Armor Color Customization in big jeopardy!

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> So basically 343i have seen the way Destiny do colour customisation and thought “sure, we could do that, and that way it gives players something else they have to grind for”
>
> This is NOT ok, colour customisation has been the most basic form of customisation in Halo since it’s inception. How are people even supposed to make machinima like Red vs Blue without being able to customise their colours? It’s completely nonsensical.
>
> There are much better ways to do this. I never played it myself but I’ve seen videos on the way Anthem treats it’s customisation and that’s similar but actually really cool. Each armour has a number of materials that can be switched out for different textures and levels of wear / shine / chrome etc. Additionally the colour can be applied to it as a separate thing. That gives huge freedom of customisability and millions of potential combinations. Where as what 343i have described is Destiny’s shader system where only a select number of combinations are allowed which have to be unlocked and can’t be mixed together, which is hugely restrictive. In fact it sounds like it’s actually more restrictive, since at least in Destiny you can mix and match shaders on different armour pieces.
>
> The community need to get behind this to signal that this is not ok.

Pretty much this. Tbh this system would be absolutely fine if you could change the baked in colours of the skins. It’d be a really cool extra layer of customisation. Why on earth did they think limiting people’s options is a win for player expression???

I can’t believe a core customization feature since CE is being removed in favor of a curated choice which is out of your control.

This is such a silly hill to die on, please reconsider.

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> > > Changing everything that we love about a franchise and things that have been there and have no need to be fixed is a good way to kill the fan base.
> >
> > Welcome to the “classic movement mechanics” discussion.
>
> Ehh to be fair I like halo 5 on paper. I think it’s playable even with the “advanced movement” but it just feels a bit like Titan Fall with the fast paced spartan charge, ground pound, aim glide stuff. I’m okay with just sprint or rather walking even.

The point is, that is literally how the classic fans have felt for a decade by now, word for word.
I’m afraid to say it, but get used to 343 not caring.
“The weight of your heresy will stay your feet. And you shall be left behind.”

Just dropping by to say I told you so. The red flags were there, accompanied by 343i’s comprehensive silence. The article confirmed our suspicion without alleviating fears. Instead of getting ahead of the problem and explaining just how customization works and what will be available at launch vs what will be unlocked through a Battle Pass system or microtransactions, 343i say nothing. They know damn well this is a bad choice, otherwise they wouldn’t have kept their silence.

Let’s make sure not to ignore the other red flags Infinite poses: the mere concept of Free to Play multiplayer, the complete reboot of the campaign’s story, the frankly ugly graphics and design choices. These red flags are huge, and 343i answer the fandom’s worries with silence. Why? Because they know we won’t like what they have to show.

343i, I hope you prove me wrong, but you already fooled us many times (Halo 4 multiplayer, Halo 5 campaign, MCC being unplayable at launch, etc). You have not earned our trust or our good will. This is the time to show us your game, to let us give you feedback, to flight it and beta test it so that when it does launch, we will love it and play it. Silence just serves to confirm our worries.

<span;>This coating system is terrible they need to let us what colours we want with a primary and secondary colour system not this paywall monetized microtransaction -Yoink-. <!–/data/user/0/com.samsung.android.app.notes/files/clipdata/clipdata_bodytext_201023_065731_324.sdocx–>

