities,

Even the break out community? Oh wait…

> 2533274873580796;501:
> Again, do you play Halo to play a fun and satisfying Triple A shooter, or do you “play” it to play dress up? Something’s gotta give… when you look at it critically, this isn’t even subject to interpretation what matters more.

False dichotomy.

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> 343’s main objective going forward should be, “how do we not compromise the experience?”

No. It should be how do we make the game better? Telling other people that their ideas and desires are ‘wastes of resources’ certainly accomplishes nothing. 343 needs the community’s input; After all if enough people care about those cosmetics, then they can’t be a waste of resources.

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> 2533274880633045;502:
> > 2533274873580796;501:
> > Let me ask you this… How was a certain fraction of the fanbase in H3, for example, ever NOT supported?
>
> Where was the no-equipment playlist? Why were people locked out of specific playlists, because they couldn’t purchase dlc. Iremember the endless debates over the bloody melee system…
>
>
> MLG? The point is, whether people disagreed with mechanical design choices (also happens in H5) the game still offered staple Halo experiences and game modes. Va****riety in MM… the game was far less prone to getting old fast.
>
> > 2533274873580796;501:
> > The point you’re making about getting rid of BTB, HCS/MLG, etc. Couldn’t be further off the mark… Nothing like that needs to be removed, because it’s all a way to PLAY the game…
>
> I recall you specifically saying grifball, breakout, and 12 man warzone we’re 'wastes of resources. … I’m guessing you aren’t familiar with map design. A good CTF map/may be -Yoink- for slayer or vice versa. If you recall reach did the same you suggest with invasion/BTB … you really play doubles on Valhalla?
>
>
> I may have said those gametypes were “cheese” but I don’t believe I ever said “remove” them… if I did, I didn’t mean it. Not sure on that one. Now I’m not familiar with map design? Lol ok… I was apart of the testing of “Onyx” in H4 with its creator and the parts of the Forge community, before it ever hit MM. I’m a fairly high-level player. Believe me, I know a good map when I see one… Would would play Doubles on Valhalla? Doubles is SLAYER and objective modes, no? Valhalla supports all game modes, playlists are not inherently game modes… MP on Reach used Campaign spaces as maps, I wouldn’t exactly call that “good” MP design on Bungie’s part. Not the best example…
>
> > 2533274873580796;501:
> > because what good is the specialized Breakout content for the vast majority of the player base? Nobody plays it…
>
> People play breakout. Some people like the new version and some people like the old. Why do you get to tell them that their content is a waste? Why do you get to say, “Screw you. You can’t have breakout.” …
>
>
> What… like 12 people? lol
> Arena IS Halo. It’s the component of the game built off of what Halo has ALWAYS been… If you don’t like Arena, I’d argue that you’re not even a true Halo fan lol. Priorities have obviously shifted within the community… MAYBE if Arena was more effectively supported, more people would play it and wouldn’t ditch the game entirely. It took HOW long for Snipers to be supported (temporarily) and now it’s gone again? Due to numbers? Unacceptable… especially when 343’s “exciting new mode” Breakout, that they like to promote, has ~12 regular players…
>
> > 2533274873580796;501:
> > … because it’s not a successful mode, it was costly content produced to very minimal value output.
>
> You have no idea what the resources put into it were or what (if anything) it would’ve taken time away from. Again Why is it a waste? Why do you get to decide that? …
>
>
> Why do I get to decide that? I’m not deciding anything… I’m looking at Breakout for what it is. The vast majority sees very little value in it, as it is hardly played… thus, the value output per dev cost is low. And you CAN have Breakout! It could’ve been played on regular symmetrical maps, built from custom game options… SMART DESIGN, utilizing your developed assets to their fullest capability and maximizing their value. That completely eliminates the need to produce it’s Forge canvas and attributed content/programming/etc. Massive savings… that content is expensive to produce. It’s all about IMPLEMENTATION.