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> > > > > If this is what it takes to have a modern Halo game that doesn’t have a population nose-dive after a few months, and for content for Infinite to continue to be developed over the course of the 10 years for which they said it’s gonna be the main Halo platform (as well as whole new games that I assume they’ll slot in like with MCC), then I’ll take it. As much as I liked armor customization in the prior games, I’d also like for players to keep coming back to the game week to week to earn cosmetics stuff, see what new modes/maps/events get released, and for the devs to be able to pay rent.
> > > >
> > > > Yah but that’s the problem, the population will nose-dive because of this.
> > > >
> > > > Its like watching an idiot babble on about how you are wrong about him being in danger while a clearly visible asteroid is heading for his exact location. You tell him the get out of the way and listen to you because his life depends on it. And he yells about how you can’t tell him what to do. Eventually, you get sick of telling this poor idiot to get out of the way and decide to let this guy earn a Darwin Award while you get out of the blast radius.
> > > >
> > > > Get the picture?
> > >
> > > Here’s an idea in halo 5 we have free colors but monetized armor i think for halo infinate 343 is doing the opposite monetized colors and earnable armor. I’ll accept this since colors only are visible in firefight infection and ffa. I’d rather have armor than colors.
> >
> > Or, you know, both? Rather than removing an option we have had since Day 1 of Halo CE. Sell gun and vehicle skins. Sell skins for armours to give them a different pattern, or extra lights. Make it so you can apply skins to each part of the armour separately, so you can increase the number of skins in a skin set that you can sell.
> >
> > You don’t take away the option to choose the colour of your armour. That isn’t something to compromise on.
>
> I mean i wish we could but considering the trend of cod fifa madden etc constantly rehashing the same game year after year and making millions, halo needs a consistent model for cash and I’d prefer we don’t monetize maps, we shouldn’t monetize armor, definitely not forge what do 343 monetize so infinate can last 10 years? If colors are the sacrificial lamb for in depth armor customization i think its a good deal.

I just listed a bunch of things that could be monetised.

If 343 want to make money, then they should make a great game that people enjoy repeatedly playing. This is Battlefront II levels of insulting: instead of grinding for hours and hours to play as Luke Skywalker and Darth Vader, we now have to grind for colours that we have always had for the past 19 years.

COD and FIFA make millions every year because 10s of millions of players play them. That just isn’t true for Halo anymore, and hasn’t been for 10 years - coinciding with the idea that Halo needed to be like other games, rather than simply being Halo. Halo 4 wanted to be COD. Halo 5 wanted to be Titanfall. Halo Infinite wants to be a Battle Royal, without being a Battle Royal. You want to know why COD and FIFA sell? People really enjoy the game. Millions and millions of people. Halo? You cannot say that. Halo 4 dropped like a lead balloon. Halo 5 only lasted as long as it did because content that absolutely should have been in the game at launch, was drip-fed to us. Nobody stuck around in Halo 5 because of the Req System, and it actually pushed fans away. You can’t stand in the spotlight when you’re trying to stand in everyone else’s shadow.

At the very least, the community hasn’t felt so united with an idea in years.

Unfortunately for 343 and Infinite, it’s at their expense.

When I saw this my heart sank. I had a gut feeling this would happen after I saw the “Monarch” skin. but I didn’t think it would be this bad.

Color customization has been a core feature of customization since Halo CE. What I think makes this even worse is that we’ll be paying for these Armor coatings which we’ll only see in game in FFA game types!
This takes away the player’s ability to fully express themselves. I’ve had gray/yellow as my primary and secondary color scheme since 2004. Now I don’t even know if that’ll be an option. And if it is, I’ll probably have to pay for something I’ve had for free for the last 16 years!

There is no positive side to this at all. They try to justify this greed by saying armor customization will be great. But notice they stop short of saying that will be locked behind a paywall also. It probably will be.

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> Coming here to voice my disapproval for removing armor color choice in favor of this ‘shader’ nonsense. Taking away a vital part of the multiplayer experience and forcing players to pay for junk outside of the game (monster drinks and products from gamestop) is a major step backwards. For the love of god, please reverse this decision.

Only way to do that. Is by stop buying bad design. Vote with you wallet man. Dont buy dont play free multiplayer.

Seriously. In todays world. Business dont care what you feel as long as it doesnt cost them all precious dollar. Halo infinite might be a good game i dont know, even if i like it. I am going to boycott these modern trends by not playing or buying. And i will tell them know this as well. I hope other who want a change will do this as well.