>
> > 2533274873580796;501:
> > Everyone could find something to do on any map, with any game mode.
>
> No. No they really can’t.
>
>
> Yes, you really could… in the OG trilogy? Again, I’m not talking playlists, I’m talking modes. Playlists should be tailored…
>
> > 2533274873580796;501:
> > I mean, frankly, when armor sets are so abundant … the remix/segregated map system was once again changing up the successful formula, offered players lower value experiences and less variety in the meantime… there’s just a lot of room for improvement man.
>
> Yet you aren’t asking for oddball are you? …
>
>
> I make a point about Oddball all the time… and KOTH, and Ricochet, and Juggernaut, etc. The game is missing valuable content that would add much needed variety to MM? Are so many Waypointer’s (in particular) blind to this? Where are they?
>
> > 2533274873580796;501:
> > Traditionally cosmetics were out of the question and players had all of these great ways to play. Now we have all these little things getting on the way, pulling resources away…
>
> Yes; cosmetics are so out of the question we got more option in Halo 2 than in CE and more in Halo 3 than 2. Bungie obviously felt they were important enough to add in the first place.
>
>
> We had only a relative handful in H3? There wasn’t an issue with that, the CORE game offerings were there. I’ve that I don’t oppose some customization… I’d actually be fine with 10-15 armor sets, give or take, with expanded customization within… where armor skins could also be applied to add even further customization options than what we have now? These could be purchased through the REQ store or unlocked through grinding and I push for this all the time? We don’t need hundreds of different armor selections though, do we?
>
> > 2533274873580796;501:
> > And no, I don’t know 343’s internal processes or anything, but its product development! It’s how development teams work… Every company does things a little different internally, …
>
> And again. You don’t know the internal workings…
>
>
> Again, it’s the nature of the BUSINESS… Somebody has to decide what’s valuable and what isn’t and develop a vision and execute the design. The question is, are their priorities in line? As much as 343/Microsoft wants you to think the REQ system is in the player’s best interest, it’s not… and again, to produce REQ content, you taking away from the pot where the resources and time could’ve been spent fixing heavy aim oh idk, a YEAR ago? Or spent on a more creative map design process? Real issues in the game… instead greed takes over. Remember, before H5 even launched or was able to bring in REQ revenue, they had 6 months of update pre-planned. The money was there… they just didn’t utilize it in the customer’s best interest.
>
> > 2533274873580796;501:
> > We can have all of these extra content pieces, but when things are already lacking, more armor effects, helmets, assassination animations, entirely useless stances… the game could go without this stuff, and from a design standpoint, it would ONLY benefit. More REQ content, simply put, does not fix the game’s problems, or the franchise’s problems.
>
> And telling people not to want things they enjoy does nothing to fix anything. You could be talking about whatever issues you think are there…you could be asking for them to fix them or add more maps. … “No, that’s a waste of resources. I don’t like it.”
>
>
> It’s not even always even that I “don’t like” something entirely… it’s that actually it really IS just a waste of resources? lol. Not sure why this is so hard to grasp, these items don’t influence the quality of the game and after a certain point, do nothing but detract from it… I ask for new maps all the time. There’s not enough of it here.
>
> > 2533274873580796;501:
> > The game needs to support all communities,
>
> Even the break out community? Oh wait…
>
>
> We’ve been over this… I wouldn’t exactly call Breakout a staple Halo experience, as it is new and not very successful among the greater H5 community. There are better ways to incorporate it as discussed… in a full, traditional suite of modes, configured with custom game options.

Answers in bold.

504

Something else that we dont need in this game, just gimmicks that waste space for beneficial improvements.

505

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> Va****riety in MM… the game was far less prone to getting old fast.

Yay; you didn’t get bored as easily. That means that other people can’t ask for things they desire to be in the game.

> 2533274873580796;50:
> I may have said those gametypes were “cheese” but I don’t believe I ever said “remove” them… if I did, I didn’t mean it. Not sure on that one. Now I’m not familiar with map design? Lol ok… I was apart of the testing of “Onyx” in H4 with its creator and the parts of the Foge community, before it ever hit MM. I’m a fairly high-level player. Believe me, I know a good map when I see one… Would would play Doubles on Valhalla? Doubles is SLAYER and objective modes, no? Valhalla supports all game modes, playlists are not inherently game modes…

Which is even more reason that maps aren’t universal. You inevitably have to make different maps for different playlists. Universal maps will not work for extremely diverse game modes/number variants etc.

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> MP on Reach used Campaign spaces as maps, I wouldn’t exactly call that “good” MP design on Bungie’s part. Not the best example…

And you’re wrong. The maps were developed for multiplayer and then placed in campaign and they still show that some game modes will not work on all maps.

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> What… like 12 people? lol

Last I checked, you were one person. Which means even if I accept your nonsensical minimization that means 11 more people think that game type/playlist is worthwhile than think it’s a waste of resources.

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> Arena IS Halo.

And again; what you like is somehow definitional to the universe. There are Halo fans that have never played multiplayer, there are people who only play BTB or Grifball. Halo is bigger than you seem capable of grasping. Right now there is someone that loves Halo…and has never owned any version of an Xbox. Halo is far more than arena, far more than even a video game.

> 2533274873580796;50:
> It’s the component of the game built off of what Halo has ALWAYS been… If you don’t like Arena, I’d argue that you’re not even a true Halo fan lol.

> 2533274873580796;50:
> Priorities have obviously shifted within the community… MAYBE if Arena was more effectively supported, more people would play it and wouldn’t ditch the game entirely. It took HOW long for Snipers to be supported (temporarily) and now it’s gone again? Due to numbers? Unacceptable… especially when 343’s “exciting new mode” Breakout, that they like to promote, has ~12 regular players…

More effectively supported; when it’s the most supported playlist…brilliant.
And since you don’t have playlist data it could easily be that breakout has more players than snipers. Your random assumptions mean nothing, but again I don’t see you in the matchmaking forum in one of the ‘bring back snipers’ threads.

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> Why do I get to decide that? I’m not deciding anything…

Yeah, you kind of are.

> 2533274873580796;50:
> I’m looking at Breakout for what it is. The vast majority sees very little value in it, as it is hardly played.]

Citation needed.

> 2533274873580796;50:
> … thus, the value output per dev cost is low. And you CAN have Breakout! It could’ve been played on regular symmetrical maps, built from custom game options… SMART DESIGN, utilizing your developed assets to their fullest capability and maximizing their value. That completely eliminates the need to produce it’s Forge canvas and attributed content/programming/etc. Massive savings… that content is expensive to produce. It’s all about IMPLEMENTATION.

Which wouldn’t be breakout…would it? It wouldn’t be the game type as the fans of that playlist enjoy it?

> 2533274873580796;50:
> I make a point about Oddball all the time… and KOTH, and Ricochet, and Juggernaut, etc. The game is missing valuable content that would add much needed variety to MM? Are so many Waypointer’s (in particular) blind to this? Where are they?

I’ll admit when I checked your post history you did mention on oddball about once a month this year. still why are you wasting time telling other people that they can’t ask for stuff they want, when you could be asking for something you want…He’ll I’ll join you if you make a thread about bringing back an official oddball mode to matchmaking. That would be a good thing IMO. That doesn’t change the fact that hasn’t been your focus. Instead of asking for what you want you still spend the majority of your time trying to knock other people down for wanting an armor or game mode you don’t like.

> 2533274873580796;50:
> We had only a relative handful in H3? There wasn’t an issue with that, the CORE game offerings were there. I’ve that I don’t oppose some customization… I’d actually be fine with 10-15 armor sets, give or take, with expanded customization within… where armor skins could also be applied to add even further customization options than what we have now? These could be purchased through the REQ store or unlocked through grinding and I push for this all the time? We don’t need hundreds of different armor selections though, do we?

Yet that isn’t something for you to determine. Someone likes each of those armors. Personally I only care about one, but that doesn’t mean I get to tell everyone else that they can’t have those armors.

> 2533274873580796;50:
> Again, it’s the nature of the BUSINESS… Somebody has to decide what’s valuable and what isn’t and develop a vision and execute the design. The question is, are their priorities in line? As much as 343/Microsoft wants you to think the REQ system is in the player’s best interest, it’s not… and again, to produce REQ content, you taking away from the pot where the resources and time could’ve been spent fixing heavy aim oh idk, a YEAR ago?