Seriously in todays time when a brother cant trust a brother in business you expect 343, in all the world microsoft and the all mighty shareholder to give a x to you? No way. You want to change something. You gotta make sacrifices for of that

The worst thing is how they claim it to be a better version of halo reach customisation, and how this will improve players choice when they in reality remove features and lock them behind paywalls. If it was not obvious by now this should get people to open their eyes to what 343 has planed for infinte.

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> If they do it like Borderlands 3 where you got “skins” that was just patterns and still let you choose the colors I’d be fine with it. If it’s Destiny style shaders then this is going to be very frustrating.
>
> The more I learn of Halo Infinite the more I realize this game isn’t being developed with Halo fans in mind.

I have a similar feeling. Who do you think the whole spiritual reboot is for? New audience. Of course. Games design Foundation in in bringing in new players. Not to satisfy exisiting player bases.

All business men knkw that todays self control lacking consumers will buy even when they dont like some things so they will throw in a few bones for us to chew while they set up a buffet for new audience. Seriously guys. If you are reading this. If you dont like direction of something in todays time. Vote with you wallets. If you dont buy. Not a damn things can these giant corporates do to get money other then to make what we want. Though i feel we will be a minority. But i feel a minority who does not buy is better then a minority which complains but still buys. Becuase that will not have a as big of an impact as the other one. Its abouts sales and money after all

I don’t think I’m going to get this game now. This is utterly rediculus. They boast about how much flexibility this system gives them now…why not give this ‘7 layer’ system to the player? Let us color our warthogs, weapons, and armor as we wish.

Now we’re effectively going to be walking ads. Worse than what EA and 2K have done with their ads in sports game, if you wear Monarch or whatever, you are effectively an ad for a real world product.

Utterly disgusting.

I was already not expecting much given 343’s track record but wow. This is a new low.

It’s rare that I post on the Forums. I don’t usually feel the need to do this, but here I am.

I’m a little hurt 343. Despite the fact that (to me) Halo 4 was one of the biggest disappointments I had in a game, despite the fact I do not like Halo 5’s campaign, and despite the fact MCC was a buggy mess, I was willing to give you a chance. I always pushed to my friends that ‘343 are learning from their mistakes’, and put forward the improvements you made to the MCC and that you seemed to be listening to the fans on the Infinite front. I even praised you for delaying Infinite when it clearly needed some more polish, despite the fact that I personally was okay with what I saw in July. The only thing I wasn’t on board with was the fact it seemed like we were getting 5 style emblems because I’m not a fan of them, but other than that? I was cool with all of it and trying to advocate that you guys listened and cared about the fans.

And with one silly move you’ve put all that in the bin. You’ve basically proven that you haven’t listened at all, or learned from your mistakes. Reach style customisation? Really? Because I don’t remember the part of reach where I had to put a preset shader on my Spartan, and lets call them what they are; shaders, that thing from Destiny 2 that no sensible person likes. I’m still annoyed that I had to settle for black and metallic teal for my Guardian in Destiny 2 rather than the usual silver/grey and red I like, and I’ll be annoyed if I can’t be the usual silver/grey and red in Halo Infinite too.

I’ve tried not to be too harsh on you guys, and not jump on the 343 hate train. I really want Infinite to succeed, but this is absolutely stupid. The fact that you acknowledge it was going to make your fans upset is worse. It makes it stupid and insulting.“Hey we know you, the people who pay for our games, won’t like this, but we’re doing it anyway.” is how it comes off to me.

Why on Earth would you do away with the two colour system? That’s been here since 2 and I’ve never heard a single player complain about having it. The worst I’ve heard is some edgelords complain about people having neon-colour-eyestrain Spartans, but not about the actual system itself. One of the only things I praise 5’s customisation for is that there’s a lot of colour options for people to pick from. To remove it and claim “we’re giving you more options” is a pile of solid waste and you know it.

Look. I get that the shaders have to stay because contracts and what not, but just make them optional. Make it so shaders are more fancy and stuff but give us the default two colour system and maybe a weathering slider like DOOM 2016 or some of the Gundam games have. That or do what everyone actually wants and just make shaders change the texture/weathering of the armour and shift where the colours the player picks go. At worst you could make the colour picker something you have to buy the campaign to unlock. Maybe do that and throw in some armours for campaign completion to tempt the free to play crowd into buying the main campaign and playing it for more stuff. Just do something that isn’t actively limiting your playerbase’s customisation options and further alienating an already dissatisified group of individuals.

You have a whole year to fix this so fix it. Quoth the Gravemind “There is still time to stop the key from turning”. Give the people the customisation they want and for the love of all things sweet and holy, like electric eels and the gungnir helmet, please stop trying to “”""“fix”"""" things that aren’t broken 343. No one likes it.

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> > > > > > If this is what it takes to have a modern Halo game that doesn’t have a population nose-dive after a few months, and for content for Infinite to continue to be developed over the course of the 10 years for which they said it’s gonna be the main Halo platform (as well as whole new games that I assume they’ll slot in like with MCC), then I’ll take it. As much as I liked armor customization in the prior games, I’d also like for players to keep coming back to the game week to week to earn cosmetics stuff, see what new modes/maps/events get released, and for the devs to be able to pay rent.
> > > > >
> > > > > Yah but that’s the problem, the population will nose-dive because of this.
> > > > >
> > > > > Its like watching an idiot babble on about how you are wrong about him being in danger while a clearly visible asteroid is heading for his exact location. You tell him the get out of the way and listen to you because his life depends on it. And he yells about how you can’t tell him what to do. Eventually, you get sick of telling this poor idiot to get out of the way and decide to let this guy earn a Darwin Award while you get out of the blast radius.
> > > > >
> > > > > Get the picture?
> > > >
> > > > Here’s an idea in halo 5 we have free colors but monetized armor i think for halo infinate 343 is doing the opposite monetized colors and earnable armor. I’ll accept this since colors only are visible in firefight infection and ffa. I’d rather have armor than colors.
> > >
> > > Or, you know, both? Rather than removing an option we have had since Day 1 of Halo CE. Sell gun and vehicle skins. Sell skins for armours to give them a different pattern, or extra lights. Make it so you can apply skins to each part of the armour separately, so you can increase the number of skins in a skin set that you can sell.
> > >
> > > You don’t take away the option to choose the colour of your armour. That isn’t something to compromise on.
> >
> > I mean i wish we could but considering the trend of cod fifa madden etc constantly rehashing the same game year after year and making millions, halo needs a consistent model for cash and I’d prefer we don’t monetize maps, we shouldn’t monetize armor, definitely not forge what do 343 monetize so infinate can last 10 years? If colors are the sacrificial lamb for in depth armor customization i think its a good deal.
>
> I just listed a bunch of things that could be monetised.
>
> If 343 want to make money, then they should make a great game that people enjoy repeatedly playing. This is Battlefront II levels of insulting: instead of grinding for hours and hours to play as Luke Skywalker and Darth Vader, we now have to grind for colours that we have always had for the past 19 years.

The crazy thing is even grinding may not get you the colours you want.

343I even said

> While we understand that many players are fond of the previous color system, we’re very excited about the breadth and scope of armor, weapon, and vehicle customization options that will be available in Halo Infinite because of the coating system

And

> We also want to stress that we know some folks are likely going to be disheartened by the limited nature of some of these current programs (tied to specific regions or products), but please rest assured the team has a lot of customization content planned including items that will be earned in-game and some that will be earned as special rewards

They literally say “We know some folks are likely going to be disheartened by the limited nature of some of these current programs”

So I think we can safely assume they’re will definitely be things that can only be unlocked by buying x item or product. So even grinding, won’t get them for you.