Yes, you would have received instantaneous gratification if only there were fewer emblems.

> 2533274873580796;50:
> It’s not even always even that I “don’t like” something entirely…

So you’d be okay with sacrificing things you enjoy if the majority voted against them? If say the majority of polled Halo players decided Capture the flag was a ‘waste of resources.’ You’d be perfectly okay with that? And so the things you don’t care about were considered important to the community you’d stop telling them they couldn’t ask for them? (I know that last one isn’t true.)

> 2533274873580796;50:
> it’s that actually it really IS just a waste of resources? lol. Not sure why this is so hard to grasp,

Because your opinion isn’t a fact? You’ve decided it’s a waste of resources, because you see it as unimportant. That doesn’t make it a waste of resources. You’re only one person, you don’t get to decide that.

> 2533274873580796;50:
> these items don’t influence the quality of the game and after a certain point, do nothing but detract from it… I ask for new maps all the time. There’s not enough of it here.

Not really on this one; perhaps you should try it. “New maps for arena. My ideas.” or something of that ilk or since you said you were an experienced forger you could make a few and submit them in the appropriate threads. All of which would be more useful than popping into a thread about armor effects that had gone on for 20 plus pages and saying, "All of you who have asked for this are wrong. This is a waste of resources, because it could be going to something I like. I’d like to see what you come up with.

> 2533274873580796;50:
> We’ve been over this… I wouldn’t exactly call Breakout a staple Halo experience, as it is new and not very successful among the greater H5 community. There are better ways to incorporate it as discussed… in a full, traditional suite of modes, configured with custom game options.

Yes we’ve been over this. You don’t get to determine what is and isn’t essential to Halo or which communities have to suffer so that you can think 343 singularly support your vision of Halo

506

> 2533274873580796;503:
> Arena IS Halo. It’s the component of the game built off of what Halo has ALWAYS been… If you don’t like Arena, I’d argue that you’re not even a true Halo fan lol.

No. Absolutely not.

CE development might have started out as a purely multiplayer game (Which has no weight to it, given that it also started out as an RTS at some point), but it’s obvious that the Campaign soon became the priority. So much so, that the multiplayer component was completely broken until a few weeks before the end. CE almost shipped without multiplayer entirely. I guess they must have deemed it a waste of resources compared to the singleplayer?
The multiplayer itself wasn’t even supposed to be PvP, it was supposed to put players argainst the AI, similar to Warzone. They just didn’t get it to work. When Halo 2 came around they were going to try again and in the process completely scrap the Arena component.
Weapons were also balanced for campaign first, multiplayer second. This clearly shows where the developers’ priorities were.
Source, if anybody cares.

As for the second part of the statement, I (and a lot of people I know) buy Halo almost exclusively for campaign (and other PvE modes, such as Firefight). In almost every single game, I have up to ten times as much time clocked in single player than multiplayer. (The only exception is Halo 4, whose campaign just didn’t have a lot of replay value. Also some friends and I wanted to grind the 1000 matches for the Raider armor.) That’s not to say that I dislike multiplayer, but I don’t really care about it. They could completely axe it for the next game and I would still buy it, if it has a good campaign (and maybe decent PvE). In fact, I already did: It’s called ODST and to this day is still my favorite Halo game.

So if you say “Arena is Halo” then to this I reply “No, campaign is Halo”. And neither of us is right.

507

I didn’t really read what everyone else said, just putting this here.

i don’t really like the armor effects from reach, i would not mind them at all tho if they were added into Halo 5

508

> 2533274801176260;506:
> > 2533274873580796;503:
> > Arena IS Halo. It’s the component of the game built off of what Halo has ALWAYS been… If you don’t like Arena, I’d argue that you’re not even a true Halo fan lol.
>
> No. Absolutely not.
> …
> So if you say “Arena is Halo” then to this I reply “No, campaign is Halo”. And neither of us is right.

No no no… You’re missing the point. OF COURSE Campaign IS Halo… just as much Arena is Halo.

I’m saying that Arena is component of Halo that MUST be in the game and treated correctly with the Halo treatment. Warzone is not “Halo” (right now) because of the way it’s treated… Breakout, is not Halo right now for the same reasons… 343 tampered with the implementation/formula and presentation of the mode itself, maps, etc.