I don’t know…should we all make bets on if this will be worst then Battlefront 2? LoL I know Halo infinite is free to play so I understand the model but as I’ve said in earlier posts, making it so colors are behind pay walls is pretty low.

As I’ve also said an earlier posts, so what’s next? Ranked modes behind pay walls? instead of the old days at the arcade where insert quarter or dollar to play it will be,

"for $5 a month, you’ll be able to play ranked Team Slayer against some of the world’s best! Come see where you stack up! Buy 3 months worth and get this exclusive armor colour!

…I can already see it… It’s comical, but it’s sad too :pensive:

Every time. I told folks to be wary of their corporate jargon in the leadup to Halo 5 (“more customization options than ever!”, instead of answering questions directly), and 343i has proven yet again that I was not nearly cynical enough. I always presented the possibility that 343i might not screw up, I won’t make that mistake again. This decision is so antithetical to what Halo was, it’s the straw that broke this camel’s back, I wont be touching the game with a 10 foot pole.

All right 343, you did it. You pissed everyone off again. I wanted to believe in you and trust me, I still want to. It’s just hard to do that anymore with these things like coatings. It’s a cliche quote at this point but I think it fits perfectly here: “If it ain’t broke, don’t fix it.” Unfortunately, I have the feeling these coatings are here to stay. They’re already in so many promotional items as is. But please, reconsider this whole color system you have going. The lack of understanding for the player gives me a headache and I’m all out of Tylenol.

I’m low-key shocked at how universal the dislike is about this. But then again, color customization was something so basic to Halo’s identity that virtually anyone no matter what side of the coin they’re on on some rather heated topics despises this change. I just think we’re all universally bummed to finally confirm this. We had our suspicions ever since we saw the first appearances of armor coatings, and while it is nice to finally get something official about this from 343, it…didn’t help their situation.

Don’t get me wrong, I want more official news from 343 about this game. They need to say more than what they have about it for someone to make a reasonable purchase for the Campaign. But a post from Cobra J24 and very important parts from ran and shai’s gets across what I’m gonna post about here now:

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> **The red flags were there…**Let’s make sure not to ignore the other red flags Infinite poses: the mere concept of Free to Play multiplayer, the complete reboot of the campaign’s story, the frankly ugly graphics and design choices. These red flags are huge, and 343i answer the fandom’s worries with silence. Why? **Because they know we won’t like what they have to show.**343i, I hope you prove me wrong, but you already fooled us many times (Halo 4 multiplayer, Halo 5 campaign, MCC being unplayable at launch, etc). You have not earned our trust or our good will. This is the time to show us your game, to let us give you feedback, to flight it and beta test it so that when it does launch, we will love it and play it. Silence just serves to confirm our worries.

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> They said the in the post that they knew it would cause backlash. That tells me they probably decided this long already. I just wonder what else they will ‘fix’.

As shai said, there are red flags being slapped onto this game since the 23rd reveal. Even before that with how long the silence behind it has been. Now, imagine if we were actually there, 2 years ago when Infinite was first announced, and we had a proper say in what they were doing? What if we had constant, weekly communication with 343 about the game in updates about different sections of the game? And on top of that, the community creator talks they had between people like Late Night Gaming or Xperia?

I would argue we would’ve been in a very different situation. I would argue this whole shader system wouldn’t have been a thing. That the Sidekick wouldn’t look the way it does. That we would’ve had more info on the Campaign and its mechanics. For god’s sake, there is an upgrades tab visible on the map and not a peep has been said about upgrades since the 23rd reveal. But, as we all know, 343 has been so incredibly silent about this game. And given the red flags that are blatant to see, the history 343 has with the franchise? I don’t trust them.