As much as Halo is a Campaign and Arena multiplayer, it is also a full suite of game modes, a diverse pool of well-designed maps… each Halo is new, but its foundation is designed the same way, and in a way that was initially established and in a way that works. You know what else is Halo? Slayer, FFA, Team Objective (w/ Oddball, KOTH… more game modes that we’re missing in H5), Team Snipers, Team Doubles, and (even more) Ranked and Social game modes… Ranked and Social K/D and stat tracking… BTB, Firefight if you’re into that sort of thing… and working Theater mode… Forge. All of this up to a Triple A standard of polish.

THAT is Halo. It’s something we’re NOT been getting in recent years, at launch especially… and sometimes even AFTER launch we still haven’t gotten it. And in some ways, H5 is a lost cause because of the way they’ve built the game and multiplayer. Warzone and Arena cannot be conjoined or made to utilize the same pool of content now, because frankly, they were designed to be their own things… which yes, they are tailored to play well with certain content, but they really should be ABLE and be designed to support most/all maps. Obviously WZ would never work in a map like Plaza, but think, hypothetically, you could make WZ work on a map like Blood Gulch if you tweaked the mode itself and it’s parameters a bit. That would be a much more “Halo” way of implementing these modes compared to what we have today.

What I am saying is that we have this community that, less and less, comes into Arena mode (it’s not been as effectively supported as us Arena Halo fans would like) and there’s a lot of casual gamers left where it seems their feedback is being heard more than the competitive crowd. (We can get Skeeball and Toilet Bowl Infection before we can get some maps that aren’t nearly the same maps as what we got when the game launched? We had to wait for a YEAR and a HALF for the heavy aim bug to be fixed, even when feedback started rolling in about a year(ish) ago? We STILL don’t have staple playlists and game modes? But Warzone can have all of these REQ’s and cosmetic armors that (again) do NOTHING for the game and make zero difference in the gameplay experience?

That’s unacceptable… and when there’s a community coming on here acting like they know what’s best for Halo and they don’t even like playing the game for what it was INITIALLY designed to be… CORE Halo… Shielded health system, guns/grenades/melee, fighting on an even board for map and weapons control… and the only added stuff to Arena is social and casual game modes, because of the amount of feedback and 343’s “carefully calculated decisions” warranted the change… and we can’t even have Team Snipers in MM… I’m sorry guys, but not only do I find that to be mismanagement of the Halo franchise and online MM environment, but I also find it very SAD that the community has come to this point… where less and less people are playing Halo for what Halo was designed to be, in it’s default, competitive form. Montages these days? It’s all Social, SWAT, and Infection game modes… yes, those are “Halo” but it’s not HALO. It just shows you how the community has changed over the years, and thus, the game is being changed and managed a certain way, when really… the dying competitive crowd, they require a high standard, they KNOW the game… and when the game is not being treated as a Halo game, we speak out.

I’m not blind guys… I’m going to call things for what they are. I’ve been a Halo fan for a long, long time… and really, I’m a sensible guy and as much as (some) of you may think I’m just out on the forums to push what I want for MYSELF in Halo, that is simply NOT TRUE… because in the past, we had something that worked very well… where all MM communities were supported effectively, content was full of creativity and upheld Halo’s integrity and level of quality. We had game modes for everyone… now we just have a massive, clunky menu of cosmetics, a bunch of similar maps, and a few modes that don’t even interface with each other half the time. I’m looking for a solution that hopefully 343 can see that involves smart design, compromise where it makes sense, reusing assets in a traditional sense, making all MP content compatible with each other, where it actually benefits the player in a meaningful way, and where the Triple A experience can be delivered and upheld once again…

But THESE are the issues people need to be aware of… that’s why I come on here and say “we have way too many cosmetics!” Because we do… and because they eat up developer time and resources, and they’re taking too many risks trying new things that don’t make a whole lot of financial sense at times, that ultimately and negatively impact the design and polish of the overall game. But here, it’s like that as long as we can get some “cool new armor” (when we have a TON of it already) and assassination animations and all of this other garbage, the game is going to magically be better and fix itself… NO.

Some of these people man… they just don’t get it!

509

Some of the armor effects were available only to bungie employees but the ones u can get are reeeeeely expensive

510

> 2533274856011418;1:
> I loved Halo: Reach when it bought it and started playing for the first time. I saw all these amazing features. I just loved how you could make your own combination of armor from helmet to shoulders to torso. I liked the armor effects as well. They were just the coolest thing to me. So the question is: Why can’t a feature like this be in Halo 5? Do they not like it, or is it just because of some other reason? Was it hated by many players and 343 decided not to add it? Many questions lay in my mind about this. I don’t know about you guys, but Maaaaaaan… do I want a sick skull, birthday party, or inclement weather effects on my Halo 5 set.
>
> How do you feel of this topic friends?

We’re so far from launch man. We are so far from Halo: Reach’s 2010-2012.

511

> 2533274832674094;510:
> > 2533274856011418;1:
> > I loved Halo: Reach when it bought it and started playing for the first time. I saw all these amazing features. I just loved how you could make your own combination of armor from helmet to shoulders to torso. I liked the armor effects as well. They were just the coolest thing to me. So the question is: Why can’t a feature like this be in Halo 5? Do they not like it, or is it just because of some other reason? Was it hated by many players and 343 decided not to add it? Many questions lay in my mind about this. I don’t know about you guys, but Maaaaaaan… do I want a sick skull, birthday party, or inclement weather effects on my Halo 5 set.
> >
> > How do you feel of this topic friends?
>
> We’re so far from launch man. We are so far from Halo: Reach’s 2010-2012.

What does the launch date of Halo: Reach have to do with the reintroduction of armor effects?
Why does it matter the time distance between the latest Halos and older Halos?

Halo CE and 2 were waaay back in the day, for example. Look at halo 5. Halo 5 reintroduced H:2 battle rifle, H:2 beam rifle, and H:CE magnum.
Everyone was fond. Might as well add the Halo in mind, too. They brought classic Halo:Reach armor sets to the game, temporarily.

So why?

512

I think the way halo 5 is set, you really can’t do what was done in Reach. I’m tired of one game it’s oneway and the next game it’s totally donkey backwards

513

I agree with most others…ill pass. I wish you could unlock ALL reqs round 1 though. Alot of times i dont get to unlock all of them by wave 5…which blows

514

this was sick it added unique features to your character

515

yeah i liked them

couldnt hurt to add them back

516

I would like the same too

517

Although they had no purpose, the visual affect gave me my personaility, and expanded my customization which is a high demand on halo!

518

> 2533274816579761;517:
> Although they had no purpose, the visual affect gave me my personaility, and expanded my customization which is a high demand on halo!

And I definately agree whixh customizing different parts of my armor! Having two different shoulder pads made me almost unmatchable which is what everyone wants

519

> 2533274880633045;502:
> > 2533274873580796;501:
> >
>
>
>
> > 2533274873580796;501:
> > 343’s main objective going forward should be, “how do we not compromise the experience?”
>
> No. It should be how do we make the game better? Telling other people that their ideas and desires are ‘wastes of resources’ certainly accomplishes nothing. 343 needs the community’s input; After all if enough people care about those cosmetics, then they can’t be a waste of resources.

Tell me what was the staple of Halo 2/3 “The Peak of Halo” and what made it so great compared to the downfalls of Halo… which includes Halo 4/5? Let’s have an open mind here and be modest MOD… We speak for the millions of people who haven’t been drawn to halo since Halo 3/ Halo: Reach or become disappointed while numbers drop immensely since launch because of these factors Lick is speaking of… Which you are completely taking out of context and/or are completely stubborn about. You won’t see those amount of people coming to this forum anymore or even posting because they simply have given up/don’t care or have joined other big forums(TeamBeyond and Thehaloforum). You may ask why are we still here then… because we see potential that has always been there but isn’t implemented. And if you say “All those People have different expectations” well… We all used to play together on Halo 2,3 and maybe Halo:Reach.

520

IDK if is a good idea to implement in H5