I said it before, and I will say it again. 343 has NO benefit of the doubt. We have no absolute trust in this company to make a game that we will enjoy, and if we did, this announcement about armor coatings lit it in flames. I do not have trust in 343 to make a game we will enjoy, and they haven’t given me a good enough reason to say I should have that trust. No good reason that we should be here, in silence with the occasional blips of news that only seems to tell us that we’re right for being worried about the parts of the game we know.

343 has been able to run flighting programs for the entire MCC collection on PC since its debut. Most of those flights occurred during the 2020 pandemic(Halo 2, Halo 3, Halo 3 ODST, Halo 4). They have been able to turn MCC from the shell it was to something much, much greater for only a $60 price tag, and that was in part to us testing the game and giving feedback. They wouldn’t have been looking into additional mod support if we weren’t asking. They wouldn’t be looking into something like a custom games browser, if we weren’t asking. Fixes for hit registration, PC settings on console, and more if we didn’t ask them for it or gave feedback on that game.

What makes Infinite different? Its a new Halo game? Why not just give us the parts of the Campaign you’ve already shown us to playtest? What does it take to fit a flighting program on 343’s schedule, even AFTER the delay, where they should have no good excuse to let us give something on the game? Even if we cannot change a single thing about the game, we can’t change the coating system, the story, or whatever else they’re keeping from us because they’re afraid of how we’ll respond, can we at least know that 343 can give us a good reason to believe they won’t deliver a subpar story, that they can be confident in their own product?

The point is, 343 needed better communication with us from the start. I do not believe 343 understands the Halo community, and what we look for in a Halo title. What we expect in a Halo title. They’ve proven they can treat past games and freshen them up, giving them a new look, updating them to be better than ever. If all that can happen to MCC, I should have some faith in 343 to understand what we want. But despite not receiving a single complaint about the new customization features coming into MCC, not a single complaint about the color customization in Halo 5(except for maybe requests to expand it), they believe it necessary to give more “breadth” to our customization.

If they can change what was never broken, what was arguably better into something that causes uproar within the community, I can only imagine what else they saw as expandable. If they could’ve just given us more about the game early on instead of the deafening silence that we all know and hate, maybe we could’ve made it extra clear to 343 that this was going to be a choice we would’ve hated, no matter what Forerunner patterns you could’ve slapped onto my spartan. I wouldn’t even be concerned about other aspects of the game and believe 343 wouldn’t change them negatively if they would just talk to us about Infinite more consistently.

Give me a better reason to have faith 343 understands what we’re looking for in a Halo game. Hell, give me a reason in general they understand what we’re looking for. The customization of vehicles and weapons is great, but it would’ve been better to just allow us to customize them like in MCC with their skins and give us color customization.

Give me more consistent news, even if I’m gonna hate it. At least you’re being straight up with us instead of keeping your head under the sand.

Personally speaking, I don’t mind the coatings, but I’m not in support of them either. If 343i wants to keep them in the game then that’s fine but for the sake of damage control, allow us to choose whether we want the coating on or go for a classic look just like the skins in Halo: The Master Chief Collection. Allow us to unlock the coating but have them be an option to equip.

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> I’m low-key shocked at how universal the dislike is about this. But then again, color customization was something so basic to Halo’s identity that virtually anyone no matter what side of the coin they’re on on some rather heated topics despises this change. I just think we’re all universally bummed to finally confirm this. We had our suspicions ever since we saw the first appearances of armor coatings, and while it is nice to finally get something official about this from 343, it…didn’t help their situation.

Yeah, 343’s done it, they’ve found something to unite the community on…their hatred of this decision. I’m pretty sure just about everything else 343 has done has had people who defended it, or tried to temper people’s rage, or tried to actually liked it.

There’s nothing to defend here. This is a basic feature we’ve had in every halo game, that will now cost us money, and has been turned into ads for different companies. If they wanted more color customization, they could have just given us more color customization.

They’ve had what 4-5 years to work on this game & it turns into a hot mess & all 343 think is “this is fine” I’ve given 343 my respect & admiration for fixing MCC just to lose it again to this BS